BREAKING NEWS: House votes to repeal Don't ask Don't tell

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="Hewkii"] yeah they are. it hasn't even been 10 years since they could perform sex legally and they are still barred from being recognized as married in 45 different states.grizza

Lol, I don't know why but I couldn't stop laughing after reading that. No one said they couldn't have sex publicly, they said legally.

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"]How does that make them inferior? Just because they can't have Sex publicly makes them inferior? Hewkii

[do not have] the same privileges and rights as the general populace

In the reference source it says publicly. As in Practicing it in Public. Snipes_2

second paragraph, in fact:

Lawrence has the effect of invalidating similar laws throughout the United States that purport to criminalize sodomy between consenting same-sex adults acting in private.

The Army needs to recognize my marriage to Athena, Olympian goddess of war and wisdom already. I keep telling them I'm married to her, and they won't pay me the extra $500 a month I get on my housing allowance for being married. Intolerant jerks.

Lawrence has the effect of invalidating similar laws throughout the United States that purport to criminalize sodomy between consenting same-sex adults acting in private.Hewkii

It says Similar Laws, not the one I was referencing.Snipes_2

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"] It says Similar Laws, not the one I was referencing.Hewkii

And since when have we banned gays from serving in the military?STurn21

And since when have we banned gays from serving in the military?

STurn21

In 1778, Lieutenant Gotthold Frederick Enslin became the first soldier to be drummed out of the Continental Army for sodomy. Throughout U.S. history, campaigns have purged military units of persons suspected of engaging in homosexual acts.

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]A map to brighten up the thread: What a cheerful club the US is part of.STurn21

And since when have we banned gays from serving in the military?

Except gays have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993 when Clinton enacted DADT. Either that map is dated or simply inaccurate.STurn21

The map is accurate. Even under DADT, you can't be openly homosexual in the military.

Except gays have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993 when Clinton enacted DADT.

STurn21

if you have to disguise yourself to participate, it's not legal for you to do it.Hewkii

It's not legal for me to have heterosexual sex since I can't do it on your lawn.

Except gays have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993 when Clinton enacted DADT. Either that map is dated or simply inaccurate.

STurn21

DADT makes it so that you can't actively attempt to determine who is gay in order to kick them out of the military. However, once the cat's out of the bag and someone knows you're gay you're out. There have been instances where very valuable members of the military, such as those who can speak Arabic, have been discharged because it came to light that they were gay.

Gays are still banned from the military. It's just that the enforcement of that rule has been lessened by DADT.

It's not legal for me to have heterosexual sex since I can't do it on your lawn.Palantas

[QUOTE="GabuEx"][QUOTE="STurn21"]Except gays have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993 when Clinton enacted DADT. Either that map is dated or simply inaccurate.STurn21

DADT makes it so that you can't actively attempt to determine who is gay in order to kick them out of the military. However, once the cat's out of the bag and someone knows you're gay you're out. There have been instances where very valuable members of the military, such as those who can speak Arabic, have been discharged because it came to light that they were gay.

Gays are still banned from the military. It's just that the enforcement of that rule has been lessened by DADT.

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="STurn21"]

Except gays have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993 when Clinton enacted DADT. Either that map is dated or simply inaccurate.

STurn21

DADT makes it so that you can't actively attempt to determine who is gay in order to kick them out of the military. However, once the cat's out of the bag and someone knows you're gay you're out. There have been instances where very valuable members of the military, such as those who can speak Arabic, have been discharged because it came to light that they were gay.

Gays are still banned from the military. It's just that the enforcement of that rule has been lessened by DADT.

Again, all of that does not take away from the fact that you can be a homosexual and be in the military.

Before 1993, homosexuals could serve in the military as long as no one knew they were homosexual.

Since 1993, homosexuals can serve in the military as long as no one knows they're homosexual.

Please explain how homosexuals were allowed to serve in the military in any greater capacity after 1993 than before 1993.

[QUOTE="grizza"]

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"] How does that make them inferior? Just because they can't have Sex publicly makes them inferior? STurn21

Lol, I don't know why but I couldn't stop laughing after reading that. No one said they couldn't have sex publicly, they said legally.

But the fact of the matter is that if they kept their same gender sex completely private no one would know and they would not ever be persecuted anyways.

There is still a big difference between having sex publicly and having sex legally.

The petitioners, John Geddes Lawrence, a medical technologist, then age 55, and Tyron Garner (1967–2006),[10] then 31, were alleged to have been engaging in consensual anal sex in Lawrence's apartment in the outskirts of Houston between 10:30 and 11 p.m. on September 17, 1998 when Harris County sheriff's deputy Joseph Quinn entered the unlocked apartment, with his weapon drawn, arresting the two.

Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying, but having sex in an apartment is private.

[QUOTE="scorch-62"]At least we're headed in the right direction . . . Now what about gay marriage?Bourbons3

Obama does not support gay marriage so no, he does not want to nor will he repeal that act.

Obama does not support gay marriage

limpbizkit818

Out of principle, or out of "I have to oppose gay marriage because I can't get elected if I don't"?

I tend to feel that it's the latter, although I recognize there is no proof of that.

[QUOTE="limpbizkit818"]

Obama does not support gay marriage

GabuEx

Out of principle, or out of "I have to oppose gay marriage because I can't get elected if I don't"?

I tend to feel that it's the latter, although I recognize there is no proof of that.

