Uncharted 4 60FPS! Not so fast ....

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GioVela2010

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#51  Edited By GioVela2010
Member since 2008 • 5566 Posts

@deadline-zero0

Of course with TressFX On

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Wasdie

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#52 Wasdie  Moderator
Member since 2003 • 53622 Posts

@Cloud_imperium said:

Will there ever be a gen where 60fps will be a standard? May be just after 8-10 years, during next generation? We'll finally get there. Just you wait.

Unless the majority of consumers demand it, 60 fps won't be a standard. Consumer do demand noticeably better visuals. With stagnate hardware each generation, developers need to prioritize rendering and image quality over framerates to meet this demand.

It doesn't matter if the consoles come out at more powerful than high end PCs. Eventually improvements to rendering will tax the system enough where developers have to drop the framerate to achieve higher image quality. That's the inherit flaw of standardized and stagnant console generations.

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Wasdie

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#53 Wasdie  Moderator
Member since 2003 • 53622 Posts

@GioVela2010: Keep obviously troll baiting and there will be punishments.

First and only warning.

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Krelian-co

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#54 Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@GioVela2010 said:

@deadline-zero0:

Of course with TressFX On

oh look, someone who actually has a 970

Loading Video...

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wolverine4262

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#55 wolverine4262
Member since 2004 • 20832 Posts

@Krelian-co: I just find that you always have something stupid to say to me quite flattering.

UC2 and TLOU are fun one off experiences with little reason to come back to them. Thats about it.

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DEadliNE-Zero0

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#56  Edited By DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

@GioVela2010 said:

@deadline-zero0:

Of course with TressFX On

TressFX is optimized for AMD cards on TB and it can kill 20 frames easy. It's not a good benchmark to use it.

Next you're going to try and prove a point by using a game with tesselation on, like Metro. Or phyx particles on full. Or SSAA 2x/4x

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ghostwarrior786

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#57 ghostwarrior786
Member since 2005 • 5811 Posts

awesome! uc games have always had rock solid fps so dont see the problem.

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Krelian-co

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#58 Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@wolverine4262 said:

@Krelian-co: I just find that you always have something stupid to say to me quite flattering.

UC2 and TLOU are fun one off experiences with little reason to come back to them. Thats about it.

you make a stupid comment, i destroy said comment with an actual argument, you reply something stupid. You talked about naughty dogs focusing on graphics i pointed out they have u2 and tlou under their belt just from this gen, which are 2 of the better games of the gen regardless what your inner butthurt lem has to say. Don't make stupid comments and i won't have to correct said stupidity.

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R4gn4r0k

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#59 R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 49120 Posts

@Desmonic said:

@R4gn4r0k:

Some people also don't believe gravity is a thing :P I have no doubt the in-engine cutscenes will achieve that graphical fidelity. Obviously the gameplay will have to be toned down a bit, but from what I saw it's not such an huge difference (especially considering what this game gained versus the previous ones).

But like I said, blood sacrifices and all that! Sony will find a way! :D

Yeah and some people deny global warming, lol.

I do think the in game graphics look amazing. The last gameplay trailer looked great.

I also think Watch_dogs is a good looking game. Developers/publishers just need to grow more confident, as games look good enough. Don't try and wow people with things you don't have, do it with things you do have.

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wolverine4262

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#60 wolverine4262
Member since 2004 • 20832 Posts

@Krelian-co: Excuse me? I mentioned actual things about the game that the devs have stated. They are clearly putting gameplay in the backseat to preserve presentation and going back on what theyve said in the past about the game. This thread has nothing to do with 343 or its shitty handling of the Halo franchise up to this point. But once again you have to change the topic. Why cant you comment on ND lying about the game being 60fps? Thats what this thread is actually about.

