Washington Post - Is Sony's PS3 Really a Sinking Ship?

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Faulttt

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#1 Faulttt
Member since 2005 • 549 Posts

"CNN has declared Sony's PS3 "a sinking ship" riffing off last Thursday's "plummeting" NPD sales results. CNN bases its gloomy diagnosis on Sony's sales plunge of 19 points, compared to sales in November 2007. That's a fair criticism, but it isolates a superficially negative statistic while ignoring the fact that this November only included two days of post-holiday sales (11/28 - 11/29) compared to last year's eight total (11/23 - 11/30). I'm speculating here, but if you could adjust for that difference, it's very likely PS3 sales would have increased, however slightly, year-over-year.

What's more, Sony rightly points out that the PS3 has seen hardware sales grow 60% year-to-date. I realize the PS3 wasn't selling well in 2007, so that figure's less impressive than it sounds, but growth is growth, any way you slice it. What's more, look at PS3 and Xbox 360 units sold in total worldwide, and Sony pretty much throughout 2008 has actually been playing catchup.

Then there's the PlayStation brand overall, which when you factor in the PSP and PS2, topped 1 million units, more than the Xbox 360's 836,000. The PlayStation brand has in fact pretty easily muscled past the Xbox brand practically every month since the PS3's launch. Sony's margins on the PSP and PS2 are almost certainly better than the PS3's, so which company's actually been more profitable in overall unit sales is less obvious than it seems.

On the other hand, CNN's whacking the nail on the head when it raises the problem of the PlayStation 3's price. The recession's been on well and long enough for Sony to have reacted by now, and yet it's stubbornly clung to that $400 entry point. Had it dropped the PS3's price to $300 or even $350 it's a safe bet October and November's numbers would've tallied much more favorably. Both Microsoft and Sony have a solid stable of exclusives, and both have interesting companion services, but it's price and not NXE/Netflix or PlayStation Home that's deciding the battle at the moment.

Quick points...

CNN's right that the video-game industry isn't recession proof. Nothing is. The rest of us saying as much merely mean "recession-proof-so-far," which it clearly is compared to other ebbing economic indices.

CNN says the differences between Blu-ray and DVD are hard to see on a TV less than 50". I suppose that'd be true if your eyes are somehow genetically fixed at 720 x 480 (NTSC). For the rest of us, Blu-ray at even 720p (1280 x 720) with all its other commensurate upticks in sample rates and color quality is shockingly better than the visuals output of the average DVD.

And finally, "the PS3 just doesn't have any must-have titles exclusive to the console." Really? I guess CNN's not familiar (or perhaps just not partial to) exclusives like Metal Gear Solid 4, Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, Ratchet & Clank Future, Wipeout HD, Valkyria Chronicles, the original Resistance: Fall of Man (twice the game the sequel is, in my opinion), and MLB 08: The Show. When you're talking new unit sales, you count the whole history of notable exclusives, not just the last month or two of holiday attention-grabbers."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/15/AR2008121500870.html

CNN Owned :D

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XturnalS

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#2 XturnalS
Member since 2004 • 5020 Posts

Thats some mighty fine ownage done by The Washington Post, nice to see a much more leveled fair analysis then that crap CNN was talking about especially the game part, I felt like that part was written by an angry fanboy.

Bravo Post Bravo

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GranReyUno

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#3 GranReyUno
Member since 2007 • 1542 Posts
Funny I posted something like this in a thread and ppl just ignored stating that a CNN professional can not be wrong. Well it seems like it is so since this is the second site to say otherwise about the PS3 being a sinking ship.
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GranReyUno

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#4 GranReyUno
Member since 2007 • 1542 Posts
[QUOTE="XturnalS"]

Thats some mighty fine ownage done by The Washington Post, nice to see a much more leveled fair analysis then that crap CNN was talking about especially the game part, I felt like that part was written by an angry fanboy.

Bravo Post Bravo

It was but Lems say the CNN writers can't be fanboys. lol!
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SynisterGamer

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#5 SynisterGamer
Member since 2008 • 806 Posts

Kinda sad actually, anyone who actually thought the PS brand was going to die are crazy.

But I love the thing they say about how the PS brand outsold the Xbox brand, 3-to-1 is really fair now is it? :roll:

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deactivated-61010a1ed19f4

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#6 deactivated-61010a1ed19f4
Member since 2007 • 3235 Posts

Good post untill you listed Resistance as a must have game.

