Rioting going in Baltimore.(update).

@silkylove

Seen the 2003 movie and that's it. So explain the reference.

@n64dd: It's the police's fault now if a criminal is trying to hurt himself? Do you take any responsibility or credibility for any actions you do yourself?"

What are you talking about? I asked him what is black culture in his own words.

It's just that the unnamed prisoner "witness" could not see Freddie Gray through the partition. So the prisoner has no earthly idea of what injuries Gray did or did not sustain in the back of that van, nor how. The Matt Murdock reference was about how Dardevil can "see" with sound, which is the only way this testimony could have any credibility.

lol, NO.

What the hell are you smoking? NO, that is not the bigger issue.

1) These people aren't just attacking cops and burning down police stations. They're actively destroying parts of the community that have nothing to do with the cops. That indicates that it ISN'T just a matter of cops killing young black men, it's a matter of them thinking that their community is shit. By that standard, the riots ARE a bigger deal than police misconduct. Police misconduct is certainly part of the equation, but these people wouldn't be wrecking their own community if that was the biggest issue.

2) Assuming that these people think that their community is shit (and they clearly don't have a very high opinion of it if they are willing to wreck it like this), that IS the bigger issue. Look, police misconduct is horrible, innocent men being killed by the cops is a terrible thing. There's no denying that. But these kinds of events tend to happen in high crime areas. Take the number of people wrongly losing their lives in the hands of police, and then compare that to the number of people who unjustly lose their lives due to CRIME BY NON-POLICE, and guess which has the bigger toll on the community. I've never been there personally, but I was under the impression that large segments of Baltimore have been violent shitholes for a while. Yes, police misconduct is awful. But add up the number of people in any given city who were wrongly killed by the police, and then weigh that against the number of people who were wrongly killed by thieves or junkies or drug dealers. And...I think you see my point.

That's all fine and well. Stagnating wages are a big problem, I agree. But my inability to find a decent job and move out of my shitty community isn't really solved very efficiently by throwing riots when the police engage in misconduct. My reaction (throwing riots) isn't a reaction to the cops, it's a reaction to the whole damn system.

The ironic thing is that I actually knew anything about the system, I'd know that throwing these kinds of riots actually HURTS my ability to get a job since now no one's gonna want to open up shop in my community.

Any way I look at it, this shit just looks STUPID to me. Hell, even when I try to play devil's advocate and imagine that things have gotten so bad that riots are necessary, it still comes off as being ignorant as shit. If it ever comes down to being warranted to destroy a community, you destroy your OPPRESSOR'S community, not YOUR OWN. Even if there's the need for some kind of rioting, did these people not realize that they're rioting in the wrong fucking place? If they'd organized and then marched en masse to riot in wealthy communities and/or burn down the homes of cops, I could at least say, "that's still fucked up, but at least it makes some kind of sense since it's an attempt to bring their perceived oppressors down to their own level." But otherwise, this makes no goddamn sense, it's just ignorant as shit. If it's JUST a reaction to police injustices, then it's counterproductive. And even if we introduce a classism/racism aspect to it, it's STILL counter-productive because they're destroying the wrong fucking community. Even if I were flat out EVIL and had no problems with rioting just for shits and giggles, I'd still think this shit was stupid simply because it goes against the best interests of the people who are actually doing the rioting.

I couldn't agree more. Well said.

As far as rights are concerned, nothing gives anyone the right to indiscriminately destroy things and hurt others. But its very hard to enforce right and wrong when you push someone to the edge-that's the point I was making. Such a mental state is tantamount to temporary (or permanent) insanity, and judging from the actions of these people, I say they're insane indeed. The U.S should be gravely concerned for its future if it harbors communities that are so impoverished and marginalized that they turn into mental asylums.

I don't want to jump on the white-antagonizing bandwagon, so I'll refrain from using the term white folks and opt for privileged people. In many parts of the world there are people that have been so privileged for so long that they don't understand immiseration and desperation. Those riots and the reaction of some people to them remind me of the reactions to upheavals happening in the Palestinian territories as a result of the unhinging ravaging and immiseration of an entire populace by an occupation. Every now and then a Palestinian would snap and commits suicide by attacking an assemblage of soldiers with a knife who shoot him on the spot and the reaction you get "terrorist got what he deserves. God bless the IDF". I used to be infuriated by such reactions but not anymore as I realized that they speak of profound ignorance and experience asymmetry.

So can we declare Doritos as the official rioting munchies

You said Capitalism had no place here

Sh*t like this makes it hard not to harbor racist thoughts. I can understand why many of them may be angry (as misguided as that anger might be), but it seems the vast majority of the people rioting are nothing more than shameless opportunist or just looking for an excuse to cause mayhem and destruction - to their own hometown no less. Pretty damn disgraceful...

LOL Jesus! I reckon there's a stormfront coming through.

