Violent Protests in the UK

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]No, I think it's silly that ANYONE expects someone else to pay for their education (an investment in YOURSELF). :|Lonelynight

No kidding. All of these things are being paid for by taxes. The government isn't giving anybody anything for free.

Entitlement issues methinks. My school raised tuition by 3000 one year and not one person sat outside to protest, much less violently.

Vaasman

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]No, I think it's silly that ANYONE expects someone else to pay for their education (an investment in YOURSELF). :|Lonelynight

Of course! If you're not lucky enough to be born into a family who can afford to send you through school for an education, well that's just not my problem! You can still make it, though. My best friend's cousin's uncle's barber made it and he was just like that!

If my college fees were raised to 14000 I think I'd flip. Everyone else would too.

...and if I had that much money I don't think I'd need to go to school to begin with...

For once i can actually follow the protestors. It could have a more "get over it" situation if the raise was by a 1000 pounds or something at like of that, but a 300% increase is just outrageous

They're actually pretty lucky. Look what happened to those Kent State students back in1970.

I wasn't too interested to be honest - I'm graduating this year and am not liable to pay the new fees. Then I heard that they attacked Prince Charles' Rolls Royce and I laughed... :lol: Buttmonkey9000

I love it, British students stand up for their rights for "an education for all" and you Yanks think it's wrong. Yet when Coca-Cola changed their recipe in the 80's there was an up roar, how pathetic. To put it in perspective, the British Govn't are proposing an increase to a £9,000 a year cap, so for the average degree course of 3 years that could be £27,000 of debt (roughly $43,000), that's even before the cost of living, food, books, etc. $43,000 of debt before you even start in your chosen career choice, hardly surprising British students are taking the news badly, but then all you Yanks seem to care about is Coca-Cola and your right own a gun.

I love it, British students stand up for their rights for "an education for all" and you Yanks think it's wrong. Yet when Coca-Cola changed their recipe in the 80's there was an up roar, how pathetic. To put it in perspective, the British Govn't are proposing an increase to a £9,000 a year cap, so for the average degree course of 3 years that could be £27,000 of debt (roughly $43,000), that's even before the cost of living, food, books, etc. $43,000 of debt before you even start in your chosen career choice, hardly surprising British students are taking the news badly, but then all you Yanks seem to care about is Coca-Cola and your right own a gun.

Bashers79

Yes, because us Americans have been talking about coca-cola and our rights to gun ownership in this thread. Where exactly, if you don't mind quoting?

Us "Yanks" just don't care. Welcome to the party, dude. Now you can pay for your education like we do. Cheers.

[QUOTE="Bashers79"]

I love it, British students stand up for their rights for "an education for all" and you Yanks think it's wrong. Yet when Coca-Cola changed their recipe in the 80's there was an up roar, how pathetic. To put it in perspective, the British Govn't are proposing an increase to a £9,000 a year cap, so for the average degree course of 3 years that could be £27,000 of debt (roughly $43,000), that's even before the cost of living, food, books, etc. $43,000 of debt before you even start in your chosen career choice, hardly surprising British students are taking the news badly, but then all you Yanks seem to care about is Coca-Cola and your right own a gun.

Yes, because us Americans have been talking about coca-cola and our rights to gun ownership in this thread. Where exactly, if you don't mind quoting?

Us "Yanks" just don't care. Welcome to the party, dude. Now you can pay for your education like we do. Cheers.

Maybe we wouldnt mind the tuition increase if we paid the low tax rates, food prices, fuel prices etc that you in the us pay.EmpCom

We pay low fuel prices? Man I pay almost three dollars a gallon for fuel and I drive a pick up. Don't complain to me about gas prices.

It sounds to me like you're government is trying to do too much with too little. That sounds like a problem with many entitlement countries in the EU.

[QUOTE="EmpCom"]Maybe we wouldnt mind the tuition increase if we paid the low tax rates, food prices, fuel prices etc that you in the us pay.airshocker

We pay low fuel prices? Man I pay almost three dollars a gallon for fuel and I drive a pick up. Don't complain to me about gas prices.

It sounds to me like you're government is trying to do too much with too little. That sounds like a problem with many entitlement countries in the EU.

