The Israelis bombed a UN compound

[QUOTE="danwallacefan"]So now the Hamas has stooped low enough to use humanitarian buildings as firebases? Even more reason that the Israelis ought to rid the world of those vermin called "Hamas"Vandalvideo

[QUOTE="Devour2Survive"]I hate how Germany is afraid to speak out against Israel just because they are afraid people will think they are Nazis. It's time to say something, Israel is not the right ally.Wasdie

[QUOTE="InterpolWilco"]Theres a big part of me that feels sympathy for the innocents being killed, but at the same time, they ELECTED HAMAS. They knew what they were electing, and thats a terrorist organization that will purposely put them in harms way to win the hearts and minds of people around the world. On top of the fact that Israel was getting rockets fired into their suburbs. After awhile enough is enough. The bombing of a UN compound though. Yikes this is a mess. Vanadium2k8

[QUOTE="danwallacefan"]So now the Hamas has stooped low enough to use humanitarian buildings as firebases? Even more reason that the Israelis ought to rid the world of those vermin called "Hamas"Vandalvideo

So now the Hamas has stooped low enough to use humanitarian buildings as firebases? Even more reason that the Israelis ought to rid the world of those vermin called "Hamas"danwallacefan

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"][QUOTE="Wasdie"] I thought it was pretty apparent that Israel is in a blind rage. If you country was surrounded by enemies who want nothing more to destroy you, I think your mentality would be a bit more aggressive.BiancaDK

[QUOTE="THE_DRUGGIE"][QUOTE="BiancaDK"] so youre right, and anyone disagreeing with you is de facto wrong? Never a valid reason? Have you heard of Hiroshima or Nagasaki? You need to brush up on your history. Theres a thing called "the lesser evil".BiancaDK

Even that's questionable. Dropping a nuclear bomb on a heavily populated industrial city with thousands of innocents doesn't sound right to me.

But hey, all those innocent people got slaughtered for a good cause, right? :D

So you find slaughtering civilians okay if it means getting to the desired outcome faster?

I guess you don't believe in Just War Theory either.

[QUOTE="danwallacefan"] oh please! I wish we could all put up a fog and demand "clear, undeniable, and objective evidence". The fact is the Israeli soldiers reported that they were taking fire from the building. The Israeli army and just about every other western army isn't about wasting artillery shells on an idle non-threatening building. Vandalvideo

[QUOTE="Vanadium2k8"][QUOTE="InterpolWilco"]Theres a big part of me that feels sympathy for the innocents being killed, but at the same time, they ELECTED HAMAS. They knew what they were electing, and thats a terrorist organization that will purposely put them in harms way to win the hearts and minds of people around the world. On top of the fact that Israel was getting rockets fired into their suburbs. After awhile enough is enough. The bombing of a UN compound though. Yikes this is a mess. danwallacefan

They said it was mistake. It probably was. I mean they aren't helping themselves.lancelot200

Hes the one making the claim that there were enemy combatants in the building itself. Why on earth should I believe Israel, the country that instigated the attacks in the first place, using questionable means of fighting the conflict as documented by dozens of reporters, and breaking tons of international law? If anything, Israel is just as much to blame. They should be dragged to The Hague.Vandalvideo

seriously vandalvideo, the Hamas has been firing qassam rockets into Israel every single day since they withdrew forces in 2005. the IDF did not instigate the attacks. Hamas is a terrorist organization which has repeatedly fired rockets at civilians indiscriminately and has ordered many suicide attacks in Israel.

in case you dont know, indiscriminate bombing of civilians IS A WAR CRIME!

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="danwallacefan"]So now the Hamas has stooped low enough to use humanitarian buildings as firebases? Even more reason that the Israelis ought to rid the world of those vermin called "Hamas"HellsAngel2c

Blockades started in 2006.

the rocket attacks started in 2005

[QUOTE="Vanadium2k8"]Hamas has received aid from who? All the aid that was sent to Palestine would have to go to Israel first, the blockades themselves are enough proof to show that the aid never reached Palestine anyway.Vanadium2k8

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="danwallacefan"] oh please! I wish we could all put up a fog and demand "clear, undeniable, and objective evidence". The fact is the Israeli soldiers reported that they were taking fire from the building. The Israeli army and just about every other western army isn't about wasting artillery shells on an idle non-threatening building. danwallacefan

seriously vandalvideo, the Hamas has been firing qassam rockets into Israel every single day since they withdrew forces in 2005. the IDF did not instigate the attacks. Hamas is a terrorist organization which has repeatedly fired rockets at civilians indiscriminately and has ordered many suicide attacks in Israel.danwallacefan

in case you dont know, indiscriminate bombing of civilians IS A WAR CRIME!

