We Are All Born Atheist

[QUOTE="toxic_jackal"]

Humans are not born atheist. We are pretty much born "knowing nothing" as others have stated. Children are taught through the process of enculturation. We're not born believing in God. How can a newborn know anything about God unless we are taught? Everything humans do is taught by learning and example. Take an anthropology class.

SgtKevali

Did you read his post? Atheism isn't necessarily a belief. Technically, he's right. All Atheists have no belief in a god. Babies have no belief in a god. Thus babies are atheists.

It's so simple, yet most people just can't understand it.

[QUOTE="alexside1"]

So... you haven't negated my point?

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="raynimrod"]

Does that automatically mean that the religion doesn't find ways to explain the creation of the universe and the cause of nature?

raynimrod

Buddhism doesn't. As far as the Buddha was concerned he considered such questions unanswerable and thus not worth pondering.

I wouldn't call buddhism a religion, it's more a way of life. It doesn't really fit the standard definition, but that's just my opinion. Either way, you've found one "religion" that doesn't try to explain that. The 2 most followed religions are quite the opposite.

Uhh arn't all religions a way of life that has certain guidelines you should try to follow? Furthermore Buddhism believes in reincarnation.. So how exactly is it not a religion?

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="toxic_jackal"]

Humans are not born atheist. We are pretty much born "knowing nothing" as others have stated. Children are taught through the process of enculturation. We're not born believing in God. How can a newborn know anything about God unless we are taught? Everything humans do is taught by learning and example. Take an anthropology class.

BluRayHiDef

Did you read his post? Atheism isn't necessarily a belief. Technically, he's right. All Atheists have no belief in a god. Babies have no belief in a god. Thus babies are atheists.

It's so simple, yet most people just can't understand it.

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

Did you read his post? Atheism isn't necessarily a belief. Technically, he's right. All Atheists have no belief in a god. Babies have no belief in a god. Thus babies are atheists.

sSubZerOo

It's so simple, yet most people just can't understand it.

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

In modern atheistic thought and discourse (which is 100% relevant to what we're discussing), there are two types of atheism (generally): strong and weak atheism. I can't reiterate this point enough. If you still disagree, then please read the wikipedia article I linked. Maybe I'm not explaining something well.

Honestly, I'm not sure what you mean by the bolded. It gives me the indication you didn't even look into what I presented.

SgtKevali

Okay but that doesn't change the meaning of the word. That's basically just a philosophical digression as to the degrees of atheism. But basically all atheism means is a disbelief in God. Now if you want to variate that....it still doesn't change the basic meaning of the word. As for the Wiki article on atheism.....it presents some controversy as to use.

[QUOTE="alexside1"]

So... you haven't negated my point?

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="raynimrod"]

Does that automatically mean that the religion doesn't find ways to explain the creation of the universe and the cause of nature?

raynimrod

Buddhism doesn't. As far as the Buddha was concerned he considered such questions unanswerable and thus not worth pondering.

I wouldn't call buddhism a religion, it's more a way of life. It doesn't really fit the standard definition, but that's just my opinion. Either way, you've found one "religion" that doesn't try to explain that. The 2 most followed religions are quite the opposite.

What is religion if not a way of life?

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

In modern atheistic thought and discourse (which is 100% relevant to what we're discussing), there are two types of atheism (generally): strong and weak atheism. I can't reiterate this point enough. If you still disagree, then please read the wikipedia article I linked. Maybe I'm not explaining something well.

Honestly, I'm not sure what you mean by the bolded. It gives me the indication you didn't even look into what I presented.

LJS9502_basic

Okay but that doesn't change the meaning of the word. That's basically just a philosophical digression as to the degrees of atheism. But basically all atheism means is a disbelief in God. Now if you want to variate that....it still doesn't change the basic meaning of the word. As for the Wiki article on atheism.....it presents some controversy as to use.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

In modern atheistic thought and discourse (which is 100% relevant to what we're discussing), there are two types of atheism (generally): strong and weak atheism. I can't reiterate this point enough. If you still disagree, then please read the wikipedia article I linked. Maybe I'm not explaining something well.

Honestly, I'm not sure what you mean by the bolded. It gives me the indication you didn't even look into what I presented.

ihateaynrand

Okay but that doesn't change the meaning of the word. That's basically just a philosophical digression as to the degrees of atheism. But basically all atheism means is a disbelief in God. Now if you want to variate that....it still doesn't change the basic meaning of the word. As for the Wiki article on atheism.....it presents some controversy as to use.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

It's so simple, yet most people just can't understand it.

BluRayHiDef

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

.. Atheism is taking a active role in that understanding.. The baby and the comatose person do not have the faculties of making the decision either way.. Seriously this would be like claiming that they are anarchists as well becuase they don't take a stand on government..

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

It's so simple, yet most people just can't understand it.

BluRayHiDef

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

So Ariel Sharon is an atheist? Intersting.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

It's so simple, yet most people just can't understand it.

BluRayHiDef

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

And so is a horse.