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Krelian-co

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#62 Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@wolverine4262 said:

@Krelian-co: Excuse me? I mentioned actual things about the game that the devs have stated. They are clearly putting gameplay in the backseat to preserve presentation and going back on what theyve said in the past about the game. This thread has nothing to do with 343 or its shitty handling of the Halo franchise up to this point. But once again you have to change the topic. Why cant you comment on ND lying about the game being 60fps? Thats what this thread is actually about.

And i pointed out what you say as always is bullshit, u2 and tlou had one of the best presentation of last gen, but yet the games itself were great, you act as if they were solely focusing on graphics, but carry on my butthurt lem, carry on.

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ghostwarrior786

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#63 ghostwarrior786
Member since 2005 • 5811 Posts
@wolverine4262 said:

@Krelian-co: Excuse me? I mentioned actual things about the game that the devs have stated. They are clearly putting gameplay in the backseat to preserve presentation and going back on what theyve said in the past about the game. This thread has nothing to do with 343 or its shitty handling of the Halo franchise up to this point. But once again you have to change the topic. Why cant you comment on ND lying about the game being 60fps? Thats what this thread is actually about.

all nd said was they are aiming for 60fps, they never confirmed it will be 60fps. massive difference.

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wolverine4262

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#64 wolverine4262
Member since 2004 • 20832 Posts

@Krelian-co said:

And i pointed out what you say as always is bullshit, u2 and tlou had one of the best presentation of last gen, but yet the games itself were great, you act as if they were solely focusing on graphics, but carry on my butthurt lem, carry on.

And like I said before when you hype up chest hair physics and neck muscles, we know where your priorities lie. The only butthurt Im seeing is coming from the cows that got lied to and bought it... like usual.

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NoodleFighter

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#65 NoodleFighter
Member since 2011 • 11897 Posts

@bunchanumbers said:

I'll be glad when the illusion of 1080p and 60 fps dies with these consoles. Its already been proven that all 3 struggle with it. Maybe in the future there will be less talk about that and more about the game itself.

...but probably not.

It was worse last gen when console gamers literally tried to pass off games that upscale to those resolutions as the real thing and got real fissy when being proved wrong.

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wolverine4262

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#66 wolverine4262
Member since 2004 • 20832 Posts

@ghostwarrior786: And now they arent aiming for 60 fps.

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freedomfreak

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#67  Edited By freedomfreak
Member since 2004 • 52565 Posts

Cuts deep.

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FoxbatAlpha

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#69 FoxbatAlpha
Member since 2009 • 10669 Posts

Content-wise, this game is really going to suck. The only thing you hear on it is 1080p/60fps. Another tech demo with empty substance for the PS4.

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ghostwarrior786

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#70 ghostwarrior786
Member since 2005 • 5811 Posts

@wolverine4262 said:

@ghostwarrior786: And now they arent aiming for 60 fps.

so? they tried and failed, nothing lost nothing gained. they never promised 60fps anyway so dont see the problem

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ninjapirate2000

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#71  Edited By ninjapirate2000
Member since 2008 • 3347 Posts

900p 60fps please.

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Robert_Mueller

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#72 Robert_Mueller
Member since 2015 • 164 Posts
@wolverine4262 said:

Yeah, well when your priorities are dumb shit like animated neck muscles and chest hair physics. Really goes to show what ND and Sony care most about.

Totally reasonable decision. Neck muscle movement and hair physics are much more important for the experience than 60fps. After all, movies have only 24fps, but the actors *do* have neck muscle movement and correct hair pysics. Thus, in order to create a cinematic experience, we need this stuff, but we do *not* need 60fps.

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wolverine4262

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#73 wolverine4262
Member since 2004 • 20832 Posts

@robert_mueller: Mhmm. We all know how much cows love their movie games.

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Robert_Mueller

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#74 Robert_Mueller
Member since 2015 • 164 Posts
@wolverine4262 said:

UC2 and TLOU are fun one off experiences with little reason to come back to them. Thats about it.

That's true, but I wouls not replay Halo either.

I can only replay sports games, racing games, simulations and other stuff like this. Still I like story-driven games better.

