Which GS review was the bigger crime? Mass Effect, Twilight Princess, or R&C

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"][QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"]

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Mass Effect -- It should've been a 9.0-9.5. The only issues it had were some little framerate drops and texture pop-in.BrownWalrus

Those are pretty major issues for a finished game......and the driving in mass effect was broken...

Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home.

There were definitely more than just "little" framerate drops and texture pop ins...Great game, but pretty damn buggy. I would say 8.5 was accurate, easily 9 if they fixed those issues. That's part of why ME on the PC got 9.

You think words such as "it's like playing a different game" mean nothing?

Not every player experiences bugs. I didn't experience a single bug my 3 times through on Mass Effect, yet I experienced bugs in both games that received 10's here (GTA IV and MGS4). Now, I know 10 =/= perfect, so I wouldn't dock a great game for some bugs that don't break the game.

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home. foxhound_fox

Your just clinging on to straws here.....The mako was broken and People won't admit it I dont' want a quick travel I have a mod on oblivion(pc) to disable it thats how much I despise it, But if somethings broken don't deny it

[QUOTE="blackeneddeath"]

[QUOTE="EuroMafia"]Twilight Princess, how was that not AAA worthy?All_that_is_Man

dated midi music, no voice acting... But still the game overall is a AAA experience imo

its not no voice acting because it can't support it, its because link is to cool to talk....it wouldn't be a zelda game with voice acting because people would argue with what link should sound like.

How un-nextgen of you..

but i agree,Zelda with voice acting would be cheesy..and it would probably resemble the cartoon from the late 80's.

Twilight Princess was great game.

funny how reviewers criticized TP for being the same as OoT,Yet i seem to recall GS reviewers practically wetting their pants to a certain 10/10 game for offering the same mechanics as it's predecessors but whatever...this is why i ignore scores/reviews

Mass Effect was also a great underscored gem..

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"][QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"]

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Mass Effect -- It should've been a 9.0-9.5. The only issues it had were some little framerate drops and texture pop-in.BioShockOwnz

Those are pretty major issues for a finished game......and the driving in mass effect was broken...

Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home.

There were definitely more than just "little" framerate drops and texture pop ins...Great game, but pretty damn buggy. I would say 8.5 was accurate, easily 9 if they fixed those issues. That's part of why ME on the PC got 9.

You think words such as "it's like playing a different game" mean nothing?

Not every player experiences bugs. I didn't experience a single bug my 3 times through on Mass Effect, yet I experienced bugs in both games that received 10's here (GTA IV and MGS4). Now, I know 10 =/= perfect, so I wouldn't dock a great game for some bugs that don't break the game.

See, this statement would hold true if it were on a pc where hardware is different, or if the general populations xbox were broken somehow...but they arn't...

You experience the bugs, you just either don't really notice them and don't look for bugs in games or you ignore them and cling on to straws and try to justify this game and admit it has no faults.

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home. All_that_is_Man

Your just clinging on to straws here.....The mako was broken and People won't admit it I dont' want a quick travel I have a mod on oblivion(pc) to disable it thats how much I despise it, But if somethings broken don't deny it

It was broken in your opinion, which is obviously not shared by everyone (including myself).

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"][QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"]

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Mass Effect -- It should've been a 9.0-9.5. The only issues it had were some little framerate drops and texture pop-in.BioShockOwnz

Those are pretty major issues for a finished game......and the driving in mass effect was broken...

Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home.

There were definitely more than just "little" framerate drops and texture pop ins...Great game, but pretty damn buggy. I would say 8.5 was accurate, easily 9 if they fixed those issues. That's part of why ME on the PC got 9.

You think words such as "it's like playing a different game" mean nothing?

Not every player experiences bugs. I didn't experience a single bug my 3 times through on Mass Effect, yet I experienced bugs in both games that received 10's here (GTA IV and MGS4). Now, I know 10 =/= perfect, so I wouldn't dock a great game for some bugs that don't break the game.

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

[QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"][QUOTE="blackeneddeath"]

[QUOTE="EuroMafia"]Twilight Princess, how was that not AAA worthy?Cocacolacowboy

dated midi music, no voice acting... But still the game overall is a AAA experience imo

its not no voice acting because it can't support it, its because link is to cool to talk....it wouldn't be a zelda game with voice acting because people would argue with what link should sound like.

