Obama vs McCain who would you vote for ?

[QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

Engrish_Major

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to his church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

Never said that. You just seemed to be defending him.

The other person compared him to Wright. So I was defending him, in that sense, because Hagee isn't half as nuts as Wright.

Two months ago,

Obama,

Today

McCain

I am so put off by the Democrats, I wonder how quickly they would kick a puppy if it won them a single super delegate.

Neither. They are both equally bad for America. One wants to control whether you live or die here in America (socialized healthcare) and other wants to spend trillions of dollars in other countries instead of his own. Asking who i would vote for out of those two is like asking "Are you a sheeple who doesn't do any research on one of the most important things in the world?". But if i must...I would vote for McCain because i REALLY don't want to government to control the health care system. But i bet McCain will doing something to push us even further in that directions...but i don't think it will be as rapid of a change as it would be if Obama was president.

Barack Obama, the leader of a nation? That would be an "obamanation" ;)

McCain will be getting my vote this November.Dutch_Mix

Mine as well.

[QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

Dracargen

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

as far as i know Obama didn't take Wright on the campaign trail and i don't believe any of the hopefuls attends church regularly.

Neither. They are both equally bad for America. One wants to control whether you live or die here in America (socialized healthcare) and other wants to spend trillions of dollars in other countries instead of his own. Asking who i would vote for out of those two is like asking "Are you a sheeple who doesn't do any research on one of the most important things in the world?". But if i must...I would vote for McCain because i REALLY don't want to government to control the health care system. But i bet McCain will doing something to push us even further in that directions...but i don't think it will be as rapid of a change as it would be if Obama was president.

Barack Obama, the leader of a nation? That would be an "obamanation" ;)

hoola

Are you a sheeple? Do your research. There are numerous countries that have universal healthcare and if you did your research you would find that it's a competent system in those countries. Don't let opponents to Universal Healthcare persuade you. They don't want it because it's way too profitable for a lot of people right now.

Also it's our current healthcare system that has the control over whether you live or die here in America. If you have the insurance and the money for chemotherapy, AIDS treatment, organ trasplants then your in the live bracket. If your not rich and you don't have insurance then you would be in the die bracket.

[QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

Dracargen

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. bman784

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

[QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

bman784

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

Nah, the anti-Obama crowd still has the flag pin issue. LOL.

Anyway, I enjoyed your post, sir. It's nice to see someone in here who actually thinks that political issues should be discussed as opposed to flag pins, who baptized who, or what his pastor said during a sermon.

[QUOTE="bman784"]Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. hoola

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

Congratulations on epic failure. You need to research inflation again and stop trying to act so matter of fact about it, because you really know nothing about the business cycle apparently. When people buy less of something the price goes down. That is not inflation. In the case of oil, buying less is barely an option because we are so dependant on it. We can get hybrid cars, carpool, ride bikes and all that fun stuff, but at the end of the day the demand for non-renewable oil will make sure that the price doesn't go down.

Judging from your post I would guess that your still living with your republican mommy and daddy.

McCain. . . .as far as I know, he doesn't emotionally attach himself to people who think America is an evil empire that created AIDS. . . . .Dracargen

What does that have to do with any of his policies?

He denounced wright plain and simple as well. Hell if you want to talk about wacko endorsements look at McCain and John Hagee and Jerry Folwell.

[QUOTE="bman784"]Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. hoola

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

[QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

bman784

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

If you honestly believe that a person's beliefs and character has nothing to do with how he handles his policies, then I have bad news for you: it does. If you honestly believe that a man will take his family to a church and not agree to what the pastor of that church has to say for TWENTY DAMN YEARS, I have worse news for you: things like that do not happen in the real world. Finally, if you believe that a bunch of happy speeches (which may or may not be a pile of lies) about hope and change mean more than a person's character, I have terrible news for you: they don't.

Obama's incredibly shady peers and the fact that he has close, personal relationships with them should strike a bell in the mind of any thinking person.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

Dracargen

those that follow the campaign know the policies. those that don't are ill informed. but it's not like he hides them. the big one right now is gas tax holiday. Clinton and McCain want one and Obama and every economist say it's not going to help but rather hurt while making the oil industry some more money.

[QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="bman784"][QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

Palax

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

If you honestly believe that a person's beliefs and character has nothing to do with how he handles his policies, then I have bad news for you: it does. If you honestly believe that a man will take his family to a church and not agree to what the pastor of that church has to say for TWENTY DAMN YEARS, I have worse news for you: things like that do not happen in the real world. Finally, if you believe that a bunch of happy speeches (which may or may not be a pile of lies) about hope and change mean more than a person's character, I have terrible news for you: they don't.

Obama's incredibly shady peers and the fact that he has close, personal relationships with them should strike a bell in the mind of any thinking person.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

So your saying that you know Obama's beliefs and character courtesy of network television? Judging someone's character or beliefs based on what the news told you is rather shallow. You, sir, are a puppet.

you sir, apparently expect everyone to literally physically meet peoplke and know them for years before they vote.

What do you expect? They try to sell themselves on television so people will vote for them.

[QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="bman784"][QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

Palax

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

If you honestly believe that a person's beliefs and character has nothing to do with how he handles his policies, then I have bad news for you: it does. If you honestly believe that a man will take his family to a church and not agree to what the pastor of that church has to say for TWENTY DAMN YEARS, I have worse news for you: things like that do not happen in the real world. Finally, if you believe that a bunch of happy speeches (which may or may not be a pile of lies) about hope and change mean more than a person's character, I have terrible news for you: they don't.

Obama's incredibly shady peers and the fact that he has close, personal relationships with them should strike a bell in the mind of any thinking person.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

So your saying that you know Obama's beliefs and character courtesy of network television? Judging someone's character or beliefs based on what the news told you is rather shallow. You, sir, are a puppet.

Um, I never said that.:| Why don't you actually come up with an argument rather than insult anyone who thinks differently than you (which is all you have done, so far)?:roll:

Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. bman784

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

I may be wrong about this, as I dont know if there was some government policy regarding banking but as far as I know the government has nothing to do with our housing market. It comes from the fact that the banks are giving out loans that arent being paid back. Stop sensationalizing everything.

Our economy is still growing, and during most of George Bush's presidency, we had an excellent economy. I dont blame him for where were at. Hes trying to fix it. but him and congress dont communicate on anything.

tax breaks right now would help big time, which georgey boy tried. but the democratic congress said no.

If you honestly believe that a person's beliefs and character has nothing to do with how he handles his policies, then I have bad news for you: it does. If you honestly believe that a man will take his family to a church and not agree to what the pastor of that church has to say for TWENTY DAMN YEARS, I have worse news for you: things like that do not happen in the real world. Finally, if you believe that a bunch of happy speeches (which may or may not be a pile of lies) about hope and change mean more than a person's character, I have terrible news for you: they don't.

Obama's incredibly shady peers and the fact that he has close, personal relationships with them should strike a bell in the mind of any thinking person.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

Dracargen

[QUOTE="Palax"][QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="bman784"][QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

H8sMikeMoore

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

If you honestly believe that a person's beliefs and character has nothing to do with how he handles his policies, then I have bad news for you: it does. If you honestly believe that a man will take his family to a church and not agree to what the pastor of that church has to say for TWENTY DAMN YEARS, I have worse news for you: things like that do not happen in the real world. Finally, if you believe that a bunch of happy speeches (which may or may not be a pile of lies) about hope and change mean more than a person's character, I have terrible news for you: they don't.

Obama's incredibly shady peers and the fact that he has close, personal relationships with them should strike a bell in the mind of any thinking person.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

So your saying that you know Obama's beliefs and character courtesy of network television? Judging someone's character or beliefs based on what the news told you is rather shallow. You, sir, are a puppet.

you sir, apparently expect everyone to literally physically meet peoplke and know them for years before they vote.

What do you expect? They try to sell themselves on television so people will vote for them.

That would be ideal, but due to the impossibility of such a situation what I expect is that people stick to the political issues.

[QUOTE="Palax"][QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="bman784"][QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="Dracargen"]

Link to his speech?

Dracargen

It was during an NPR interview. More info about it here.

Ah, thanks.

