they got f**** over and continue to get f**** over to this very day. They have a very tragic history
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they got f**** over and continue to get f**** over to this very day. They have a very tragic history
People today did none of that....so no.[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="tenaka2"]
Guilty
tenaka2
Yet quick to celebrate the 4th of July.
Must be nice to be able to chose what to be proud or ashamed of based upon convenience.
The 4th is considered the birth of the US. Not the same thing TBH.[QUOTE="tenaka2"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] People today did none of that....so no.LJS9502_basic
Yet quick to celebrate the 4th of July.
Must be nice to be able to chose what to be proud or ashamed of based upon convenience.
The 4th is considered the birth of the US. Not the same thing TBH.I think you mean not the same thing IMO :P
A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.They dont believe in land ownership. Native americans thought the idea of owning land was silly. So it's not really their land.
sonicare
The 4th is considered the birth of the US. Not the same thing TBH.[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="tenaka2"]
Yet quick to celebrate the 4th of July.
Must be nice to be able to chose what to be proud or ashamed of based upon convenience.
tenaka2
I think you mean not the same thing IMO :P
I said not.:?Conquering is living on someones land... lol.We don't live on their land. We conquered them.
airshocker
This is called DEFENSE.l already posted this but I deleted it. I don't want to come off as a racist because im not. This is just a historical fact, okay? In the war between the Native Americans and the settlers, the Native Americans fired the first shots. There were people living out on the prairies that were too affraid to leave thier homes because the Natives would kill them. It doesn't make what the settlers did okay but it was war.
TheHighWind
[QUOTE="airshocker"]Conquering is living on someones land... lol. History of the world. Nonetheless NA were more nomadic. They didn't particularly own any piece of land but traveled in areas.We don't live on their land. We conquered them.
Matthew-first
they got screwed over but anyone here that thinks they are part of some magical race of people that have not committed horrendous atrocities throughout history is just a dumbass.
tough to hold the high moral ground when your highground is a mountian of corpses
what are these horrible crimes you speak ofthey got screwed over but anyone here that thinks they are part of some magical race of people that have not committed horrendous atrocities throughout history is just a dumbass.
tough to hold the high moral ground when your highground is a mountian of corpses
Riverwolf007
[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]what are these horrible crimes you speak ofHave you studied history at all?they got screwed over but anyone here that thinks they are part of some magical race of people that have not committed horrendous atrocities throughout history is just a dumbass.
tough to hold the high moral ground when your highground is a mountian of corpses
infinite884
[QUOTE="infinite884"][QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]what are these horrible crimes you speak ofHave you studied history at all? I know native americans have done some f*** up sh!t I just wanna know what incidents he's referring too, also how do you know i even live in the United States and have knowledge of your countries history? I know you have this "i know everything" mentality but i don't possess that trait and just asked a simple question, no need to be a d*ck about it.they got screwed over but anyone here that thinks they are part of some magical race of people that have not committed horrendous atrocities throughout history is just a dumbass.
tough to hold the high moral ground when your highground is a mountian of corpses
LJS9502_basic
They were born there... they lived there for centuries before 'colonization' began...Matthew-firstI read that as "consolization".
[QUOTE="Matthew-first"] They were born there... they lived there for centuries before 'colonization' began...Am_ConfuciusI read that as "consolization". Both would be true.
I still feel bad about how my earlier outburt come across, engrish. By the grace of the goddess athena, please forgive me.
I have never seen one, in the US or Canada frankly i am not convinced they exist weezyfbGo to Minnesota.
Oh, no prob. I was actually hoping for this to turn into a debate about moral relativity (except across time, not cultures) and if today's morals can be retroactively placed upon our ancestors. Because obviously we would not condone the same actions if taken today against technologically-weaker cultures.I still feel bad about how my earlier outburt come across, engrish. By the grace of the goddess athena, please forgive me.
sonicare
A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.ghoklebutter
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
[QUOTE="ghoklebutter"]A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.airshocker
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
Maybe he lives in his car?Native Americans should give these European Americans a taste of there own medicine Bucked20They did fight back....just didn't win. And as they say.....to the victor goes the spoils.