[QUOTE="THE_DRUGGIE"]

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"]How many mistakes before it becomes intentional?Wasdie

You know, I'm starting to think that too. So far they've blown up UN-operated schools, supply lines, humanitarian buildings, and shelters.

Maybe Israel's in a blind rage and wants to see the Gaza Strip burn.

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"][QUOTE="THE_DRUGGIE"]

Even that's questionable. Dropping a nuclear bomb on a heavily populated industrial city with thousands of innocents doesn't sound right to me.

But hey, all those innocent people got slaughtered for a good cause, right? :D

THE_DRUGGIE

So you find slaughtering civilians okay if it means getting to the desired outcome faster?

I guess you don't believe in Just War Theory either.

[QUOTE="danwallacefan"] vandalvideo, this skepticism you are conveying is bull****. If you think the lot of Israeli soldiers were lying (being in a trained, professional western army, I tend to doubt such claims), then you're making a positive claim. do you have any evidence at all that the Israeli soldiers were lying? after all, such behavior would be unusual for an army which has cease-fires daily to let in food and humanitarian supplies and uses smart munitions to target hamas and avoid civilian casualties. Vandalvideo

Hamas attacked them from that location, Israel blindly responded and now they're facing the heat. Damn it Israel, you're falling right into the hands of the political warfare that Hamas is playing.Stevo_the_gamer

[QUOTE="HellsAngel2c"] you have evidence that they DONT have evidence? You know Hamas are living, breathing scum right? You should check out their latest in a series of TV ads which threatens Israel- thy've been going for a few months now and arent too cheery, Vandalvideo

How do you know that the UN (assuming that the sources were people inside the building) is a more credible source than the IDF? Furthermore, if you're saying that the Israeli army purposefully bombed the UN headquarters without provocation, you have a DAMN-HIGH standard of proof to fulfill. danwallacefan

if you havent noticed, were not exactly living in utopia quite yet. Sacrifices have been made and will be made for the greater good of whomever is most powerful.BiancaDK

I wonder if you would say the same if a country dropped a nuke on your country and killed your entire family. Sacrifices are always good, as long as they arent your loved ones... :?

And not living in a Utopia is not a valid excuse for actin barbaric. If I live in the Ghetto that doesnt give me the right to murder people.

[QUOTE="THE_DRUGGIE"][QUOTE="BiancaDK"] They did indeed. I really dont care if youre being sarcastic or not, or find me callous in my opinion.BiancaDK

So you find slaughtering civilians okay if it means getting to the desired outcome faster?

I guess you don't believe in Just War Theory either.

1. Do you have any evidence they're not?mastersword007

in just about every western court of law, honesty is assumed until proven otherwise. I'm not making a positive claim, YOU are shifting the burden of proof.

2. Haha, no.mastersword007

[QUOTE="Vanadium2k8"]Blockades started in 2006.

the rocket attacks started in 2005

[QUOTE="Vanadium2k8"]Hamas has received aid from who? All the aid that was sent to Palestine would have to go to Israel first, the blockades themselves are enough proof to show that the aid never reached Palestine anyway.danwallacefan

How are there methods of fighting questionable? Just because they are well equiped does not mean they should go easy ya know. If you had a boulder, would you switch tosticks just because your enemy uses sticks? No. The IDF only attacks for defense- that is their number one teaching. But you havnt been in the IDF so you wouldnt know. So how can you say that defensive to offensive combat is questionable?

Oh, and what laws have they broken? If i may add, during war, the main law of war is to give the innocent/ non-combatents their human rights. Israel do that to the best of their capabilities ...Hamas obviously dont.

[QUOTE="Vanadium2k8"]Blockades started in 2006.

the rocket attacks started in 2005

[QUOTE="Vanadium2k8"]Hamas has received aid from who? All the aid that was sent to Palestine would have to go to Israel first, the blockades themselves are enough proof to show that the aid never reached Palestine anyway.danwallacefan

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"] if you havent noticed, were not exactly living in utopia quite yet. Sacrifices have been made and will be made for the greater good of whomever is most powerful.II_Seraphim_II

I wonder if you would say the same if a country dropped a nuke on your country and killed your entire family. Sacrifices are always good, as long as they arent your loved ones... :?

And not living in a Utopia is not a valid excuse for actin barbaric. If I live in the Ghetto that doesnt give me the right to murder people.

[QUOTE="mastersword007"]
1. Do you have any evidence they're not?danwallacefan

in just about every western court of law, honesty is assumed until proven otherwise. I'm not making a positive claim, YOU are shifting the burden of proof.

