It is wrong that religion preys on children at an early age.

Almost every religious person in the world believes what they do because they were taught to as a child. This is not a generalization. This is a fact. I know there are exceptions, and I'm sure there are some on this very forum, but don't pretend like child indoctrination isn't used excessively around the world.

So I ask you, why is this acceptable? In today's society, it would not be acceptable for me to pick my child's spouse, his political party, or his future career choices. These are decisions we generally leave our children to make for when they are responsible enough to do so. However, it is acceptable for us to pick the religion they will likely follow for the rest of their lives. Shouldn't a choice this important be left up to the individual? Shouldn't they have to the right to decide for themselve what religious path they will follow, or if they will even be religious at all? By pressuring beliefs on our children at a young age, we are robbing them of this choice. And please, don't give me that crap about "Well they can choose to believe something else when they're older." We all know that after an entire childhood of being raised to be follow a certain religion, it can be difficult to change your beliefs later on in life. In a world of advanced science, there is reason why religion is so prevalent, and it is because of this immoral practice of child indoctrination.

Hey, everybody! Teaching your child values of any kind is wrong! You should let the children decide their own values! Nevermind they aren't even fully aware of what "values" are; they should be able to decide!

Are you teaching your child that stealing is wrong? Well that's bad! Let him decide if stealing is wrong!

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion.

The opening post is full of empty statements and broad generalizations based on "it's a fact." You also need to show how "indoctrination" is wrong in the first place, rather than play circular reasoning and go "it's wrong because it's wrong."

Hey, everybody! Teaching your child values of any kind is wrong! You should let the children decide their own values! Nevermind they aren't even fully aware of what "values" are; they should be able to decide!

Are you teaching your child that stealing is wrong? Well that's bad! Let him decide if stealing is wrong!

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion.

Theokhoth

You're making the mistake of associating basic, universal morals with religion. I do not have to be a religious person to know that stealing is wrong.

That's why confirmation exists in Christianism. I don't know about other religions.Thiago26792

I was confirmed when I was 8 years old.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

Hey, everybody! Teaching your child values of any kind is wrong! You should let the children decide their own values! Nevermind they aren't even fully aware of what "values" are; they should be able to decide!

Are you teaching your child that stealing is wrong? Well that's bad! Let him decide if stealing is wrong!

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion.

Gamer556

You're making the mistake of associating basic, universal morals with religion. I do not have to be a religious person to know that stealing is wrong.

I never made that association. Are you teaching your kids that stealing is wrong? How DARE you indoctrinate your child with YOUR values!

Get it? It works both ways.

Totally wrong on all counts. Children are given some basic facts but they make the choice when they grow as to whether they want to believe or not.

What I find wrong is this constant intolerance in OT of different beliefs. Get over it....not everyone thinks the same.

The opening post is full of empty statements and broad generalizations based on "it's a fact." You also need to show how "indoctrination" is wrong in the first place, rather than play circular reasoning and go "it's wrong because it's wrong."

Theokhoth

Indoctrination is brain washing. If someone fills their child's head with images of Satan and hell fire then that's child abuse. We're specifically talking about religious indoctrination-- not stealing or any other things like that. Don't get we wrong, forcing your kid to be an agnostic or atheist is also wrong.

Hey, everybody! Teaching your child values of any kind is wrong! You should let the children decide their own values! Nevermind they aren't even fully aware of what "values" are; they should be able to decide!

Are you teaching your child that stealing is wrong? Well that's bad! Let him decide if stealing is wrong!

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion.

The opening post is full of empty statements and broad generalizations based on "it's a fact." You also need to show how "indoctrination" is wrong in the first place, rather than play circular reasoning and go "it's wrong because it's wrong."

Theokhoth

Values can be OK, but religion should be a choice for the child. Bring them to a church, a synagogue, a mosque, other places, let them keep an open mind. However, I would suggest that to remain impartial, don't bring them on a big holiday or anything.