Yes you do we pay the equivalent of nearly nine dollars a gallon. As for your second remark how much is the us national debt now.Seems like your government is tring to do too much with too little. That seems like a typical problem with the us. But hey keep posting on a topic you know nothing about.

EmpCom

I never said my government wasn't doing the exact same thing. Which is why I'm vehemently fighting against becoming anything like the EU. No offense intended, I just don't want to pay the tax rates you guys do and not get any of the benefits because I'm a hard-working individual who doesn't rely on the government to survive.

[QUOTE="EmpCom"]

Yes you do we pay the equivalent of nearly nine dollars a gallon. As for your second remark how much is the us national debt now.Seems like your government is tring to do too much with too little. That seems like a typical problem with the us. But hey keep posting on a topic you know nothing about.

I never said my government wasn't doing the exact same thing. Which is why I'm vehemently fighting against becoming anything like the EU. No offense intended, I just don't want to pay the tax rates you guys do and not get any of the benefits because I'm a hard-working individual who doesn't rely on the government to survive.

[QUOTE="DarthJohnova"]

I think a lot of you are completely misinformed, so lets go back to square 1 and set the scene.

They're rioting for various matters, increasing tuition fees to £9000 a year, cuts to EMA (free money for students whose parents earn less than £30,000 p/a), false promises from MP's e.t.c e.t.c

Nick Clegg pledged to his voters, that he and his fellow liberals would not support an increase in tuition fees and would vote against it. Since the Government is a coalition, Clegg has less of a say and cannot employ all his policies, as David Cameron's Conservatives had the majority of the vote. The Conservatives have employed their education policies, which have been incredibly unpopular amongst students.

Cuts to education are severe, arts, humanities and social sciences are having funding pulled completely, so the Universities have to scrape the money themselves to fund these courses, thus having to raise the fees. I'm in the University system and the chances are in my final year, i'll be paying 7, 000 instead of 3,000...boo-hoo, i'll get over it.

People are angry because Clegg lied. People are also frustrated because EMA is being cut; i personally detest EMA and think it's a complete joke, no kid should be given £30/$40 a week and the majority (not all) spend it on alcohol, drugs, lifestyle choices and clothing. It's ridiculous.

But basically you've got two camps of protesters; one camp are genuinely concerned for their education and are campaigning because they cannot afford the higher fees, then you've got the other camp who consist of anarchists and anti-establishment individuals looking for violence and moaning because they won't get paid to turn up to college...

poptart

It's funny I was listening to kids this morning talking about the situation, and those who opposed the current riots were frightfullymiddle class - those I imagine who live in the home counties and born with a silver spoon in their mouths. It's the under privileged kids who rightfully demonstrate against these typical conservative measures that ensure higher education is reserved only for the wealthy thus ultimately broadening the gap between the wealthy and poor.

And you're right protest will always attract the anarchists who will be rioting for riotings sake only. I remember going on the criminal justice bill march back in 95 in London - it's the minority of anarchists who were handing out the 'bring down no. 10' flyers that kicked off and caused the mayhem to start. The media tarnished us all with the same brush though of course, those darn hippies with attitude...

It's called student loans...

You don't have to be wealthy to go to college. Many, many people pay for it on there own. Yes, it's costly upfront, but the knowledge you'll gain (if you pick a degree in demand) will far outweigh the cost, considering you're investing in yourself.

But yep, let's have the government hold our hand all the way through life and not be responsible for our own lives.

[QUOTE="EmpCom"]Maybe we wouldnt mind the tuition increase if we paid the low tax rates, food prices, fuel prices etc that you in the us pay.airshocker

We pay low fuel prices? Man I pay almost three dollars a gallon for fuel and I drive a pick up. Don't complain to me about gas prices.

It sounds to me like you're government is trying to do too much with too little. That sounds like a problem with many entitlement countries in the EU.

We pay over £1 per litre

[QUOTE="Ultimas_Blade"]

I say good on the workers for sticking up for their rights. optiow

Co-signed brother. F*** these austerity-minded imbeciles. If they would just TAX the money these corporations and CEOssiphoned out of the middle c1ass at the correct levels and REGULATE the Financial and Energymarkets like they should be.

Instead of protecting the troves people have amassed, they need to invest in education, health, and technology.

Who do you think corporations pass the tax onto? The consumer...

