Do You Consider Yourself To Be A Good Person? Poll.

[QUOTE="Dark_Knight6"][QUOTE="blackregiment"]

I really don't understand your last statement. It appears that you might be blaming God. God does not cause you to disobeyHim and sin.

blackregiment

Well, something caused it. And, if God created me then I can't see how he isn't responsible.

God does not control your free will to choose obedience to Him, you do. Rather than play victim and blame God or others, we must take personal responsibility for our lives and our actions.

One does not simply choose to be attracted to the opposite sex or not. Did you yourself choose to be heterosexual or does such an attraction for you happen involuntarily?

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

God does not control your free will to choose obedience to Him, you do. Rather than play victim and blame God or others, we must take personal responsibility for our lives and our actions.

Dark_Knight6

Sexual preference has nothing to do with free will.  You don't choose who you are attracted to.  

I disagree with your premise. There is a difference in having an attraction and acting on those feelings. There have been many people that have overcome what you are dealing with through Christ. There are organizations that can help. Do you think that heterosexual people aren't attracted to the opposite sex, say a woman that flirts with a married man, as well? Why is someone that is following Christ, say that man, able to resist temptation to act out his attraction and commit adultery? Temptation is temptation whether it be same sex or opposite sex.The difference is having Christ and obeying Him, walking in the spirit and not in the flesh. 

I edited my last  post and added some additional comments. You  might go back and read it.   

[QUOTE="blackregiment"][QUOTE="Dark_Knight6"]

 

Well, something caused it. And, if God created me then I can't see how he isn't responsible.

-Jiggles-

God does not control your free will to choose obedience to Him, you do. Rather than play victim and blame God or others, we must take personal responsibility for our lives and our actions.

One does not simply choose to be attracted to the opposite sex or not. Did you yourself choose to be heterosexual or does such an attraction for you happen involuntarily?

Read my other response. It is not about attraction, it is about acting or not acting on that attraction. It is about having Christ and being obedient to Him or choosing to be disobedient. 

Have you ever told a lie? Yes
Have you ever stolen anything? No
Have you ever looked with lust? Yes
Have you ever hated anyone? Disliked, but not hate
Have you ever used God's name in vain? Like as a swear word? Yes

Overall, I think I'm a pretty nice guy :D

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

God does not control your free will to choose obedience to Him, you do. Rather than play victim and blame God or others, we must take personal responsibility for our lives and our actions.

Dark_Knight6

Sexual preference has nothing to do with free will.  You don't choose who you are attracted to.  

Did you even read what I wrote? It is not about attraction, it is about acting or not acting on that attraction. It is about choosing to be obedient to the Lord or choosing to be disobedient. You seem to be making excuses for a lack of self-control over your free will. If one has Christ and is serving Him, He will help them with that. It is about walking in the spirit and not in the flesh.  It is our free will choice to obey God or disobey Him. If we obey Him in Christ, He will help overcome difficulties we struggle with, correct us,  and bless us, If we choose disobedience, we will pay the consequences of that disobedience. It is really pretty simple, not much different, other than the eternal consequences, than things we deal with in this wold, such as our job or our courses in school. We either do what is expected of us and are rewarded, or don't and pay the consequences.

Gal 5:16  This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:17  For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Gal 5:18  But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
Gal 5:19  Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20  Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21  Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
 

Because He is God and works His plan at His pleasure, not yours.

blackregiment

then he is not all good, now is he. 

Did you even read what I wrote? It is not about attraction, it is about acting or not acting on that attraction. It is about choosing to be obedient to the Lord or choosing to be disobedient. You seem to be making excuses for a lack of self-control over your free will. If one has Christ and is serving Him, He will help them with that. It is about walking in the spirit and not in the flesh.  

blackregiment

If being obediant means having to bottle up emotions and natural urges, then I don't see how I can be.  I've acted on it before and I won't stop myself from doing so again.  I have control over what needs to be controlled, that isn't one of those things that needs to be.  And I've served Christ in the past, and like I've said before, doing so didn't help me.   

[QUOTE="blackregiment"][QUOTE="dog64"]

 

You must have an answer as to why all other religions are "false", but yet there are countless people in these religions that claim to receive gods help and blessing just as you do. If you have no answer, then does that mean that god helps and blesses people that are not in his chosen religion; people that he does not approve of?

