What games or franchises do you think gamers are/were too harsh on?

@kejigoto: I wish they made a Pokémon spin-off that was for adults

Watch_Dogs. I remember back when this was initially set to release and friend pulled me into the hype-boat when I was trying to reserve my expectations and when the game came out, I immediately panned it in about an hour. Came back around Black Friday and played it without any hype, expectations, and loved the game. I still say that outside of any expectations that were initially set from the trailer, I still feel there was a lot of hype and inflated expectations the game started to get tagged on it ("It's gonna be the best game to have ever come out" is some of the opinions I remember hearing) and I feel that is what caused it to be knocked initially until some years later. It is a shame because it is a very fun game and the characters and lore are interesting, as well with the sequel improving and becoming more of what the first game was pushed to be.

@with_teeth26: This. I agree wholeheartedly. I kind of felt some of the criticism that was tacked on to the game later on was more so people trying to find more problems with it than there really was. I know one person I talked to about this had finally played through it and had a similar opinion and mentioned that some of the people who hated how Mass Effect 3 ended kind of brought that frustration along into Andromeda.

@judaspete: I think it is similar to what Raycevick said on the subject of Catalyst: it definitely is a great game, but the story and unnecessary additions like the skill tree is what slightly brings it down, but not by much.

@kejigoto: So I'm not the only one who notices this with Pokemon? Started realizing that after Pokemon Sword and eventually playing it.

this is another good one actually. I really enjoyed the stealth/hacking gameplay in Watch Dogs, even if the story/characters were pretty bland.

I actually bounced hard off the sequel though, I just found the went too far in the other direction and the characters were all super annoying.

@warmblur said:

@ghosts4ever said:

@warmblur said:

@ghosts4ever said:

@warmblur said:

Pirate opinions don't matter.

you cant debate with me. always loose debate.

still I respect you.

Sorry Ghost the GS community has spoken your opinion don't matter.

Thread no longer exist. Check

no evidence of me being pirate? check

Im too nice that I cant name call you like stupid or idiot or something.

Pirate opinions don't matter.

Is that a general fact?

So when the opinions of people, who play games they haven´t bought, doesn´t matter to you and those 56%, then i guess you and those 56% never read any game-reviews from game-magazine journalists, coz they also play and review a game they haven´t bought, hence...their opinon doesn´t matter.

On the other hand, you could as well just ask "Does the opinion of people with black skin really matter?" so that all the racists claim "Of course it does not matters!"

So what does that tell you about "opinions" and what is this telling about yourself and those 56%?

What's funny is that I think the story/characters were actually good and interesting, but it comes from either a 2nd or multiple playthroughs to get at what it's pointing towards with Aiden and the characters along with some of the lore tidbits scattered around.

The sequel I liked, but the DLC is where I felt this similar feeling with the characters. They became too pop culture reference and social media obsessed whereas in the base game they felt more focused with tidbits of this showing.

Actually, this immediately comes to mind now.

It's the best Bioshock game as far as i'm concerned. Had dumbshit takes from people before it was even released and after from both gamers and gaming critics alike.

Damn, too many lol.

I'll just go with one of my own bad takes, Super Mario Sunshine. Used to shit on that game so hard, as if didn't even deserve to be part of the series.

Game has its problems, sure. But overall it's a really good game with some truly great sections. My opinion of a game has never changed so drastically on a revisit.

Yeah, got pretty absurd on this board for a while there. It's been funny seeing the slow trickle of people finally coming around on the game though.

Yesterday went to visit a bud I hadn't talked to in like 4 years. Dude was just gushing about the game, probably completely unaware lol.

Was recently thinking about the irony in that Stray is basically the game that people incorrectly assumed Death Stranding to be. Yet people seem to love it.

@ConanTheStoner: you played Sunshine on PC, right? Tried to play it on Switch but it just didn’t feel right.

Death Stranding had some amazing horror elements to it. And then there’s the addicting game loop and fun game mechanics. I feel like the worst parts were the story and the combat. Hopefully that gets improved for the next one!

Ha, yeah trips me out when people say the story was "amazing", like wtf? MGS may have been batshit, but at least it was entertaining for the first few games. DS had some solid world building, interesting concepts going for it, but that moment to moment story was cheeks.

The stealth/combat issue seems tricky. The controls are already so damn stacked. Haven't thought it through tbh, but at a glance almost seems you'd need a separate control set depending on context.

Personally would like to see a sequel push in the other direction tbh. Double down on the man vs. harsh environment, ditch traditional combat. But I doubt that'll be the case.

