Why do people say that MGS4 cant be done on th 360?

(Please note this is not a lemming thread, just a question)

I have personaly excepted the fact that MGS4 will never be on th e360. But what irritates me the most is the fact that everyone says that MGS4 is, "too advanced for the 360" How is it too advanced, because of the Camo. So it can mimic the background, why cant th e360 do that. I dosent seem that super complecated. I still refuse to believe that this game cannot be done on 360 Hardware.  

Kojima said it himself, guess thats where its coming from.

All the people I hear that say that around here are qualified, experienced developers that have worked on projects for both machines and have an intimate knowledge of what each machine is capable of.karicha9

:lol: Awesome.

coz kojima said this

"But like I said, MGS4 is aimed for the movie theatre, it's aimed for the PS3, so the game's scenario and graphics need this theatre-type hardware. It's when a producer has a game that can work on the 'DVD level' that a game will go multiplatform", he says. Sorry kids. Your "OMGMGS4360" banners will have to come out another day.

ahh see thats y 

I think its part of Sony's standards and practises to make every company working on exclusive title to recite the following

"This BLANK could only be done on the PS3" Its pretty pathetic they make every dev say that. I'm sure even the developers of Genji said the same thing.

All the people I hear that say that around here are qualified, experienced developers that have worked on projects for both machines and have an intimate knowledge of what each machine is capable of.karicha9

It can... MGS4 as last talked about by Kojima cannot even be done on the PS3 under normal circumstances. Kojima said he needed the 50GB Bluray disc because the uncompressed 5.1/7.1 sound and textures took up so much room. Factor 5 said that it is easier to build a game on the PS3 and port it to the 360 than vice-versa.

MGS4 will be optimised for the Cell and PS3 hardware but there is nothing to say that it is not possible on the 360. It will just take some time and work to port it over. The 360 and PS3 are so similar in terms of power that I would not be surprised if they share many games early in this generation.

I would rather see MGS4 on the PC than the 360.
foxhound_fox

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :| 

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :| 

CQCmasta

You didn't prove much of anything in your post...

[QUOTE="CQCmasta"]

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :|

musicalmac

You didn't prove much of anything in your post...

wot didnt i prove enough of, straight from the source himself kojima said that. 

[QUOTE="musicalmac"][QUOTE="CQCmasta"]

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :|

CQCmasta

You didn't prove much of anything in your post...

wot didnt i prove enough of, straight from the source himself kojima said that. 

Wheres the link to this interview/statement by Kojima?

[QUOTE="musicalmac"][QUOTE="CQCmasta"]

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :|

CQCmasta

You didn't prove much of anything in your post...

wot didnt i prove enough of, straight from the source himself kojima said that. 

I don't think it proves anything.

[QUOTE="CQCmasta"][QUOTE="musicalmac"][QUOTE="CQCmasta"]

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :|

Nagidar

You didn't prove much of anything in your post...

wot didnt i prove enough of, straight from the source himself kojima said that.

Wheres the link to this interview/statement by Kojima?

oh http://kotaku.com/gaming/go307/feature-talkin-metal-gear-with-hideo-kojima-248695.php

To be perfectly honest I am sure it could be done on the 360 but it would probably be on a few cd's!Ericvon71

Yeah that's how i see it.

Ok... so if you believe Kojima... completely up to you of course... that would mean you would have to believe Ubisoft and their recent rediculous claim that the things being done in the new Splinter Cell (that is exclusive to the X360) can not be done on the PS3. So I ask you this.... do you believe them?moohan

lol at ubisoft, your right it is a stupid claim but don't you get the idea that mgs4 is just to big for the x360, if a port comes just expect more than one disc to come with the case and booklet. blu ray does have its advantages in storage space.

[QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="CQCmasta"][QUOTE="musicalmac"][QUOTE="CQCmasta"]

but in my post just then it says its practically not possible on the xbox 360 :|

CQCmasta

You didn't prove much of anything in your post...

wot didnt i prove enough of, straight from the source himself kojima said that.