Qooroo

Joh 14:6Jesus saith unto him, Iamtheway,thetruth,andthelife:no mancomethuntotheFather,butbyme.

Joh 3:35The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

Joh 3:36He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Here are three links that will give you the information you are looking for.

http://www.gotquestions.org/so-many-religions.html

http://www.gotquestions.org/correct-religion.html

http://www.gotquestions.org/Christianity-unique.html

1Jn 5:11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

1Jn 5:12He that hath the Son hath life: and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

1Jn 5:13These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

You're being circular. You have repeatedly cited the power of the holy spirit to change lives as evidence for the Truth of Christianity. Yet when asked to explain why the life-changing experiences of Christians are divine when those of other religions aren't, your answer relies on the premise that Christianity is True.

So sorry. You asked this question, "You must have an answer as to why all other religions are "false",". I actually thought you were looking for the answer to that question so I gave you some information to answer that question. This post-modern debate technique is something else. Ask a question and expect an answer to a different question.  Oh and in the process, ignore the answer to the question you actually asked. 

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

Did you even read what I wrote? It is not about attraction, it is about acting or not acting on that attraction. It is about choosing to be obedient to the Lord or choosing to be disobedient. You seem to be making excuses for a lack of self-control over your free will. If one has Christ and is serving Him, He will help them with that. It is about walking in the spirit and not in the flesh.  

Dark_Knight6

If being obediant means having to bottle up emotions and natural urges, then I don't see how I can be.  I've acted on it before and I won't stop myself from doing so again.  I have control over what needs to be controlled, that isn't one of those things that needs to be.  And I've served Christ in the past, and like I've said before, doing so didn't help me.   

Sounds to me like you have made your free will choice.  God will respect your choice to remain separated from Him. 

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

Because He is God and works His plan at His pleasure, not yours.

Hewkii

then he is not all good, now is he. 

You are entitled to your opinion and will get the chance to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

Sounds to me like you have made your free will choice.  God will respect your choice to remain separated from Him. 

blackregiment

Yes, I've chosen to seperate myself from him based on things he could have easily made play out differently.  That is, if he is real.      

I'm pretty good.  Not perfect, but good.

[QUOTE="Dark_Knight6"][QUOTE="blackregiment"]

God does not control your free will to choose obedience to Him, you do. Rather than play victim and blame God or others, we must take personal responsibility for our lives and our actions.

blackregiment

Sexual preference has nothing to do with free will. You don't choose who you are attracted to.

I disagree with your premise. There is a difference in having an attraction and acting on those feelings. There have been many people that have overcome what you are dealing with through Christ. There are organizations that can help. Do you think that heterosexual people aren't attracted to the opposite sex, say a woman that flirts with a married man, as well? Why is someone that is following Christ, say that man, able to resist temptation to act out his attraction and commit adultery? Temptation is temptation whether it be same sex or opposite sex.The difference is having Christ and obeying Him, walking in the spirit and not in the flesh.

I edited my last post and added some additional comments. You might go back and read it.

Temptation isn't what I built my original premise off of, which is what you seem to be targetting here. With your adultery example, the main real-world consequence would be a person cheating on their spouse, which is considered wrong in many socities, not just within Christianity.

What if there are two married, consenting homosexual partners who wish to have sex? Is there truly some sort of "act of sin" taking place? Despite what God may think or not, I simply do not see what's wrong with two loving, married adults expressing their gratitude for eachother, especially considering that they're not harming or disrupting the lives of other people around them.

So sorry. You asked this question, "You must have an answer as to why all other religions are "false",". Silly me, I actually thought you were looking for the answer to that question so I gave you some information to answer that question. This post-modern debate technique is something else. Ask a question and expect an answer to a different question.  Oh and in the process, ignore the answer to the question you actually asked. 

blackregiment

Actually, I asked that. And I think you misread the question. That's a comma there, not a period. I asked: "You must have an answer as to why all other religions are "false", but yet there are countless people in these religions that claim to receive gods help and blessing as you do". To clarify, why would god bless people and lead them to a religion that's false?

