[QUOTE="The_Versatile"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]As an agnostic that I am, I find it completely honest to say that I have no undeniable proof to choose any side; be that side theists or atheists. In simple words I don't see why a god must exist but also, I don't find it absurd for a god to exist.chessmaster1989

*sigh* some people don't seem to realize the difference...

An atheist does not believe in God, and believes that God cannot exist.

An agnostic recognizes the possiblity of God's existence, but does not personally believe in God (and, usually, believes that there is no way to prove or disprove God's existence).

I'm an agnostic, by the way ;).

Incorrrect. Atheism means lack of theism. Which means an atheist is a person who hasn't swallowed the poison. It doesn't represent a hard-headed idiot who firmly believes that no higher power of any kind exists. I'm not sure if know ANYONE like that, actually.

If an agnostic does not believe in God, he is without theism as well, therefore he's an atheist. "Agnosticism" is just a sub-set of atheism, created for those who are too weak to deal with the chastising one would recieve from theists for not believing the same things that they do. You see, a person who calls himself atheist, doesn't give a crap what people will think of his lack of belief. Someone who calls himself agnsotic, is just trying to keep the theist attacks at bay. It's a shield, of sorts. And I'm sorry that you need it.

The whole concept of hell, which was stolen from greek/roman mythology and who knows where else anyways, is so utterly ridiculous that it's hard to believe that anyone with a functional brain could ever believe in it.

It's unfortunate that God gave man brains and most societies attempt to help people develop and use their brains, yet so many people throw it all away and live their life around a ridiculous fantasy (Christianity or any other manmade religion).

I don't think anyone can say whether or not God exists - I don't think man is capable of knowing.

But that won't stop manipulative man from telling you that they think they know, creating ridiculous fantasies surrounding the concept of God, and convincing sheep to believe whatever they want them to believe. And do what they say. And live how they say.

If I were, today, to say that God talks to me and has told me what everyone is supposed to do, people would laugh me right into the psych ward.

But thousands have no troubles believing that something like this happened thousands of years ago and structure their whole lives around the mutilated, calculated, selective, and controlling words of ancient man (telling others what he thinks God wants you to do).

It would be funny if it wasn't such an insult to common sense and intellect.

As an agnostic that I am, I find it completely honest to say that I have no undeniable proof to choose any side; be that side theists or atheists. In simple words I don't see why a god must exist but also, I don't find it absurd for a god to exist.Teenaged

[QUOTE="The_Versatile"]What a silly argument going back and forth here. Yes, atheism and agnosticism are basically the same thing. Just because an agnostic won't definitively say the magic words "There is no God", doesn't mean they hold any more belief than an atheist would in their heart that there is a chance for a God to exist. Why else do you think they don't believe in the first place? They'll believe it when they see it, just like an atheist would. The term "atheism" means - a lack of theism, or, being without theism. An agnostic is without theism, aren't they? I'd say so. An agnostic sits on the fence waiting for evidence to come along. An atheist takes a more assertive approach. When an athiest says, "There is no God", they're simply referring to, or openly rejecting, the Gods of worldly religions that they've been exposed to. But they're just like the agnostics, in that they'll believe in any God that reveals itself to them. Who wouldn't. You'd have to be an idiot not to. It's really only a diffference in personality types. Basically, agnosticism is weak atheism.Teenaged

But if you are just trying to say that based on Christianity, both atheists and agnostics are going to hell, then I agree.

If you are trying to "prove" the above by saying that atheists and agnostics are the same then I will tell you you are wrong. ;)

[QUOTE="Sajedene"] But as I said earlier in this thread (really now... read the whole thread) -- girls dress the way they do because they want to attract the boys who define "hot attractive females" as wallpaper girls (alba, fox, vs models, etc) -- so the girls just go for what the guys want.Gamer4Iife

But you don't have to show a lot of skin to be hot. >_> Guys like to attract the opposite sex as well, you don't see us walking around wearing only a leaf on our privates or something.

[QUOTE="The_Versatile"][QUOTE="bytgames"] good no one knows, so will aethiest quit telling me there isnt a god, when they dont know if there is or not.bytgames

Yes, precisely. When I look at the world around me, I see obvious evidence of a power that is either greater than man, or unknown to man. The way the seasons change, the rotation of the sun, the way plant life and mammals are dependent on each other to survive, it's like a perfect mutual relationship. How about the mountains? Aren't they glorious? None of these things were made by mankind. Complex, mathematical, rhythmic, compelling, breath-taking, and at times unnerving, surroundings of our living environment.

But at the same time, there is zero evidence for any of the Gods that people have invented throughout history to explain these phenomena. It's just ridiculous to me, how people can plunk their heads in the sand, and mindlessly mill about within the construct of obvious fables, whatever one happens to be native to their region, and actually believe that it's all true, especially after being exposed to the beliefs of other cultures, and realizing how ridiculous they are. Why don't they ever realize they look just as ridiculous to the others? Because they're all ridiculous. But everyone clings to what they know, I suppose.... Sadly, this is exactly what's keeping us from ever really knowing the truth about ourselves and discovering our actual origin. People need to accept the fact that religious stories are nothing more than filler material, that were designed to give the ancient people something to hang on to, in times of turmoil, and to fill in the gaps in their knowledge as well. We don't need that anymore. We need to throw them away actually, to move on and find out what's really going on, if we care to do so. And I care to do so, but apparently, not everyone does. Makes me sad. :(

I had a point I was trying to make. How do you know that even questioning whether or not you can find the truth is true? Einstein once said, "the most incomprehensible thing about the world is that it is comprehensible." Whether you believe it or not, it is possible to learn about the universe. If there is indeed a theistic and personal God like the one in the Bible then he could very well make himself known. If he is a deistic God like Ben Franklin's God then he indeed cannot be learned about.mindstorm