You myst have really low standards

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SynisterGamer

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#7 SynisterGamer
Member since 2008 • 806 Posts

Good post untill you listed Resistance as a must have game.

You myst have really low standards

scottiescott238

Resistance 1 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Resistance 2 in everything but the co-op campagin.

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htekemerald

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#8 htekemerald
Member since 2004 • 7325 Posts

You sure this isnt a sony defence force article? I mean I seriosuly started souding like one when they started using PS2 and PSP number to say the PS3 was better than the 360.

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rgame1

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#9 rgame1
Member since 2008 • 2526 Posts
don't know who fails more, CNN or PS3.
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delta3074

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#10 delta3074
Member since 2007 • 20003 Posts
the ps3 is not a sinking ship, but it will come last this gen unless SONY take a big hit to bring the price down
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GreyFoXX4

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#11 GreyFoXX4
Member since 2008 • 3612 Posts

You sure this isnt a sony defence force article? I mean I seriosuly started souding like one when they started using PS2 and PSP number to say the PS3 was better than the 360.

htekemerald
It is fair to bring up the psp and ps2 numbers when people run around saying the ps3 is a failure and that there will be no more playstations after this gen. You got to remember there is more to Sony than just the ps3, unlike MS and its gaming division. Like it or not Sony is making a killing on the ps2 and the psp, and all of that goes into the gaming division at Sony, not just the ps3. Not only that but really the World wide sales of the 360 and the ps3 is alot closer than most like to say it is. Its just that the numbers that MS is putting up now is catching the ps3 from numbers it had put up earlier in the year. Also people need to remember that the ps3 at its stage of life (2 years) is ahead of what the 360 was at its 2 year point, even though the 360 had a year on the market to its self without the wii or the ps3 to contend with. So as far as Sony is concerned they are right on track with what they were expecting from a console that has always been the higher price point. And when they do do a price drop, it will be more competitive with monthly sales between the 360 and ps3, and they know this :)
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HuusAsking

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#12 HuusAsking
Member since 2006 • 15270 Posts
the ps3 is not a sinking ship, but it will come last this gen unless SONY take a big hit to bring the price downdelta3074
They can't afford to. They're still losing money for each PS3 sold, and their attach rate is too low to make up the difference if they drop the price further. IOW, Sony would end up turning the PS3 into a money sink. Furthermore, the price gap has become too great. The 360 Arcade is half the cheapest PS3's price (and the cheapest PS3 is not backward compatible--at least the cheapest 360 can be upgraded), and the 360 has hit the vaunted $200 commodity mark. Any attempt to play price catch up by Sony would be business suicide.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#13 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
Yay! Fanboy wars have reached the "serious" news level. Next they'll be calling each other Xbots and Sony drones :| Oh, washingtonpost.com just took an article from PC World magazine. That guy probably is actually a fanboy. :P
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#14 CreepyBacon
Member since 2005 • 3183 Posts
I was buying it till he said resistence 1 was good. I'm sorry, it truly was a god awful terrible mess of a game and should be buried and never spoken of again.
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#15 HarlockJC
Member since 2006 • 25546 Posts
[QUOTE="htekemerald"]

You sure this isnt a sony defence force article? I mean I seriosuly started souding like one when they started using PS2 and PSP number to say the PS3 was better than the 360.

GreyFoXX4

It is fair to bring up the psp and ps2 numbers when people run around saying the ps3 is a failure and that there will be no more playstations after this gen.

You can still say that there will be a PS4 and that the PS3 is a failure. In the same way that the GC was a failure even though it made money and the Wii is not.

In the business world to not be a failure the current model would need to make more money that a previous model. A company does not want their sales and shares of a marketplace to go down not up. Until the PS3 makes more money for Sony than the PS2 than it is technically a failure even if it does make a profit.

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Devil-Itachi

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#16 Devil-Itachi
Member since 2005 • 4387 Posts
I wouldn't say CNN is owned. CNN could of jumped the gun perhaps but if December sales numbers fail then they were right.
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DarkStar4565

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#17 DarkStar4565
Member since 2007 • 293 Posts

Thats some mighty fine ownage done by The Washington Post, nice to see a much more leveled fair analysis then that crap CNN was talking about especially the game part, I felt like that part was written by an angry fanboy.