I disagree with your premise. There is a difference in having an attraction and acting on those feelings. There have been many people that have overcome what you are dealing with through Christ. There are organizations that can help. Do you think that heterosexual people aren't attracted to the opposite sex, say a woman that flirts with a married man, as well? Why is someone that is following Christ, say that man, able to resist temptation to act out his attraction and commit adultery? Temptation is temptation whether it be same sex or opposite sex.The difference is having Christ and obeying Him, walking in the spirit and not in the flesh. 

I edited my last  post and added some additional comments. You  might go back and read it.   

blackregiment

You can't overcome it.  And the difference is, according to the Bible, I'm never allowed to act on any feelings I have towards other men.  And I've tried to control it through Christ.  I used to pray to him to make it go away.  Guess not, though.  

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

So sorry. You asked this question, "You must have an answer as to why all other religions are "false",". Silly me, I actually thought you were looking for the answer to that question so I gave you some information to answer that question. This post-modern debate technique is something else. Ask a question and expect an answer to a different question.  Oh and in the process, ignore the answer to the question you actually asked. 

dog64

Actually, I asked that. And I think you misread the question. That's a comma there, not a period. I asked: "You must have an answer as to why all other religions are "false", but yet there are countless people in these religions that claim to receive gods help and blessing as you do". To clarify, why would god bless people and lead them to a religion that's false?

First of all, as I told you, I cannot speak for what people from other religions claim. Second, you are speaking of hypothetical people and their claims, please give some specific examples. Third, you are assuming that what ever happened to these hypothetical people was of God. Finally, you do not seem to understand that there are demonic spirits in this world that deceive people with signs and wonders.

I have personall talke with dozens of people that have been lifted out of alcholism, addiction, sexual disorders, a life of crime, etc.. bu accepting Christ and serving Him. We have a member on our union that has a personal testimony of redemption from a life of abusing drugs.      

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

I disagree with your premise. There is a difference in having an attraction and acting on those feelings. There have been many people that have overcome what you are dealing with through Christ. There are organizations that can help. Do you think that heterosexual people aren't attracted to the opposite sex, say a woman that flirts with a married man, as well? Why is someone that is following Christ, say that man, able to resist temptation to act out his attraction and commit adultery? Temptation is temptation whether it be same sex or opposite sex.The difference is having Christ and obeying Him, walking in the spirit and not in the flesh. 

I edited my last  post and added some additional comments. You  might go back and read it.   

Dark_Knight6

You can't overcome it.  And the difference is, according to the Bible, I'm never allowed to act on any feelings I have towards other men.  And I've tried to control it through Christ.  I used to pray to him to make it go away.  Guess not, though.  

I don't know your personal situation and I cannot know your heart. That being said, there are many that have overcome it. You mention Christ. I cannot know your heart but how do you know that you experienced true salvation? Did you see the fruits of salvation manifested in your life? Serving Christ is more than praying a prayer and walking the aisle, it is repentance of one's sinful ways, being born again, a new creature in Christ. It is total surrender of our will to Him. Jesus said that we must be born again. Many people attempt to come to Christ looking for Him to rush in and solve all of their problems, or an immediate issue they are dealing with like a  DWI. They are expecting Jesus to just "fix things" for them right away. It this does not happen right away, they fall away. The truth is that they never surrendered their will to Him and began to serve Him in obedience. The Lord works on His schedule, not ours. Following Christ is a way of life, not a therapy session or a source of a quick fix. If one does not have true fellowship with Christ, they prayers will not even be heard or answered. Sorrow, repentance, and obedience comes bfore blesings. The Bible tells us...

Luk 6:46  And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?

Joh 14:15  If ye love me, keep my commandments.

1Jn 2:4  He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1Jn 1:6  If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

Jesus said...

Mat 7:21  Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22  Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23  And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:24  Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
Mat 7:25  And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not; for it was founded upon a rock.
Mat 7:26  And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
Mat 7:27  And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.  

 you do not seem to understand that there are demonic spirits in this world that deceive people with signs and wonders.blackregiment

I'm pretty sure that if someone doesn't believe God exists, they probably don't think there are demons either.

Just thought I'd let you know ;) 

You are entitled to your opinion and will get the chance to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

blackregiment

ah good, it seems you are refusing the notion that he is all good. that can only have positive aspects.