Your kidding right? If these guys were to march into a wealthy area to riot, they would all be killed. Plus i don't know what you expect these guys to do, the system is against them and it seems like nobody cares. I guess when they are rioting its the only time they feel like people are taking notice.

When you separate a group of people from their history and culture, then tell them for generations that this is who they are, combined with consistent oppression, you come up with these results.

We aren't far removed from whites acting in the same manner, see the Italians and Irish during the 60s and 70s (it was just easier for them to assimilate), or the how white savagely treated blacks prior to and during the civil rights movement, and those of Muslim faith in the 2000s. The outcomes of those activities still play out today, however the crimes now have become less overt, while affecting a greater portion of society (people of all nationalities, socioeconomic status, education, ect...) in a negative manner (think about the recession we are still dealing with).

I often tell people that at one point in time, sitting near a body of water, under the heavens, eating some meat cooked over an open flame, half naked, with your family and friends was a way of life. When "civilization" was brought to the far reaches of the world, that went from a way of life, to a vacation from life.

As a reason for why this has happened.

or if it's going to get burned down / looted if a riot breaks out...

You don't see that one on corporate news outlets.

An interesting perspective on who started the riots according to Mother Jones:

LINK

To summarize, the Baltimore PD indirectly caused the riots by displacing students off their buses in placing them in a mall and guarding them with riot police.

Also, contrary to popular belief or at least according to the gangs in the area, the Bloods and the Crips declared a truce to peacefully protest police brutality. They also worked to prevent the riots and the looting (on black-owned businesses). This may seem like a good thing but it's not. If it's the gangs that are keeping control, it shows how incompetent the local government and the police are, and a textbook example of a successful gang.

Considering the abuses of the Baltimore Police, it's definitely in dire need of reform. And while I'm at it, all groups of race, color, and creed riot. I mean, we've had riots because of sports. At least this one is for social justice... kind of.

Oh lord, now it's the police that caused people to burn down buildings, attack innocent bystanders, and rob/destroy people's businesses. At what point do you run out of fingers to point with?

The actions of the rioters are wrong, but actions of the Baltimore PD were also wrong. This is just an article on what caused it and in this case, it was because the Baltimore PD decided (or maybe it was the Baltimore Government) to take students off their school buses, prevent them from going to their homes, and then criminalize them. That's what authoritarian dictatorships do and if I recall, I thought I live in the United States and so did many of these Baltimore residents. It was a fucked up thing to do in the first place.

We're looking at a symptom of a major problem, not the cause. In which case, the cause may be the Baltimore Police Department abuses: LINK

Considering the violence and damage started well before the police reacted to the threats on social media (the purge), the whole premise is bunk. The idea that everything would have been nice and calm if the police didn't (rightfully, I might add) react to more threats of violence/destruction/vandalism/theft after there was ALREADY violence is ridiculous.

@MrGeezer:

What a dumb comment. 1st off i asked it on the form of question.But the issue is the cause of the riots. And that's police killing young black males.

Like I said earlier in this thread, a lot of you people are ignoring the cause and you prove it. It seems "Black lives don't matter" Does have some truth behind it.

@Renevent42:

The purge threat was only supported by 75-100 people and even then, it probably wouldn't have followed through. The police didn't react properly and in directly caused the riots as I stated above. Even then, you don't escalate the situation by standing kids and not letting them go home.

The police in this case were unprofessional and idiotic, and the only groups that are maintaining order are the gangs, which proved the police and the government need reform.

There was a Real News story that reported the same findings a few days back. Yeah...I can believe that the police agitated the situation

They didn't directly cause them, regardless of what some people speculate. The fact is there was rioting even before then and the entire premise is flawed beyond consideration.

Regarding the purge I'm not sure how anyone could gauge how many people supported it...there's no telling how many people saw it and planned to participate. Even then, there was rioting taking place before that specific event so it really doesn't matter anyways.

Oh and yes, the gangs. What a laugh that comment is. The level of insanity where people are now acting as if the blood and cripts, who are both responsible for who knows how much grief in those neighborhoods, are saviors and protectors is literally overwhelming.

It would be such sweet poetic justice if these neighborhoods were abandoned by police and allowed to be taken over by these lovely and generous gangs.

They're making the system even MORE against them. Because people are taking notice alright, and what they're noticing is that the rioters are acting like violent animals.

As to your first point, boo hoo. If there's cause for a riot, then they're rioting in the wrong place. If the risks associated with rioting in the right place aren't worth it, then things haven't got bad enough to justify rioting. If they're too scared to riot against the actual "oppressors", then the answer is don't fucking riot.

Against whom? Where's the right place to riot? And even now, who here is justifying rioting?

I'm talking about the rioters justifying rioting. As in, they clearly feel justified if they actually went through with it.

And like i said before...if there's ever sufficient cause to riot, then you riot against your actual oppressors. But what we're seeing now is the equivalent of someone getting into an argument with a bigger dude. And instead of lashing back at the bigger dude (because he knows he'll get his ass kicked), he turns around and kicks a puppy. At that point, any sympathy for your plight kind of vanished because you just kicked a puppy.