How un-nextgen of you..

but i agree,Zelda with voice acting would be cheesy..and it would probably resemble the cartoon from the late 80's.

Twilight Princess was great game.

funny how reviewers criticized TP for being the same as OoT,Yet i seem to recall GS reviewers practically wetting their pants to a certain 10/10 game for offering the same mechanics as it's predecessors but whatever...this is why i ignore scores/reviews

This

And PLEASE, NO VOICE in my Zelda!!!

I want them to talk jibberish like Midna. Say its Hyrulean and make them talk a made up language like the elfs in Lord of the Rings, or Shadow of the Colossus

Mass Effect.

TP was OoT with a new skin.

Haziqonfire

Disagreed, TP felt refined, with a ton of fresh ideas.

If anything it needed a bump in production values (Voice acting, Orchestral Music).

Anyonen who says TP was just a new OoT never played TP as far as I'm concerned.

[QUOTE="Cocacolacowboy"][QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"][QUOTE="blackeneddeath"]

[QUOTE="EuroMafia"]Twilight Princess, how was that not AAA worthy?Fawlcon_Pawnch

dated midi music, no voice acting... But still the game overall is a AAA experience imo

its not no voice acting because it can't support it, its because link is to cool to talk....it wouldn't be a zelda game with voice acting because people would argue with what link should sound like.

How un-nextgen of you..

but i agree,Zelda with voice acting would be cheesy..and it would probably resemble the cartoon from the late 80's.

Twilight Princess was great game.

funny how reviewers criticized TP for being the same as OoT,Yet i seem to recall GS reviewers practically wetting their pants to a certain 10/10 game for offering the same mechanics as it's predecessors but whatever...this is why i ignore scores/reviews

This

And PLEASE, NO VOICE in my Zelda!!!

I want them to talk jibberish like Midna. Say its Hyrulean and make them talk a made up language like the elfs in Lord of the Rings, or Shadow of the Colossus

I wish more games used made up or other languages. Specially games involving more then one race.

They could use Hebraic or Latin :)

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

BrownWalrus

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

Mass Effect was the biggest rob ever.

[QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"]

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home. The_Game21x

Your just clinging on to straws here.....The mako was broken and People won't admit it I dont' want a quick travel I have a mod on oblivion(pc) to disable it thats how much I despise it, But if somethings broken don't deny it

It was broken in your opinion, which is obviously not shared by everyone (including myself).

In my opinion, and in the general public's opinion since thats one of the flaws most reviews bring up

...man I can't move these straws...because someone seems to be clinging to them >.>

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"]

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

BioShockOwnz

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

Do you wanna argue that the same doesn't hold true for TP, or are you gonna spin it around and say it was a completely different game and no similar to OOC at all? Why don't you explain then how GTA4 got a 10 when it was more of the same, minus a lot of the fun of the previous titles? Your arguments basically holds true for most games then.

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"]

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

BioShockOwnz

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

High Five!

In my opinion, and in the general public's opinion since thats one of the flaws most reviews bring up

...man I can't move these straws...because someone seems to be clinging to them >.>

All_that_is_Man

Who said 9 was even perfect? It seems like games that score in the 9's can't have bugs, but that's entirely untrue. Many games that have scored 9.5-10's have bugs, because a 10 =/= perfect. And you say people are clinging to straws. Errr, no. GTA IV is my favorite game this year thus far (which will be replaced by LittleBigPlanet), but I admit it had bugs, but not everyone experienced the same bugs as I did, because it's open in its structure, much like Mass Effect. That's a fact. Not everyone experiences these bugs.

Both TP and Mass effect deserved their scores.

TP was a been there done that type of deal and mass effect had horrible technical issues and boring sidequests bogging it down.

Can't comment on ratchet though. But from the looks of it it kind of looks like an 8.0 game at least.

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"][QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"]

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]Nope, not at all. They were pretty minor in the game, actually. I handled the driving fine. People like to say it was "broken", but those people just never learned how to drive the Mako. Some gamers want instant gratification, then if they don't get it, they cry all the way home. All_that_is_Man

Your just clinging on to straws here.....The mako was broken and People won't admit it I dont' want a quick travel I have a mod on oblivion(pc) to disable it thats how much I despise it, But if somethings broken don't deny it

It was broken in your opinion, which is obviously not shared by everyone (including myself).