Yup, was also disappointed with the Switch release. Took a lot of jumping through hoops, but eventually had it running and looking awesome on PC with proper controls.

@ConanTheStoner: Dude that big blob boss at the end.. so bad lol. which is weird, because Kojima can do so much better.

The Last of Us Part II

The game was pretty good imo. It has some of the best transition from action to stealth dynamics I've ever seen in gaming and also some of the best enemy AI I've ever seen

But people hated it cause of the SJW bs, that does exist, but its very minor in the bigger spectrum of things.

I always hear this argument but it doesnt make any sense since the first Crysis was eventualy ported to both PS3 and XBox 360 and it was very playable. Yeah, it wasnt as good as the PC version but what multiplat game was? It was still very much playable, open world and everything thus confirming it was possible.

This makes me believe the linearity in Crysis 2 was more of a design choice rather then hardware restrictability. I remember pc gamers were furious when Crysis 1 was anounced for consoles at the time... why? oh, because it devoided all their theories that Crysis 2 was "consoles fault"... tsk tsk

Big sky whale shit? Yeah. Boss fights in general felt clunky. Found myself exclusively using the choke wire in the Cliff Unger fights to make them more interesting.

Imo the only flashes of fun stealth/action were the Mule encampments, though admittedly still too basic. BT encounters just became snore after a while.

All things that could stand to be greatly improved, especially considering the types of games Kojimas directed in the past. Though again, just wish they'd take the good shit and run with it. Planning ahead, navigating tricky routes, creating infrastructure to help yourself and in turn, other players. That's the stuff that had me hooked, very well done and could easily be expanded upon.

FF15.

Yeah devs really deserved the hate especially the 1.0 release where the 2nd part of the game very unfinished, and devs add story via patches which pissed a lot of people. Still, the first part of the story was pretty awesome I really enjoyed the open world FF experience.

@ConanTheStoner: I was thinking of this lol. It was just a spam fest.

@SolidGame_basic:

Ah yeah. Was typical "hit the weak spot for MASSIVE DAMAGE" shit. Quad rockets at Higgs face every time he pops out of the bosses skin. Think I was more annoyed with how often it would spawn those jellyfish BTs. And you absolutely had to be stacked with weapons for that fight, which of course made it all that much more sluggish.

@vatususreturns: Crysis 1 on console was a joke at the time when it hit on 360/PS3 being parred way down and featuring a reworked nanosuit system from the second game which drastically decreased how versatile it was to the gameplay. Enemy AI was simplified and designs reduced down to make it so human soldiers and alien soldiers could use the same animations, attack patterns, all that stuff.

I'm not saying it was impossible to do more on the systems at the time, I'm saying they had a deadline to meet, two new platforms to develop for one of which was notorious for being difficult to develop for let alone port existing engines to, and this was the easiest way to get it done.

Wasn't until after they did Crysis 2 that they were able to go back and bring over the original with trimmed out content and systems from Crysis 2.

Play them back to back and the differences between them are striking in how they are designed. Crysis 2 was more about learning the hardware than it was pushing the franchise forward.

Marvel vs. Capcom Infinite.

I acknowledge all the criticisms: the story mode is disappointing, the art style is uninspired, the system has been downgraded from 3v3 to 2v2, popular X-Men characters like Wolverine and Deadpool are absent, and the gem system is too complicated for beginners.

That said, the core gameplay is very solid. It is very fast and well-paced, and the seemingly complex gem system can be used creatively once you get used to it. The freedom to formulate your own strategy prevents the game from becoming monotonous. The netcode also works very well.

As for new characters, we have Black Panther, Black Widow, Captain Marvel, Gamora, Ultron, and Winter Soldier from the Marvel side, and Jedah, Monster Hunter, Sigma, Megaman-X, from the Capcom side. It is a lot of fun to play with these new characters and learn their unique characteristics and movesets.

This is a game that has unfortunately become an internet meme because of Chun-Li's funny face, etc., but if you think of it as a pure fighting game, it is actually very well done.

I'll just mention GameCube and its library until I come to think of something better. Weird that something so damn good sold so damn little.

I have to repeat myself. No it wasnt as good as the PC version but it was doable and playable. I played both versions btw: PC and PS3. Have you? The console version was fine, very much playable. If its open world structure was doable then it was possible. Not consoles hardware fault. Now if you want to argue that Crysis 2 linearity for cinematic spectacle focus was due to modern military shooters being popular on console at the time that a whole another matter of discussion. But thats due to design decisions not hardware restrictability

Mister Hideo Kojima tries too hard to make something "BRANDNEW BREAKING THROUGH EVERYTHING WITH A BAM!!!" and risks falling on his ass while making himself look more and more like sum freakish weirdo who gets off on watching weird octopus-porn and stuff like that.