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SuperKingJesus

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#75 SuperKingJesus
Member since 2015 • 25 Posts

@wolverine4262 said:

@ghostwarrior786: And now they arent aiming for 60 fps.

Rofl

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Robert_Mueller

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#76  Edited By Robert_Mueller
Member since 2015 • 164 Posts
@wolverine4262 said:

@robert_mueller: Mhmm. We all know how much cows love their movie games.

Yes, and we all know how much hermits and lems love their multiplayer FPS games although online gaming is rather unimportant for me.

It's actually quite simple: If you want some multiplayer FPS junk, go for PC or Xbox. If you want story-driven games, go for PS4, because there is no reasonable alternative in this case.

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lamprey263

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#77 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 45482 Posts

Funny how just 4 years ago a game like Vanquish was praised for its silky smooth framerate of which was mostly 30fps but might dip a frame or two once in a while, now such a thing is highly despised, even a solid 30fps. Personally, I'm fine with it. Sure 60fps would be better but by no means do I think 30fps is horrible. I'm sure it was a trade-off, sacrifice framerate for improved visual fidelity.

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lostrib

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#79 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

@robert_mueller said:
@wolverine4262 said:

@robert_mueller: Mhmm. We all know how much cows love their movie games.

Yes, and we all know how much hermits and lems love their multiplayer FPS games although online gaming is rather unimportant for me.

It's actually quite simple: If you want some multiplayer FPS junk, go for PC or Xbox. If you want story-driven games, go for PS4, because there is no reasonable alternative in this case.

...not sure if serious

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SolidTy

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#80  Edited By SolidTy
Member since 2005 • 49991 Posts

What I want and what I know are sometimes two different things. I wish 60fps was a standard static consoles would push, but I know better.

For those curious on the answer, I'll post below:

---

Actually there were at least 2 threads on this a few weeks ago in SW, but I see this article is new to Gamespot.com at least. That just means GS is late to the news.

I explained this over the years and I've also explained it recently, but static console hardware will always prioritize resolution over fps. The PS2 had 60 fps in very select games (Devil May Cry, Ratchet & Clank 1-3, etc) but ultimately publishers are going to push the games to 30fps to get better better graphics. Graphic fidelity takes a hit when frame rate goes up, and at the end of the day most of these games are fine at 30fps for consoles and sales will be fine. This is not an indictment of the current consoles power because this is an issue static consoles will always have to deal with even if the machines were twice as weak or four times as strong. The devs ask: "We have finite resources, so where to we prioritize and allocate the resources?" What is the priority for the developer? What sells the most copies and looks the prettiest? Does the industry give out awards for graphics? They do! Do critics and consumers praise graphics? They do! It's not hard to figure out how this limited console box is going to be pushed. It MAY not even be the devs call, the publisher may insist on better graphics and lower the frame rate. That's because the competition is doing the same and PEOPLE expect it.

It sucks for those expecting something else. I said this last year and many years before, it's easier to get 1080p/60fps when porting some last gen game, but don't expect devs to hold back their graphics when their peers and the industry keeps pumping out prettier games. It's how the industry works. Consumers prioritize graphics and the pubs deliver. The dev that does deliver 60fps/1080p will only serve to limit their marketing potential as pubs see it (unless it's a genre that fps is crucial). That 60fps dev will risk their peers sucking up all the accolades from their peers and critics, and risk losing sales to the casual consumer for graphics that aren't quite as pretty as the competing game sitting next to them on the shelf at 30fps. Think about that. It's already happened as Insomniac tried to do 60fps since the PS2 and midway through the PS3 cycle.