[QUOTE="Thiago26792"]That's why confirmation exists in Christianism. I don't know about other religions.Gamer556

I was confirmed when I was 8 years old.

Really? What's your religion?

[QUOTE="Gamer556"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

Hey, everybody! Teaching your child values of any kind is wrong! You should let the children decide their own values! Nevermind they aren't even fully aware of what "values" are; they should be able to decide!

Are you teaching your child that stealing is wrong? Well that's bad! Let him decide if stealing is wrong!

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion.

Theokhoth

You're making the mistake of associating basic, universal morals with religion. I do not have to be a religious person to know that stealing is wrong.

I never made that association. Are you teaching your kids that stealing is wrong? How DARE you indoctrinate your child with YOUR values!

Get it? It works both ways.

Religion =/= Moral values

Some kind of moral code is necessary to maintain a peaceful society. Could you explain to me the benefits of my child believing in supernatural things? Why is it so necessary that I instruct him to do so?

Religion is not an "entity". It can't "prey" on anything.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

The opening post is full of empty statements and broad generalizations based on "it's a fact." You also need to show how "indoctrination" is wrong in the first place, rather than play circular reasoning and go "it's wrong because it's wrong."

dracula_16

Indoctrination is brain washing. If someone fills their child's head with images of Satan and hell fire then that's child abuse. We're specifically talking about religious indoctrination-- not stealing or any other things like that. Don't get we wrong, forcing your kid to be an agnostic or atheist is also wrong.

You have a very loose definition of "child abuse."

The child abuse is seen in the large amount which has physical, emotional abuse, sexual abuse and neglect of children by parents. ...www.1mentalhealth.com/A-B/Abuse.html

Harm or threatened harm to a child's health or welfare that occurs through nonaccidental physical or mental injury, sexual abuse, sexual exploitation, or maltreatment, by a parent, a legal guardian, or any other person responsible for the child's health or welfare, or by a teacher, a teacher's ...www.carehouse.org/mandated-reporter/glossary.aspx

And of course, if the child decides Hell doesn't exist, then how was he abused?

Religion =/= Moral values

Some kind of moral code is necessary to maintain a peaceful society. Could you explain to me the benefits of my child believing in supernatural things? Why is it so necessary that I instruct him to do so?

Gamer556

Morality is defined by many things, including religion.

[QUOTE="Gamer556"]

[QUOTE="Thiago26792"]That's why confirmation exists in Christianism. I don't know about other religions.Thiago26792

I was confirmed when I was 8 years old.

Really? What's your religion?

I was raised a Catholic. I didn't have to be confirmed at 8, but my school and church kind of set that up as the ceremonial age. Most kids I knew were confirmed at that time, so I was as well.

Religion =/= Moral values

Some kind of moral code is necessary to maintain a peaceful society. Could you explain to me the benefits of my child believing in supernatural things? Why is it so necessary that I instruct him to do so?

Gamer556

Religion = moral code granted by God. :|

You don't have to, but if you're a religious parent, it would be no different than instructing societal law to him.

So if you're saying parents have no right to teach their child religion, then you are a hypocrite for teaching your child about laws and telling him to follow them.

Religion is not an "entity". It can't "prey" on anything.

The_Ish

No, but its members certainly can.

I was raised a Catholic. I didn't have to be confirmed at 8, but my school and church kind of set that up as the ceremonial age. Most kids I knew were confirmed at that time, so I was as well.

Gamer556

[QUOTE="dracula_16"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

The opening post is full of empty statements and broad generalizations based on "it's a fact." You also need to show how "indoctrination" is wrong in the first place, rather than play circular reasoning and go "it's wrong because it's wrong."

Theokhoth

Indoctrination is brain washing. If someone fills their child's head with images of Satan and hell fire then that's child abuse. We're specifically talking about religious indoctrination-- not stealing or any other things like that. Don't get we wrong, forcing your kid to be an agnostic or atheist is also wrong.