Wheres the link to this interview/statement by Kojima?

oh http://kotaku.com/gaming/go307/feature-talkin-metal-gear-with-hideo-kojima-248695.php

 This was apparently left out of the article, it was posted by someone that was there in the full article:

"This Blog doesn't cover the full event

During the presentation Kojima teased the idea of MGS4 on the 360,

By that I mean that during the lead up to each Game he mention the original platform for the game, by the time MGS4 came around he displayed BOTH PS3 and 360 together, but he didn't specificly mention that MGS4 would be on the 360,

The guy sure likes to be a teaser"

 Don't believe everything you read from game designers, they say what is needed to hide rumors.

(Please note this is not a lemming thread, just a question)

I have personaly excepted the fact that MGS4 will never be on th e360. But what irritates me the most is the fact that everyone says that MGS4 is, "too advanced for the 360" How is it too advanced, because of the Camo. So it can mimic the background, why cant th e360 do that. I dosent seem that super complecated. I still refuse to believe that this game cannot be done on 360 Hardware.  

black_awpN1

Because Kameo looks 10x better in textures, shaders, lighting and view distance/huge worlds, polygons ? That must be it, they know for a fact thay Rare without even trying at 360 launhc ade a game 10x better looking, so how the hell could they possibly make such a bad looking game on 360, whatever programming power they had, it would still look FAR better, that is why MGS4 in its current downgraded PS3 form could never be done on 360

(Please note this is not a lemming thread, just a question)

I have personaly excepted the fact that MGS4 will never be on th e360. But what irritates me the most is the fact that everyone says that MGS4 is, "too advanced for the 360" How is it too advanced, because of the Camo. So it can mimic the background, why cant th e360 do that. I dosent seem that super complecated. I still refuse to believe that this game cannot be done on 360 Hardware.  

black_awpN1

[QUOTE="black_awpN1"]

(Please note this is not a lemming thread, just a question)

I have personaly excepted the fact that MGS4 will never be on th e360. But what irritates me the most is the fact that everyone says that MGS4 is, "too advanced for the 360" How is it too advanced, because of the Camo. So it can mimic the background, why cant th e360 do that. I dosent seem that super complecated. I still refuse to believe that this game cannot be done on 360 Hardware.

greg_splicer

Because Kameo looks 10x better in textures, shaders, lighting and view distance/huge worlds, polygons ? That must be it, they know for a fact thay Rare without even trying at 360 launhc ade a game 10x better looking, so how the hell could they possibly make such a bad looking game on 360, whatever programming power they had, it would still look FAR better, that is why MGS4 in its current downgraded PS3 form could never be done on 360

LOL @ you hyping Kameo in 30 threads this week. Kameo is like 2 years old, get over it. Everyone else already has. 

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

Because you can't do 4D graphics without blu-ray and the cell.Darthmatt

you forgot the dual hdmi. and the easy programming of the ps3. and all that other junk. but anyways the idea that mgs4 can't be done on the 360 is from a statement a long time ago that kojima said something about not being able to do the same camo on the 360 and his desire for uncompressed audio. that said, MGS4 cannot be done on the 360 IN ITS CURRENT FORM. it would take massive programming changes to change from a openGL based system with a crazy unique architecture to a DX9.5 system with a fairly standard architecture. that said, it would probably be easier than the other way around.

thats about it. 

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

cheapness1

No, you are wrong, the models, animtions, AI, textures, story, CGI videos, HUD, controls, presentation owuld NOT have to be redone at all, just a 10% of the game would have to be redone, if that, since the  GPU rendering part would not be that different anyway, both GPU's are DX9 parts, they could optimize for DX10 effects on 360 more next gen part of course

Graphics like these can't be produced on 360, with the type of gameplay that Metal Gear Solid 4 is going to offer. Its just not a possibility. 

