G@y m@rri@ge

This is my opinion for you to discuss. Before i continue, let's get the record straight:

Firstly, I'm not homophobic and I don't hate gay people. I seriously have no prejudices.
Secondly, I'm not religious, although I am monodeistic.

If you guys want to accuse me of these things then fine. It's not like you are going to convince me. It'll be more of a reflection on your inadequacy to debate your opinions.

 Now. Opinion.

1. Why are you against gay marriage?

The most common arguement that gay-marriage apologists use is that Gay marriage doesn't hurt / effect you". This is true to an extent. Firstly though, let's look at what marriage is. Marriage was established by religions all over the world in order to regulate the obligations and responsibilities of pro-creation. No, it isn't about love. Love is very much so a secondary part of marriage. Fortunately, we live in a society where we can choose our spouse based on love, but ultimately, if you brought forth Gay marriage there is absolutely no reason for it to exist.

Many people argue: This isn't about religion, we are talking about secular marriage. Well, wrong. We all live in a culturally religious society, whether that be christianity in the USA, or Islam in the Middle East or Hinduism in India. However, take a holiday like Christmas. Yes, you celebrate that, don't you atheists. Now i'm sure you realised - Christmas was popularised by the Christians, in order to celebrate the birth of christ. Whether he was actually born on December 25th doesn't matter, what matters is that jesus was born, and christians celebrate it.

Now. Say the supreme court said that Christmas is now actually Chuck Norris joke day. The Christians would be offended, and rightly so. It would be a complete slap in the face to their religion.

This is the same with Marriage -- only it's not offensive to just christians: it's offensive to jews, muslims, hindu, buddhist etc etc etc. To prioritise Gay marriage because they 'love each other very much', is a complete slap in the face to a religious ceremony

2. If we had your views, inter-racial marriages wouldn't exist!

Sigh. No legitimate and respected religious movement advocates racism. There is nothing anti-religious about inter-racial marriages. Considering there are plenty of people who worship a religion not assosiated with their skin colour (e.g. black christians, white muslims, etc.)

3. You've talked about religion a lot... Religion is filled with evil and bigotry!

The USA is 90% religious. If you honestly think that all religious people are backward !@#$%'s, then i suggest you stop singing 'God Bless America' so much.

Sure, some people are backwards, but the majority of religious people are free thinking, reasonable people.

4. How do you expect people to share happy lives?

Marriage isn't the only way to a successful relationship. Civil unionships if you must. And moreover, WHY DO YOU NEED TO GET MARRIED TO BE HAPPY? I have an uncle who has a long time partner, and he still calls her his 'wife'. You don't need to be married to show that you are in love, and you don't need to be married in order to have a happy life and successful relationship.

5. Yes, the 'sanctity' of marriage is reeeaaaally great when there is a 50% divorce rate.

Who ever said divorce is a good thing? I find that statistic both frightening and sad. Religion in all cultures has opposed divorce. However, it does not completely deny it. In an ideal world, nobody would want divorce rates that high... but what can you do?

If you're against gay marriage, you're discriminatory of gays.

/thread

Most same sex couples couldn't care less about religion and "marriage". 

All they want is equal rights and their relationship to be open to the same advantages and respect as hetro couples.  Which it isn't at present in nearly every so called "modern" country in the world.

If you're straight, two same sex people being together has absolutely NOTHING to do with you.  It doesn't affect you in any way, shape or form. And while your argument might be rooted in some semblence of sanity, MANY others are simply homophobic and bred from hate and prejudice.

If you're against gay marriage, you're discriminatory of gays.

/thread

xMOBSTER23x

If you're for gay marriage, you're discriminatory of religious people. 

can be argued both ways.

I agree with you on a lot of things..

But can I just say this.. Dam the election ended and now the forums are now filled with Gay Marriage and stupid stuff Obama has said.. ahhh good times.. good times..

I agree with you on a lot of things..

But can I just say this.. Dam the election ended and now the forums are now filled with Gay Marriage and stupid stuff Obama has said.. ahhh good times.. good times..

ferrari2001

I know, it's like there's always a posting fad here.  A couple weeks ago, all we talked about was the election, now it's Prop. 8 and gay marriage. 

I think we should make gay marriage mandatory, so that people begin to understand why the government has no business regulating social issues. If everyone had to marry some guy named Steve, people might start to go "gee, we shouldn't use the legal system just to arbitrarily push the most popular social views". Plus, Steve is a pretty interesting name.

Random question: If a man and woman have a marriage and one later decides to change his or her sex, would it then be a same-sex marriage and thus be illegal?mindstorm

That is an interesting question.  I don't think it would be illegal because technically, the changes are only superficial.

