Anti-Science bill passed in Indiana

why is this even a discussion?

Science isthe systematic study of the nature and behaviour of the material and physical universe, based on observation, experiment, and measurement, and the formulation of laws to describe these facts in general terms.

How is Creationism a part of that? Oh, that's right, it isn't. That's why it has nothing to do in science education.
There is nothing wrong with creationism in 'I don't know the proper english word' in a social science or sociology education, but it should stay out of science

[QUOTE="imaps3fanboy"]

Reminds me of this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbZKUNvmsCU

theone86

"How can, like, an African-American person evolve from a white person, we're different skin."

[QUOTE="Inconsistancy"][QUOTE="sonicare"]

I've never met anyone who believes in creationism. And I've lived in some serous backwater places. Who the hell are these people?

aprioristic

Before I start teaching creationism, I want to see some scientific evidence of the Garden of Eden. I think there would be some pretty cool scientific papers into the origin and physical properties of Eve's fig leaf.

Before I start teaching creationism, I want to see some scientific evidence of the Garden of Eden. I think there would be some pretty cool scientific papers into the origin and physical properties of Eve's fig leaf.

jimkabrhel

"Creation science"

Oxymoron of the week.

[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]

Before I start teaching creationism, I want to see some scientific evidence of the Garden of Eden. I think there would be some pretty cool scientific papers into the origin and physical properties of Eve's fig leaf.

wis3boi

Did you know that reading the Bible from the literal Hebrew texts shows a much more malicious, intolerant, and downright mean God than what contemporary translations have glossed over?

God is shown to be completely irrational and spiteful towards Adam and Eve.

I wonder if that should be taught in classrooms as well, instead of the traditional "benevolent God" interpretation.

Not to mention all of the contradictions inherent in the Bible, and how it promotes appalling things like slavery, etc.

[QUOTE="wis3boi"][QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]

Before I start teaching creationism, I want to see some scientific evidence of the Garden of Eden. I think there would be some pretty cool scientific papers into the origin and physical properties of Eve's fig leaf.

peterw007

Did you know that reading the Bible from the literal Hebrew texts shows a much more malicious, intolerant, and downright mean God than what contemporary translations have glossed over?

God is shown to be completely irrational and spiteful towards Adam and Eve.

I wonder if that should be taught in classrooms as well, instead of the traditional "benevolent God" interpretation.

Not to mention all of the contradictions inherent in the Bible, and how it promotes appalling things like slavery, etc.

There is nothing wrong with presenting two sides of an argument, but not when you are actively promoting a bias towards one side rather than look at it as a whole.hiphops_savior

True, but the problem here is that this isn't a lecture on rhetorics or debating. this is SCIENCE. By claiming that Creationism is true, you have to deny so many other SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN THEORIES, that the global science community is practically reset back to the dark ages. You can teach creationism as part of that specific religion, or in ideahistory, but to directly stand up in science class and say "This stuff written in a 1700 year old book is absolutely true in all sense and form, despite being dismissed by the entire scientific community for several centuries" is not science, it is direct indoctrination.

fundamental type religious people will never be happy until everyone is equally stupid.

so yes by all means lets teach creationism and that the world is supported on the back of a giant tortose, and that thor causes thunder and that grandfather raven stole fire from the gods as alternative scientific theory.

[QUOTE="hiphops_savior"]There is nothing wrong with presenting two sides of an argument, but not when you are actively promoting a bias towards one side rather than look at it as a whole.DoomZaW

True, but the problem here is that this isn't a lecture on rhetorics or debating. this is SCIENCE. By claiming that Creationism is true, you have to deny so many other SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN THEORIES, that the global science community is practically reset back to the dark ages. You can teach creationism as part of that specific religion, or in ideahistory, but to directly stand up in science class and say "This stuff written in a 1700 year old book is absolutely true in all sense and form, despite being dismissed by the entire scientific community for several centuries" is not science, it is direct indoctrination.

But science lacks the ability to prove anything.

It can only "not disprove beyond a reasonable doubt."

No scientific theories are certain, even evolution.

Although, considering the overwhelming amount of evidence in favor of evolution, you'd have to be a fool to choose creationism over it.

There is nothing wrong with presenting two sides of an argument, but not when you are actively promoting a bias towards one side rather than look at it as a whole.hiphops_savior

it's not called the Fact of Evolution so the theory can't be all trueZumaJones07

Zuma raped this thread with one post.

GG, hats off.

InEMplease

Indeed.

Zuma

InEMplease

I've never met anyone who believes in creationism. And I've lived in some serous backwater places. Who the hell are these people?

sonicare

I know the Wisconsin Synod believes in creationism, and am 99% sure that the Missouri Synod does as well, there are two pretty large religious movements (deep ties to Dobson's group, BTW, I consider them fundamentalist). I believe it's the Southern Baptist Movement (there are generally considered to be two Baptist movements and iirc the other one is the gospel movement or something like that) that believes in creationism, they're also large and also fundamentalist by every objective measure. Maybe you shouldn't think of fundamentalism as existing only in backwaters. I grew up going to a WS church in the Chicago suburbs, the Baptists that I know live in some pretty posh areas of North Carolina, and I also know some fundies living in upscale Florida neighborhoods. Colorado I know has the largest fundamentalist population, and there are large contigents in places like Kansas and Ohio. At any rate, perhaps it's not so much that there haven't been fundies where you live but that you haven't known any fundies in the area where you lived.