Bravo Post Bravo

XturnalS

agreed

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Rahnyc4

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#18 Rahnyc4
Member since 2005 • 6660 Posts
smh@thee post. thats basically another guys opinion. we already see how badly the ps3 is doing, and basically can decide for ourselves how poor its doing. the things sony do to try and cover up the fact that the ps3 brand is a failure is pretty good. Sadly from reading documents and other sites that basically state sony is taking big hits in the gaming division, simply can't be hidden.

unless they can figure out how to get cheep chipsets into the new batch of ps3's then sony will continue taking serious losses. The thing is how are they going to handle the upcoming years, with xbox 360 seeming more appealing to the eyes of gamers? I'm not even going to include the wii, since its on a level of its own.
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blackdreamhunk

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#19 blackdreamhunk
Member since 2007 • 3880 Posts
pc gaming is depression proof and resson proof as long as there is an internet.
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RuinedMachine

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#20 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts
The CNN article failed when they said there was no difference between BR and DVD with a TV under 50" and when they said the PS3 had no "must own" titles.

There's subjectivity, there's bad journalism and then there's flat out lying.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#21 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
The CNN article failed when they said there was no difference between BR and DVD with a TV under 50" and when they said the PS3 had no "must own" titles.

There's subjectivity, there's bad journalism and then there's flat out lying.
RuinedMachine
I dunno. The PS3 has no must own titles in my opinion. You're right. He should've said there wasn't *much* difference between BluRay and an upscaled DVD on smaller tvs.
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#22 FatalDomain
Member since 2005 • 1783 Posts

Seems as if fanboys from both camps have a problem with reading. These articles are not written by the Washington Post or CNN. These opinions are coming from PC world and AlleyInsider. The real question is who is right which leads to the obvious article that uses cold hard facts about here and now (NPD figures), not the "Playstation brand" BS twist. There used to be a time where Sony could just flat out say the PS2 has sold more consoles than the GC/Xbox combined, times two!!! Now they have to use the Playstation brand trump card that doesnt amount to anything relevant to the slumping sales of the PS3......

Game On...

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RuinedMachine

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#23 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts
[QUOTE="RuinedMachine"]The CNN article failed when they said there was no difference between BR and DVD with a TV under 50" and when they said the PS3 had no "must own" titles.

There's subjectivity, there's bad journalism and then there's flat out lying.
Jandurin
I dunno. The PS3 has no must own titles in my opinion. You're right. He should've said there wasn't *much* difference between BluRay and an upscaled DVD on smaller tvs.




So are you lying or are your eyes broken?

I have a 720p 32" and there is a MAJOR difference between DVD and BR.
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blue_hazy_basic

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#24 blue_hazy_basic  Moderator
Member since 2002 • 30854 Posts
So now consolites are using articles from a PC magazine as ownage? While I think the CNN was OTT this guy's article looks like it was lifted directly from a Sony press release.
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#25 blue_hazy_basic  Moderator
Member since 2002 • 30854 Posts
[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="RuinedMachine"]The CNN article failed when they said there was no difference between BR and DVD with a TV under 50" and when they said the PS3 had no "must own" titles.

There's subjectivity, there's bad journalism and then there's flat out lying.
RuinedMachine
I dunno. The PS3 has no must own titles in my opinion. You're right. He should've said there wasn't *much* difference between BluRay and an upscaled DVD on smaller tvs.




So are you lying or are your eyes broken?

I have a 720p 32" and there is a MAJOR difference between DVD and BR.

I have a 42" and there isn't a huge difference, but some people will try and convince you there is ;)
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#26 EuroMafia
Member since 2008 • 7026 Posts
PS3 is a submarine.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#27 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
I have a 720p 32" and there is a MAJOR difference between DVD and BR.RuinedMachine
Do you have a good upscaling DVD player? http://images.google.com/images?ndsp=18&um=1&hl=en&rls=com.microsoft:*&q=difference+between+blu+ray+and+dvd&start=0&sa=N Can't see much difference in most of the comparisons. >_> Maybe you're just attributing more difference than there is.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#28 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
but some people will try and convince you there is ;)blue_hazy_basic
The same as people always do, trying to justify their purchases. That said, I do intend to buy a PS3 for the Bluray player as soon as the price is right. Shoot, I can even play games on it!
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#29 WilliamRLBaker
Member since 2006 • 28915 Posts
""Blu-ray at even 720p (1280 x 720) with all its other commensurate upticks in sample rates and color quality is shockingly better than the visuals output of the average DVD."" Shockingly better? yeah right lol 720p is not that much better then 480i/p for that matter when are people gonna learn HD is not this dramatic increase that will cure all our woes? its just another resolution increase that says hey you gotta purchase a new tv every couple of years man. Nah I think ill stay with my mostly SD content thank you very much the only reason i got the HDTV i have is because it was super cheap.
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RuinedMachine

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#30 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts

Maybe you're just attributing more difference than there is.Jandurin

I have a 42" and there isn't a huge difference, but some people will try and convince you there is ;)blue_hazy_basic

I think I'm going to trust my own eyes instead of some random people on the Internet. Thanks anyways guys.