Gay couples should have the same rights as a traditional man and woman marriage, because it doesn't hurt anyone to give those rights to them... now being married in a church a "religious marriage" now that is up to the church not the government

[QUOTE="xMOBSTER23x"]

If you're against gay marriage, you're discriminatory of gays.

/thread

Stumpt25

If you're for gay marriage, you're discriminatory of religious people. 

can be argued both ways.

I'm religious and support gay marriage.... 

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]Random question: If a man and woman have a marriage and one later decides to change his or her sex, would it then be a same-sex marriage and thus be illegal?stevenk4k5

That is an interesting question. I don't think it would be illegal because technically, the changes are only superficial.

If the changes are superficial that wouldn't really matter..it'd still be two people of the same gender who are married..you can't blur the lines when marriage has been so wonderfully defined. On a side note I'm pro gay marriage..I can not stand the foolish arguments against it...

Religion has nothing to do with Marriage. This is a mistake many people make. Your culture plays a much bigger roll in Marriage than religious philosophy does. You could say that Religion is a reflection of culture. IT is not. Culture is entirely independent of religious beliefs. The interpretation of sin for example will be very different in certain societies, even though Religion may always define it the same way. IT's really not that complicated of a concept. Culture drives us. Religion stays the same. The greatest advantage species have is their ability to change and adapt to the World around them. Religion has it's purpose, but in the end it's old and primitive in many regards because it refuses to change at the rate Culture does.

Marriage was not established as a part of Religion.. it was adopted by it. Marriages origins have more to do with connecting tribal communities together, and reproduction than it does religious philosophy.

Religion is not the ultimate authority on the rules of Marriage. The community is. Now.. if we lived in small communities I'd agree with you.. there would be no room for Gay Marriage. But we do not live in small communities. There are many different forms of religion, and because of that we have to respect every bodies view. EVEN if they are the minority. It does us no good to live by majority rule in large communities when it comes to concepts like Marriage. It only creates conflict, where people could work together.

Do gay people not deserve their own form of religion that allows for Marriage? Yes, they do. Do aethist not deserve their own view that allows them to get Married? Yes, they do. If you tell somebody they can't do something because of what they believe.. then that's discrimination. Everybody in America is allowed their own religion. Is this not true? As long as it doesn't harm anybody in a physical sense? This is true. But apparently not because we say the Christians have the Ultimate Religious Authority to define Marriage. That's laughable to me. Freedom of Religion in America, am I right? So.. Yes, gay couples can have their own definition of Marriage. It's still controlled by the State for reasons of exchange of Money.

As long as we run around defining everything based on the fact most people believe in Christianity.. then were not progressing. We're not evolving. We're just staying the same. It does us very little good in the end. I really don't understand how people can use Religion to say it has the authority to deny Gay Marriage. Gay Communities are allowed their own religious views. That's how it works in America. So they should be giving the State Right of Marriage. It's pretty simple.

Its funny how people argue like sexual preference and race are the same thing. LOLTSCombo

You know what's more funny? Is that the assumption that a black man, and a white man are two different races. CAN THEY BREED together and produce offspring that can reproduce? Yes, they can. So, therefore they are the same Race. It's been a misused terminology for a long time in American culture, and it's about time somebody corrected people.

A different race would be somebody like A Elf, and A Dwarf from World of Warcraft.. They can't produce offspring together. So, they are too seperate Humanoid races. Like A Baboon and A Gorilla. Now if You have Red Haired Baboons and Grey haired Baboons, and they can still reproduce with each other. They are still Baboons. Pretty simple concept. No? IT's so funny to me that people get this concept confused over and over again.

[QUOTE="TSCombo"]Its funny how people argue like sexual preference and race are the same thing. LOLEMOEVOLUTION

You know what's more funny? Is that the assumption that a black man, and a white man are two different races. CAN THEY BREED together and produce offspring that can reproduce? Yes, they can. So, therefore they are the same Race. It's been a misused terminology for a long time in American culture, and it's about time somebody corrected people.

A different race would be somebody like A Elf, and A Dwarf from World of Warcraft.. They can't produce offspring together. So, they are too seperate Humanoid races. Like A Baboon and A Gorilla. Now if You have Red Haired Baboons and Grey haired Baboons, and they can still reproduce with each other. They are still Baboons. Pretty simple concept. No? IT's so funny to me that people get this concept confused over and over again.

I am Christian (not exactly always a practicing one) but a Christian nevertheless.

I pretty much have one opinion on this topic:

You want to get married? Go ahead, just stop trying to get married in a church and by a priest.

I dont know about the other religions, but Homosexuality is not allowed in this religion since it was concieved. I have no idea why gays are constantly trying to have it accepted by the church and whatnot.

Go get married, really, who gives a rats @$$, just stop expecting it to be a religious sacrament when you do it.