And here, 40% of the U.S. population believes that the earth is less than 10,000 years old:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/145286/Four-Americans-Believe-Strict-Creationism.aspx

And here, 40% of the U.S. population believes that the earth is less than 10,000 years old:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/145286/Four-Americans-Believe-Strict-Creationism.aspx

theone86

[QUOTE="cheese_game619"]>Murrika >Secular State Pick one.th3warr1or

F**k yeah.

Kruse expressed disdain for evolution, calling it a "Johnny-come-lately" theory. tenaka2

[QUOTE="theone86"]

And here, 40% of the U.S. population believes that the earth is less than 10,000 years old:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/145286/Four-Americans-Believe-Strict-Creationism.aspx

Randolph

[QUOTE="ZumaJones07"]is there actual visible evidence of something evolving into something else over millions of years? no... :? if there isn't proof of one thing then you can't eliminate the possibility of something else being true.Human-after-all

He is just trolling.

evolution is only a theory and hasn't been proven whatsoever so it makes sense to include religious teachings in schools, it's only fair.ZumaJones07

It's not like we have undeniable proof that evolution exists...

It's not like we have undeniable proof that evolution exists...

gameking5000

It's not like we have undeniable proof that evolution exists...

gameking5000

evolution is only a theory and hasn't been proven whatsoever so it makes sense to include religious teachings in schools, it's only fair.ZumaJones07

[QUOTE="ZumaJones07"]evolution is only a theory and hasn't been proven whatsoever so it makes sense to include religious teachings in schools, it's only fair.chrisrooR

I know, right?

"Only a theory."

In order for a hypothesis to become a theory, it needs to be tested thousands of times from research labs and independent, peer-reviewed studies all-throughout the world.

Theories are serious claims with mountains of scientific evidence behind them.

It's not like one person can just claim "I have a theory!" and expect to have any credence in the scientific community.

It's not like we have undeniable proof that evolution exists...

gameking5000

It is a fact that evolution occurs, it has been witnessed and the experiments can be repeated in the lab.

The Theory of Evolution is the best explanation as to why it occurs.

evolution is only a theory and hasn't been proven whatsoever so it makes sense to include religious teachings in schools, it's only fair.ZumaJones07

Oh so he basically wants to be able to say "Yes evolution and science are correct, BUT THEY ARE MADE BY GOD TROLOLOLOL OWNED" ... only he has no proof.... and now the kids there have to go along with it. greaaaaat. Goes against Science in every possible way.PC360Wii

So it's either science or a god.. can't be both, right?

[QUOTE="PC360Wii"]Oh so he basically wants to be able to say "Yes evolution and science are correct, BUT THEY ARE MADE BY GOD TROLOLOLOL OWNED" ... only he has no proof.... and now the kids there have to go along with it. greaaaaat. Goes against Science in every possible way.shoot-first

So it's either science or a god.. can't be both, right?

[QUOTE="shoot-first"]

[QUOTE="PC360Wii"]Oh so he basically wants to be able to say "Yes evolution and science are correct, BUT THEY ARE MADE BY GOD TROLOLOLOL OWNED" ... only he has no proof.... and now the kids there have to go along with it. greaaaaat. Goes against Science in every possible way.yellonet

So it's either science or a god.. can't be both, right?

Nice one. :roll:

[QUOTE="yellonet"]

[QUOTE="shoot-first"]

So it's either science or a god.. can't be both, right?

shoot-first

Nice one. :roll:

does god NEED proof to be true? it only makes sense that the universe was created and not... just there. things can't just poof into existence.ZumaJones07

Many phenomenon have been explained as "it's god at work..." until they've been understood and scientifically explained.

Science is constantly pushing the boundaries of our understanding of the universe we live in, and the room for religion is shrinking, but as god doesn't need proof he can always stay a few steps ahead... convenient huh?

does god NEED proof to be true? it only makes sense that the universe was created and not... just there. things can't just poof into existence.ZumaJones07

God and religion is a creation of man, science is discoveries. One can't be proven or tested in anyway, the other is the result of multitudes of tests that can be repeated.

And, according to the weird world of Quantum Mechanics Yes crap can just pop into existence! The reason why, not known.

"If you think you understand Quantum Mechanics, you don't" -Richard Feynman

Teaching sh*t to children is just going to lower the standard of education in this country. Imagine those kids going to a university wanting to major in science. Completely screwing them. Creationism should not be taught in school. Religion shouldn't be in schools. It is just plain wrong.

If you don't believe in evolution, then you are an idiot and should stay away from the science world.

^ This is the only argument that has been made in this thread, by the way if you talk like that, you are an idiot. And idiot is a adult who acts like a child. How more condescending can you get? TC, you are a terrible thread creator, your thread titles are so full of bias, and very slanted. Your thread title suggest this bill is about getting rid of science altogether. Lets face it, people who believe in evolution really really want it to be true. Going by the other thread you made, it leads me to the conclusion that you have a world view, and you will believe anything that satisfies that world view.

edit: notice he uses the world "believe".... This shows what he is really thinking. Btw, I have not seen a connection between teaching evolution and the IQ rates increasing, it does not make you smarter to believe in evolution.

Btw, I have not seen a connection between teaching evolution and the IQ rates increasing, it does not make you smarter to believe in evolution.mahlasor