So i just can´t wait for his next game, i heard it shall be something....well.....totally new people have yet never seen before!

As to DEATH STRANDING, i must say i like it, especially when playing with my VR-Goggles!

Yeah. Honestly do feel the hate was deserved. And the contrast between it and the labor of love that is DBFZ? Just a terrible look really, the timing of those games couldn't have been more hilarious. Though regardless, even on its own merits it came across as a shit effort.

But I'd agree that a lot of the hate came from a simpleton place. "Game is shite", no not really, game is actually pretty sick. Started with a strong core and could have grown into something awesome.

@wladolfputler: lol, it’s in VR??

I never played it because of the reception it got. I do miss Marvel vs Capcom 2.. that was legendary. Remember going to the arcades to see it too. Why did Capcom throw this franchise out the window?

Yeah MVC2 definitely an all timer.

MVCI issues are on Marvel themselves. The part that Capcom was in charge of, the actual gameplay, was dope.

Would love to see a return to form, have Capcom work with a team at Marvel that knows what's what. But at this point, would rather just see Capcom make a Capcom Allstars. They have enough IP to pull it off, wouldn't have to gamble on the whims of modern Marvel.

I mean, still sucks. No doubt it would be best to get a proper MVC. But I'd rather see an unrestricted Capcom give it their best effort on a vs. style game.

Edit: Mang, imagine a Capcom vs. Konami lol. MGS, Contra, Suikoden, Bomberman, Castlevania, Silent Hill, etc. Could make for a crazy ass roster.

@ConanTheStoner: lol. Someone needs to buy Konami. So many great IPs. Maybe Capcom should buy them? Lol

@SolidGame_basic:

Yeah, probably the only case in gaming in which I wouldn't mind seeing an acquisition. Though from what I understand, Konami is doing very well for themselves.

Still, would be nice to see them license out their IPs for bigger titles. Or in the case of this convo, use of their characters.

@ConanTheStoner: looks like they’re starting to get back into it. The Ninja Turtles Collection, new Bomberman game, and supposedly a new Silent Hill

@SolidGame_basic:

Oh nice. Admittedly haven't kept up much with gaming news for a while. Did seem odd that they wanted to downscale traditional gaming output to such an extent. They had that one mobile hit, promoted the guy to executive level and he decided to gut traditional gaming, but.... just always seemed like why not both? It's not as if their traditional games weren't still very profitable lol.

Glad to hear they're coming back around.

Just read this bit

Another notable element in these financial results, though this is probably wishful thinking, is that Konami references Metal Gear several times as one of its biggest franchises. The financials include a note that the Metal Gear series has sold 58.3 million units, making it Konami's second-highest selling series after Winning Eleven / eFootball. Given today's apparent Silent Hill leak,and Konami's aggression in going after it(opens in new tab), that may not be the only classic series that has a future.

Would be cool.

@ConanTheStoner: yea I remember you said you’d be ok with a non Kojima MGS as long as they retain the talent

@SolidGame_basic:

Yep. For sure it wouldn't be the same. And I wouldn't want the new director to even try to emulate Kojima, bring your own style plz.

Doesn't mean they couldn't make another great playing stealth action game in that same universe though. Retain the sandbox style play and additional wacky options that MGS is known for, I'd be down.

A few that come to mind are:

- Final Fantasy XIII

- Final Fantasy XV

- Marvel vs Capcom Infinite

- Mass Effect Andromeda

Certainly not the best games those franchises have to offer but still pretty good games in general.

Nope, but with "vorpX" i practically can play all games in VR, either in Full-VR (with certain tweaks, if it´s as well supported by vorpX!) or, as i am mostly doing it, on huge theater screens or theater-screens being ultra-wide. That´s how i am playing DEATH STRANDING, on a huge theater screen and i lllllluuuuv it that way!

Actually i am even playing pixel-sidescroller shooter on theater screens too, i just can´t go back to my tiny 31inch monitor coz everything is so small compared to my virtual theater screen in vorpX! So yes, i am always wearing them stupid goggles when playing my games, sum pain in the ass on hot summer-days but the hell, you can´t have everything.

From butthurt trolls? The Last of Us 2. too insecure/sensitive to enjoy what is literally one of the top 10 greatest games ever made and arguably the best game of the last generation.