Now can you show me where McCain said that he attended Hagee's church for twenty years, was married by Hagee, put Hagee on his campaign trail and took his children to Hagee's church their whole lives? Or how Hagee is different from any of the other 20,000 people who support McCain?

If you honestly believe that a person's beliefs and character has nothing to do with how he handles his policies, then I have bad news for you: it does. If you honestly believe that a man will take his family to a church and not agree to what the pastor of that church has to say for TWENTY DAMN YEARS, I have worse news for you: things like that do not happen in the real world. Finally, if you believe that a bunch of happy speeches (which may or may not be a pile of lies) about hope and change mean more than a person's character, I have terrible news for you: they don't.

Obama's incredibly shady peers and the fact that he has close, personal relationships with them should strike a bell in the mind of any thinking person.

As for his policies, all I can say is: What policies? The main reason anyone wants to vote for Obama is "because he's not Bush," which is no reason to vote for anyone. Obama side-steps any questions he is asked, and he doesn't give much better answers on his own website (the ones he does give are near-identical to Hillary's). Perhaps more people would argue his policies if he'd give us an idea of what the hell they are.

So your saying that you know Obama's beliefs and character courtesy of network television? Judging someone's character or beliefs based on what the news told you is rather shallow. You, sir, are a puppet.

Um, I never said that.:| Why don't you actually come up with an argument rather than insult anyone who thinks differently than you (which is all you have done, so far)?:roll:

We've argued before. It does always seem to end up the same way, with you posting emoticons of rolling eyes mixed with a little denial. I've come to know you as a neoconservative fundamentalist with a mentality that is rather scary.

Your post detailing how it was Wright that baptized Obama's kids etc etc just proves how you have made assumptions about Obama's character based on.....well that part I'm still confused about, but it probably has something to do with a neocon fundamentalist's mentality.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/17/DJIA_historical_graph.svg

Bush has ruined the US economy? :roll:12twelves

the economy is more than the Dow Jones. and adjusted for inflation they didn't gain as much as you'd think.

We've argued before. It does always seem to end up the same way, with you posting emoticons of rolling eyes mixed with a little denial. I've come to know you as a neoconservative fundamentalist with a mentality that is rather scary.

Your post detailing how it was Wright that baptized Obama's kids etc etc just proves how you have made assumptions about Obama's character based on.....well that part I'm still confused about, but it probably has something to do with a neocon fundamentalist's mentality.

Palax

This whole Wright thing needs to end. But i do think it is good that every little "bad" detail comes out in the media...i have seen it for every candidate.

I actually think Obama wants something good for this country along with McCain but unforunately i don't think they are going to make any changes for the better.

OBAMA

john MCSTAIN can rot in hell.

Your knowledge of Wright's opinions spanning twenty years come from a few cross sections of video clips taken out of context over a number of years; sermons that Obama didn't even attend.

Out of context? You mean Wright went "But then, I guess America is an okay place after all" after calling it the oppressive Great White West?

Do you honestly think that Wright's political views only came up once or twice, and only during Obama's absences? Do you honestly think that Obama happened to miss that one on 9/11, and then Wright never mentioned it again in seven years? Do you honestly think Wright would be the type of man to keep his politics out of his church?

If so, then you're more blind than anyone who follows the media.

Yes, Wright is an idiot, that's a given. But if you honestly think that in a church he spews political idiocy on a daily basis, you're wrong.

Not on a daily basis, but I have difficulty believing that he hasn't done it more than a few times in the twenty+ years Obama has been attending that church. You know how Christians are with mixing their politics and their religion. . . .;)

Obama's spirituality has nothing to do with Wright's political opinions, ergo Obama's politics have nothing to do with Wright's political opinions.

So he has been attending the church of a man he disagrees with on some very key issues (according to Obama) for twenty years?

He has denounced, distanced, then redenounced, yet people still feel the need to assume he's a closet racist who feeds on Wright's every word and secretly incorporates it into his own politics (even though there is no evidence to indicate such *conspiracy*).

The fact that Obama views his pastor as a family member, took his very young children to that man their whole lives, and married his wife under him all indicate such a "conspiracy."