I am Christian (not exactly always a practicing one) but a Christian nevertheless.

I pretty much have one opinion on this topic:

You want to get married? Go ahead, just stop trying to get married in a church and by a priest.

I dont know about the other religions, but Homosexuality is not allowed in this religion since it was concieved. I have no idea why gays are constantly trying to have it accepted by the church and whatnot.

Go get married, really, who gives a rats @$$, just stop expecting it to be a religious sacrament when you do it.

1337h4xx0rz

They aren't trying to get married by the church as far as I remember, they just want their marriages recognized by the state.  Prop 8 banned gay marriage completely in California which means that gays aren't even allowed to be married by the state which is not right.

I am Christian (not exactly always a practicing one) but a Christian nevertheless.

I pretty much have one opinion on this topic:

You want to get married? Go ahead, just stop trying to get married in a church and by a priest.

I dont know about the other religions, but Homosexuality is not allowed in this religion since it was concieved. I have no idea why gays are constantly trying to have it accepted by the church and whatnot.

Go get married, really, who gives a rats @$$, just stop expecting it to be a religious sacrament when you do it.

1337h4xx0rz

90% of the US is technically "Christian" by religion, but how many of them are actually practicising Christians?

Being for gay marriage (what a stupid bloody term) is not being anti-religion. Marriage is more than just Christian marriage - it covers Muslim marriage, Jewish marriage, Hindu marriage, civil unions and so on. A lot of Christians, Muslims and Jews (actually Jews are the more tolerant ones here) who want absolutely no "marriage" rights for gays don't give a damn about the sanctity of marriage - they're just in it to dig at gays as much they can (remember Fred "God Hates F*gs Phelps?).

Now, on the other hand, I have absolutely nothing about keeping marriage between gays to non-religious civil unions. There is a distinct separation between church and state, regardless of what people say, and denial of this would basically make the US no better than Iran - both religious theocracies with the only difference being religion. If you listen to the loony religious right, then you would believe that the US is a religious theocracy, but thankfully I know that they're not the majority - they're just loud.

At the end of the day, though, how individual religions handle gay marriage is up to that community's definition of marriage, but gays should be granted the same rights under civil, secular law.

Just as a pointer, by the way - here in Germany, a religious marriage ceremony is not considered binding by law. Christians, Muslims and Jews marry twice in this country - once in a church/mosque/synagogue, and once in a registry office.

Im against gay adoption and marriagefreshgman

Here in the UK gay marriage has been legalised and it hasn't affected me negatively. Or any one I know, for that matter. Saying gay people can get 'married' but have to call it something different is pretty much the modern equvilant of saying "Yes, you can drink water from a fountain. Just not from the fountain I use" to a black person.

Here in the UK gay marriage has been legalised and it hasn't affected me negatively. Or any one I know, for that matter. Saying gay people can get 'married' but have to call it something different is pretty much the modern equvilant of saying "Yes, you can drink water from a fountain. Just not from the fountain I use" to a black person.

manicfoot

Im against gay adoption and marriagefreshgman

We already know, you've made that clear quite a few times.

[QUOTE="freshgman"]Im against gay adoption and marriageGreatgone12

First of all, you need to relax because everyone is entitled to their own opinion, regardless if it conflicts with yours.

Second of all, what if his reason is that it is because they are gay In all honesty, if that was his reason, it could very well be a valid argument. Im sorry, but two men being together is not a natural occurrence, so what makes you think that two men raising a child is any more natural? I think that the maternal insticts and abilities of a mother are a necessity in a childs upbringing. Having two men raise a child will never be the same as a mother and father.

Not to mention, who knows what will happen when the child gets older, and goes to school, etc. This world is cruel, and filled with cruel people, especially children. There is no doubt in my mind that if anyone in school found out that a child had two parents of the same sex, there would be one prick in the school who would ridicule that child to no extent, which I am sure would at least have some sort of influence to either self esteem problems, or even possible resentment to the two people that brought him/her up.

So, in the end, there are valid arguments to CONCERNS at least to gay adoptions, whether I agree if I am against it or not I am on the fence, but it is undenyable that two families one with a mother and a father, and one with two fathers, and we will say both are equally fit to be parents (on an upbringing scale), the child would have less problems personally and socially with the family with heterosexual parents.

[QUOTE="xMOBSTER23x"]

If you're against gay marriage, you're discriminatory of gays.

/thread

Stumpt25

If you're for gay marriage, you're discriminatory of religious people.

can be argued both ways.

I'm protestant and I support gay marriage.

[QUOTE="freshgman"]

We already know, you've made that clear quite a few times.

stevenk4k5

you have made your stance as well. this is a thread on gay marriage so whats your point?