[QUOTE="cheapness1"]

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

greg_splicer

No, you are wrong, the models, animtions, AI, textures, story, CGI videos, HUD, controls, presentation owuld NOT have to be redone at all, just a 10% of the game would have to be redone, if that, since the  GPU rendering part would not be that different anyway, both GPU's are DX9 parts, they could optimize for DX10 effects on 360 more next gen part of course

Only the 360 uses DX, the PS3 uses OpenGL, DX is owned by MS and SONY cannot use it.

Graphics like these can't be produced on 360, with the type of gameplay that Metal Gear Solid 4 is going to offer. Its just not a possibility. 

Adrian_Cloud

Right and what kind of gameplay is that? Please do tell, I haven't played this game yet.

I beleive the only reason is Octacamo. Other than that, cell isnt needed for that game and the 360s graphics card is pretty on par with the ps3's if not better.

I beleive the only reason is Octacamo. Other than that, cell isnt needed for that game and the 360s graphics card is pretty on par with the ps3's if not better.

leejohnson7

The Xenos IS FAR superior to the RSX, no one should even argue this anymore.

[QUOTE="Adrian_Cloud"]

Graphics like these can't be produced on 360, with the type of gameplay that Metal Gear Solid 4 is going to offer. Its just not a possibility.

Nagidar

Right and what kind of gameplay is that? Please do tell, I haven't played this game yet.

I'd inform you but i rather you read what Hideo Kojima the director and producer has to say about it. www.konami.com start there.

This game's physics makes gears look like a joke, all damage is substantial and not artifical like in games like Gears and COD3.

^So wait... a tactical/stealth game is going to have a more realistic damage model than an over-the-top, action shooter??? nooooo way! ........................ I don't believe you.moohan

:lol: play MGS3 there are some pretty over the top action scenes in that game, with more characters on screen than gears. :|

Sarcasm :lol: 

[QUOTE="greg_splicer"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

Nagidar

No, you are wrong, the models, animtions, AI, textures, story, CGI videos, HUD, controls, presentation owuld NOT have to be redone at all, just a 10% of the game would have to be redone, if that, since the  GPU rendering part would not be that different anyway, both GPU's are DX9 parts, they could optimize for DX10 effects on 360 more next gen part of course

Only the 360 uses DX, the PS3 uses OpenGL, DX is owned by MS and SONY cannot use it.

Still it owuld be 10% of the initial work, same for FF13, i expect both to appear on 360, FF13 100% and MGS4 70% possibility

[QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="Adrian_Cloud"]

Graphics like these can't be produced on 360, with the type of gameplay that Metal Gear Solid 4 is going to offer. Its just not a possibility.

Adrian_Cloud

Right and what kind of gameplay is that? Please do tell, I haven't played this game yet.

I'd inform you but i rather you read what Hideo Kojima the director and producer has to say about it. www.konami.com start there.

This game's physics makes gears look like a joke, all damage is substantial and not artifical like in games like Gears and COD3.

Reading means nothing, if you haven't played it, just shut up and wait untill its released before commenting, not to mention Hideo said MGS4 is PS3 exclusive than when he gets to talking about MGS4 there is a PS3 and a 360 sitting with him, only he doesn't mention anything about it on the 360.

  Don't believe anything game developers tell you, they only say whats needed to be said, nothing more.

Because you can't do 4D graphics without blu-ray and the cell.Darthmatt

Because "Yknow, things break" and they dont want a game on a console that breaks 

[QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="greg_splicer"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

greg_splicer

No, you are wrong, the models, animtions, AI, textures, story, CGI videos, HUD, controls, presentation owuld NOT have to be redone at all, just a 10% of the game would have to be redone, if that, since the  GPU rendering part would not be that different anyway, both GPU's are DX9 parts, they could optimize for DX10 effects on 360 more next gen part of course

Only the 360 uses DX, the PS3 uses OpenGL, DX is owned by MS and SONY cannot use it.

