The "T" should be removed from LGBT

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deactivated-5c74ba2955026

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#151 deactivated-5c74ba2955026
Member since 2013 • 451 Posts
Well, that was a good laugh lol, but that is pretty hypocritical OP
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#152 Spartan_N7
Member since 2013 • 581 Posts

[QUOTE="Spartan_N7"]If youre born a certain gender, then stay that gender. Thats what I think about this. Aljosa23

Thankfully reality isn't so black and white.

Thats just my opinion. If you want to do it, then by all means, go for it. I just dont think it's right, thats all. I wouldnt stand in the way about it though.
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#153 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts
[QUOTE="Leejjohno"]

[QUOTE="Barbariser"]

I can't believe my eyes. A homosexual who wants to exclude other groups of people on the basis that they are different? :|

PannicAtack

It's not actually all that uncommon. Just because somebody is gay doesn't mean they have to be open minded.

The LGBT movement isn't quite so happily unified. You got folks who marginalize bisexuals because they think they aren't really gay or or just posers or they have it easier. Then you have bisexuals who think EVERYONE is bisexual. And of course, there are factions that hate the transpeople.

Just like everyone else they're divided by petty grievances that blind them to the bigger picture, unfortunate.
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#154 hippiesanta
Member since 2005 • 10301 Posts
I agree with this topic ..... the "T" are people with no respect on who they are...... they want to be someone else and try to legalize it on paper.
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#155 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

I agree with this topic ..... the "T" are people with no respect on who they are...... they want to be someone else and try to legalize it on paper.hippiesanta
Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

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#156 hippiesanta
Member since 2005 • 10301 Posts

[QUOTE="hippiesanta"]I agree with this topic ..... the "T" are people with no respect on who they are...... they want to be someone else and try to legalize it on paper.toast_burner

Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

they are not themself ... don't be ignorant.. if you said they are themself.... then why they want to chop of their front tail, or breast removal.... oh yes I know why... because they hate themself...... Anyway I love most gay and lesbian because they accept who they are inside out
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#157 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="hippiesanta"]I agree with this topic ..... the "T" are people with no respect on who they are...... they want to be someone else and try to legalize it on paper.hippiesanta

Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

they are not themself ... don't be ignorant.. if you said they are themself.... then why they want to chop of their front tail, or breast removal.... oh yes I know why... because they hate themself...... Anyway I love most gay and lesbian because they accept who they are inside out

They get surgery to make their exterior image to match their how they feel inside. 

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Lockedge

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#158 Lockedge
Member since 2002 • 16765 Posts

[QUOTE="hippiesanta"]I agree with this topic ..... the "T" are people with no respect on who they are...... they want to be someone else and try to legalize it on paper.toast_burner

Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

it's always funny that people try to push one's sex as their primary defining characteristic of their personhood, the aspect of themselves that overrides any other part of them that they find important. Well, mostly it's funny because they're running on 5th grade sex ed class logic and totally forget about intersex individuals whose genitals are often modified at birth without their knowledge. And then there are ones whose conditions start becoming visible at puberty....sex is indeed a murky swamp of physical characteristics that aren't so black and white at all, and it's funny when people assert that "Yes, Sex IS Male/Female" and "You're trying to be another person by changing it". Like...I always thought my body was the physical shell my brain...the most important part of who I am, and generally what makes me who i am...is housed in. People change their bodies all the time, but they get all peeved off if people change their sexual characteristics, as if it's honestly so vastly different than anything else. I mean, in my case, I was born infertile, so my stuff downstairs was pretty much useless AND painful to own. So what if i change it up to make myself more comfortable? To make my brain more at ease and happier? My body is my temple, and my house was a fixer-upper that leaked during any sort of rainstorm, and was entirely lacking insulation, and the floorboard nails tended tto pop out just enough o stub a toe on or ruin socks.... while most other people got these awesome cozy homes, and they're telling me to deal with what I got. Not cool. I don''t want to shovel snow out of my living room in the winter. Besides, no one can come up with a comprehensive definition of sex that instills a solid, stable binary. There are AlWAYS exceptions, and thus there are always variant positions. The sooner people come to terms with the fact that sex is not strictly male or female... or that male and female, as categories, can encompass a larger amount of variances based on the state of one's primary and secondary sex characteristics, genetics, etc....the better it'll be for people everywhere.
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#159 hippiesanta
Member since 2005 • 10301 Posts
[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="hippiesanta"]I agree with this topic ..... the "T" are people with no respect on who they are...... they want to be someone else and try to legalize it on paper.Lockedge

Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

it's always funny that people try to push one's sex as their primary defining characteristic of their personhood, the aspect of themselves that overrides any other part of them that they find important. Well, mostly it's funny because they're running on 5th grade sex ed class logic and totally forget about intersex individuals whose genitals are often modified at birth without their knowledge. And then there are ones whose conditions start becoming visible at puberty....sex is indeed a murky swamp of physical characteristics that aren't so black and white at all, and it's funny when people assert that "Yes, Sex IS Male/Female" and "You're trying to be another person by changing it". Like...I always thought my body was the physical shell my brain...the most important part of who I am, and generally what makes me who i am...is housed in. People change their bodies all the time, but they get all peeved off if people change their sexual characteristics, as if it's honestly so vastly different than anything else. I mean, in my case, I was born infertile, so my stuff downstairs was pretty much useless AND painful to own. So what if i change it up to make myself more comfortable? To make my brain more at ease and happier? My body is my temple, and my house was a fixer-upper that leaked during any sort of rainstorm, and was entirely lacking insulation, and the floorboard nails tended tto pop out just enough o stub a toe on or ruin socks.... while most other people got these awesome cozy homes, and they're telling me to deal with what I got. Not cool. I don''t want to shovel snow out of my living room in the winter. Besides, no one can come up with a comprehensive definition of sex that instills a solid, stable binary. There are AlWAYS exceptions, and thus there are always variant positions. The sooner people come to terms with the fact that sex is not strictly male or female... or that male and female, as categories, can encompass a larger amount of variances based on the state of one's primary and secondary sex characteristics, genetics, etc....the better it'll be for people everywhere.

Blog It
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#160 hippiesanta
Member since 2005 • 10301 Posts

[QUOTE="hippiesanta"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

toast_burner

they are not themself ... don't be ignorant.. if you said they are themself.... then why they want to chop of their front tail, or breast removal.... oh yes I know why... because they hate themself...... Anyway I love most gay and lesbian because they accept who they are inside out

They get surgery to make their exterior image to match their how they feel inside. 

I shave my beard so that I don't look like a woman
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Lockedge

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#161 Lockedge
Member since 2002 • 16765 Posts
[QUOTE="Lockedge"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

hippiesanta
it's always funny that people try to push one's sex as their primary defining characteristic of their personhood, the aspect of themselves that overrides any other part of them that they find important. Well, mostly it's funny because they're running on 5th grade sex ed class logic and totally forget about intersex individuals whose genitals are often modified at birth without their knowledge. And then there are ones whose conditions start becoming visible at puberty....sex is indeed a murky swamp of physical characteristics that aren't so black and white at all, and it's funny when people assert that "Yes, Sex IS Male/Female" and "You're trying to be another person by changing it". Like...I always thought my body was the physical shell my brain...the most important part of who I am, and generally what makes me who i am...is housed in. People change their bodies all the time, but they get all peeved off if people change their sexual characteristics, as if it's honestly so vastly different than anything else. I mean, in my case, I was born infertile, so my stuff downstairs was pretty much useless AND painful to own. So what if i change it up to make myself more comfortable? To make my brain more at ease and happier? My body is my temple, and my house was a fixer-upper that leaked during any sort of rainstorm, and was entirely lacking insulation, and the floorboard nails tended tto pop out just enough o stub a toe on or ruin socks.... while most other people got these awesome cozy homes, and they're telling me to deal with what I got. Not cool. I don''t want to shovel snow out of my living room in the winter. Besides, no one can come up with a comprehensive definition of sex that instills a solid, stable binary. There are AlWAYS exceptions, and thus there are always variant positions. The sooner people come to terms with the fact that sex is not strictly male or female... or that male and female, as categories, can encompass a larger amount of variances based on the state of one's primary and secondary sex characteristics, genetics, etc....the better it'll be for people everywhere.

Blog It

No worries, maybe I will. There are plenty of people like you in the world who have absolutely no idea how bodies function, how they're defined, why they're defined in such ways, and why people think about bodies like they do. Hrm. Then again, those same people's arguments tend to be "Cutting off a dick doesn't make you another person" and "But but but CHROMOSOMES amirite?", so maybe it's not worth pandering to people with the intelligence of a red-eyed tree frog.
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#162 hippiesanta
Member since 2005 • 10301 Posts
[QUOTE="Lockedge"][QUOTE="hippiesanta"][QUOTE="Lockedge"] it's always funny that people try to push one's sex as their primary defining characteristic of their personhood, the aspect of themselves that overrides any other part of them that they find important. Well, mostly it's funny because they're running on 5th grade sex ed class logic and totally forget about intersex individuals whose genitals are often modified at birth without their knowledge. And then there are ones whose conditions start becoming visible at puberty....sex is indeed a murky swamp of physical characteristics that aren't so black and white at all, and it's funny when people assert that "Yes, Sex IS Male/Female" and "You're trying to be another person by changing it". Like...I always thought my body was the physical shell my brain...the most important part of who I am, and generally what makes me who i am...is housed in. People change their bodies all the time, but they get all peeved off if people change their sexual characteristics, as if it's honestly so vastly different than anything else. I mean, in my case, I was born infertile, so my stuff downstairs was pretty much useless AND painful to own. So what if i change it up to make myself more comfortable? To make my brain more at ease and happier? My body is my temple, and my house was a fixer-upper that leaked during any sort of rainstorm, and was entirely lacking insulation, and the floorboard nails tended tto pop out just enough o stub a toe on or ruin socks.... while most other people got these awesome cozy homes, and they're telling me to deal with what I got. Not cool. I don''t want to shovel snow out of my living room in the winter. Besides, no one can come up with a comprehensive definition of sex that instills a solid, stable binary. There are AlWAYS exceptions, and thus there are always variant positions. The sooner people come to terms with the fact that sex is not strictly male or female... or that male and female, as categories, can encompass a larger amount of variances based on the state of one's primary and secondary sex characteristics, genetics, etc....the better it'll be for people everywhere.