2. Haha, no.mastersword007

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"][QUOTE="THE_DRUGGIE"]

So you find slaughtering civilians okay if it means getting to the desired outcome faster?

I guess you don't believe in Just War Theory either.

mastersword007

[QUOTE="danwallacefan"]

[QUOTE="mastersword007"]

in just about every western court of law, honesty is assumed until proven otherwise. I'm not making a positive claim, YOU are shifting the burden of proof.

[QUOTE="mastersword007"]
2. Haha, no.mastersword007

:lol: yes. Have you ever stopped to wonder why 75% of the casualties have been hamas militants?

danwallacefan

EDIT: From the above artivcle:

Israel launched its war on December 27 in an effort to stop militant rocket fire from Gaza that has terrorised hundreds of thousands of Israelis. Some 1,100 Palestinians have been killed, roughly half of them civilians, according to UN and Palestinian medical officials. Gaza health official Dr. Moaiya Hassanain said at least 50 people were killed throughout Gaza on Thursday.

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"]

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"] if you havent noticed, were not exactly living in utopia quite yet. Sacrifices have been made and will be made for the greater good of whomever is most powerful.BiancaDK

I wonder if you would say the same if a country dropped a nuke on your country and killed your entire family. Sacrifices are always good, as long as they arent your loved ones... :?

And not living in a Utopia is not a valid excuse for actin barbaric. If I live in the Ghetto that doesnt give me the right to murder people.

You know, I understand civilian casualties occur in every war and mistakes happen, but when 50% of the dead happen to be civilians....one has to pause and wonder.....II_Seraphim_II

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"]

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"] if you havent noticed, were not exactly living in utopia quite yet. Sacrifices have been made and will be made for the greater good of whomever is most powerful.BiancaDK

I wonder if you would say the same if a country dropped a nuke on your country and killed your entire family. Sacrifices are always good, as long as they arent your loved ones... :?

And not living in a Utopia is not a valid excuse for actin barbaric. If I live in the Ghetto that doesnt give me the right to murder people.

[QUOTE="mastersword007"][QUOTE="danwallacefan"] :lol: yes. Have you ever stopped to wonder why 75% of the casualties have been hamas militants?

LJS9502_basic

Such is war. Israel said they were attacked from that area which is consistent with Hamas' mode of operation.LJS9502_basic

Oh wow this is BBC-style braudcasting at its best! Israel has never used white phospherous. All of their weapon equipment is screed by forign parties before used in combat. The white phospherous 'rumour' originated from, you guessed it, GAZA. In it's current state, im sure any bull they say which provides a great excuse as to why Israel are 'dominating' them in war will be backed and supported by Iran...seeing as Iran fund Hamas. This means the media influence is less than perfect.

Also, Israel has rarely abducted. When they DO abduct, they abduct members of the militia, and even then they hold them in acceptable conditions, unlike Hamas who abduct to torture.

Finally, Israel send humanitry supplies through their barriar- they feed the citizens of Gaza. Hamas, the loving government they are, are too busy busying and smuggling weapons into the country to provide food and water for their citizens.

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"]

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"] if you havent noticed, were not exactly living in utopia quite yet. Sacrifices have been made and will be made for the greater good of whomever is most powerful.BiancaDK

I wonder if you would say the same if a country dropped a nuke on your country and killed your entire family. Sacrifices are always good, as long as they arent your loved ones... :?

And not living in a Utopia is not a valid excuse for actin barbaric. If I live in the Ghetto that doesnt give me the right to murder people.

[QUOTE="BiancaDK"][QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"]

I wonder if you would say the same if a country dropped a nuke on your country and killed your entire family. Sacrifices are always good, as long as they arent your loved ones... :?

And not living in a Utopia is not a valid excuse for actin barbaric. If I live in the Ghetto that doesnt give me the right to murder people.

mastersword007

LJS has a very valid point, a point that most people seem to miss. Hamas cares very little about the palestinian people. They are merely tools to achieve their goal. Their lives are insignificant to them. They are conducting more of a urban war than a guerilla war. They are firing rockets from within populated areas. I'm sure it doesn't take too much understaning to realize that Israel is going to respond by firing missles back at those areas. In fact, I suspect they are counting on it.sonicare

[QUOTE="sonicare"]LJS has a very valid point, a point that most people seem to miss. Hamas cares very little about the palestinian people. They are merely tools to achieve their goal. Their lives are insignificant to them. They are conducting more of a urban war than a guerilla war. They are firing rockets from within populated areas. I'm sure it doesn't take too much understaning to realize that Israel is going to respond by firing missles back at those areas. In fact, I suspect they are counting on it.Vanadium2k8