My god, the amount of economic and business illiterate people on this forum is astounding.

[QUOTE="Ultimas_Blade"]

Co-signed brother. F*** these austerity-minded imbeciles. If they would just TAX the money these corporations and CEOssiphoned out of the middle c1ass at the correct levels and REGULATE the Financial and Energymarkets like they should be.

Instead of protecting the troves people have amassed, they need to invest in education, health, and technology.

Who do you think corporations pass the tax onto? The consumer...

My god, the amount of economic and business illiterate people on this forum is astounding.

I voted Lib Dem because they promised a reduce in tuition fees so as far as im concerned these protests are exactly the right idea. We are actually making a difference and really harassing the government about all this crap they have put us in. They are screwing over the future because the present got us in so much debt, too right im gonna be angry.Wolls

I saw that this morning on CNN and thought to myself when was the last time the US went balistic and just rioted over a bunch of nonsense? I think the early 90's in South Central LA during the whole Rodney King/Racial fallout. I think we are do for a riot.xXDrPainXx

[QUOTE="poptart"]

[QUOTE="DarthJohnova"]

I think a lot of you are completely misinformed, so lets go back to square 1 and set the scene.

They're rioting for various matters, increasing tuition fees to £9000 a year, cuts to EMA (free money for students whose parents earn less than £30,000 p/a), false promises from MP's e.t.c e.t.c

Nick Clegg pledged to his voters, that he and his fellow liberals would not support an increase in tuition fees and would vote against it. Since the Government is a coalition, Clegg has less of a say and cannot employ all his policies, as David Cameron's Conservatives had the majority of the vote. The Conservatives have employed their education policies, which have been incredibly unpopular amongst students.

Cuts to education are severe, arts, humanities and social sciences are having funding pulled completely, so the Universities have to scrape the money themselves to fund these courses, thus having to raise the fees. I'm in the University system and the chances are in my final year, i'll be paying 7, 000 instead of 3,000...boo-hoo, i'll get over it.

People are angry because Clegg lied. People are also frustrated because EMA is being cut; i personally detest EMA and think it's a complete joke, no kid should be given £30/$40 a week and the majority (not all) spend it on alcohol, drugs, lifestyle choices and clothing. It's ridiculous.

But basically you've got two camps of protesters; one camp are genuinely concerned for their education and are campaigning because they cannot afford the higher fees, then you've got the other camp who consist of anarchists and anti-establishment individuals looking for violence and moaning because they won't get paid to turn up to college...

SpartanMSU

It's funny I was listening to kids this morning talking about the situation, and those who opposed the current riots were frightfullymiddle class - those I imagine who live in the home counties and born with a silver spoon in their mouths. It's the under privileged kids who rightfully demonstrate against these typical conservative measures that ensure higher education is reserved only for the wealthy thus ultimately broadening the gap between the wealthy and poor.

And you're right protest will always attract the anarchists who will be rioting for riotings sake only. I remember going on the criminal justice bill march back in 95 in London - it's the minority of anarchists who were handing out the 'bring down no. 10' flyers that kicked off and caused the mayhem to start. The media tarnished us all with the same brush though of course, those darn hippies with attitude...

It's called student loans...

You don't have to be wealthy to go to college. Many, many people pay for it on there own. Yes, it's costly upfront, but the knowledge you'll gain (if you pick a degree in demand) will far outweigh the cost, considering you're investing in yourself.

But yep, let's have the government hold our hand all the way through life and not be responsible for our own lives.

I wouldn't mind paying off these large (for a student) prices, but it just seems like you're spending it for nothing. Hardly anyone who's a veteran in their career make a degree sound particularly appealing; all I hear is that degree's don't mean much compared to actual work experience, and it won't increase your job prospects all that much (although I guess it depends on what field you're working on). It just doesn't sound worthy of the soon-to-be high price they're sticking on it, especially if you're a student who has minimal to no experience in work.