[QUOTE="blackregiment"][QUOTE="Dark_Knight6"]

 

Sexual preference has nothing to do with free will. You don't choose who you are attracted to.

-Jiggles-

I disagree with your premise. There is a difference in having an attraction and acting on those feelings. There have been many people that have overcome what you are dealing with through Christ. There are organizations that can help. Do you think that heterosexual people aren't attracted to the opposite sex, say a woman that flirts with a married man, as well? Why is someone that is following Christ, say that man, able to resist temptation to act out his attraction and commit adultery? Temptation is temptation whether it be same sex or opposite sex.The difference is having Christ and obeying Him, walking in the spirit and not in the flesh.

I edited my last post and added some additional comments. You might go back and read it.

Temptation isn't what I built my original premise off of, which is what you seem to be targetting here. With your adultery example, the main real-world consequence would be a person cheating on their spouse, which is considered wrong in many socities, not just within Christianity.

What if there are two married, consenting homosexual partners who wish to have sex? Is there truly some sort of "act of sin" taking place? Despite what God may think or not, I simply do not see what's wrong with two loving, married adults expressing their gratitude for eachother, especially considering that they're not harming or disrupting the lives of other people around them.

You are leaning on your own understanding and rationalizing based on our finite reasoning as humans. Are your thoughts and ways higher than God's? God gave us His law and expects us to sunmit to it and obey it or pay the consequenses in eternity. He did not provide an option for us to amend it.

That is they way it is, we cannot change it, the only option we have is to obey it or pay the consequences.

He gives us a free will to do either.  

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

You are entitled to your opinion and will get the chance to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

Hewkii

ah good, it seems you are refusing the notion that he is all good. that can only have positive aspects.

Here's your "positive effects".  

Don't change what I wrote to try to put words in my mouth. The fact that I granted that you are entiled to your opinion does not mean that I agree with it. I don't. When you attempt to imply  something other than what a person wrote, you are being intellectually dishonest. I will not entertain discussions with one that resorts to that tactic.  

God is all good, holy, righteous, and just. 

1Th 4:6  That no man go beyond and defraud his brother in any matter: because that the Lord is the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.
 

Don't prevaricate and change what I wrote to try to put words in my mouth. The fact that I granted that you are entiled to your opinion does not mean that I agree with it. I don't. When you attempt to imply  something other than what a person wrote, you are being intellectually dishonest. I will not entertain discussions with one that resorts to that tactic. 

blackregiment

but I didn't put words in your mouth. you yourself implied that God wouldn't take kindly to my statements, and hence that he would not be all good in the first place. almost as if he'd be insulted, but that would take some sort of pride, which is a sin in some places.

[QUOTE="blackregiment"] you do not seem to understand that there are demonic spirits in this world that deceive people with signs and wonders.harashawn

I'm pretty sure that if someone doesn't believe God exists, they probably don't think there are demons either.

Just thought I'd let you know ;) 

That is their free will perogative. Our beliefs do not determine the truth in reality however. 

you are speaking of hypothetical people and their claims, please give some specific examples. blackregiment

Third, you are assuming that what ever happened to these hypothetical people was of God.blackregiment

Finally, you do not seem to understand that there are demonic spirits in this world that deceive people with signs and wondersblackregiment

My point with all this? You can't prove any religion, which is why I'm not a part of it. Any "evidence" of god supposedly helping his true leaders is moot. Either god accepts and helps everyone, or he is misleading people by making them think that they are his chosen people. Another possibility, is that all religion is false.