In my opinion, and in the general public's opinion since thats one of the flaws most reviews bring up

...man I can't move these straws...because someone seems to be clinging to them >.>

A Reviewer (or number of reviewers) opinion does not equal that of the general public...

If anyone's grasping for straws here, it's you. You're trying so hard to convince us that our opinions are wrong. You have your opinion, and I have mine. Nothing you say is going to change that.

The version of Mass Effect I played got a 9.0, which isn't bad by any standard.

The Twilight princess review was dead on.

So I guess that leaves R&C. I haven't played it, but thats my only choice left, so I'll go with it. :P

Why don't you explain then how GTA4 got a 10 when it was more of the same, minus a lot of the fun of the previous titles?BrownWalrus

I can see where this thread is headed, and I don't like it. :(

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"][QUOTE="BrownWalrus"]

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

BrownWalrus

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

Do you wanna argue that the same doesn't hold true for TP, or are you gonna spin it around and say it was a completely different game and no similar to OOC at all? Why don't you explain then how GTA4 got a 10 when it was more of the same, minus a lot of the fun of the previous titles? Your arguments basically holds true for most games then.

Nope. Twilight Princess was an 8.0 for me. I just didn't enjoy it that much. I can understand why some do, but it just wasn't for me. GTA IV brought a more realistic world with brand new characters, an interesting tale, and some fun gameplay, including the brand new cover system, OTS camera, Euphoria physics, and so on. Sure, you can have you personal taste on it, but it brought a lot new, but it did go in a more realistic direction, and maybe taking out the fun for those that wanted the over-the-top serial killer mayhem, and that's why we play Saints Row 2. While some may not like the realistic direction of GTA IV, it brought a lot of new, while something like R&C: ToD stuck to its rather stale past. Sure, it was fun, but also boring since it was like the previous games in the franchise, but not the best.

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"][QUOTE="BrownWalrus"]

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

BioShockOwnz

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

Do you wanna argue that the same doesn't hold true for TP, or are you gonna spin it around and say it was a completely different game and no similar to OOC at all? Why don't you explain then how GTA4 got a 10 when it was more of the same, minus a lot of the fun of the previous titles? Your arguments basically holds true for most games then.

Nope. Twilight Princess was an 8.0 for me. I just didn't enjoy it that much. I can understand why some do, but it just wasn't for me. GTA IV brought a more realistic world with brand new characters, an interesting tale, and some fun gameplay, including the brand new cover system, OTS camera, and so on. Sure, you can have you personal taste on it, butt it brought a lot new, but it did go in a more realistic direction, and maybe taking out the fun for those that wanted the over-the-top serial killer mayhem, and that's why we play Saints Row 2. While some may not like the realistic direction of GTA IV, it brought a lot of new, while something like R&C: ToD stuck to its rather stale past. Sure, it was fun, but also boring since it was like the previous games in the franchise, but not the best.

Brand new tale, interesting characters? That means it brought something new? Every new game brings those things. As for the other features, basically everything Saints Row had. Hell, it basically took everything that Saints Row already had from a while back. If you think making a cover system and a new camera is revolutionary, then so is bringing SIXAXIS to Ratchet and clank, as well as the hacking minigame, etc.

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]

Nope. Twilight Princess was an 8.0 for me. I just didn't enjoy it that much. I can understand why some do, but it just wasn't for me. GTA IV brought a more realistic world with brand new characters, an interesting tale, and some fun gameplay, including the brand new cover system, OTS camera, and so on. Sure, you can have you personal taste on it, butt it brought a lot new, but it did go in a more realistic direction, and maybe taking out the fun for those that wanted the over-the-top serial killer mayhem, and that's why we play Saints Row 2. While some may not like the realistic direction of GTA IV, it brought a lot of new, while something like R&C: ToD stuck to its rather stale past. Sure, it was fun, but also boring since it was like the previous games in the franchise, but not the best.

BrownWalrus

Brand new tale, interesting characters? That means it brought something new? Every new game brings those things. As for the other features, basically everything Saints Row had. Hell, it basically took everything that Saints Row already had from a while back. If you think making a cover system and a new camera is revolutionary, then so is bringing SIXAXIS to Ratchet and clank, as well as the hacking minigame, etc.

