Stalin Sculpture at National D-Day memorial- your opinions

we have to Remember in 1944 80% of teh German army was in Russia, the rest divided to secure other fronst aswell. Now imagine if D-Day had taken place with at least 50% of the German Army (what was left of the Air force was in Russia), the Allied invasion would have become a massacre like Gallipoli in WW1. Russia Won the War, everyone else just helped a little.

I have very little knowledge about the whole subject or about the guy so bear with me if I sound ignorant, but if somebody murdered that many people, why are they getting a statue? he doesn't sound like a hero, he sounds like a monster.

XilePrincess

[QUOTE="XilePrincess"]I have very little knowledge about the whole subject or about the guy so bare with me if I sound ignorant, but if somebody murdered that many people, why are they getting a statue? he doesn't sound like a hero, he sounds like a monster.sSubZerOo

.. Andrew Jackson signed the bill which killed thousands to tens of thousands of Cherokee in the Indian Removal Act.. As well as displacing many more, this was just one of many of his questionable things.. Yet we honor him as a president and most certainly have statues and what not him.. I would agree if this practice was actually done, but it isn't.. To me this seems like historical convience to overwrite people they do not agree with..

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

dercoo

[QUOTE="dercoo"]

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

lordreaven

Very funny? More like absolutely hilarious drunk :lol:

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="XilePrincess"]I have very little knowledge about the whole subject or about the guy so bare with me if I sound ignorant, but if somebody murdered that many people, why are they getting a statue? he doesn't sound like a hero, he sounds like a monster.jwsoul

.. Andrew Jackson signed the bill which killed thousands to tens of thousands of Cherokee in the Indian Removal Act.. As well as displacing many more, this was just one of many of his questionable things.. Yet we honor him as a president and most certainly have statues and what not him.. I would agree if this practice was actually done, but it isn't.. To me this seems like historical convience to overwrite people they do not agree with..

Absolutely fortunately this has been reducing in current generations where revisionist historians are calling EVERYTHING into question..

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

dercoo

We then should have a special note under Truman saying that he was the onlyleader who dropped a nuclear bomb on a major city in history.. Of a nation that big generals like Eisenhower said that it was not neccesary because they had already lost and were about to surrender.. We can go back and fourth all day on both sides, neither side was a bed of roses..

[QUOTE="jwsoul"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

.. Andrew Jackson signed the bill which killed thousands to tens of thousands of Cherokee in the Indian Removal Act.. As well as displacing many more, this was just one of many of his questionable things.. Yet we honor him as a president and most certainly have statues and what not him.. I would agree if this practice was actually done, but it isn't.. To me this seems like historical convience to overwrite people they do not agree with..

sSubZerOo

Absolutely fortunately this has been reducing in current generations where revisionist historians are calling EVERYTHING into question..

What do you think of Subhas Chandra Bose subzero? He's still pretty respected in India, and even in Japan, and I can certainly understand why.

[QUOTE="dercoo"]

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

sSubZerOo

We then should have a special note under Truman saying that he was the onlyleader who dropped a nuclear bomb on a major city in history.. Of a nation that big generals like Eisenhower said that it was not neccesary because they had already lost and were about to surrender.. We can go back and fourth all day on both sides, neither side was a bed of roses..

Thats the problem. No one likes to question what the Allies did since they were designated "the good guys"

[QUOTE="lordreaven"][QUOTE="dercoo"]

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

taj7575

Very funny? More like absolutely hilarious drunk :lol:

"Drunk I may be, Madam, but you are ugly, and in the morning I will be sober."

- Winston Churchill

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

dercoo

Why would we need notes saying what everyone already knows?

Since his role in D-Day wasn't too large I say no to a D-Day related statue. But a statue related to allied contribution in WW2 would be okay.Jaguar_Shade

[QUOTE="taj7575"]

Then lets have little notes next to Churchill saying he was a Drunk..........a very funny drunk:)lordreaven

Very funny? More like absolutely hilarious drunk :lol:

"Drunk I may be, Madam, but you are ugly, and in the morning I will be sober."