I don't know your personal situation and I cannot know your heart. That being said, there are many that have overcome it. You mention Christ. I cannot know your heart but how do you know that you experienced true salvation? Did you see the fruits of salvation manifested in your life? Serving Christ is more than praying a prayer and walking the aisle, it is repentance of one's sinful ways, being born again, a new creature in Christ. It is total surrender of our will to Him. Jesus said that we must be born again. Many people attempt to come to Christ looking for Him to rush in and solve all of their problems, or an immediate issue they are dealing with like a  DWI. They are expecting Jesus to just "fix things" for them right away. It this does not happen right away, they fall away. The truth is that they never surrendered their will to Him and began to serve Him in obedience. The Lord works on His schedule, not ours. Following Christ is a way of life, not a therapy session or a source of a quick fix. If one does not have true fellowship with Christ, they prayers will not even be heard or answered. Sorrow, repentance, and obedience comes bfore blesings. The Bible tells us...

blackregiment

Again, you can't overcome it, it doesn't go away.  Anyone who claims otherwise isn't doing anything but ignoring it.  I've repented and I've been obediant.  There was a time where my life revolved around my faith.  And to be offered no help from something I've devouted myself to for so long really changed the way I looked at the world.  

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

Don't prevaricate and change what I wrote to try to put words in my mouth. The fact that I granted that you are entiled to your opinion does not mean that I agree with it. I don't. When you attempt to imply  something other than what a person wrote, you are being intellectually dishonest. I will not entertain discussions with one that resorts to that tactic. 

Hewkii

but I didn't put words in your mouth. you yourself implied that God wouldn't take kindly to my statements, and hence that he would not be all good in the first place. almost as if he'd be insulted, but that would take some sort of pride, which is a sin in some places.

You seem to consider your finite reasoning, in judgement of God, as truth in reality. Like I said, you will get to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

Jer 9:23  Thus saith the LORD, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches:
Jer 9:24  But let him that glorieth glory in this, that he understandeth and knoweth me, that I am the LORD which exercise lovingkindness, judgment, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith the LORD.

You are leaning on your own understanding and rationalizing based on our finite reasoning as humans. Are your thoughts and ways higher than God's? God gave us His law and expects us to sunmit to it and obey it or pay the consequenses in eternity. He did not provide an option for us to amend it.

That is they way it is, we cannot change it, the only option we have is to obey it or pay the consequences.

He gives us a free will to do either.  

blackregiment

So, "because I said so?"  I truly, truly hate this answer.  We're told something so trivial is horrible and given absolutely no reason why.  

You seem to consider your finite reasoning, in judgement of God, as truth in reality.blackregiment

pot, meet kettle.

Like I said, you will get to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

more subtle acknowledgements of his pride and being insulted. good show.

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

I don't know your personal situation and I cannot know your heart. That being said, there are many that have overcome it. You mention Christ. I cannot know your heart but how do you know that you experienced true salvation? Did you see the fruits of salvation manifested in your life? Serving Christ is more than praying a prayer and walking the aisle, it is repentance of one's sinful ways, being born again, a new creature in Christ. It is total surrender of our will to Him. Jesus said that we must be born again. Many people attempt to come to Christ looking for Him to rush in and solve all of their problems, or an immediate issue they are dealing with like a  DWI. They are expecting Jesus to just "fix things" for them right away. It this does not happen right away, they fall away. The truth is that they never surrendered their will to Him and began to serve Him in obedience. The Lord works on His schedule, not ours. Following Christ is a way of life, not a therapy session or a source of a quick fix. If one does not have true fellowship with Christ, they prayers will not even be heard or answered. Sorrow, repentance, and obedience comes bfore blesings. The Bible tells us...

Dark_Knight6

Again, you can't overcome it, it doesn't go away.  Anyone who claims otherwise isn't doing anything but ignoring it.  I've repented and I've been obediant.  There was a time where my life revolved around my faith.  And to be offered no help from something I've devouted myself to for so long really changed the way I looked at the world.  

Well, I have shared God's truth with you as best I could. What you do with it is now up to you. There is really nothing more I can say than what I have. I wish I could be of more help but that doesn't seem possible. God gave us each a free will and the choices we make with it are ours alone.  

I will be praying for you.

[QUOTE="Hewkii"][QUOTE="blackregiment"]

Don't prevaricate and change what I wrote to try to put words in my mouth. The fact that I granted that you are entiled to your opinion does not mean that I agree with it. I don't. When you attempt to imply  something other than what a person wrote, you are being intellectually dishonest. I will not entertain discussions with one that resorts to that tactic. 

blackregiment

but I didn't put words in your mouth. you yourself implied that God wouldn't take kindly to my statements, and hence that he would not be all good in the first place. almost as if he'd be insulted, but that would take some sort of pride, which is a sin in some places.