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#31 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts

The same as people always do, trying to justify their purchases. That said, I do intend to buy a PS3 for the Bluray player as soon as the price is right. Shoot, I can even play games on it!Jandurin

So you don't even have a PS3 and you're trying to convince me, a person that owns one, that there isn't much difference between BR and DVD.

lol ok. Thanks for your input.

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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#32 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts

So you don't even have a PS3 and you're trying to convince me, a person that owns one, that there isn't much difference between BR and DVD.

RuinedMachine
haha. You're the one trying to convince me, buddy. :)
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RuinedMachine

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#33 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts
[QUOTE="RuinedMachine"]

So you don't even have a PS3 and you're trying to convince me, a person that owns one, that there isn't much difference between BR and DVD.

Jandurin

haha. You're the one trying to convince me, buddy. :)

I'm not trying to convince you.

I just said the article was wrong about it and then you came in to try and say there wasn't much difference. Yet you don't even own a PS3.

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#34 thinicer
Member since 2006 • 3704 Posts

It is not a sinking ship, but I think it's pretty clear that the PS3 won't be nearly as successful as the PS2 and Sony will be the big loser this generation, even if they manage to pull out ahead of Microsoft. Considering the level of hype surrounding the PS3, the promises, and the PS2's monstrous install base, I don't believe anybody anticipated Sony to lose this much marketshare and hardly anybody expected the Wii to sell this strong.

I think when it's all said and done, you'll be able to sum up this generation as follows:

Nintendo - Far exceeded expectations.

Microsoft - Met expectations.

Sony - Fell below expectations.

I think the PS3 is a good console, but price & content is the ultimate driver of hardware sales.

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manziny

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#35 manziny
Member since 2003 • 252 Posts
To me ps3 is only useful for storing movies from pc downloads thats it.
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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#36 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
Yet you don't even own a PS3.RuinedMachine
Too much kool-aid this morning? You think the only way to watch HD content is with a bluray player?
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#37 Truth-slayer
Member since 2004 • 2510 Posts
[QUOTE="RuinedMachine"]The CNN article failed when they said there was no difference between BR and DVD with a TV under 50" and when they said the PS3 had no "must own" titles.

There's subjectivity, there's bad journalism and then there's flat out lying.
Jandurin
I dunno. The PS3 has no must own titles in my opinion.

And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.
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RuinedMachine

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#38 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts

[QUOTE="RuinedMachine"] Yet you don't even own a PS3.Jandurin
Too much kool-aid this morning? You think the only way to watch HD content is with a bluray player?




I also watch other non Blu-Ray HD media and it doesn't look as good as the BR movies I've seen.

But you don't even have a PS3 so... Did you even watch a BR movie?

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deactivated-5e836a855beb2

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#39 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.Truth-slayer
Hahahaha. Your opinion of my opinion is incorrect. What "must-own" title do you think exists?

Did you even watch a BR movie?

RuinedMachine
Actually, yes :) My friend owns a PS3, a launch 60GB one with full backward compatibility. Of course, I've only seen a Bluray on his 32" and not my tv, so there's a chance I would notice it more on mine.
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#40 delta3074
Member since 2007 • 20003 Posts
[QUOTE="delta3074"]the ps3 is not a sinking ship, but it will come last this gen unless SONY take a big hit to bring the price downHuusAsking
They can't afford to. They're still losing money for each PS3 sold, and their attach rate is too low to make up the difference if they drop the price further. IOW, Sony would end up turning the PS3 into a money sink. Furthermore, the price gap has become too great. The 360 Arcade is half the cheapest PS3's price (and the cheapest PS3 is not backward compatible--at least the cheapest 360 can be upgraded), and the 360 has hit the vaunted $200 commodity mark. Any attempt to play price catch up by Sony would be business suicide.

that's why i said they need to take a hit, they need to take a loss like MS did last gen, cos otherwise the playstation brand will take a hit and that could be worse for SONY than losing a lot of money.
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3picuri3

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#41 3picuri3
Member since 2006 • 9618 Posts

lol. this was an article written by PC World staff, a writer who has an obvious love for the PS3. a fanboy one might say ;) - look his name up, and remember that the Washington Post was one of the mags that wrote the financial articles about the PS3. you don't even need to look up his other articles, just look at the tone, lol. it's obvious he's angry. he probably posts here!

and last but not least, this peice is an OPINION article - nowhere near the same validity as the financial articles that made the rounds :).