From people in general?

Dark Souls 2. Yes it might be the worst FromSoft game, but its so much better than anything else in the genre. a "bad" Souls game is still easily an 8/10 (it has 91 on MC)

@st_monica: My issue with MvCI was the fact that it was trying to cash in on the MCU fame and roster was changed drastically because of it. I have wanted to try it but considering how late in the game I am even thinking about this, I am wondering if it is even worth it.

I would defend the devs on the point that at least they were actually trying to update and improve the game continually that it drastically changed from the initial release. I'm still frustrated that they never finished the last bit of dlc and alternate ending because the lore of the game is actually really interesting and was worth the rest of the content.

Please tell me that Death Stranding was more than the "Amazon Delivery Service" meme it eventually became. I would like to try it but the initial view when it was still releasing pushed me away from playing it.

Solid list. I'm still iffy on Infinite, but would like to give it a shot. XIII I always felt was overhated and I am glad I started having an interest in playing the game later after the heat around it died out.

Also, thanks for suggesting an Xbox. Got a Series X and love it.

Yes I have played both versions (PC and 360 plus Switch) and the PC version is vastly superior in every possible way including having a completely different nano suit system which changes how the game plays and flows.

Using the Crysis 2 engine to develop a Crysis 1 port sans certain sections and with a new nano suit system doesn't exactly prove Crysis 2 wasn't held back because of console specific hardware.

In fact once consoles were introduced the openness of the first game went away as even Crysis 3 couldn't get back to the former glory and had to keep elements people didn't like about Crysis 2 like the city location, linear setup, and smaller maps. Despite all the criticism those elements received in Crysis 2 they had to remain. Weird.

Also weird that Warhead never got a port off PC despite using CryEngine 2 and having similar specs to the first game yet being much better optimized, getting better reviews, having improved AI, DX9 support, mid range GPUs getting better performance, and more that should have made it work perfectly on console yet all that got tossed for Crysis 2 which did come to console.

But I'm sure leaving behind all those improvements, never porting over the highly regarded single-player expansion, and all that has nothing to do with the fact that the 360/PS3 weren't all that equipped to handle a game like Crysis hence all the changes when they ported the original after Crysis 2 released. Or is it normal to release a sequel in March 2011 on 360/PS3 and then port the original over months later in November 2011 with reworked mechanics to make it work on console? Cause that doesn't seem very normal. Almost seems like they learned how to make the engine work with Crysis 2 then applied that knowledge to get Crysis 1 running using the systems of Crysis 2 which was built with console in mind hence the whole new nano suit system and all that. And cut content to "improve pacing". But no expansion. Ever. The one that actually improved on the original.

dishonored 2. refined and improved on the original in just about every aspect. critics loved it. i loved it. but lukewarm reception and sales from gamers, and now the series is paused indefinitely. i read deathloop is a continuation of the dishonored universe, supposedly there's subtle clues and easter eggs throughout the game that link the two, but it's definitely no spiritual successor, and far from being close to either dishonored game quality wise.

if youre curious just try it. pick it up on a sale.

there's a lot of very cool stuff and clever ideas in the game, and it's incredibly stylish and well presented. there's a lot to like in that gameplay loop, just go in with an open mind. it's definitely not going to be to everyone's taste but that's a good thing to me.

if there was more to the combat and stealth it could've been something very special (very limited stealth options in what is essentially a survival game being particularly frustrating coming from kojima)

I like it. but its not as good as original.

too much focus on fantasy and witches and more action focus compare to original which was pure stealth.

story was also better in original.

@Macutchi: Cool. Is it even worth picking up the PS5 version, or does the PS4 version hold up pretty well?

@blackacezero777: 100% get the ps5 version. it's the director's cut so you'll get a ton of improvements and extra content. it's a gorgeous looking game on ps4 so should look even better on ps5. i'll definitely get the upgrade when i come back to playing it again.

ps5 director's cut is generally around £20 here in uk so to me it's not worth the time / effort trying to find the ps4 version under £10 and upgrading it to save a few quid, but i'm happy to take a punt on a game for that price

@Macutchi: Got it. I'll keep it in mind and put that on the list for when I get a PS5. I know games like that go on sale ever so often, so it should be a decent price by the time I get my hands on one.

@uninspiredcup: Bioshock 2 is a good one. Improves on the gameplay of the first, and compliments it well story-wise. Like how individualism and collectivism can both lead to bad shit, the lesson being avoid hyper-devotion to any one cause or world-view. And Sofia Lamb is just as terrifying as Andrew Ryan.