You seem to consider your finite reasoning, in judgement of God, as truth in reality. Like I said, you will get to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

Care to demonstrate your infinite reasoning, BR?

Perhaps you have forgotten that your reasoning is just as finite as the rest of us.

[QUOTE="-Jiggles-"][QUOTE="blackregiment"]

I disagree with your premise. There is a difference in having an attraction and acting on those feelings. There have been many people that have overcome what you are dealing with through Christ. There are organizations that can help. Do you think that heterosexual people aren't attracted to the opposite sex, say a woman that flirts with a married man, as well? Why is someone that is following Christ, say that man, able to resist temptation to act out his attraction and commit adultery? Temptation is temptation whether it be same sex or opposite sex.The difference is having Christ and obeying Him, walking in the spirit and not in the flesh.

I edited my last post and added some additional comments. You might go back and read it.

blackregiment

Temptation isn't what I built my original premise off of, which is what you seem to be targetting here. With your adultery example, the main real-world consequence would be a person cheating on their spouse, which is considered wrong in many socities, not just within Christianity.

What if there are two married, consenting homosexual partners who wish to have sex? Is there truly some sort of "act of sin" taking place? Despite what God may think or not, I simply do not see what's wrong with two loving, married adults expressing their gratitude for eachother, especially considering that they're not harming or disrupting the lives of other people around them.

You are leaning on your own understanding and rationalizing based on our finite reasoning as humans. Are your thoughts and ways higher than God's? God gave us His law and expects us to sunmit to it and obey it or pay the consequenses in eternity. He did not provide an option for us to amend it.

That is they way it is, we cannot change it, the only option we have is to obey it or pay the consequences.

He gives us a free will to do either.

Uh-huh. Do you have your own personal opinions on homosexuality or just the parroted version that many fundamentalist Christians seem to speak about? You will learn very little of the world around you and not experience the full potential of life if you don't study and form your own opinions about the many areas of life. After all, I'm pretty sure that God wants you to live a happy and fulfilling life when you're oustide of a church, and isolating your entire mindset to what one religious book has to say is silly at best.

Tell me, what do you personally think about homosexuals?

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]Specific examples? I can't do that over the internet. That would require someone elses testimony, which there are thousands of. Just look on any religious website or walk into a church or other place of worship. You'll get plenty of examples. Or look up just about any story of someone being cured of a disease or cancer, and 90% of the time they'll thank god.

 

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]Third, you are assuming that what ever happened to these hypothetical people was of God.dog64

Finally, you do not seem to understand that there are demonic spirits in this world that deceive people with signs and wondersblackregiment

My point with all this? You can't prove any religion, which is why I'm not a part of it. Any "evidence" of god supposedly helping his true leaders is moot. Either god accepts and helps everyone, or he is misleading people by making them think that they are his chosen people. Another possibility, is that all religion is false.

Here is where you are mistaken. There is only one faith that acknowledges a belief in Jesus as God, our Savior, who predicted His death and resurrection. There is more evidence, firsthand eyewitness testimony from those that gave their lives for what they saw and knew was true, rather than recant their faith, than any other historical evidence for the truth of His death and resurrection than any other event in antiquity. Jesus said...

You have a free will to accept Jesus or reject Him. That is your choice. I can't make you do either. It is not my job. My total responsibility to the Lord is to share the Good News of God's love and salvation in Christ. I have done that. What you do with it is now up to you.

[QUOTE="blackregiment"][QUOTE="-Jiggles-"]

 

Temptation isn't what I built my original premise off of, which is what you seem to be targetting here. With your adultery example, the main real-world consequence would be a person cheating on their spouse, which is considered wrong in many socities, not just within Christianity.

What if there are two married, consenting homosexual partners who wish to have sex? Is there truly some sort of "act of sin" taking place? Despite what God may think or not, I simply do not see what's wrong with two loving, married adults expressing their gratitude for eachother, especially considering that they're not harming or disrupting the lives of other people around them.

-Jiggles-

You are leaning on your own understanding and rationalizing based on our finite reasoning as humans. Are your thoughts and ways higher than God's? God gave us His law and expects us to sunmit to it and obey it or pay the consequenses in eternity. He did not provide an option for us to amend it.