Blog It

No worries, maybe I will. There are plenty of people like you in the world who have absolutely no idea how bodies function, how they're defined, why they're defined in such ways, and why people think about bodies like they do. Hrm. Then again, those same people's arguments tend to be "Cutting off a dick doesn't make you another person" and "But but but CHROMOSOMES amirite?", so maybe it's not worth pandering to people with the intelligence of a red-eyed tree frog.

to bad some people don't appreciate to have a d1(k
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#163 Smokescreened84
Member since 2005 • 2565 Posts
I would sooner remove the male junk between my legs given the chance than live with it. I hate being trans-gender, I hate being female in a male body, I hate not being able to fully be myself because of society's obsession with people's genitals, I hate that my entire life has been taken from me because of this birth defect of a male body. I can't bear a child to term, I can't be a mum - something I've dreamed of doing ever since I was a child, I can't do much of anything because my body is wrong. I didn't choose to be trans-gender, I didn't wake up one morning and just decide to be female, I am female and have been all my life. It's just my body that doesn't match and it's a living hell to endure when you know exactly how your body was supposed to be, how you were supposed to look, but always seeing this shadow in the mirror who has taken everything from you. Having the wrong physical sex that doesn't match your gender is a very cruel and distressing thing to have to endure. You can't tell someone who's trans-gender to 'deal with it', that's basically just telling them to die just to suit your narrow minded attitudes. And being trapped in the wrong physical sex is very much a slow death, you feel yourself fading away bit by bit the more you're forced to be the sex and gender you don't identify as. You ignorant fools who are so against those of us who are trans-gender are basically demanding us to die just to suit yourselves, you're pathetic and heartless.
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#164 deactivated-594be627b82ba
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[QUOTE="Smokescreened84"]I would sooner remove the male junk between my legs given the chance than live with it. I hate being trans-gender, I hate being female in a male body, I hate not being able to fully be myself because of society's obsession with people's genitals, I hate that my entire life has been taken from me because of this birth defect of a male body. I can't bear a child to term, I can't be a mum - something I've dreamed of doing ever since I was a child, I can't do much of anything because my body is wrong. I didn't choose to be trans-gender, I didn't wake up one morning and just decide to be female, I am female and have been all my life. It's just my body that doesn't match and it's a living hell to endure when you know exactly how your body was supposed to be, how you were supposed to look, but always seeing this shadow in the mirror who has taken everything from you. Having the wrong physical sex that doesn't match your gender is a very cruel and distressing thing to have to endure. You can't tell someone who's trans-gender to 'deal with it', that's basically just telling them to die just to suit your narrow minded attitudes. And being trapped in the wrong physical sex is very much a slow death, you feel yourself fading away bit by bit the more you're forced to be the sex and gender you don't identify as. You ignorant fools who are so against those of us who are trans-gender are basically demanding us to die just to suit yourselves, you're pathetic and heartless.

It's when I read story like yours I was able to bother doing some reaserch before spitting bs about things that I know nothing about. I'm heterosexual and I don't remember choosing to be like that, like I don't remember choosing my body or my brain, because you can't freaking choose it. Everyone is different and no matter how easy of a concept it is, some people are just too stupid to try to understand that. How hard is it to put yourself in people's shoes?
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#165 deactivated-5b78379493e12
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I would sooner remove the male junk between my legs given the chance than live with it. I hate being trans-gender, I hate being female in a male body, I hate not being able to fully be myself because of society's obsession with people's genitals, I hate that my entire life has been taken from me because of this birth defect of a male body. I can't bear a child to term, I can't be a mum - something I've dreamed of doing ever since I was a child, I can't do much of anything because my body is wrong. I didn't choose to be trans-gender, I didn't wake up one morning and just decide to be female, I am female and have been all my life. It's just my body that doesn't match and it's a living hell to endure when you know exactly how your body was supposed to be, how you were supposed to look, but always seeing this shadow in the mirror who has taken everything from you. Having the wrong physical sex that doesn't match your gender is a very cruel and distressing thing to have to endure. You can't tell someone who's trans-gender to 'deal with it', that's basically just telling them to die just to suit your narrow minded attitudes. And being trapped in the wrong physical sex is very much a slow death, you feel yourself fading away bit by bit the more you're forced to be the sex and gender you don't identify as. You ignorant fools who are so against those of us who are trans-gender are basically demanding us to die just to suit yourselves, you're pathetic and heartless.Smokescreened84

Very well said.

tumblr_m4zc1fMLux1rwcc6bo1_500.gif

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Smokescreened84

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#166 Smokescreened84
Member since 2005 • 2565 Posts
No one chooses their sexuality, their gender, their life. No one chooses to be born and no one chooses to be born differently. If people did have the choice then most would likely choose the safer option so to avoid the hate and abuse they would suffer for not fitting with others. Choice never factors into difference, it never factors into who we are as a person. If those who are born trans-genders were able to choose, then they would choose to be cis-gender so to avoid the kind of hate that many, like those on threads like these, show. But we never choose, we don't get a drop down menu in the womb with a selection of options. It would be great if that were possible but it isn't. Difference happens, get used to it.
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#167 OmenUK
Member since 2011 • 1268 Posts

I am gay and I don't think the T should be included. Its a WHOLE different issue, so I don't know why its being added to us. Being attracted to the same sex is a whole lot different issue than thinking you are a member the opposite sex. We dont choose to be gay. Nobody can prove we chose to either. However, we can prove that you were born a man or woman, so that is a choice to have a sex change. Its a fact.