You have a very loose definition of "child abuse."

The child abuse is seen in the large amount which has physical, emotional abuse, sexual abuse and neglect of children by parents. ...www.1mentalhealth.com/A-B/Abuse.html

Harm or threatened harm to a child's health or welfare that occurs through nonaccidental physical or mental injury, sexual abuse, sexual exploitation, or maltreatment, by a parent, a legal guardian, or any other person responsible for the child's health or welfare, or by a teacher, a teacher's ...www.carehouse.org/mandated-reporter/glossary.aspx

And of course, if the child decides Hell doesn't exist, then how was he abused?

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

[QUOTE="Gamer556"]

Religion =/= Moral values

Some kind of moral code is necessary to maintain a peaceful society. Could you explain to me the benefits of my child believing in supernatural things? Why is it so necessary that I instruct him to do so?

Theokhoth

Religion = moral code granted by God. :|

You don't have to, but if you're a religious parent, it would be no different than instructing societal law to him.

So if you're saying parents have no right to teach their child religion, then you are a hypocrite for teaching your child about laws and telling him to follow them.

No, granted by the leaders of a certain society or the society itself. God has nothing to do with it.

Values can be OK, but religion should be a choice for the child. Bring them to a church, a synagogue, a mosque, other places, let them keep an open mind. However, I would suggest that to remain impartial, don't bring them on a big holiday or anything.

Video_Game_King

You know, it's funny; if I told you how to raise your children (should you have any) then you and anyone else would go ape-****, and rightly so, but apparently there's a new rule that says teaching children religion is wrong. :roll:

No, granted by the leaders of a certain society or the society itself. God has nothing to do with it.

Video_Game_King

No, in a religion, a religious moral code is usually instructed by God. Ten Commandments?

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

dracula_16

Religion is not an "entity". It can't "prey" on anything.

The_Ish

[QUOTE="Video_Game_King"]

Values can be OK, but religion should be a choice for the child. Bring them to a church, a synagogue, a mosque, other places, let them keep an open mind. However, I would suggest that to remain impartial, don't bring them on a big holiday or anything.

Theokhoth

You know, it's funny; if I told you how to raise your children (should you have any) then you and anyone else would go ape-****, and rightly so, but apparently there's a new rule that says teaching children religion is wrong. :roll:

Huh? I don't really follow. And it'd be OK to teach them ALL religions (Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc.), but not limit it to pretty much one. Let your kids keep an open mind. And I don't have a prince yet, nor a princess. Gotta work that out with the Queen.

[QUOTE="dracula_16"]

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

LJS9502_basic

That has nothing to do with what I said. This thread is about parents forcing religion down their child's throat.

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion. Theokhoth

I doubt it. Child indoctrination is wrong. No matter how they are indoctrinated.

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

dracula_16

Apparently you do, as there's no such thing as "mental abuse." What you call mental abuse is nothing more than somebody's mind being frightened to the point of mental problems, but this has other terms and is not called abuse without physical involvement.

[QUOTE="Video_Game_King"]

No, granted by the leaders of a certain society or the society itself. God has nothing to do with it.

Theokhoth

No, in a religion, a religious moral code is usually instructed by God. Ten Commandments?

Not exactly. Need I quote Lewis Black?

[QUOTE="Thiago26792"][QUOTE="Gamer556"]

[QUOTE="Thiago26792"]That's why confirmation exists in Christianism. I don't know about other religions.Gamer556

I was confirmed when I was 8 years old.

Really? What's your religion?

I was raised a Catholic. I didn't have to be confirmed at 8, but my school and church kind of set that up as the ceremonial age. Most kids I knew were confirmed at that time, so I was as well.

That's weird. I was confirmed at the age of 15. I was already old enough to decide. I did it because I wanted to, not because of my parents.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion. -Austin-

I doubt it. Child indoctrination is wrong. No matter how they are indoctrinated.