Maybe he lives in his car?LJS9502_basic
Man, it's silly that people can own cars. What a stupid idea. :roll:
Native Americans should give these European Americans a taste of there own medicine Bucked20They can have New Jersey if they want it.
I have my own property and pay taxes for it, it's my land now. And we beat them in a war, sorry kid but that's how it goes.
As for how I feel about Native Americans, well I feel the same way I feel about any other ethnic group in America, I don't judge them as a group I can only judge the ones I know indivdually and that's based off their personality and values ect...
I will say however that many Native Americans live on reserverations (which are basically 3rd world countires) and live below the poverty line, this is due to the Government however and not the American themselves.
To make matters worse the Government gives Native Americans in many parts of the US a discount on Alcohol (among other things), which if you know about gentics and ethnic groups, some can't tolerate alchohol as well as others, and Native Americans are the worst at that, it's because they produce more enzymes or sugar in their blood or something.
But no I don't hate Native Americans if that's what your trying to imply TC, and no I won't give them any of my land so get over it.
[QUOTE="sonicare"]They can have New Jersey if they want it.airshocker
What would happen to Chris Christie? :(
Just move him to NY.[QUOTE="ghoklebutter"]A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.airshocker
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
And viceversa. But owning land is a practice barely 6000 years old so it has less history on which to support its silliness.And viceversa. But owning land is a practice barely 6000 years old so it has less history on which to support its silliness.kuraimen
And thankfully it'll never go away.
I've only met two in my life: my best friend's girlfriend and their daughter.
I keep hearing about them at Casino's but I went to Atlantic City in 2010 but I guess I wasn't paying attention cause I didn't see any.
[QUOTE="airshocker"][QUOTE="ghoklebutter"]A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.kuraimen
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
And viceversa. But owning land is a practice barely 6000 years old so it has less history on which to support its silliness. Though "owning land" may have some public value. You never truly own land in the US, because you have to pay property taxes on it. That's usually a big source of income for local and some state govts, so that money gets back to the people. Bam, world peace and equality.They own casinos but not in Atlantic City.:|I've only met two in my life: my best friend's girlfriend and their daughter.
I keep hearing about them at Casino's but I went to Atlantic City in 2010 but I guess I wasn't paying attention cause I didn't see any.
AtlanticRock
Indian casinos are usually on reservations in certain states. Upstate NY, Michigan, and a couple of others.I've only met two in my life: my best friend's girlfriend and their daughter.
I keep hearing about them at Casino's but I went to Atlantic City in 2010 but I guess I wasn't paying attention cause I didn't see any.
AtlanticRock
And viceversa. But owning land is a practice barely 6000 years old so it has less history on which to support its silliness. Though "owning land" may have some public value. You never truly own land in the US, because you have to pay property taxes on it. That's usually a big source of income for local and some state govts, so that money gets back to the people. Bam, world peace and equality. Of course it has public value, although I would find more value on it if all of it was actually public but I'm thinking outside of today's context, I don't know how possible that could be right now but maybe someday.[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="airshocker"]
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
sonicare
[QUOTE="sonicare"]Though "owning land" may have some public value. You never truly own land in the US, because you have to pay property taxes on it. That's usually a big source of income for local and some state govts, so that money gets back to the people. Bam, world peace and equality. Of course it has public value, although I would find more value on it if all of it was actually public but I'm thinking outside of today's context, I don't know how possible that could be right now but maybe someday. The way I look at it, you're in a sense, renting land from the government to live on. But in the end, that land is property of the govt and thus the public. It's a stretch, but it makes me feel better at night.[QUOTE="kuraimen"] And viceversa. But owning land is a practice barely 6000 years old so it has less history on which to support its silliness.kuraimen
[QUOTE="sonicare"] If you consider that wrong. Maybe it's just human nature? A historical look at man kind shows that kind of behavior is pretty much the norm. Societies have been evolving and developing a code of morality, but it's kind of disingenuous to judge people of the past by our standards of today. Things were much different back then and life must have sucked majorly.Engrish_MajorYou can say the same thing to excuse slaveowners in the past. I choose not to.