WHo said anything was revolutionary? Don't put words in my mouth. It's new to the series and genre.

Sixaxis controls to take out a wall and hack is and was a joke. It's nothing to add to the actual gameplay, just a gimmick.

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"]

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

BioShockOwnz

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

I'm sorry but you're pretty wrong. If it's not borken, why fix it. If it was more of the same, reviews would have noticed and given the game progessively worse scores. In reality, GR says up your arsenal was the best. In fact, when they tried to change the forumla with deadlocked, reviews did not like it.

Sure tools of desctruction wasn't the best R&C but it definitly deserved at least an 8.5, and insomniac IS creative.

tie between tp and me.

i thought r+c review was completely on the mark excpet for the variety complaint

[QUOTE="All_that_is_Man"]

In my opinion, and in the general public's opinion since thats one of the flaws most reviews bring up

...man I can't move these straws...because someone seems to be clinging to them >.>

BioShockOwnz

Who said 9 was even perfect? It seems like games that score in the 9's can't have bugs, but that's entirely untrue. Many games that have scored 9.5-10's have bugs, because a 10 =/= perfect. And you say people are clinging to straws. Errr, no. GTA IV is my favorite game this year thus far (which will be replaced by LittleBigPlanet), but I admit it had bugs, but not everyone experienced the same bugs as I did, because it's open in its structure, much like Mass Effect. That's a fact. Not everyone experiences these bugs.

Tho Grand Theft auto had bugs....Quite a few it had enough good to justify those bugs and the good out weighed the bad, while mass effect didn't have all that extra to weigh in favor

Grand Theft Auto had loads extra and you can really tell the developers went out of their way to make a great game.

Mass Effect was a real cinematic experience for me. I absolutely loved the Mako. Especially the last sequence you are in it. I haven't played the others so I can't really say what I think in relation to which was the biggest "crime", but I do think Mass Effect deserves a better score than 8.5.

I think Mass Effect should've swaped scores with Call of Duty 4. That game is waaay overrated in my opinion.

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]

Nope. Twilight Princess was an 8.0 for me. I just didn't enjoy it that much. I can understand why some do, but it just wasn't for me. GTA IV brought a more realistic world with brand new characters, an interesting tale, and some fun gameplay, including the brand new cover system, OTS camera, and so on. Sure, you can have you personal taste on it, butt it brought a lot new, but it did go in a more realistic direction, and maybe taking out the fun for those that wanted the over-the-top serial killer mayhem, and that's why we play Saints Row 2. While some may not like the realistic direction of GTA IV, it brought a lot of new, while something like R&C: ToD stuck to its rather stale past. Sure, it was fun, but also boring since it was like the previous games in the franchise, but not the best.

BioShockOwnz

Brand new tale, interesting characters? That means it brought something new? Every new game brings those things. As for the other features, basically everything Saints Row had. Hell, it basically took everything that Saints Row already had from a while back. If you think making a cover system and a new camera is revolutionary, then so is bringing SIXAXIS to Ratchet and clank, as well as the hacking minigame, etc.

WHo said anything was revolutionary? Don't put words in my mouth. It's new to the series and genre.

Sixaxis controls to take out a wall and hack is and was a joke. It's nothing to add to the actual gameplay, just a gimmick.

You're getting TOO specific with genere, or you haven't noticed that there have been many third person shooters that have had cover systems besides GTA4.

And hey!! I liked those hacking minigames in R&C, thought they were fun and a good break from the normal gameplay (though I did not like other uses of the sixaxis)

[QUOTE="BrownWalrus"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]

Nope. Twilight Princess was an 8.0 for me. I just didn't enjoy it that much. I can understand why some do, but it just wasn't for me. GTA IV brought a more realistic world with brand new characters, an interesting tale, and some fun gameplay, including the brand new cover system, OTS camera, and so on. Sure, you can have you personal taste on it, butt it brought a lot new, but it did go in a more realistic direction, and maybe taking out the fun for those that wanted the over-the-top serial killer mayhem, and that's why we play Saints Row 2. While some may not like the realistic direction of GTA IV, it brought a lot of new, while something like R&C: ToD stuck to its rather stale past. Sure, it was fun, but also boring since it was like the previous games in the franchise, but not the best.