Then teaching your children not to steal, murder, or hit the dog is wrong, since that's child indoctrination. And if you punish them, or threaten to punish them, you're abusing them.

[QUOTE="dracula_16"]

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

Theokhoth

Apparently you do, as there's no such thing as "mental abuse." What you call mental abuse is nothing more than somebody's mind being frightened to the point of mental problems, but this has other terms and is not called abuse without physical involvement.

So you are openly admitting that you think it's ok for the church to scare children to the point of "mental problems"?

Hey, everybody! Teaching your child values of any kind is wrong! You should let the children decide their own values! Nevermind they aren't even fully aware of what "values" are; they should be able to decide!

Are you teaching your child that stealing is wrong? Well that's bad! Let him decide if stealing is wrong!

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion.

The opening post is full of empty statements and broad generalizations based on "it's a fact." You also need to show how "indoctrination" is wrong in the first place, rather than play circular reasoning and go "it's wrong because it's wrong."

Theokhoth

Agreed.

Hell, even though my parents "indoctrinated" me to be a Christian, It was something I chose for my self. It wasnt till I was a teenager that I questioned the world and decided to get saved.

[QUOTE="Gamer556"]

Religion =/= Moral values

Some kind of moral code is necessary to maintain a peaceful society. Could you explain to me the benefits of my child believing in supernatural things? Why is it so necessary that I instruct him to do so?

Theokhoth

Religion = moral code granted by God. :|

You don't have to, but if you're a religious parent, it would be no different than instructing societal law to him.

So if you're saying parents have no right to teach their child religion, then you are a hypocrite for teaching your child about laws and telling him to follow them.

No, because these basic moral rules promoted by most religions are not actually religious at all. Killing is not outlawed around the world because God dictated it, but because at some point humans themselvesdecided it would be beneficial to establish rules to stop the killing. God did not make these rules up, so God does not have to be taught along side of them.

If you insist that teaching children morals for the gain of society is an immoral practice, so be it. See it as a necessary evil. Teaching children to believe in the supernatural, however, is not necessary at all, and it is nothing more than shameless promotion of your own spiritual beliefs.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="dracula_16"]

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

dracula_16

That has nothing to do with what I said. This thread is about parents forcing religion down their child's throat.

Once again....a topic in OT filled with those that do not understand the decision making but have to voice their opinion.:roll:

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Video_Game_King"]

No, granted by the leaders of a certain society or the society itself. God has nothing to do with it.

Video_Game_King

No, in a religion, a religious moral code is usually instructed by God. Ten Commandments?

Not exactly. Need I quote Lewis Black?

Like a comedian has some form of authority with religious studies? But go ahead.

That's weird. I was confirmed at the age of 15. I was already old enough to decide. I did it because I wanted to, not because of my parents.

Thiago26792

[QUOTE="-Austin-"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion. Theokhoth

I doubt it. Child indoctrination is wrong. No matter how they are indoctrinated.

Then teaching your children not to steal, murder, or hit the dog is wrong, since that's child indoctrination. And if you punish them, or threaten to punish them, you're abusing them.

We talking about religious indoctrination and you know that. Your just being difficult.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="dracula_16"]

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

-Austin-

Apparently you do, as there's no such thing as "mental abuse." What you call mental abuse is nothing more than somebody's mind being frightened to the point of mental problems, but this has other terms and is not called abuse without physical involvement.

So you are openly admitting that you think it's ok for the church to scare children to the point of "mental problems"?

The church doesn't do that. Tell me where the fear of the concept of Hell has given somebody mental problems.

[QUOTE="Gamer556"]

I was raised a Catholic. I didn't have to be confirmed at 8, but my school and church kind of set that up as the ceremonial age. Most kids I knew were confirmed at that time, so I was as well.

LJS9502_basic

OH, you're right, I was thinking 8th grade, not 8 years old. I was actually 13.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="-Austin-"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

The TC is just mad because people don't indoctrinate children the way he wants them to. Everybody "indoctrinates" their children in some form or another, whether it's in the area of politics or law or morals or religion. -Austin-

I doubt it. Child indoctrination is wrong. No matter how they are indoctrinated.