- Winston Churchill

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="jwsoul"] hahah History written by the victors as is the case for almost all documented wars. Manipulation to justify a nations persecution of an entire race what ever the flavour you can find it in history, taj7575

Absolutely fortunately this has been reducing in current generations where revisionist historians are calling EVERYTHING into question..

What do you think of Subhas Chandra Bose subzero? He's still pretty respected in India, and even in Japan, and I can certainly understand why.

Imo he is like every so called great leader in history.. Some good some bad.. People like Stalin are certainly an extreme, but what value can you put on life.. I mean The guy that kills tens of thousands should not be treated any different from the man who killed a million... I mean we love to demonize German culture during World War 2.. But we don't look upon our selves.. During the trials when the men put on war crimes were asked on why they did it.. All to often they brought the US up as a example to which they took notes from with acts like the Jim Crow Laws..

And the fact he tried to ally him self with Axis sides had nothing to do with sharing their beliefs imo, it was because who in their right mind would come crawling back to Britain after trying to get rid of them.. They obviously couldn't be trusted. Though I will be the first one to admit to have little knowledge of the history of India, including this man.. So what do I know?

[QUOTE="taj7575"]

[QUOTE="lordreaven"] Then lets have little notes next to Churchill saying he was a Drunk..........a very funny drunk:)GabuEx

Very funny? More like absolutely hilarious drunk :lol:

"Drunk I may be, Madam, but you are ugly, and in the morning I will be sober."

- Winston Churchill

He is what you would call a classy badass..:P

[QUOTE="taj7575"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

Absolutely fortunately this has been reducing in current generations where revisionist historians are calling EVERYTHING into question..

sSubZerOo

What do you think of Subhas Chandra Bose subzero? He's still pretty respected in India, and even in Japan, and I can certainly understand why.

Imo he is like every so called great leader in history.. Some good some bad.. People like Stalin are certainly an extreme, but what value can you put on life.. I mean The guy that kills tens of thousands should not be treated any different from the man who killed a million... I mean we love to demonize German culture during World War 2.. But we don't look upon our selves.. During the trials when the men put on war crimes were asked on why they did it.. All to often they brought the US up as a example to which they took notes from with acts like the Jim Crow Laws..

And the fact he tried to ally him self with Axis sides had nothing to do with sharing their beliefs imo, it was because who in their right mind would come crawling back to Britain after trying to get rid of them.. They obviously couldn't be trusted. Though I will be the first one to admit to have little knowledge of the history of India, including this man.. So what do I know?

No, your right, and thats why I feel he is respected. He was in the INC and was for independence, but was tired of waiting. So he aligned himself with the axis powers and the Azad Hind fought for Indian independence. I remember reading somewhere how they found Indian soldiers surrendering with Japanese/Greman troops and left the allies confuesd.

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

dercoo

What did Stalin have to do with D-Day and the invasion of Normandy specifically?

What did Stalin have to do with D-Day and the invasion of Normandy specifically?

SgtKevali

He begged the Allies to open up a second front to help the Soviets on the Eastern front, this culminated in the invasion of Normandy.

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

What did Stalin have to do with D-Day and the invasion of Normandy specifically?

TheMightyHoov

He begged the Allies to open up a second front to help the Soviets on the Eastern front, this culminated in the invasion of Normandy.

I'm not sure if that's really enough if it's a memorial for D-day specifically.

What did Stalin have to do with D-Day and the invasion of Normandy specifically?

SgtKevali

That's certainly interesting, but I'm still mixed about it. It would make sense if they put up his statue, though.

"Approximately 350,000 Hungarian officials and intellectuals were purged from 1948 to 1956."

The United States wasn't around during most of those and Stalin Comitted Atrocities during and After the war.

"Approximately 350,000 Hungarian officials and intellectuals were purged from 1948 to 1956."