And then there's what Obama had to say about his own grandmother being "a typical white person." Please explain this:

"... .. The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity. She doesn't. But she is a typical white person who, uh, if she sees somebody on the street that she doesn't know there's a reaction that's been been bred into our experiences that don't go away and that sometimes come out in the wrong way and that's just the nature of race in our society. We have to break through it..." - Senator Barack Obama

Can you imagine what would have happened had McCain or Clinton said "typical black person"?

There's the key word, assumption, because that's all the Wright hubub is. A giant assumption.

An assumption that is backed by very questionable circumstances on Obama's part. . . .

Obama couldn't be slightly apathetic towards religion, or like Wright's religious stances. No, that's not an assumption that anyone is willing to make, just because of the pure fact that it would be too plausible.

Tisk tisk. Cheap shots aren't going to help you.

I maintain, the Wright argument is cmpletely unsupported, and ridiculously cynical given that so many more plausible facts can be blatantly ignored.

Please post this facts, then. Cynicism is very helpful in politics; imagine how it would have helped with Bush.;)

It's media sensationalism that the American public has fallen for, and it's the path of least resistance, because it gives the opposition the chance to easily ignore the actual meaningful politics and focus on the most trivial things.

A man's character is far and away not a trivial matter. Except when it's an inconvenient factor to someone.

bman784

[QUOTE="Palax"]

We've argued before. It does always seem to end up the same way, with you posting emoticons of rolling eyes mixed with a little denial. I've come to know you as a neoconservative fundamentalist with a mentality that is rather scary.

Your post detailing how it was Wright that baptized Obama's kids etc etc just proves how you have made assumptions about Obama's character based on.....well that part I'm still confused about, but it probably has something to do with a neocon fundamentalist's mentality.

hoola

This whole Wright thing needs to end. But i do think it is good that every little "bad" detail comes out in the media...i have seen it for every candidate.

I actually think Obama wants something good for this country along with McCain but unforunately i don't think they are going to make any changes for the better.

Agreed....the Wright thing needs to end. The networks should be focused on discussing politics as opposed to more character assasination. Although nowadays who can tell the difference? Politics has become character assasination. Anyone who is watching TV for that kind of garbage information is perpetuating the problem.

[QUOTE="bman784"]Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. hoola

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/02/09/whitehouse.plots/index.html

OK? Use common sense people we accomplished nothing in Iraq and yet some want to get another bomb-happy guy in the white house? And now war>"socialism in health care?":x geez people are you against it just so you can wave your flag harder? Did you ever look at other countries that have universal health care? or is it too "socialist, omg commies, i love you uncle sam?"

[QUOTE="hoola"]

[QUOTE="bman784"]Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. darkIink

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/02/09/whitehouse.plots/index.html

OK? Use common sense people we accomplished nothing in Iraq and yet some want to get another bomb-happy guy in the white house? And now war>"socialism in health care?":x geez people are you against it just so you can wave your flag harder? Did you ever look at other countries that have universal health care? or is it too "socialist, omg commies, i love you uncle sam?"

socialized healthcare dosent work due to rationing. Other countries have it, but that dosent mean it works.

Do you want to wait 6 months for cancer treatment, what about the day you goto the doctor (finally) and some crack head over doses and screws you over?

Do you realize how many canadians come to the United States for healthcare? seriously youtube it. I recommend searching John Stossel hes the guy from 20/20 he does great work.

I wouldn't care if Obama worshipped Satan. He is way more intelligent than george W shrub and won't have a geriatric outlook like McStain. I'll vote Hillary if i have to. Just not another neocon schmuck who will continue to waste billions in iraq while ignoring afganistan, and support big oil at the expense of hard working Americans. Maybe all politicians do this, ok. I still think America needs to flush the neocon dookies down the toilet.tocklestein2005

what if a real conservative ran, how would you feel about them?

[QUOTE="hoola"]

[QUOTE="bman784"]Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. darkIink

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/02/09/whitehouse.plots/index.html

OK? Use common sense people we accomplished nothing in Iraq and yet some want to get another bomb-happy guy in the white house? And now war>"socialism in health care?":x geez people are you against it just so you can wave your flag harder? Did you ever look at other countries that have universal health care? or is it too "socialist, omg commies, i love you uncle sam?"