Then teaching your children not to steal, murder, or hit the dog is wrong, since that's child indoctrination. And if you punish them, or threaten to punish them, you're abusing them.

We talking about religious indoctrination and you know that. Your just being difficult.

Yes, you're implementing a double standard. It's not okay to teach children religion, but you can teach them any other rules.:roll:

[QUOTE="Video_Game_King"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Video_Game_King"]

No, granted by the leaders of a certain society or the society itself. God has nothing to do with it.

Theokhoth

No, in a religion, a religious moral code is usually instructed by God. Ten Commandments?

Not exactly. Need I quote Lewis Black?

Like a comedian has some form of authority with religious studies? But go ahead.

Like a bunch of bored 16 year olds on a message board have the authority on religious studies?

[QUOTE="Video_Game_King"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Video_Game_King"]

No, granted by the leaders of a certain society or the society itself. God has nothing to do with it.

Theokhoth

No, in a religion, a religious moral code is usually instructed by God. Ten Commandments?

Not exactly. Need I quote Lewis Black?

Like a comedian has some form of authority with religious studies? But go ahead.

He does raise good points, but I couldn't find the damn clip. Nor can I find the quote. It was either in Black on Broadway or Nothing's Sacred, I can't remember when he said it. It has to do with Moses and the 10 Commandments, so you could try your luck on Youtube.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="dracula_16"]

It's abuse because you'd be threatening them with eternal torture. I don't need links to know what mental abuse is.

dracula_16

That has nothing to do with what I said. This thread is about parents forcing religion down their child's throat.

Whats shocking to most people is that churches hardly ever talk about hell! Its like some mith that people believe that churches preach believe in God or you go to Hell. Hell is hardley ever brought up. We try to teach about Jesus and not about the devil or hell.

We talking about religious indoctrination and you know that. Your just being difficult.

-Austin-

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Gamer556"]

I was raised a Catholic. I didn't have to be confirmed at 8, but my school and church kind of set that up as the ceremonial age. Most kids I knew were confirmed at that time, so I was as well.

Gamer556

OH, you're right, I was thinking 8th grade, not 8 years old. I was actually 13.

Oh, ok, so you were old enough to decide.

Totally wrong on all counts. Children are given some basic facts but they make the choice when they grow as to whether they want to believe or not.

What I find wrong is this constant intolerance in OT of different beliefs. Get over it....not everyone thinks the same.

LJS9502_basic

I agree. Childern usually follow religion same as their parents. When they grow up, they can change if they feel like they want to.

Also, I agree theres some ignorance in OT on diff. beliefs. Just sometimes though, not all the time.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Gamer556"]

Religion =/= Moral values

Some kind of moral code is necessary to maintain a peaceful society. Could you explain to me the benefits of my child believing in supernatural things? Why is it so necessary that I instruct him to do so?

Gamer556

Religion = moral code granted by God. :|

You don't have to, but if you're a religious parent, it would be no different than instructing societal law to him.

So if you're saying parents have no right to teach their child religion, then you are a hypocrite for teaching your child about laws and telling him to follow them.

No, because these basic moral rules promoted by most religions are not actually religious at all. Killing is not outlawed around the world because God dictated it, but because at some point humans themselvesdecided it would be beneficial to establish rules to stop the killing. God did not make these rules up, so God does not have to be taught along side of them.

If you insist that teaching children morals for the gain of society is an immoral practice, so be it. See it as a necessary evil. Teaching children to believe in the supernatural, however, is not necessary at all, and it is nothing more than shameless promotion of your own spiritual beliefs.

Double standards, nothing more. You can teach your child whatever values you like as long as they aren't religious?

According to a religious person, teaching their child religious values is just as important as teaching societal laws. You don't seem to be getting that through your head.