This is complete asinine, no one who owned slaves is alive today. I can't blame you for something your ancestors did or not, no for the record I am not black nor did my ancestors own slaves, however my point still stands. We can't blame eachother for something our ancestors did, I wasn't there and neither were you or anyone else. It's time to move on, holding onto that is the reason why there are so many conflicts today.
What they did was wrong, yes. But you can't go around blaming people on your problems today for something that happened a long time ago.
That's not much different than how many Native American tribes treated the land. They did not have individual property ownership - it was deemed the "property" of the community, with the rights to the resources shared among the members of the tribe. However, it is merely the lack of an advanced written language that keeps that "ownership" informal in the eyes of the colonists.The way I look at it, you're in a sense, renting land from the government to live on. But in the end, that land is property of the govt and thus the public. It's a stretch, but it makes me feel better at night.
sonicare
You can say the same thing to excuse slaveowners in the past. I choose not to.[QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="sonicare"] If you consider that wrong. Maybe it's just human nature? A historical look at man kind shows that kind of behavior is pretty much the norm. Societies have been evolving and developing a code of morality, but it's kind of disingenuous to judge people of the past by our standards of today. Things were much different back then and life must have sucked majorly.ShadowMoses900
This is complete asinine, no one who owned slaves is alive today. I can't blame you for something your ancestors did or not, no for the record I am not black nor did my ancestors own slaves, however my point still stands. We can't blame eachother for something our ancestors did, I wasn't there and neither were you or anyone else. It's time to move on, holding onto that is the reason why there are so many conflicts today.
What they did was wrong, yes. But you can't go around blaming people on your problems today for something that happened a long time ago.
Go pick on someone else. I never blamed any living person.Indian casinos are usually on reservations in certain states. Upstate NY, Michigan, and a couple of others.[QUOTE="AtlanticRock"]
I've only met two in my life: my best friend's girlfriend and their daughter.
I keep hearing about them at Casino's but I went to Atlantic City in 2010 but I guess I wasn't paying attention cause I didn't see any.
sonicare
Thanks, because I seriously was looking to spot one... now I know why.
On Topic:
I feel bad for them, because they really got raped of their land and basically killed off.
[QUOTE="ghoklebutter"]A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.airshocker
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
It sounds nice to imperialists, sure. As an anarchist, I think that land ownership is oppressive. The idea is reprehensible to me for the same reason that I think private property is bad.[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"] You can say the same thing to excuse slaveowners in the past. I choose not to.Engrish_Major
This is complete asinine, no one who owned slaves is alive today. I can't blame you for something your ancestors did or not, no for the record I am not black nor did my ancestors own slaves, however my point still stands. We can't blame eachother for something our ancestors did, I wasn't there and neither were you or anyone else. It's time to move on, holding onto that is the reason why there are so many conflicts today.
What they did was wrong, yes. But you can't go around blaming people on your problems today for something that happened a long time ago.
Go pick on someone else. I never blamed any living person.I'm not picking on anyone, you were implying that we should blame people today, at least that's what it seemed like to me. Sorry I was mistaken.
[QUOTE="airshocker"][QUOTE="ghoklebutter"]A wise idea that the settlers should have believed in. Owning land is indeed a silly concept.ghoklebutter
To those who don't own land. As with everything else, the have nots think everything the haves value is silly.
It sounds nice to imperialists, sure. As an anarchist, I think that land ownership is oppressive. The idea is reprehensible to me for the same reason that I think private property is bad.lol your joking right?
My best friend growing up is half Oglala Sioux. He jokes every now and then about "taking back the land", but it's pretty obvious he's kidding. Though he always gets irritated whenever someone mentions that Christopher Columbus discovered America (and rightfully so).-Toshy-Damn Genoese always taking credit for everything.
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