@blackacezero777: Nice. Glad you’re enjoying the Xbox Series X. Hoping to pick one up myself before the end of this year.

@Archangel3371: Do so. The improvements on the Series X are worth it, especially in the long-run. I cannot tell you how much of a different experience it is playing Sonic Unleashed on this console.

Rage 2. It's a bland open world ... , it has some technical issues, and they might as well not have put vehicle combat in the game ... but the FPS combat is alot of fun and I enjoyed the game about as much as the recent Doom games.

Crash Wrath of Cortex ... admittedly haven't played it in 15 plus years but far as I can remember it's basically crash 3.5 , which based on the reviews of Warped would make a good game.

Just finished Director's Cut on PS5. Wow, this is a beautiful game. It is eye candy through and through.

I read along your replies and agree. This game has some really solid fundamentals. The world building is fun and addicting. The gameplay mechanics are solid. The combat is a mix of good and bad, but overall I thought it was ok. The concept and premise are very interesting. The cast and voice acting is top tier. And the soundtrack and game world/environment are awesome. Truly.

And then there is the story. And the cutscenes. And the constant interruptions. If ever there was a game that did not value your time or agency as a player -- this is it. It was so frustrating! It's a shame because the actual gameplay sections are so fun and enjoyable. But then there is a cutscene. Followed by a codec. Followed by more interrupting dialogue. It's like being in an abusive relationship.

The Legend of Zelda series. It seems to me that the more hardcore fans demand that each mainline Zelda title meet a higher standard than the previous title. If a title does not exceed the standard of the previous game, they denounce it.

having a completely different nano suit system which changes how the game plays and flows.

Crytek had to fit the nano suit system on a controler. Understandable. If they wanted to they could still adopt different systems on consoles vs PC on its sequel. They just chose not to. That still has jack sh*t to do with the "weak power of consoles" argument PC fanboys claimed loudly back at the time

Using the Crysis 2 engine to develop a Crysis 1 port sans certain sections and with a new nano suit system doesn't exactly prove Crysis 2 wasn't held back because of console specific hardware.

So? Why does it matter what engine they used if it made it run? They did it run on consoles good enough and thats all that matter. They had Crysis 2 engine already optimized for consoles, dont see why they wouldnt use it. If it made Crysis run fine on consoles why would that matter?

In fact once consoles were introduced the openness of the first game went away as even Crysis 3 couldn't get back to the former glory and had to keep elements people didn't like about Crysis 2 like the city location, linear setup, and smaller maps. Despite all the criticism those elements received in Crysis 2 they had to remain. Weird.

Again, that was a design choice, not a hardware restrictability issue. Linear cinematic games were very popular at the time on console and EA wanted a piece of that pie. Simple. Its not weird at all.

But I'm sure leaving behind all those improvements, never porting over the highly regarded single-player expansion, and all that has nothing to do with the fact that the 360/PS3 weren't all that equipped to handle a game like Crysis hence all the changes when they ported the original after Crysis 2 released.

Funny you mention warhead because it was a way more linear experience and thus not really more demanding that the original crysis. Warhead also isnt part of the most recent Crysis Remastered trilogy... is it because the current consoles also couldnt run it? o_0 lol gtfo here

Or is it normal to release a sequel in March 2011 on 360/PS3 and then port the original over months later in November 2011 with reworked mechanics to make it work on console?

Pretty normal. What isnt normal about that? Crysis wasnt the first PC exclusive to be ported later down the line to consoles with significant changes to gameplay mechanics.

And cut content to "improve pacing". But no expansion. Ever. The one that actually improved on the original

The only real content they cut was a terrible TERRIBLE level that hurt the original crysis. And one very linear and not hardware demanding at all when compared to the rest of the game. so no, it wasnt because of the "weak powah of consoles". And, again, the expansion might have been good but it was that, an expansion. For some reason EA or crytek never did bother porting it, not even today cause its still not included on the remastered trilogy pack

The way I see it is that PC gamers cried foul that Crysis 2 was as it was because of consoles weak hardware. Crysis being ported and very much functional on consoles proved most of the changes were rather design choices in order to pursue the CoD crowds cash cows. I still remember very much how p*ssed they were when EA anounced a port for the consoles. Why? Because all their bullsh*t was on display for everyone to see it just like the million and millions of bullshots pc fanboys posted on internet forums when Crysis, not even modded, looked anywhere close to hundreds of the semi-realistic images they posted constantly anywhere "best graphics" came around. All their bullsh*t was on display for everyone to see