I do look at those countries....actually i look at them through a microscope because, as of right now, the American economy is huge compared to those countries...I don't think americas economy became so huge by having socialized healtchare (which will cost the government lots of money and raise taxes by insane amounts). I am most scared that instead of doing it themselves, the government will force Businesses to provide healthcare for their employess (they already do to an extent but i don't know if that is federal or state) and that will pretty much destroy the economy...I work at a small business and the owner has talked about that before and he says that if he is forced to do that he will have to close the business which will make me lose my job.

You know...I still don't understand why my aunt came down to America from Canada to get an MRI because Socialized healthcare is SOOOOO great and i don't see why she would come to Americas "Failing" system to have it done....maybe she saw that it would only take her three days to get one done here in America VS the six months she would have had to wait if she had not come down. I don't know, it doesn't make any sense.

[QUOTE="darkIink"][QUOTE="hoola"]

[QUOTE="bman784"]Obama. McCain is a contunuation of the previous seven years of terrible economic and foreign policy that have severely damaged our country. hoola

Hmm really? I seem to still have cable internet...more than enough food...Doctor visits every 6 months... In fact...i think i am living better now than i have in any other part of my entire life (though that isn't exactly that long). I think, as of right now, the only thing that is bad is that gas prices have risen which may not have been completely caused by the the government. Of course the gas prices rising means the prices of everything else have risen but do you know what? When the price goes up, people buy less and that causes inflation to go down. Have you ever heard of the business cycle?

I must say i am against the war, but when i actually think about it, i am glad that they have handled it the way they have. There hasn't been an single terrorist attack on U.S. soil since 9/11 and i don't know if i would be saying that if the current president didn't do what he had done..

Of course bush hasn't severely damaged our country for us right now, but he has for the future and i honestly believe that obama will only make the future worse...both are horrible.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/02/09/whitehouse.plots/index.html

OK? Use common sense people we accomplished nothing in Iraq and yet some want to get another bomb-happy guy in the white house? And now war>"socialism in health care?":x geez people are you against it just so you can wave your flag harder? Did you ever look at other countries that have universal health care? or is it too "socialist, omg commies, i love you uncle sam?"

I do look at those countries....actually i look at them through a microscope because, as of right now, the American economy is huge compared to those countries...I don't think americas economy became so huge by having socialized healtchare (which will cost the government lots of money and raise taxes by insane amounts). I am most scared that instead of doing it themselves, the government will force Businesses to provide healthcare for their employess (they already do to an extent but i don't know if that is federal or state) and that will pretty much destroy the economy...I work at a small business and the owner has talked about that before and he says that if he is forced to do that he will have to close the business which will make me lose my job.

You know...I still don't understand why my aunt came down to America from Canada to get an MRI because Socialized healthcare is SOOOOO great and i don't see why she would come to Americas "Failing" system to have it done....maybe she saw that it would only take her three days to get one done here in America VS the six months she would have had to wait if she had not come down. I don't know, it doesn't make any sense.

you know what else, when michael moore tried losing a few lbs he went to a private clinic. John Stossel called him out on that right to his face and he had nothing. Pwnage!

[QUOTE="Palax"]

We've argued before. It does always seem to end up the same way, with you posting emoticons of rolling eyes mixed with a little denial. I've come to know you as a neoconservative fundamentalist with a mentality that is rather scary.

Your post detailing how it was Wright that baptized Obama's kids etc etc just proves how you have made assumptions about Obama's character based on.....well that part I'm still confused about, but it probably has something to do with a neocon fundamentalist's mentality.

Dracargen

More insults. Is this the mentality of all the Obama fans?

Oh, and technically, I'm a Liberal.;) I'm even a Libertarian, with no far views in any direction.

I never said a word about Wright baptising Obama's children. Learn to read, please. Also learn to not insult people because they think differently than you. It's a sign of fundamentalism and a rather scary mentality.

Didn't insult you that time, but you were quick to insult me. I made assumptions, but asking someone to learn to read when it's obvious they know how to read would be considered an insult. Obviously you don't really care to practice what you preach though so just drop the whole "insult" thing it's very unbecoming for a hypocrite such as yourself.