[QUOTE="xXDrPainXx"]I saw that this morning on CNN and thought to myself when was the last time the US went balistic and just rioted over a bunch of nonsense? I think the early 90's in South Central LA during the whole Rodney King/Racial fallout. I think we are do for a riot.X360PS3AMD05

I wouldn't mind paying off these large (for a student) prices, but it just seems like you're spending it for nothing. Hardly anyone who's a veteran in their career make a degree sound particularly appealing; all I hear is that degree's don't mean much compared to actual work experience, and it won't increase your job prospects all that much (although I guess it depends on what field you're working on). It just doesn't sound worthy of the soon-to-be high price they're sticking on it, especially if you're a student who has minimal to no experience in work.

cyborg100000

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="Ultimas_Blade"]

Co-signed brother. F*** these austerity-minded imbeciles. If they would just TAX the money these corporations and CEOssiphoned out of the middle c1ass at the correct levels and REGULATE the Financial and Energymarkets like they should be.

Instead of protecting the troves people have amassed, they need to invest in education, health, and technology.

EmpCom

Who do you think corporations pass the tax onto? The consumer...

My god, the amount of economic and business illiterate people on this forum is astounding.

I'm double majoring in Finance and Economics...

[QUOTE="EmpCom"][QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

Who do you think corporations pass the tax onto? The consumer...

My god, the amount of economic and business illiterate people on this forum is astounding.

I'm double majoring in Finance and Economics...

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="poptart"]

It's funny I was listening to kids this morning talking about the situation, and those who opposed the current riots were frightfullymiddle class - those I imagine who live in the home counties and born with a silver spoon in their mouths. It's the under privileged kids who rightfully demonstrate against these typical conservative measures that ensure higher education is reserved only for the wealthy thus ultimately broadening the gap between the wealthy and poor.

And you're right protest will always attract the anarchists who will be rioting for riotings sake only. I remember going on the criminal justice bill march back in 95 in London - it's the minority of anarchists who were handing out the 'bring down no. 10' flyers that kicked off and caused the mayhem to start. The media tarnished us all with the same brush though of course, those darn hippies with attitude...

gameguy6700

It's called student loans...

You don't have to be wealthy to go to college. Many, many people pay for it on there own. Yes, it's costly upfront, but the knowledge you'll gain (if you pick a degree in demand) will far outweigh the cost, considering you're investing in yourself.

But yep, let's have the government hold our hand all the way through life and not be responsible for our own lives.

I never said a college degree guarantees you a job...

What you're saying has more to due with our current economic situation and the fact that you need more than just a degree now because much more people have them than in previous years. That doesn't mean a degree still isn't valuable...

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="EmpCom"] Trust me you are not any economic whizz yourself. The guy had a point many companies avoid paying the tax they should because of an overly complicated tax system.EmpCom

I'm double majoring in Finance and Economics...

It's well agreed upon by most economists that a corporate tax just gets passed on to consumers...

Try again.

[QUOTE="EmpCom"][QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

I'm double majoring in Finance and Economics...

It's well agreed upon by most economists that a corporate tax just gets passed on to consumers...

Try again.

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="EmpCom"] Wow standards in education are really slippingEmpCom

It's well agreed upon by most economists that a corporate tax just gets passed on to consumers...

Try again.

I could care less about the other things he said. I was simply addressing one point. I'm not going to argue with someone who's economic knowledge and understanding is that of a 12 year old.

[QUOTE="EmpCom"][QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

It's well agreed upon by most economists that a corporate tax just gets passed on to consumers...

Try again.

SpartanMSU

I could care less about the other things he said. I was simply addressing one point. I'm not going to argue with someone who's economic knowledge and understanding is that of a 12 year old.

I would mind of the government was overthrown and sentenced to death row/life long sentence each and everyone individually for selling out its people.
The government messed up and they are letting college students pay the debt? #### no, let the banks pay up.
This horridly, sick, twisted way the bank controls our lives has to stop. I don't think we can't trust a single government here.

In the Netherlands, they are planning some bull too;
Every student that has a delay for more than a year due to foreseen and unforeseen circumstances in his education, be it sickness, handicaps, change in education plans, change in university/education gets a €3000,- fine along with the regular €1670 yearly tuition fee. I study medicine 40 hours in the week and I would not ever be able to pay the fine as I'm barely able to pay the tuition fee.

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="EmpCom"] Why the original poster made valid arguments which you ignored. Companies should pay tax like everyone else and loopholes should be closed. Regulators should regulate , for example wholesale gas prices rise 50% gas companies increase price to consumer accordingly, then when wholesale gas prices fall lets say by 50% also, gas companies reduce price to consumer by 2%. You choose to ignore this i didntEmpCom

I could care less about the other things he said. I was simply addressing one point. I'm not going to argue with someone who's economic knowledge and understanding is that of a 12 year old.