[QUOTE="freshgman"]Im against gay adoption and marriageGreatgone12

i feel a child needs to be raised by a mother and father for the child's development. The child will be ridiculed and singled out and wont understand why he has 2 fathers etc. Its just a hardship that a child shouldnt have to go through. Plus its unnatural

It seems that the majority of guys on this site only view homosexuality as a trait that occurs in males.  (i.e. "...Won't understand why HE has 2 FATHER'S")  What if it was a girl with two fathers?  Or a boy with two mothers?

It seems that the majority of guys on this site only view homosexuality as a trait that occurs in males. (i.e. "...Won't understand why HE has 2 FATHER'S") What if it was a girl with two fathers? Or a boy with two mothers?

stevenk4k5

You're right.. and that really annoys me. Its even worse in real life. I have a friend who thinks men being gay isn't natural... Yet cheers girls on when they make out with eachother. It drives me insane.

It seems that the majority of guys on this site only view homosexuality as a trait that occurs in males. (i.e. "...Won't understand why HE has 2 FATHER'S") What if it was a girl with two fathers? Or a boy with two mothers?

stevenk4k5

yeah it would be the same. why cant we have at it has been intended if you can have kids you shouldnt be raising them.

[QUOTE="Greatgone12"]

[QUOTE="freshgman"]Im against gay adoption and marriage1337h4xx0rz

First of all, you need to relax because everyone is entitled to their own opinion, regardless if it conflicts with yours.

Second of all, what if his reason is that it is because they are gay In all honesty, if that was his reason, it could very well be a valid argument. Im sorry, but two men being together is not a natural occurrence, so what makes you think that two men raising a child is any more natural? I think that the maternal insticts and abilities of a mother are a necessity in a childs upbringing. Having two men raise a child will never be the same as a mother and father.

Not to mention, who knows what will happen when the child gets older, and goes to school, etc. This world is cruel, and filled with cruel people, especially children. There is no doubt in my mind that if anyone in school found out that a child had two parents of the same sex, there would be one prick in the school who would ridicule that child to no extent, which I am sure would at least have some sort of influence to either self esteem problems, or even possible resentment to the two people that brought him/her up.

So, in the end, there are valid arguments to CONCERNS at least to gay adoptions, whether I agree if I am against it or not I am on the fence, but it is undenyable that two families one with a mother and a father, and one with two fathers, and we will say both are equally fit to be parents (on an upbringing scale), the child would have less problems personally and socially with the family with heterosexual parents.

I hate this friggin' arguement, people will get bullied no matter what, it doesn't matter if you have gay or straight parents, in all honesty I've seen kids raised better by a homosexual couple than by a heterosexual couple, it doesn't matter what orientation the parents are, as long as they care for their kids and raise them well it shouldn't matter.

Anyhow, would people stop making these topics, it's getting really old really fast.

[QUOTE="stevenk4k5"]

It seems that the majority of guys on this site only view homosexuality as a trait that occurs in males. (i.e. "...Won't understand why HE has 2 FATHER'S") What if it was a girl with two fathers? Or a boy with two mothers?

 

manicfoot

You're right.. and that really annoys me. Its even worse in real life. I have a friend who thinks men being gay isn't natural... Yet cheers girls on when they make out with eachother. It drives me insane.

Same here.  If you are going to condemn homosexual men then you might as well do the same thing for homosexual women.  One does not take precedence over the other.

i aint gay but my older brother is ( 32) and imho i dont care if gays wanna marry since when has this country become a lynchmob on whos right to be married? i cant sit here and say i dont want a specific couple to get married. who ever believes homosexuality is a choice is ignorent and homophobic. my aunt whos a bible thumper believes homosexuality is a choice heck she even believs predators chose to rape little kids. ifi didnt have my brother around id be in a gang i never had a dad to take care of me and i can say coming from a home where my brother is gay im not ashamed of him if he wants to marry a dude hey more power to him. i dont care what the bible, church , homophobic people say they cant say im wrong on this fact based statement

If you are going to condemn homosexual men then you might as well do the same thing for homosexual women. One does not take precedence over the other. stevenk4k5

I agree, they both should be condemned.

[QUOTE="stevenk4k5"]If you are going to condemn homosexual men then you might as well do the same thing for homosexual women. One does not take precedence over the other. TSCombo

I agree, they both should be condemned.

No they shouldn't.  Why should we condemn a sexuality which no one has control over?

[QUOTE="TSCombo"]

[QUOTE="stevenk4k5"]If you are going to condemn homosexual men then you might as well do the same thing for homosexual women. One does not take precedence over the other. stevenk4k5

I agree, they both should be condemned.

No they shouldn't. Why should we condemn a sexuality which no one has control over?

your right we should condemn them both since most lesbians arent "hot" anyway. most look like men to begin with