You didn't say that Wright baptised Obama's kids, but you did say that Obama took his kids to church everyday for 20 years which in my opinion is even worse. Shouldn't it be a good thing that he took his kids to church, no matter what politics were discussed? I thought that Christians were all about taking the kids to church.

I'm making assumptions here again, but I refuse to believe that your a liberal.

If it comes down to those 2 pieces of ****....I will move away.

America is disgusting.

How can anyone with any moral value or education vote for those 2 imbeciles is beyond me.

For me, it's a matter of weighing up the pros and cons.

Obama: + Seeks peace in the middle east, rational approach to foreign affairs, generally rational and intillegent person.

+ Charismatic, shown his strong attributes and that he can take on a leader role and do well in it.

+ Very well educated, has a law degree from Harvard.

+ Evidently very good with making and spending money, as compared with his supposedly much better prepared Democrat rival.

- His young age suggests a lack of (possibly vital) experience.

McCain: + Older, more experienced.

+/- More charismatic than the other Republicans, probably better in terms of money/knowledge of economy, don't know how he would compare to Obama - would think Obama is more charismatic.

- Wants to add more troops to Iraq, seeks war, generally irrational.

- Uneducated, has never been to college (I don't regard some type of army college as a real college)

- Has been involved in the Vietnam war, and - although possibly a war hero - imprisoned for about 5 years, 2 of which were solitary confinement, which leads me to think that he would have developed some type of psychosocial disorder, as any normal human being most likely would.

Just my opinion on the issue, feel free to disagree. Do the math = Obama FTW.

[QUOTE="Dracargen"][QUOTE="Palax"]

We've argued before. It does always seem to end up the same way, with you posting emoticons of rolling eyes mixed with a little denial. I've come to know you as a neoconservative fundamentalist with a mentality that is rather scary.

Your post detailing how it was Wright that baptized Obama's kids etc etc just proves how you have made assumptions about Obama's character based on.....well that part I'm still confused about, but it probably has something to do with a neocon fundamentalist's mentality.

Palax

More insults. Is this the mentality of all the Obama fans?

Oh, and technically, I'm a Liberal.;) I'm even a Libertarian, with no far views in any direction.

I never said a word about Wright baptising Obama's children. Learn to read, please. Also learn to not insult people because they think differently than you. It's a sign of fundamentalism and a rather scary mentality.

Didn't insult you that time, but you were quick to insult me. I made assumptions, but asking someone to learn to read when it's obvious they know how to read would be considered an insult. Obviously you don't really care to practice what you preach though so just drop the whole "insult" thing it's very unbecoming for a hypocrite such as yourself.

You didn't say that Wright baptised Obama's kids, but you did say that Obama took his kids to church everyday for 20 years which in my opinion is even worse. Shouldn't it be a good thing that he took his kids to church, no matter what politics were discussed? I thought that Christians were all about taking the kids to church.

I'm making assumptions here again, but I refuse to believe that your a liberal.

You called me a neoconservative fundamentalist several times, and threw in a "scary mentality" line. :roll:

Are you joking? Taking kids to church is great and all, but not when you are taking them to a complete nutjob.:|

As for me being a liberal, I don't blame you for not believing me. I'm not sure I believe it, either.

- Uneducated, has never been to college (I don't regard some type of army college as a real college)

- Has been involved in the Vietnam war, and - although possibly a war hero - imprisoned for about 5 years, 2 of which were solitary confinement, which leads me to think that he would have developed some type of psychosocial disorder, as any normal human being most likely would.

SolidsnakeY15

1) Dude one of the Best colleges in the nation is the United States Airforce academy. It is an army type college. They usually teach very well they are very strict which leads to a much better education then going to a college where you can Party Every Day!

2) Just because he was in war and captured doesn't mean he has problems. And if he does it could be for the better. Like he knows what it's like for prisoners which could lead to better human treatment for current and future prisoners. And I know several War vets even one that was captured also and they are usually very great people.

Has everyone forgotten that Obama openly admitted to taking part in a racist church for 20 YEARS?

OBAMA said Reverend Wright is as important to him as his grandmother.

OBAMA said Reverend Wright was his spiritual advisor.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAYe7MT5BxM