One of his points was about corporate taxes...which I addressed...:|

...theres an individualistic feel in this country, where you don't need the government to supply you with everything and thats what I appreciate. You work for what you have and get rewarded for it.halo1399

"The laws of capitalism, blind and invisible to the majority, act upon the individual without his thinking about it. He sees only the vastness of a seemingly infinite horizon before him. That is how it is painted by capitalist propagandists, who purport to draw a lesson from the example of Rockefeller - whether or not it is true - about the possibilities of success. The amount of poverty and suffering required for a Rockefeller to emerge, and the amount of depravity entailed in the accumulation of a fortune of such magnitude, are left out of the picture"

You keep believing in that "individualistic feeling".

[QUOTE="EmpCom"]

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

I could care less about the other things he said. I was simply addressing one point. I'm not going to argue with someone who's economic knowledge and understanding is that of a 12 year old.

One of his points was about corporate taxes...which I addressed...:|

[QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

[QUOTE="EmpCom"] You never addressed any of his points all you did is what you always do and state tax increases get passed to comsumerand then state how shocked you are by the lack of economic understanding on here. Well if thats the case a 12year old isjust aboutat your level

EmpCom

One of his points was about corporate taxes...which I addressed...:|

Everyone tries to pay as little tax as possible...

Regardless, it's estimated that 22% of what you pay goes to taxes. Which is why I think the FairTax should replace the income Tax. I agree that the tax system is ridiculously complicated and a mess, something the FairTax would also fix.

Can't the UK just hold a referendum on this? I'm sure students want lower tuitions, but someone has to pay those tutition fees. The government gets its money from the people, so just find out if the people want to pay to keep tuition low. That way you can assess what your society values. Generally, most countries put emphasis on education, so I'd expect that people may be willing to pay more tax in the UK to see lower tuition prices.

I'm all for the violence, I want it get to the point where the military have to step in and start shooting 16 year old girls in the face. Seriously, this shows that men still have balls, and that our government can't castrate us and tell us to DO NOT, FOLLOW, SHUT UP and OBAY!

Viva la revolution!!!!

"Runs off to London to join in"

Good on you students, Teenagers are often responsible for movements because they haven't built up as many responsibilities so they can spend it making life more difficult for others, which is a good thing in this case, anything that pisses in the face of our government is a good thing. Go on my sons!

[QUOTE="EmpCom"] You never addressed any of his points all you did is what you always do and state tax increases get passed to comsumerand then state how shocked you are by the lack of economic understanding on here. Well if thats the case a 12year old isjust aboutat your level

One of his points was about corporate taxes...which I addressed...:|

Just a bunch of spoiled brats who think they deserve someone else's money.

[QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="SpartanMSU"]

It's called student loans...

You don't have to be wealthy to go to college. Many, many people pay for it on there own. Yes, it's costly upfront, but the knowledge you'll gain (if you pick a degree in demand) will far outweigh the cost, considering you're investing in yourself.

But yep, let's have the government hold our hand all the way through life and not be responsible for our own lives.

SpartanMSU

I never said a college degree guarantees you a job...

What you're saying has more to due with our current economic situation and the fact that you need more than just a degree now because much more people have them than in previous years. That doesn't mean a degree still isn't valuable...

It's also worth noting that the difficulties in finding a job faced by gen Y aren't just due to everyone having a degree and the recession. The baby boomers are refusing to retire and as a result nearly every career field is experiencing a freeze in promotions because there's no where for anyone to go. Gen X is stuck in the middle of their career development and they're the ones who get laid off or search for new jobs. Since they have several years of experience at minimum by this point and are resorting to applying to entry level positions just to have any job no employer is willing to hire inexperienced applicants when they've got a large pool of experienced Gen X'ers to choose from.

Brits need to learn that the government can't always hold there hand with everything, my tuition for college is much, much more expensive than what the British Parliament is raising it to, these protests are getting extremely violent and to be honest I think its hysterical. Same thing with France, they raised the retirement age 2 years and people try and overthrow the government...Thank God I live in the US

halo1399