Ratchet & Clank last gen was primarily 60fps and no one in SW gave a damn (and neither did the majority of the world). The industry (critics and peer devs) didn't compliment the frame rate of the R&C series for being at a much higher standard on PS2/PS3 and ultimately Insomniac posted they are going to stop pushing 60fps and go to 30 fps. The last few R&C games are at 30fps now and they looked prettier and not many cared about the fps drop. That's the way the industry is. I've articulated this better in the past but this is always the issue with these static console boxes. Devs have a lot to juggle with these limited static, non-upgradeable console boxes and frame-rate isn't high on the list compared to other areas like textures, resolution, polygons, particles, AI, etc. They could promote and push 60fps, but it's a question of if they need to and if they would rather push the hardware in other ways. This is the problem for all consoles now and in the past. This isn't going to change, devs that push 60fps may not get recognized in the industry for their efforts like the devs that take the fps hit to 30fps and push the pretty pictures that are posted on boxes and advertisements (marketing used to sell games). The PS4 hardware could be 2x as powerful as it is now and this issue would always be there. Should devs push the envelope on FPS or limit the FPS to push graphics? FPS isn't going to win for the majority of most games.

Look at HDTV's even. You see people buying terrible 60hz HDTVs because they don't pay attention. What people do pay attention to is the resolution (4K, 1080p, etc). There is a reason the TV industry keeps pumping out these terrible 60hz HDTVs. Because, sadly, people buy the absolute minimum 60hz HDTVs. The people that realize they were bamboozled learn the lesson and pay attention for their next HDTV purchase. This move and priority by ND is to appease the majority of people.

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DaVillain

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#81  Edited By DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 58721 Posts

@wolverine4262: My sig is from: Ore Twintail ni narimasu. And the woman you see, her name is: Thouars.

What can I say, I have a thing for Anime chicks.

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xdude85

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#82 xdude85
Member since 2006 • 6559 Posts

Who fucking cares? This whole emphasis on frame rate and resolution having to be the primary focus is what's killing games.

All I care about is game-play, and preferably a good story.

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HalcyonScarlet

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#83 HalcyonScarlet
Member since 2011 • 13838 Posts

bu bu cows told me teh GPGPU.

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wolverine4262

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#84 wolverine4262
Member since 2004 • 20832 Posts

@davillain-: Only a liar would say they arent interested in anime girls. May give that anime a chance. Never heard of it. Thanks.

Currently rewatching Samurai Champloo with good old freedomfreak.

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freedomfreak

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#85 freedomfreak
Member since 2004 • 52565 Posts

Sharp like an edge of a samurai sword.

The mental blade cut through flesh and bone.

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ninjapirate2000

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#86  Edited By ninjapirate2000
Member since 2008 • 3347 Posts

Actually I want 23.98 FPS.

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Daious

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#87 Daious
Member since 2013 • 2315 Posts

@deadline-zero0 said:

@GioVela2010 said:

Yah I don't get it.

With Tomb Raider @ 1080p i max out the settings, use 4xAA and get 30 FPS. No way I lower settings or use no AA to get 60 FPS

And this with a 6 core Intel CPU @4.2 Ghz and an overclocked GTX 970

Are you using TressFX? Because otherwise, that's impossible.

I think he was joking

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DEadliNE-Zero0

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#88 DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

@daious: he wasn't

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Krelian-co

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#89  Edited By Krelian-co
Member since 2006 • 13274 Posts

@davillain- said:

@wolverine4262: My sig is from: Ore Twintail ni narimasu. And the woman you see, her name is: Thouars.

What can I say, I have a thing for Anime chicks.

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SuddenlyTragic

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#90 SuddenlyTragic
Member since 2005 • 976 Posts

@robert_mueller said:
@wolverine4262 said:

Yeah, well when your priorities are dumb shit like animated neck muscles and chest hair physics. Really goes to show what ND and Sony care most about.

Totally reasonable decision. Neck muscle movement and hair physics are much more important for the experience than 60fps. After all, movies have only 24fps, but the actors *do* have neck muscle movement and correct hair pysics. Thus, in order to create a cinematic experience, we need this stuff, but we do *not* need 60fps.