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#42 RuinedMachine
Member since 2008 • 622 Posts
[QUOTE="Truth-slayer"]And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.Jandurin
Hahahaha. Your opinion of my opinion is incorrect. What "must-own" title do you think exists?

Did you even watch a BR movie?

RuinedMachine

Actually, yes :) My friend owns a PS3, a launch 60GB one with full backward compatibility. Of course, I've only seen a Bluray on his 32" and not my tv, so there's a chance I would notice it more on mine.

It can also depend on the transfer too. For example, A Clockwork Orange's on BR is known for not being all that better yet 2001 and other Kubrick movies look much better.

Or the BBC's Planet Earth. That looks amazing.

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delta3074

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#43 delta3074
Member since 2007 • 20003 Posts
PS3 is a submarine.EuroMafia
i laughed my head off when i read this
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#44 delta3074
Member since 2007 • 20003 Posts
[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="RuinedMachine"]The CNN article failed when they said there was no difference between BR and DVD with a TV under 50" and when they said the PS3 had no "must own" titles.

There's subjectivity, there's bad journalism and then there's flat out lying.
Truth-slayer
I dunno. The PS3 has no must own titles in my opinion.

And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.

i agree with him, so should i keep my opinion to myself. and how can he be wrong, saying the ps3 DOES have must have titles is also just an opinion and opinions don't equal facts.
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#45 MarloStanfield
Member since 2008 • 2409 Posts
PS3 is in deep trouble that's all we can really say
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#46 Truth-slayer
Member since 2004 • 2510 Posts
[QUOTE="Truth-slayer"]And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.Jandurin
Hahahaha. Your opinion of my opinion is incorrect. What "must-own" title do you think exists?[.

It isnt a matter of thinking...as it is a matter of knowing as atleast two of them this year alone have been nominated for several game of the year awards. But if I were to suddenly give you my PS3, free of charge, but with none of my games...do you honestly think there arent any games you would buy for it?
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#47 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
[QUOTE="Jandurin"][QUOTE="Truth-slayer"]And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.Truth-slayer
Hahahaha. Your opinion of my opinion is incorrect. What "must-own" title do you think exists?[.

It isnt a matter of thinking...as it is a matter of knowing as atleast two of them this year alone have been nominated for several game of the year awards. But if I were to suddenly give you my PS3, free of charge, but with none of my games...do you honestly think there arent any games you would buy for it?

You must not understand the meaning of "must-have" title.
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#48 Truth-slayer
Member since 2004 • 2510 Posts
[QUOTE="Truth-slayer"][QUOTE="Jandurin"] I dunno. The PS3 has no must own titles in my opinion. delta3074
And your opinion would be wrong and you should keep it to yourself.

i agree with him, so should i keep my opinion to myself. and how can he be wrong, saying the ps3 DOES have must have titles is also just an opinion and opinions don't equal facts.

Some opinions are better than others...especially when one of the opinions is being stated for the sole purpose of annoying other people and the person doesnt really believe it.
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#49 deactivated-5e836a855beb2
Member since 2005 • 95573 Posts
Some opinions are better than others...especially when one of the opinions is being stated for the sole purpose of annoying other people and the person doesnt really believe it. Truth-slayer
Are you calling me a liar? Saying I fabricated an OPINION?
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#50 Malta_1980
Member since 2008 • 11890 Posts

if PS3 is being considered a sinking ship cause its loosing money to Sony then from a business point of view i can agree on that... however if people (haters) consider the PS3 a flop or sinking ship because its selling less / has the smallest install base compared to its competition than i think its wrong..

I personally think that PS3 might very well end up having a 35+ million install base by the time next gen kicks off, so i dont think that can be considered a flop in terms of success.. Obviously if you compare that to what previous SONY consoles did you can say it did not meet the expectations... but surely not a flop..

Cause by that logic only a few consoles cannot be considered flops since if we take that consoles should sell over 40/50 million in order to be considered a success only the NES, SNES, PS1 & PS2 make it in this list.... what should the other many consoles be considered ??????