That is they way it is, we cannot change it, the only option we have is to obey it or pay the consequences.

He gives us a free will to do either.

Uh-huh. Do you have your own personal opinions on homosexuality or just the parroted version that many fundamentalist Christians seem to speak about? You will learn very little of the world around you and not experience the full potential of life if you don't study and form your own opinions about the many areas of life. After all, I'm pretty sure that God wants you to live a happy and fulfilling life when you're oustide of a church, and isolating your entire mindset to what one religious book has to say is silly at best.

Tell me, what do you personally think about homosexuals?

You are making assumptions and putting forth false premises. Following Christ is a joyful and fulfilling life. Obedience to God's Word keeps one from so many errors tht are common in the world, STD's unwanted pregnancies, hangovers, drug addiction, lying, deceit, drunken car wrecks, DWI's, jilted love, adultery, theft, jealousy, covetousness, AIDS, I could go on and on. There are also soooo many blessings. In addition I know where I am going to spend my eternity.

Before you criticize something, you should learn a little about it. I choose not to be conformed to the world. 

To answer your last question, God reveals that it is a sin against Him and therefore wrong.

By the way, I take my instruction on life from God's Word, not the philsophies of man, or the world. 

[QUOTE="blackregiment"]

[QUOTE="Hewkii"]

but I didn't put words in your mouth. you yourself implied that God wouldn't take kindly to my statements, and hence that he would not be all good in the first place. almost as if he'd be insulted, but that would take some sort of pride, which is a sin in some places.

Shad0ki11

You seem to consider your finite reasoning, in judgement of God, as truth in reality. Like I said, you will get to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

Care to demonstrate your infinite reasoning, BR?

Perhaps you have forgotten that your reasoning is just as finite as the rest of us.

Nowhere have I said that my reasoning is infinite. I am a fallen sinner, saved by the grace of God, with finite reasoning just like you. The difference is, I have access to God's wisdom through  His Word and the mind of Christ from my personal relationship with Him.

You are depending on the wisdom of the world and the philsophies of man.

[QUOTE="Shad0ki11"][QUOTE="blackregiment"]

You seem to consider your finite reasoning, in judgement of God, as truth in reality. Like I said, you will get to tell Him that face to face someday. Let me know how that goes.

blackregiment

Care to demonstrate your infinite reasoning, BR?

Perhaps you have forgotten that your reasoning is just as finite as the rest of us.

Prevaricating is quite the common practice among non-believers. Nowhere have I said that my reasoning is infinite. I am a fallen sinner, saved by the grace of God, with finite reasoning just like you. The difference is, I have access to God's wisdom through  His Word and the mind of Christ from my personal relationship with Him.

You are depending on the wisdom of the world and the vain philsophies of man.

I'm not a non-believer. I just don't agree with your beliefs. 

Do you see yourself as anything more than a human being?

Well, I have shared God's truth with you as best I could. What you do with it is now up to you. There is really nothing more I can say than what I have. I wish I could be of more help but that doesn't seem possible. God gave us each a free will and the choices we make with it are ours alone.  

I will be praying for you.

blackregiment

Thanks!  I've enjoyed this chat with you.  And, at this point, I'd think it would be best to just agree to disagree on this matter as we both, obviously, have very different views.  :D  

[QUOTE="-Jiggles-"][QUOTE="blackregiment"]

You are leaning on your own understanding and rationalizing based on our finite reasoning as humans. Are your thoughts and ways higher than God's? God gave us His law and expects us to sunmit to it and obey it or pay the consequenses in eternity. He did not provide an option for us to amend it.

That is they way it is, we cannot change it, the only option we have is to obey it or pay the consequences.

He gives us a free will to do either.

blackregiment

Uh-huh. Do you have your own personal opinions on homosexuality or just the parroted version that many fundamentalist Christians seem to speak about? You will learn very little of the world around you and not experience the full potential of life if you don't study and form your own opinions about the many areas of life. After all, I'm pretty sure that God wants you to live a happy and fulfilling life when you're oustide of a church, and isolating your entire mindset to what one religious book has to say is silly at best.

Tell me, what do you personally think about homosexuals?