Well if he we really up for change he would change his stance on that now that he is in office no? Or is america still too conservative for that, because if they are it further reinforces my point on the first page. Although serving in the military and marriage are two different things.

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="STurn21"]

Again, all of that does not take away from the fact that you can be a homosexual and be in the military.

STurn21

Before 1993, homosexuals could serve in the military as long as no one knew they were homosexual.

Since 1993, homosexuals can serve in the military as long as no one knows they're homosexual.

Please explain how homosexuals were allowed to serve in the military in any greater capacity after 1993 than before 1993.

Stop making assumptions. I simply said that gays can serve in the military. Why do you want to turn this into an argument?

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="STurn21"]

Again, all of that does not take away from the fact that you can be a homosexual and be in the military.

STurn21

Before 1993, homosexuals could serve in the military as long as no one knew they were homosexual.

Since 1993, homosexuals can serve in the military as long as no one knows they're homosexual.

Please explain how homosexuals were allowed to serve in the military in any greater capacity after 1993 than before 1993.

Stop making assumptions. I simply said that gays can serve in the military. Why do you want to turn this into an argument?

You said that gays "have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993". So I asked you what changed in 1993.

Is it out of bounds to do so? :?

Sorry, no its not.

Let me revise that.

Gays have been allowed to serve in the military since forever.

STurn21

OK then, suppose a felon managed to vote in a state in which ex-cons are permanently barred from voting. Would it then be correct to say that felons are allowed to vote?

Except measures are taken to keep the felon from voting. Under DADT measures are not taken to keep gays out.

STurn21

Measures are not taken to keep gays out?

Gay people who are known to be gay are discharged from the military because they're gay.

Discharging people from the military because they're gay is not a measure taken to keep gays out of the military? What other purpose does it serve then?

Sorry, no its not.

Let me revise that.

Gays have been allowed to serve in the military since forever.

STurn21

Closeted gays have, open gays have not.

When you enlist/apply for a commissioning program no one asks for your sexual orientation. Why? Because the military could care less if you like girls or boys as long as you keep it to yourself.

Gays are/were discharged for coming out as gay because of the effects it has on those who are supposed to live/shower/fight with the person.

There is a difference between keeping all gay people out and keeping openly gay people out.

STurn21

And when you enlisted or applied for a commissioning program before, all you had to do was say "no", if it was asked at all. Or did they break out their "gaydar"? :P

Again... before 1993, closeted gay people could serve, while openly gay people could not. And after 1993, closeted gay people can serve, while openly gay people cannot. I don't exactly see what changed in 1993.

[QUOTE="grizza"]

[QUOTE="STurn21"]

But the fact of the matter is that if they kept their same gender sex completely private no one would know and they would not ever be persecuted anyways.

STurn21

There is still a big difference between having sex publicly and having sex legally.

The petitioners, John Geddes Lawrence, a medical technologist, then age 55, and Tyron Garner (1967–2006),[10] then 31, were alleged to have been engaging in consensual anal sex in Lawrence's apartment in the outskirts of Houston between 10:30 and 11 p.m. on September 17, 1998 when Harris County sheriff's deputy Joseph Quinn entered the unlocked apartment, with his weapon drawn, arresting the two.

Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying, but having sex in an apartment is private.

Can I see a source please, or should I just take your word for it?

perform sex legallySame source that was posted before by Hewkii. If it doesn't work there try here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_v._Texas

[QUOTE="limpbizkit818"]

Obama does not support gay marriage

GabuEx

Out of principle, or out of "I have to oppose gay marriage because I can't get elected if I don't"?

I tend to feel that it's the latter, although I recognize there is no proof of that.

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="limpbizkit818"]

Obama does not support gay marriage

DMAngara90

Out of principle, or out of "I have to oppose gay marriage because I can't get elected if I don't"?

I tend to feel that it's the latter, although I recognize there is no proof of that.

[QUOTE="DMAngara90"][QUOTE="GabuEx"]

Out of principle, or out of "I have to oppose gay marriage because I can't get elected if I don't"?

I tend to feel that it's the latter, although I recognize there is no proof of that.

limpbizkit818

Have to look at Biden's voter base.. Senator's don't just vote on their personal views they have to think about their voter base in which they can win the next election.. Its a red herring, Obama already has a ton of problems.. The last thing you need is deal witha serious issue.. A issue in which Bush won the vote as the primary issue in multiple states in the 2004 election..

[QUOTE="limpbizkit818"][QUOTE="DMAngara90"] Back in an interview when he was running for his state's senate, he said he supported marriage rights. sSubZerOo

Have to look at Biden's voter base.. Senator's don't just vote on their personal views they have to think about their voter base in which they can win the next election.. Its a red herring, Obama already has a ton of problems.. The last thing you need is deal witha serious issue.. A issue in which Bush won the vote as the primary issue in multiple states in the 2004 election..

[QUOTE="Bourbons3"]A map to brighten up the thread: What a cheerful club the US is part of.STurn21

Yeah, If everyone else does it, it must be great!

More like "Everyone else has done it and their militaries didn't crumble and there wasn't a mass genocide of homosexuals."

[QUOTE="scorch-62"]

[QUOTE="STurn21"]Except gays have been allowed to serve in the military since 1993 when Clinton enacted DADT. Either that map is dated or simply inaccurate.STurn21

The map is accurate. Even under DADT, you can't be openly homosexual in the military.

Yet you can be homosexual and in the military,....