Still it owuld be 10% of the initial work, same for FF13, i expect both to appear on 360, FF13 100% and MGS4 70% possibility

FFXIII WOULD in fact need to be reworked, its using an engine specifically built around the Cell, don't expect that game to come to the 360.

All the people I hear that say that around here are qualified, experienced developers that have worked on projects for both machines and have an intimate knowledge of what each machine is capable of.karicha9

Sweet black irony, how you make my heart sing.   You just made my day, karicha. :lol:

[QUOTE="moohan"]^So wait... a tactical/stealth game is going to have a more realistic damage model than an over-the-top, action shooter??? nooooo way! ........................ I don't believe you.Adrian_Cloud

:lol: play MGS3 there are some pretty over the top action scenes in that game, with more characters on screen than gears. :|

Sarcasm :lol: 

[QUOTE="greg_splicer"][QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="greg_splicer"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

Nagidar

No, you are wrong, the models, animtions, AI, textures, story, CGI videos, HUD, controls, presentation owuld NOT have to be redone at all, just a 10% of the game would have to be redone, if that, since the  GPU rendering part would not be that different anyway, both GPU's are DX9 parts, they could optimize for DX10 effects on 360 more next gen part of course

Only the 360 uses DX, the PS3 uses OpenGL, DX is owned by MS and SONY cannot use it.

Still it owuld be 10% of the initial work, same for FF13, i expect both to appear on 360, FF13 100% and MGS4 70% possibility

FFXIII WOULD in fact need to be reworked, its using an engine specifically built around the Cell, don't expect that game to come to the 360.

Not again, FF13 would have to be redone, 10%, that is the engine, nothing else, will i ever get it over with you you people, a 3 year old would understand what i say 100 times faster i suppose

[QUOTE="Adrian_Cloud"]

[QUOTE="moohan"]^So wait... a tactical/stealth game is going to have a more realistic damage model than an over-the-top, action shooter??? nooooo way! ........................ I don't believe you.moohan

:lol: play MGS3 there are some pretty over the top action scenes in that game, with more characters on screen than gears. :|

Sarcasm :lol:

But thats only one aspect of the physics. As a whole you want over the top action, play MGS4. Evertyhing from the ground to buildings are destrutable! Now that is over the top.  

[QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="greg_splicer"][QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="greg_splicer"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]

I think that games made to exploit either the 360's or Ps3's advantages specifically would basically have to be rebuilt for the other platform...these are also probably the ones that'd  stand out on their respective platforms whereas multiplats wouldn't be taking full advantage and so would seem rather pathetic in comparison!

so in its current form MGS4 isn't possible on the x360, it'd have to be completely reworked! 

greg_splicer

No, you are wrong, the models, animtions, AI, textures, story, CGI videos, HUD, controls, presentation owuld NOT have to be redone at all, just a 10% of the game would have to be redone, if that, since the  GPU rendering part would not be that different anyway, both GPU's are DX9 parts, they could optimize for DX10 effects on 360 more next gen part of course

Only the 360 uses DX, the PS3 uses OpenGL, DX is owned by MS and SONY cannot use it.

Still it owuld be 10% of the initial work, same for FF13, i expect both to appear on 360, FF13 100% and MGS4 70% possibility

FFXIII WOULD in fact need to be reworked, its using an engine specifically built around the Cell, don't expect that game to come to the 360.

Not again, FF13 would have to be redone, 10%, that is the engine, nothing else, will i ever get it over with you you people, a 3 year old would understand what i say 100 times faster i suppose

No, you don't understand, the White Engine is specific to the Cell and FFXIII is built around that, it would have to be reworked to be used on another engine, the engine a game uses is the biggest thing for a game, its what is used to put everything in place, imagine trying to put FFXIII on the Diablo engine(Just an example), it just wouldn't work without being reworked, it would in fact be a long process.