 

I think the T is setting us back from progress because a whole different issue is being lumped in with us for no reason. . Our issue is a whole different matter, and not all gay people think having operations removing the gentilia you were born with is ok. 

TidusIsBest


So let me get this straight, you are gay, and have probably had to put up with homophobic comments since coming out, but then you want to discriminate against transgender? Seems a little like double standards at the very least, certainly like discrimination.

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#168 deactivated-5b19214ec908b
Member since 2007 • 25072 Posts

[QUOTE="TidusIsBest"]

I am gay and I don't think the T should be included. Its a WHOLE different issue, so I don't know why its being added to us. Being attracted to the same sex is a whole lot different issue than thinking you are a member the opposite sex. We dont choose to be gay. Nobody can prove we chose to either. However, we can prove that you were born a man or woman, so that is a choice to have a sex change. Its a fact.

 

I think the T is setting us back from progress because a whole different issue is being lumped in with us for no reason. . Our issue is a whole different matter, and not all gay people think having operations removing the gentilia you were born with is ok. 

OmenUK


So let me get this straight, you are gay, and have probably had to put up with homophobic comments since coming out, but then you want to discriminate against transgender? Seems a little like double standards at the very least, certainly like discrimination.

He's not gay, he's a troll.

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#169 chaoscougar1
Member since 2005 • 37603 Posts
[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="hippiesanta"] they are not themself ... don't be ignorant.. if you said they are themself.... then why they want to chop of their front tail, or breast removal.... oh yes I know why... because they hate themself...... Anyway I love most gay and lesbian because they accept who they are inside outhippiesanta

They get surgery to make their exterior image to match their how they feel inside. 

I shave my beard so that I don't look like a woman

wut
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#170 nomsayin
Member since 2013 • 1346 Posts

I can't believe my eyes. A homosexual who wants to exclude other groups of people on the basis that they are different? :|

Barbariser

There are many bigoted homosexuals. 

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#171 PannicAtack
Member since 2006 • 21040 Posts
[QUOTE="Lockedge"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

hippiesanta
it's always funny that people try to push one's sex as their primary defining characteristic of their personhood, the aspect of themselves that overrides any other part of them that they find important. Well, mostly it's funny because they're running on 5th grade sex ed class logic and totally forget about intersex individuals whose genitals are often modified at birth without their knowledge. And then there are ones whose conditions start becoming visible at puberty....sex is indeed a murky swamp of physical characteristics that aren't so black and white at all, and it's funny when people assert that "Yes, Sex IS Male/Female" and "You're trying to be another person by changing it". Like...I always thought my body was the physical shell my brain...the most important part of who I am, and generally what makes me who i am...is housed in. People change their bodies all the time, but they get all peeved off if people change their sexual characteristics, as if it's honestly so vastly different than anything else. I mean, in my case, I was born infertile, so my stuff downstairs was pretty much useless AND painful to own. So what if i change it up to make myself more comfortable? To make my brain more at ease and happier? My body is my temple, and my house was a fixer-upper that leaked during any sort of rainstorm, and was entirely lacking insulation, and the floorboard nails tended tto pop out just enough o stub a toe on or ruin socks.... while most other people got these awesome cozy homes, and they're telling me to deal with what I got. Not cool. I don''t want to shovel snow out of my living room in the winter. Besides, no one can come up with a comprehensive definition of sex that instills a solid, stable binary. There are AlWAYS exceptions, and thus there are always variant positions. The sooner people come to terms with the fact that sex is not strictly male or female... or that male and female, as categories, can encompass a larger amount of variances based on the state of one's primary and secondary sex characteristics, genetics, etc....the better it'll be for people everywhere.

Blog It

Grow up.
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#172 Nibroc420
Member since 2007 • 13571 Posts

If those who are born trans-genders were able to choose, then they would choose to be cis-gender so to avoid the kind of hate that many, like those on threads like these, show. Smokescreened84

>Two Humans, a Man, and a Woman, have Sex.
>As a result, the Woman gets pregnant, and gives birth 9 months later.
>The baby is born with a penis thus, we call the baby a "boy", and thus is of the "male" category.

male 
/ml/
Adjective
Of or denoting the sex that produces small, typically motile gametes, esp. spermatozoa, with which a female may be fertilized or...: "male children"

 

>Baby decides years later, through societal norms, that He actually has more in common with girls, than with guys.
However instead of simply being an effeminate guy, which is acceptable, He claims the world ment for him to be a girl, because he likes girl things, and gets a sex change.