Uh, we're not talking about movies. I like to play my games personally, and the smoothest gameplay can only be achieved with 60fps. I'm not saying that 30fps is unplayable or anything of that nature - I absolutely loved every Uncharted game and those were all in 30fps. But if you're actually buying into this "cinematic experience" crap developers are throwing at us (which, apparently you are), then god help you. The truth is, every developer wants their game to be 60fps. It provides smoother gameplay without question. That's what this article is about - how Naughty Dog really wishes that they could achieve 60fps but they probably aren't going to be able to. If 30fps was fine and dandy with everyone - developer included - we wouldn't even be having this conversation. But that's not the case and now whenever a developer can't hit 60 fps, they try to justify it by saying "oh, it's more cinematic this way." Bullshit.

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Legend002

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#91 Legend002
Member since 2007 • 13405 Posts

Any answer other than yes means no. It will not be 60fps.

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Telekill

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#92 Telekill
Member since 2003 • 12061 Posts

Pretty old news. Like mid January news. Also, I don't care.

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GioVela2010

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#93 GioVela2010
Member since 2008 • 5566 Posts

@Krelian-co said:

@GioVela2010 said:

@deadline-zero0:

Of course with TressFX On

oh look, someone who actually has a 970

Loading Video...

I clearly said with 4xMSAA, that is FXAA. Nice try tho.

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GioVela2010

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#94 GioVela2010
Member since 2008 • 5566 Posts

@Wasdie said:

@GioVela2010: Keep obviously troll baiting and there will be punishments.

First and only warning.

What obvious trolling? Im not trolling at all. Please be more specific and let me know what you deem as "trolling"

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Daious

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#95 Daious
Member since 2013 • 2315 Posts

@deadline-zero0 said:

@daious: he wasn't

then he was doing something horribly wrong.

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Gue1

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#96 Gue1
Member since 2004 • 12171 Posts

IN NAUGHTY GODS I TRUST.

LOTS OF TEARS WILL FLOW THIS FALL AND IT'S NOT GONNA BE COW'S.

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deactivated-5cf4b2c19c4ab

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#97 deactivated-5cf4b2c19c4ab
Member since 2008 • 17476 Posts

@GioVela2010 said:

@Krelian-co said:

@GioVela2010 said:

@deadline-zero0:

Of course with TressFX On

oh look, someone who actually has a 970

I clearly said with 4xMSAA, that is FXAA. Nice try tho.

Tomb Raider does not natively support MSAA, it supports FXAA and SSAA.

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GioVela2010

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#98 GioVela2010
Member since 2008 • 5566 Posts

@daious said:

@deadline-zero0 said:

@daious: he wasn't

then he was doing something horribly wrong.

Oviously I am not.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/03/20/tomb_raider_video_card_performance_iq_review/3#.VNKw-v7F9nQ

There was an extremely large performance loss when enabling higher levels of aliasing while leaving TressFX on. This was more evident at 2560x1600 than 1080p. Playing with 4X MSAA was unplayable for each video card. The NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680 SLI was close to 20 FPS, while the Radeon HD 7970 GHz Edition CrossFire averaged a little less than 30 FPS.

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GioVela2010

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#99 GioVela2010
Member since 2008 • 5566 Posts

@ferret-gamer said:

@GioVela2010 said:

@Krelian-co said:

@GioVela2010 said:

@deadline-zero0:

Of course with TressFX On

oh look, someone who actually has a 970

I clearly said with 4xMSAA, that is FXAA. Nice try tho.

Tomb Raider does not natively support MSAA, it supports FXAA and SSAA.

Maybe you are right. In which case I meant SSAA than, not FXAA still. I'll check when i get home

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SuddenlyTragic

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#100 SuddenlyTragic
Member since 2005 • 976 Posts

You're apparently playing in 1080p though not 2560x1600 so this doesn't affect you. And those benchmarks came out when the game did, so there were no drivers or game updates to fix this. Shutup