@Renevent42:

"Indirectly" for some reason there is a space between "in" and "directly" in my sentence but you couldn't have noticed. ;)

Can you show me if the riots started before this incident? because I can't find anything on that other than a CNN timeline of the Boston riots which confirms that the riots began when the police indirectly agitated the situation.

I don't want gangs enforcing the law but if you have minorities in a community being discriminated and corruption in the government, you get gangs and sometimes you get a successful gang which is why the government and the police need reform, to prevent that from happening. I'm not saying it's a good thing for Baltimore.

Indirectly then followed by caused. They can't cause something that was already taking place.

For dates, check wiki...the purge was not the first of the rioting.

Then I stand corrected. There were rioting and looting before but the police still agitated the situation and caused further rioting and looting to happen.

Thanks Obama.

Well, unlike some here, I can't presume to know if all of the rioters feel justified or not. It's a fit of rage and violence; I don't know if many of them even think about it - though I'm sure plenty do. If I bash my gamepad or toss furniture and break glasses in my own home, in a fit of rage, I don't think "yeah, I'm definitely justified in doing this." And I probably shouldn't have destroyed much of the property in my living room - it's my property, after all. But, what can I say, I was raging out.

A riot is what it is; group violence, uncontrolled. If the violence were logical, properly directed and controlled, would it still be a riot?

Maaaan am I so tired. Of this. We should all be able to get along. It's the 21st century. We're off to a bad start.

Do you ever wonder why communities with high employment and higher than average income have relatively low crime?


Of course you have, you're obviously a really bright kid

I'm sorry: Capitalism has no place here.

@outworld222: "Maaaan am I so tired. Of this. We should all be able to get along. It's the 21st century. We're off to a bad start."

I feel sorry for your great great great great great great great great great great grandchildren.

@iloveatlus: he should get a gun. Worked great for the Korean business owners during the LA riots. They loot, you shoot. If they came at me and my car with lighter fluid, they would have been dead. Full stop. You mess with me or my property, you die.

Nope. Its racist to defend yourself or your property. You're supposed to bend over and let them **** you.

Could police brutality be such an effect in this? What if this could have happened somewhere else?

@plageus900: lol, yeah, I know. They'd insist I shot because they were black, not because they were trying to destroy my property and kill or harm me. I'd rather be labeled a racist by a bunch of clowns than be dead.

Pretending it's not true doesn't change things.

Calling me racist doesn't mitigate the culture that holds up violence and puts education down.

The past is not an excuse for what is happening now.

There's never an excuse for rioting or assaulting innocent people.

Those rioters don't deserve equal rights, they've just proven they don't deserve anything more than what they have.

I don't know if I'd go that far, but I do agree that there is no excuse for targeting innocent people.

If they don't feel justified (at least at the time they're doing it), then that makes this shit even worse. That's the equivalent knowing that looting a store is wrong but "I'm gonna do it anyway, because of free TV's."

And it IS controlled, at least partly. As someone mentioned before, they're smart enough to NOT go burn down the communities of the "oppressors", because they know doing that is gonna get them fucking slaughtered. You see gangs coming together to protect black owned businesses, while then saying "but **** those other businesses, because those are owned by chinese and arabs." Granted, I'm not saying that people are putting MUCH thought into this, but you can see some very clear deliberate and logical thinking in all of this (albeit logical thinking that is likely based on a truly fucked up sense of priorities and values).

The blood, crips and another gang planned to each kill a police officer each. They never planned a peaceful protest, lol I want the drugs you're smoking.

I call you a racist because you are a racist.

Calling me racist doesn't mitigate the culture that holds up violence and puts education down.

That's true of American culture, unfortunately.

If they don't feel justified (at least at the time they're doing it), then that makes this shit even worse. That's the equivalent knowing that looting a store is wrong but "I'm gonna do it anyway, because of free TV's."

Is that what I'm thinking when I destroy property within my home during a fit of rage? I suspect that many of them feel just as justified as I do when I destroy property my property. For me, the question of justification simply doesn't come up.

Rioting within state barriers; that character has always been in keeping of a riot. I don't know the collective thinking process of everyone who engages in a riot But historically, folks would engage in riots to cause plenty of destruction; the destruction that was caused, however. was commensurate to how much the state would tolerate and where they would tolerate it. The mayor herself admitted that she courted off "space to let them destroy." But there are barriers and I'm sure plenty of rioters are aware of them. What does that suggest?

@n64dd:

And it turned out to be false, according to reputable news sources. The gangs themselves (of course, there are some loose elements that advocated violence) stated that they declared a truce and to march peacefully against police brutality. Although they also stated that they were trying to prevent looting, the reality was that they were directing looters from black-owned businesses to Arab/Asian owned businesses.