 

 

Why shouldn't we be working to make the sex you're born with the acceptable one? Rather than, "I like girl things, and I think girls are prettier, so i should be a girl".
Not every girl who plays with their brother's action figures and toy guns is really just a male trapped in a female's body. Eventually it comes down to their own idea of themself, rather than what nature had intended.

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#173 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts

I would sooner remove the male junk between my legs given the chance than live with it. I hate being trans-gender, I hate being female in a male body, I hate not being able to fully be myself because of society's obsession with people's genitals, I hate that my entire life has been taken from me because of this birth defect of a male body. I can't bear a child to term, I can't be a mum - something I've dreamed of doing ever since I was a child, I can't do much of anything because my body is wrong. I didn't choose to be trans-gender, I didn't wake up one morning and just decide to be female, I am female and have been all my life. It's just my body that doesn't match and it's a living hell to endure when you know exactly how your body was supposed to be, how you were supposed to look, but always seeing this shadow in the mirror who has taken everything from you. Having the wrong physical sex that doesn't match your gender is a very cruel and distressing thing to have to endure. You can't tell someone who's trans-gender to 'deal with it', that's basically just telling them to die just to suit your narrow minded attitudes. And being trapped in the wrong physical sex is very much a slow death, you feel yourself fading away bit by bit the more you're forced to be the sex and gender you don't identify as. You ignorant fools who are so against those of us who are trans-gender are basically demanding us to die just to suit yourselves, you're pathetic and heartless.Smokescreened84
I personally feel okay about being trans*, but otherwise I can completely relate. Thank you.

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Smokescreened84

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#174 Smokescreened84
Member since 2005 • 2565 Posts

[QUOTE="Smokescreened84"]If those who are born trans-genders were able to choose, then they would choose to be cis-gender so to avoid the kind of hate that many, like those on threads like these, show. Nibroc420

>Two Humans, a Man, and a Woman, have Sex.
>As a result, the Woman gets pregnant, and gives birth 9 months later.
>The baby is born with a penis thus, we call the baby a "boy", and thus is of the "male" category.

male 
/ml/
Adjective
Of or denoting the sex that produces small, typically motile gametes, esp. spermatozoa, with which a female may be fertilized or...: "male children"

 

>Baby decides years later, through societal norms, that He actually has more in common with girls, than with guys.
However instead of simply being an effeminate guy, which is acceptable, He claims the world ment for him to be a girl, because he likes girl things, and gets a sex change.

 

 

Why shouldn't we be working to make the sex you're born with the acceptable one? Rather than, "I like girl things, and I think girls are prettier, so i should be a girl".
Not every girl who plays with their brother's action figures and toy guns is really just a male trapped in a female's body. Eventually it comes down to their own idea of themself, rather than what nature had intended.

Yet another narrow mind where the information goes in one ear and out the other, people like you are proof that people choose to be stupid. Gender and sex are two different things, they are not the same. Sex is based around the physical aspects of reproduction, gender is based around personality and self identity. Neither are the same, they only thing they have in common is that people are born with a physical sex, a sexuality and a gender identity. For those who are born trans-gender, that means that their gender identity - their sense of self, the sex and gender they identify as, the sense of where they fit in the world and who they are as a person - does not match the physical sex they were born with. This is a trait from birth and kicks in when the person's sense of self awareness kicks in at a young age, some will notice automatically that something is wrong, some won't notice it until later in life. You can't force someone who is trans-gender to be their physical sex, that is a very abusive and cruel thing to do, it forces the person to someone else, to be a lie. It causes major emotional and mental distress and can cause assorted mental issues through their lives ranging from an ever strong depression to suicidal tendencies in an attempt to be free of a life that doesn't match with who they are as a person within. Gender does not determine what a person will like, there are plenty of cis-gender females in the world who enjoy things that society labels as for males - video games for example - and there are cis-gender males in the world who have an interest in things that society labels as being for females - My Little Pony fans for example. Personal interests are not determined nor defined by the person's gender, they are simply a personal aspect of the person. Everyone likes different things, my sister is cis-gender and she loved playing with toys that were society labeled as being for males, she had no interest in things like dolls. Someone who's trans-gender will not automatically like the things that are labeled as being for a particular gender and sex, I identify as female yet I have a fondness for video games, Transformers, science and Star Trek - all things that society labels as being for males. Someone who's trans-gender has their own personal interests just like anyone else who isn't trans-gender, that comes down to personal taste. Gender identity though is not linked to a person's physical sex, both gender and sex are two separate things. It isn't hard to understand.
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worlock77

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#175 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="Lockedge"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]Are you trolling or just really stupid?