The United States wasn't around during most of those and Stalin Comitted Atrocities during and After the war.

Snipes_2

Thats not why we are putting the statue there!

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

The statue isn't honoring him for that :|

It's honoring him for standing with the Allied Troops in bringing down Nazi Germany.

Like Gabu noted....Andrew Jackson's Indian Removal policy lead directly to the deaths of ten's of thousand native american's yet he's on the $20 bill and dozens of statues and memorials.

CuDDKiDD

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"]

"Approximately 350,000 Hungarian officials and intellectuals were purged from 1948 to 1956."

The United States wasn't around during most of those and Stalin Comitted Atrocities during and After the war.

TheMightyHoov

Thats not why we are putting the statue there!

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="Duckman5"] i thank him for not allowing his country to fall to Germany. Otherwise we would probably be screwed today. TheMightyHoov

Yeah but those countries didnt suffer the worst of the war either ;)

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="taj7575"]

No he's not, but respect where it's due.

And this is coming from someone who thinks Stalin was as as bad as Hitler.

taj7575

..Okay?

I think this is just ignorant on our part. During the parade for the Great Patriotic War (WWII) this year in Russia, they had US and French soldiers march along with the Russian soldiers. They were the main country fighting wise during WWII and they deserve respect no matter what.

We respect ignorant people in this country too.

[QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

The statue isn't honoring him for that :|

It's honoring him for standing with the Allied Troops in bringing down Nazi Germany.

Like Gabu noted....Andrew Jackson's Indian Removal policy lead directly to the deaths of ten's of thousand native american's yet he's on the $20 bill and dozens of statues and memorials.

Snipes_2

The statue for Stalin is to honor his contribuitions for D-Day :| . More than 4,000 died. That's not enough for it to be considered an attrocity?

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"]

[QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

The statue isn't honoring him for that :|

It's honoring him for standing with the Allied Troops in bringing down Nazi Germany.

Like Gabu noted....Andrew Jackson's Indian Removal policy lead directly to the deaths of ten's of thousand native american's yet he's on the $20 bill and dozens of statues and memorials.

CuDDKiDD

The statue for Stalin is to honor his contribuitions for D-Day :| . More than 4,000 died. That's not enough for it to be considered an attrocity?

[QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"] What's it honoring him for, while he was helping the Allies this is what he was doing. He was also an American President and didn't kill Hundreds of Thousands of Innocent People. From what I've read on it, 4,000 Cherokees were killed and the Rest were Relocated.

Snipes_2

The statue for Stalin is to honor his contribuitions for D-Day :| . More than 4,000 died. That's not enough for it to be considered an attrocity?

One statue isn't comparable to every single $20 bill since we slapped his face on there either.

[QUOTE="taj7575"]

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"] He can have respect in his own country. Snipes_2

..Okay?

I think this is just ignorant on our part. During the parade for the Great Patriotic War (WWII) this year in Russia, they had US and French soldiers march along with the Russian soldiers. They were the main country fighting wise during WWII and they deserve respect no matter what.

We respect ignorant people in this country too.

Yes he did.

Stalin may have been a horrible person, but he did play a large part in assisting the Allies.

[QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"] What's it honoring him for, while he was helping the Allies this is what he was doing. He was also an American President and didn't kill Hundreds of Thousands of Innocent People. From what I've read on it, 4,000 Cherokees were killed and the Rest were Relocated.

Snipes_2

The statue for Stalin is to honor his contribuitions for D-Day :| . More than 4,000 died. That's not enough for it to be considered an attrocity?

[QUOTE="XilePrincess"]

I have very little knowledge about the whole subject or about the guy so bear with me if I sound ignorant, but if somebody murdered that many people, why are they getting a statue? he doesn't sound like a hero, he sounds like a monster.

GabuEx

Because this is a memorial dealing with WWII, and it would be blatantly historically inaccurate to solely credit the Allied victory in the European theater to the Americans and the Brits.