BioShockOwnz

Brand new tale, interesting characters? That means it brought something new? Every new game brings those things. As for the other features, basically everything Saints Row had. Hell, it basically took everything that Saints Row already had from a while back. If you think making a cover system and a new camera is revolutionary, then so is bringing SIXAXIS to Ratchet and clank, as well as the hacking minigame, etc.

WHo said anything was revolutionary? Don't put words in my mouth. It's new to the series and genre.

Sixaxis controls to take out a wall and hack is and was a joke. It's nothing to add to the actual gameplay, just a gimmick.

You obviously have a strong opinion and stick to it very well. Fine, here's something else then. More of the same, alright? What about the fact that it's the most refined R & C out with easily some of the most impressive production values seen to date. Add to that the fact that the game has virtually no bugs and is lengthy, plus extremely fun. It may not add much to what has already been seen, but it definitely doesn't sacrifice anything either. If anything, it should have scored at least an 8 for just how refinished, polished, and fun it was. You put it down for it being more of the same and justify the 7.5 score yet are not bothered at all by the fact that Mass Effect was not released in the best way it could have been, which is exactly why the PC version is so much better, more optimized, and "different" than the 360 one. Quite a rare seeing how PC ports usually get dumbed down from their console counterparts. It's quite rare to see a game score higher on a PC but this is exactly what happened here simply because the game was fixed and refined more for the PC.

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"][QUOTE="BrownWalrus"]

The majority experienced bugs/slowdown/popin, etc. Why do you think just about (if not every) review mentioned that? Fine, let me ask you a question. Can you honestly say that Mass effect deserves that .5 (keep in mind it was a 8.5, still a helluva good score) more than R & C deserved at least 1 point more? It was a 7.5, that's just horrible. I know it's your opinion and all and i respect that, but you have to consider that 8.5 is still a great score and not far off from AAA at all (considering the average and all) but R & C was very far off from at least an 8.5. I'm not entirely saying that ME did not deserve a 9, or that TP did not deserve a 9, but i simply think that R & C deserved a higher score far more than either of those games.

munu9

Yup. R&C: ToD was just more of the same. And it wasn't even the best R&C. Much like Wipeout HD, sure... it's fun, but after milking the same damn thing for so long, it starts to wear out its welcome. How many R&C (including spinoffs) have there been in this short amount of time. It's time to change up the formula and get a little creative, Insomniac.

I'm sorry but you're pretty wrong. If it's not borken, why fix it. If it was more of the same, reviews would have noticed and given the game progessively worse scores. In reality, GR says up your arsenal was the best. In fact, when they tried to change the forumla with deadlocked, reviews did not like it.

Sure tools of desctruction wasn't the best R&C but it definitly deserved at least an 8.5, and insomniac IS creative.

Well if its not broken...Dont' fix it ..Change it and mold it for the better don't keep it the same or else you'll never go any where

ratchet and tp both got the scores they deserved if you ask me. zelda maybe could been 9.0

mass effect havent played so cant say

Well if its not broken...Dont' fix it ..Change it and mold it for the better don't keep it the same or else you'll never go any where

All_that_is_Man

What same or what different is hard to objectify. I could say that new weapons system, flying, level design, and boss battle types could be different. Which is what each R&C game had. (besides size matters)

Mass Effect's story was probably my favorite this generation so far, the last few hours were freaking amazing. I think a 9.0 would have been appropriate, the only flaws it had were framerate issues in certain areas, they weren't present in the whole game.

Twilight Princess was great too, but I didn't care for the wolf levels much. And there's nothing wrong with being "OoT in a new skin" ;) hopesfall2own

i agree,nothing wrong it it.just like theres nothing wrong with MGS4 and GTA4 being nothing but "their older predecessors in new skin" :P

There is more than one way to get a 10 that actually does not involve the game being more fun. Same with movies, people gave Schindlers List a 10, but it lacked the fun of movies like Rambo. But who would argue that Schindlers List should deserve a lower score than Rambo because it wasn't as fun as Rambo.

People can always make better graphics than GTA 4, people can come up with a better soundtrack than GTA 4, people can have more gameplay options or more activities than GTA 4, but few could ever make the masterful and moving story as GTA 4 across all media. Which is what makes GTA 4 timeless, and what makes it one of the greatest games ever made.