How funny, You are good at making assumptions and putting forth false premises aren't you. While you can never knoiw it if you do not have Christ, following Christ is a joyful and fulfilling life. Obedience to God's Word keeps one from so many errors tht are common in the world, STD's unwanted pregnancies, hangovers, drug addiction, lying, deceit, drunken car wrecks, DWI's, jilted love, adultery, theft, jealousy, covetousness, AIDS, I could go on and on. There are also soooo many blessings. In addition I know where I am going to spend my eternity.

Before you criticize something, you should learn a little about it. You are conformed to the world. I choose not to be.

To answer your last question, God reveals that it is a sin against Him and therefore wrong.

By the way, I take my instruction on life from God's Word, not the vain philsophies of man, or the world.

After reading what you've said about "God's Word keeping one from so many errors", I had to chuckle inside; it reminds me of a story that I once read while reading the Bible (I was a former Christian and taught in a Christian school). It is the story of Jobe. You being such a devout and passionate Christian, I'm sure you've heard of this story.

Jobe was a kind and generous man who raised a grand, loving family. He was also a devoted follower of God and put aside time every day to thank Him for all the wonderful things he blessed him with. One day, however, Satan talked to God (Satan being, what I refer to him as, God's "on-off girlfriend") and told him that Jobe would not love and worship God if he wasn't blessed with all the things he was given. God, wishing to prove his spastic girlfriend wrong once again, killed Jobe's entire family, destroyed his home and covered his body in many painful sores. Despite all the hardships inflicted upon Jobe, he still retained his love and belief in God and worshipped him still. After a brief moment of "Haha, I told you so" from God to Satan, Jobe lived happily ever after... with no family and home... and painful sores...

To wrap this post up, you haven't clearly answered my question from before yet; God's word does not substitute for your own opinion. I clearly asked about what you felt about homosexuality, not what your god thinks about it.

No.

Also, BR, your still preaching in OT? :|

Here is where you are mistaken. There is only one faith that acknowledges a belief in Jesus as God, our Savior, who predicted His death and resurrection. There is more evidence, firsthand eyewitness testimony from those that gave their lives for what they saw and knew was true, rather than recant their faith, than any other historical evidence for the truth of His death and resurrection than any other event in antiquity. Jesus said...Joh 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

You have a free will to accept Jesus or reject Him. That is your choice. I can't make you do either. It is not my job. My total responsibility to the Lord is to share the Good News of God's love and salvation in Christ. I have done that. What you do with it is now up to you.blackregiment

If Jesus was god, then there is no other greater than him. Yet he's saying here that the father (god) is greater than him. Why would god say there's someone greater than him? So, perhaps then, that there's a possiblity that Jesus is not god? This is why not every Christian religion believes that Jesus was god. There are other scriptures too that agree. If you post scriptures that say otherwise like "I and the Father are one", than you're posting contradictions.

Second, the rest of what you posted doesn't go any further into the question. You still haven't provided any proof that explains why the help and blessings that god is giving you and the people you talked with is legit and the help and blessings that are happing to everyone else is false or done by a evil spirit. If I were to show you a newspaper article that quoted someone as saying "God cured my cancer!" but yet he is a muslim, what would you say to that? (There is no such article, but its an illustration as to how you would answer to someone claiming such).

If Jesus was god, then there is no other greater than him. Yet he's saying here that the father (god) is greater than him. Why would god say there's someone greater than him? So, perhaps then, that there's a possiblity that Jesus is not god? This is why not every Christian religion believes that Jesus was god. There are other scriptures too that agree. If you post scriptures that say otherwise like "I and the Father are one", than you're posting contradictions.

dog64

That's because Jesus was God's son, not God himself. (At least that's what I believe) 

[QUOTE="dog64"]

If Jesus was god, then there is no other greater than him. Yet he's saying here that the father (god) is greater than him. Why would god say there's someone greater than him? So, perhaps then, that there's a possiblity that Jesus is not god? This is why not every Christian religion believes that Jesus was god. There are other scriptures too that agree. If you post scriptures that say otherwise like "I and the Father are one", than you're posting contradictions.

harashawn

That's because Jesus was God's son, not God himself. (At least that's what I believe) 

My point exactly.