But it's a D-Day Memorial, which Stalin played absolutely no part in. There should be no statue of Stalin at the D-Day Memorial.

[QUOTE="dercoo"]

He should be there, but with special notes below his statue (like the fact he killed more people than Hitler)

GabuEx

Why would we need notes saying what everyone already knows?

Not everyone knows that little fact actually. What a hyperbole on your part.

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

The statue for Stalin is to honor his contribuitions for D-Day :| . More than 4,000 died. That's not enough for it to be considered an attrocity?

wstfld

One statue isn't comparable to every single $20 bill since we slapped his face on there either.

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="CuDDKiDD"]

The statue for Stalin is to honor his contribuitions for D-Day :| . More than 4,000 died. That's not enough for it to be considered an attrocity?

wstfld

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="taj7575"]

..Okay?

I think this is just ignorant on our part. During the parade for the Great Patriotic War (WWII) this year in Russia, they had US and French soldiers march along with the Russian soldiers. They were the main country fighting wise during WWII and they deserve respect no matter what.

We respect ignorant people in this country too.

Mercury_May2112

Yes he did.

Stalin may have been a horrible person, but he did play a large part in assisting the Allies.

Furthermore, Multiple Fliers etc...Were sent out Prior to the Bombing. IF you stayed it was on your own accord.

He wasn't assisting the Allies, it was for his own personal Agenda.

Stallin was paranoid mass murderer. He does not deserve a statue :|. . .

We arent honoring him for his mass murder..... We are honoring him for standing with the Allies and help bringing down Nazi Germany

TheMightyHoov

We're honoring a mass-murder for his aid in fighting against another mass murderer? Why honor Stalin when he is just as much of a monster as Hitler Stalin deserves no statue nor recognition for WW2, and he certainly doesn't represent the spirit of Russia. Why not just forget the statues altogether, and have a plaque commemorating the efforts of the Allied Forces, including Great Britain, U.S., and Russia. That way we're not honoring mass-murderers or hypocrites and liars.

[QUOTE="wstfld"][QUOTE="Snipes_2"] Like I said, What I've read on it. Stalin killed Hundreds of Thousands of People, that's not really comparable to 4,000 while we as a country were maturing and expanding. IF you want to Honor Stalin, Fine by me. Snipes_2

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"]

[QUOTE="wstfld"] Did you just rationalize the death of 4,000 people due to our expansion? American Exceptionalism is such BS. wstfld

i'd have to read up on his efforts in WWII more...

[QUOTE="wstfld"][QUOTE="Snipes_2"] They were killed during a War basically. Stalin Killed innocents for no apparent Reason. Innocents that could not fight back, unlike the Indians.

Snipes_2

How did you assume that I meant no Indians fought back? I didn't assume that you meant there were no innocent Indians. Anyway. Here is a fact: Andrew Jackson forcefully removed peaceful, Christian, "civilized" Indians from their own lands resulting in the death of 4,000 innocent people.

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="XilePrincess"]

I have very little knowledge about the whole subject or about the guy so bear with me if I sound ignorant, but if somebody murdered that many people, why are they getting a statue? he doesn't sound like a hero, he sounds like a monster.

TheAbbeFaria

Because this is a memorial dealing with WWII, and it would be blatantly historically inaccurate to solely credit the Allied victory in the European theater to the Americans and the Brits.

But it's a D-Day Memorial, which Stalin played absolutely no part in. There should be no statue of Stalin at the D-Day Memorial.

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"][QUOTE="wstfld"] Actually they were innocents that could not fight back. They were in the process of assimilating Western white culture. No war was going on.wstfld

How did you assume that I meant no Indians fought back? I didn't assume that you meant there were no innocent Indians. Anyway. Here is a fact: Andrew Jackson forcefully removed peaceful, Christian, "civilized" Indians from their own lands resulting in the death of 4,000 innocent people.