They aren't trying to be someone else. They're trying to be themself and idiots like you make it hard for them to do so. 

hippiesanta

it's always funny that people try to push one's sex as their primary defining characteristic of their personhood, the aspect of themselves that overrides any other part of them that they find important. Well, mostly it's funny because they're running on 5th grade sex ed class logic and totally forget about intersex individuals whose genitals are often modified at birth without their knowledge. And then there are ones whose conditions start becoming visible at puberty....sex is indeed a murky swamp of physical characteristics that aren't so black and white at all, and it's funny when people assert that "Yes, Sex IS Male/Female" and "You're trying to be another person by changing it". Like...I always thought my body was the physical shell my brain...the most important part of who I am, and generally what makes me who i am...is housed in. People change their bodies all the time, but they get all peeved off if people change their sexual characteristics, as if it's honestly so vastly different than anything else. I mean, in my case, I was born infertile, so my stuff downstairs was pretty much useless AND painful to own. So what if i change it up to make myself more comfortable? To make my brain more at ease and happier? My body is my temple, and my house was a fixer-upper that leaked during any sort of rainstorm, and was entirely lacking insulation, and the floorboard nails tended tto pop out just enough o stub a toe on or ruin socks.... while most other people got these awesome cozy homes, and they're telling me to deal with what I got. Not cool. I don''t want to shovel snow out of my living room in the winter. Besides, no one can come up with a comprehensive definition of sex that instills a solid, stable binary. There are AlWAYS exceptions, and thus there are always variant positions. The sooner people come to terms with the fact that sex is not strictly male or female... or that male and female, as categories, can encompass a larger amount of variances based on the state of one's primary and secondary sex characteristics, genetics, etc....the better it'll be for people everywhere.

Blog It

zQqyR_zps8e53c484.gif.

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deactivated-5b78379493e12

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#176 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="Nibroc420"]

[QUOTE="Smokescreened84"]If those who are born trans-genders were able to choose, then they would choose to be cis-gender so to avoid the kind of hate that many, like those on threads like these, show. Smokescreened84

>Two Humans, a Man, and a Woman, have Sex.
>As a result, the Woman gets pregnant, and gives birth 9 months later.
>The baby is born with a penis thus, we call the baby a "boy", and thus is of the "male" category.

male 
/ml/
Adjective
Of or denoting the sex that produces small, typically motile gametes, esp. spermatozoa, with which a female may be fertilized or...: "male children"

 

>Baby decides years later, through societal norms, that He actually has more in common with girls, than with guys.
However instead of simply being an effeminate guy, which is acceptable, He claims the world ment for him to be a girl, because he likes girl things, and gets a sex change.

 

 

Why shouldn't we be working to make the sex you're born with the acceptable one? Rather than, "I like girl things, and I think girls are prettier, so i should be a girl".
Not every girl who plays with their brother's action figures and toy guns is really just a male trapped in a female's body. Eventually it comes down to their own idea of themself, rather than what nature had intended.

Yet another narrow mind where the information goes in one ear and out the other, people like you are proof that people choose to be stupid. Gender and sex are two different things, they are not the same. Sex is based around the physical aspects of reproduction, gender is based around personality and self identity. Neither are the same, they only thing they have in common is that people are born with a physical sex, a sexuality and a gender identity. For those who are born trans-gender, that means that their gender identity - their sense of self, the sex and gender they identify as, the sense of where they fit in the world and who they are as a person - does not match the physical sex they were born with. This is a trait from birth and kicks in when the person's sense of self awareness kicks in at a young age, some will notice automatically that something is wrong, some won't notice it until later in life. You can't force someone who is trans-gender to be their physical sex, that is a very abusive and cruel thing to do, it forces the person to someone else, to be a lie. It causes major emotional and mental distress and can cause assorted mental issues through their lives ranging from an ever strong depression to suicidal tendencies in an attempt to be free of a life that doesn't match with who they are as a person within. Gender does not determine what a person will like, there are plenty of cis-gender females in the world who enjoy things that society labels as for males - video games for example - and there are cis-gender males in the world who have an interest in things that society labels as being for females - My Little Pony fans for example. Personal interests are not determined nor defined by the person's gender, they are simply a personal aspect of the person. Everyone likes different things, my sister is cis-gender and she loved playing with toys that were society labeled as being for males, she had no interest in things like dolls. Someone who's trans-gender will not automatically like the things that are labeled as being for a particular gender and sex, I identify as female yet I have a fondness for video games, Transformers, science and Star Trek - all things that society labels as being for males. Someone who's trans-gender has their own personal interests just like anyone else who isn't trans-gender, that comes down to personal taste. Gender identity though is not linked to a person's physical sex, both gender and sex are two separate things. It isn't hard to understand.

Just ignore nibroc. Trolls like nibroc don't deserve responses.

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LOXO7

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#177 LOXO7
Member since 2008 • 5595 Posts
Sexual orientation is learned and so is transgender.
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deactivated-5b78379493e12

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#178 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

Sexual orientation is learned and so is transgender. LOXO7

[citation needed]

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Smokescreened84

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#179 Smokescreened84
Member since 2005 • 2565 Posts
Sexual orientation is learned and so is transgender. LOXO7
No, it isn't, both are born traits. Stupidity like you've shown though, that's learned.
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LOXO7

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#180 LOXO7
Member since 2008 • 5595 Posts

[QUOTE="LOXO7"]Sexual orientation is learned and so is transgender. jimkabrhel

[citation needed]

My biology professor. Trust her. She's a doctor. We come out of the womb and breath on instinct. Everything else is learned.
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deactivated-5b78379493e12

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#181 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]

[QUOTE="LOXO7"]Sexual orientation is learned and so is transgender. LOXO7

[citation needed]

My biology professor. Trust her. She's a doctor. We come out of the womb and breath on instinct. Everything else is learned.

I'm a professor of chemistry. Would you take my expertise on all chemistry matters? No. You shouldn't.

One person is not an expert.

How about this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_and_sexual_orientation#Chromosome_linkage_studies

Is it hereditary for all gay men and women? Not likely. But making a blanket statement based on one person's opinion is just idiotic.

Homosexuality is also found in other species, who do not have the higher brain functions to choose in the way that we do. If homosexuality is learned, how can heterosexual parents have gay kids?

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#182 ShadowsDemon
Member since 2012 • 10059 Posts
If youre born a certain gender, then stay that gender. Thats what I think about this. Spartan_N7
Agreed.
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nomsayin

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#183 nomsayin
Member since 2013 • 1346 Posts
If homosexuality is learned, how can heterosexual parents have gay kids?jimkabrhel
hmm...idk..environment and society?
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#184 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"] If homosexuality is learned, how can heterosexual parents have gay kids?nomsayin
hmm...idk..environment and society?

There were plenty of gay men and women back before the current "environment and society". It was acceptable in some ancient cultures.

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#185 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts
[QUOTE="Spartan_N7"]If youre born a certain gender, then stay that gender. Thats what I think about this. ShadowsDemon
Agreed.

Spent my day watching your sig
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nomsayin

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#186 nomsayin
Member since 2013 • 1346 Posts

[QUOTE="nomsayin"][QUOTE="jimkabrhel"] If homosexuality is learned, how can heterosexual parents have gay kids?jimkabrhel

hmm...idk..environment and society?

There were plenty of gay men and women back before the current "environment and society". It was acceptable in some ancient cultures.

Oh, I agree definitely, but don't get me wrong, there have been tons of people "coming out" because of environmental pressures. I myself know several girls that have came out as "lesbians" to simply gain attention. I think it's safe to say that homosexuality is influenced by the society one lives in. As you said before, homosexuality was very common and accepted in cultures like Ancient Rome and Greece. In other cultures, like modern day America, homosexuality is still relatively uncommon, despite the fact that it's now pretty much acceptable. If homosexuality was really innate (i.e. if their was a gay gene), I'd think the % of gays would be pretty uniform and not differ by the society they live in.

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deactivated-5b78379493e12

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#187 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]

[QUOTE="nomsayin"] hmm...idk..environment and society? nomsayin

There were plenty of gay men and women back before the current "environment and society". It was acceptable in some ancient cultures.

Oh, I agree definitely, but don't get me wrong, there have been tons of people "coming out" because of environmental pressures. I myself know several girls that have came out as "lesbians" to simply gain attention. I think it's safe to say that homosexuality is influenced by the society one lives in. As you said before, homosexuality was very common and accepted in cultures like Ancient Rome and Greece. In other cultures, like modern day America, homosexuality is still relatively uncommon, despite the fact that it's now pretty much acceptable. If homosexuality was really innate (i.e. if their was a gay gene), I'd think the % of gays would be pretty uniform and not differ by the society they live in.

But how many of those women (or men) that you mention are truly gay? I agree that it's become somewhat popular based on certain parts of our media, but I think that detracts from the real discussion about homosexuality and where it comes from. I bet there is a uniform % of each population that is gay, but because of social differences, the number that are actually out, or would admit it wildly varies.

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#188 nomsayin
Member since 2013 • 1346 Posts

[QUOTE="nomsayin"]

[QUOTE="jimkabrhel"]

There were plenty of gay men and women back before the current "environment and society". It was acceptable in some ancient cultures.

jimkabrhel

Oh, I agree definitely, but don't get me wrong, there have been tons of people "coming out" because of environmental pressures. I myself know several girls that have came out as "lesbians" to simply gain attention. I think it's safe to say that homosexuality is influenced by the society one lives in. As you said before, homosexuality was very common and accepted in cultures like Ancient Rome and Greece. In other cultures, like modern day America, homosexuality is still relatively uncommon, despite the fact that it's now pretty much acceptable. If homosexuality was really innate (i.e. if their was a gay gene), I'd think the % of gays would be pretty uniform and not differ by the society they live in.

But how many of those women (or men) that you mention are truly gay? I agree that it's become somewhat popular based on certain parts of our media, but I think that detracts from the real discussion about homosexuality and where it comes from. I bet there is a uniform % of each population that is gay, but because of social differences, the number that are actually out, or would admit it wildly varies.

Yeah, there probably is some genetic factor. It's just interesting to see the disparity. 

- Ancient Rome: Homosexuality is considered acceptable (no religious restrictions against it, it's common), a pretty large % of males have homosexual tendencies. 

- America: Homosexuality is about accepeted by 50% of the population, the other half are against it), a small portion of our male population is homosexual.

 

If everyone is "born gay", It leads me to believe that most American males are closet gays...but if that's true, then it that begs the question why most American males can live relatively happy lives wrt sex and be comfortable with their sexuality when gays commonly tell us how hard it is to live in their shoes. 

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WSGRandomPerson

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#189 WSGRandomPerson
Member since 2007 • 13697 Posts
Haha.... dumb people.
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SmugDarkLoser0

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#190 SmugDarkLoser0
Member since 2013 • 29 Posts
I kind of agree. If someones gay it seems like preference. Of they consider themselves transgender it seems more of a problem with self identification and whatnot. Not that people should treat them differently, but yea, its definitely a different issue.
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#191 jeremiah06
Member since 2004 • 7217 Posts
[QUOTE="dave123321"]"Laihendi can turn any number into 4 as well,through the powers of addition and subtraction. If he's feeling fancy, he sometimes will even use multiplication or division."-Laihendi I like this

That is actually very awesome...
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#192 ShadowsDemon
Member since 2012 • 10059 Posts
[QUOTE="ShadowsDemon"][QUOTE="Spartan_N7"]If youre born a certain gender, then stay that gender. Thats what I think about this. dave123321
Agreed.

Spent my day watching your sig

Seems my sig has taken the time out of a lot of people's days. :P
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heeweesRus

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#193 heeweesRus
Member since 2012 • 5492 Posts

[QUOTE="Spartan_N7"]If youre born a certain gender, then stay that gender. Thats what I think about this. ShadowsDemon
Agreed.

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frannkzappa

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#194 frannkzappa
Member since 2012 • 3003 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"]The male figure is a symbol ofPannicAtack

So things can be symbols now? Whatever happened to "A is A" and Plato being full of crap?

HAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHA

this is perfect.

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#195 frannkzappa
Member since 2012 • 3003 Posts

Thought we all agreed that lai had/has different personas across different sites, then discovered ot and brought them here.dave123321

nah he started turning into current lai back in wowhead.

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#197 frannkzappa
Member since 2012 • 3003 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="PannicAtack"]So things can be symbols now? Whatever happened to "A is A" and Plato being full of crap?

PannicAtack

The law of identity does not contradict the existence of symbols. I am not talking about theories of supernatural metaphysics; I am talking about representations that exist and have meaning here in the physical world.

No. That makes no sense - if we are to talk about things in the rational point of view, a physical thing is itself - not a "representation" of an "ideal." That is something that exists only in the mind of the viewer, not a thing inherent to something's existence.

You're contradicting yourself again.

i can't believe lai admitted to the existence of forms and symbols.

what i couldn't do with hours of typing he did himself.

i'm so happy.

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#198 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
[QUOTE="jeremiah06"][QUOTE="dave123321"]"Laihendi can turn any number into 4 as well,through the powers of addition and subtraction. If he's feeling fancy, he sometimes will even use multiplication or division."-Laihendi ei I like this

That is actually very awesome...

I have never understood why that quote was so well received (I recall someone siging it on a different site). Anyways Frank Zappa, you are demonstrating an ignorance of Objectivism. Ayn Rand never said that symbols do not exist. The word "symbol" and its derivatives (symbolic, symbolize, etc.) occur 26 times in The Fountainhead, and 38 times in Atlas Shrugged. That includes 5 times within Galt's speech.
The symbol of all relationships among such men, the moral symbol of respect for human beings, is the trader.John Galt
With the sign of the dollar as our symbol-the sign of free trade and free minds-we will move to reclaim this country once more from the impotent savages who never discovered its nature, its meaning, its splendor.John Galt
Anyone who claims that symbolism contradicts Objectivism is just making stuff up.
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#199 frannkzappa
Member since 2012 • 3003 Posts

[QUOTE="jeremiah06"][QUOTE="dave123321"]"Laihendi can turn any number into 4 as well,through the powers of addition and subtraction. If he's feeling fancy, he sometimes will even use multiplication or division."-Laihendi ei I like thisLaihendi
That is actually very awesome...

I have never understood why that quote was so well received (I recall someone siging it on a different site). Anyways Frank Zappa, you are demonstrating an ignorance of Objectivism. Ayn Rand never said that symbols do not exist. The word "symbol" and its derivatives (symbolic, symbolize, etc.) occur 26 times in The Fountainhead, and 38 times in Atlas Shrugged. That includes 5 times within Galt's speech.
The symbol of all relationships among such men, the moral symbol of respect for human beings, is the trader.John Galt
With the sign of the dollar as our symbol-the sign of free trade and free minds-we will move to reclaim this country once more from the impotent savages who never discovered its nature, its meaning, its splendor.John Galt
Anyone who claims that symbolism contradicts Objectivism is just making stuff up.

i wasn't just talking about symbols...

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#200 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="jeremiah06"][QUOTE="dave123321"]"Laihendi can turn any number into 4 as well,through the powers of addition and subtraction. If he's feeling fancy, he sometimes will even use multiplication or division."-Laihendi ei I like thisLaihendi
That is actually very awesome...

I have never understood why that quote was so well received (I recall someone siging it on a different site). Anyways Frank Zappa, you are demonstrating an ignorance of Objectivism. Ayn Rand never said that symbols do not exist. The word "symbol" and its derivatives (symbolic, symbolize, etc.) occur 26 times in The Fountainhead, and 38 times in Atlas Shrugged. That includes 5 times within Galt's speech.

Are you so enamored with that book that you actually sit down and count out how many times individual words are used in it?