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

sSubZerOo

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

.. Atheism is taking a active role in that understanding.. The baby and the comatose person do not have the faculties of making the decision either way.. Seriously this would be like claiming that they are anarchists as well becuase they don't take a stand on government..

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

.. You can't classify a baby either way.. Atheism is the disbelief of god.. Seriously this would be like claiming a comatose person is a atheist.. Becuase nothing is going through their head just about.

sSubZerOo

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

.. Atheism is taking a active role in that understanding.. The baby and the comatose person do not have the faculties of making the decision either way.. Seriously this would be like claiming that they are anarchists as well becuase they don't take a stand on government..

Yes, they would be anarchist as well.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

Yes, a comatose person is an atheist. They are without belief in god, and hence they are atheist.

ihateaynrand

.. Atheism is taking a active role in that understanding.. The baby and the comatose person do not have the faculties of making the decision either way.. Seriously this would be like claiming that they are anarchists as well becuase they don't take a stand on government..

They don't have a opinion on the government meaning they automatically against government.. Which he is suggesting. That is my point.. That because they don't have a understanding of what government is or what not, they are anarchists.

Back to arguing over terminology? Lovely.

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

.. Atheism is taking a active role in that understanding.. The baby and the comatose person do not have the faculties of making the decision either way.. Seriously this would be like claiming that they are anarchists as well becuase they don't take a stand on government..

sSubZerOo

They don't have a opinion on the government meaning they automatically against government.. Which he is suggesting. That is my point.. That because they don't have a understanding of what government is or what not, they are anarchists.

I'm surprised this is still going. It was pointed out very early on that an atheist must play an active role in the so called "lack" of belief in God. If atheism is merely the absence of a belief then agnostics would also be atheists. SolidSnake35

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

In modern atheistic thought and discourse (which is 100% relevant to what we're discussing), there are two types of atheism (generally): strong and weak atheism. I can't reiterate this point enough. If you still disagree, then please read the wikipedia article I linked. Maybe I'm not explaining something well.

Honestly, I'm not sure what you mean by the bolded. It gives me the indication you didn't even look into what I presented.

LJS9502_basic

Okay but that doesn't change the meaning of the word. That's basically just a philosophical digression as to the degrees of atheism. But basically all atheism means is a disbelief in God. Now if you want to variate that....it still doesn't change the basic meaning of the word. As for the Wiki article on atheism.....it presents some controversy as to use.

Well, what do you mean by disbelief? If you mean disbelief in an affirmative sense, as in "I believe there is no..." or "I believe A is false".

If this is what you mean, you are incorrect. All atheists lack a belief in a god, some atheists have a belief there is no god. It's the broader definition. It's sort of like Christians and Catholics.

Seriously this would be like claiming that they are anarchists as well becuase they don't take a stand on government..

sSubZerOo

Yeah, I agree that calling everyone who is not a true atheist simply because of the definition of another word that is used in the definition of the word in some specific dictionary is pointless when it goes against the true meaning that most people give to the word.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

In modern atheistic thought and discourse (which is 100% relevant to what we're discussing), there are two types of atheism (generally): strong and weak atheism. I can't reiterate this point enough. If you still disagree, then please read the wikipedia article I linked. Maybe I'm not explaining something well.

Honestly, I'm not sure what you mean by the bolded. It gives me the indication you didn't even look into what I presented.

SgtKevali

Okay but that doesn't change the meaning of the word. That's basically just a philosophical digression as to the degrees of atheism. But basically all atheism means is a disbelief in God. Now if you want to variate that....it still doesn't change the basic meaning of the word. As for the Wiki article on atheism.....it presents some controversy as to use.

Well, what do you mean by disbelief? If you mean disbelief in an affirmative sense, as in "I believe there is no..." or "I believe A is false".

If this is what you mean, you are incorrect. All atheists lack a belief in a god, some atheists have a belief there is no god. It's the broader definition. It's sort of like Christians and Catholics.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"]What? Anarchists do take a stand on government - they want a stateless society. :?ihateaynrand

They don't have a opinion on the government meaning they automatically against government.. Which he is suggesting. That is my point.. That because they don't have a understanding of what government is or what not, they are anarchists.

I AM TALKING ABOUT ALL FORMS Of government as a blanket idea.. Your completely going after something unrelated due to you misinterpreting what I said.

I'm surprised this is still going. It was pointed out very early on that an atheist must play an active role in the so called "lack" of belief in God. If atheism is merely the absence of a belief then agnostics would also be atheists. SolidSnake35

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Okay but that doesn't change the meaning of the word. That's basically just a philosophical digression as to the degrees of atheism. But basically all atheism means is a disbelief in God. Now if you want to variate that....it still doesn't change the basic meaning of the word. As for the Wiki article on atheism.....it presents some controversy as to use.

LJS9502_basic

Well, what do you mean by disbelief? If you mean disbelief in an affirmative sense, as in "I believe there is no..." or "I believe A is false".

If this is what you mean, you are incorrect. All atheists lack a belief in a god, some atheists have a belief there is no god. It's the broader definition. It's sort of like Christians and Catholics.

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

They don't have a opinion on the government meaning they automatically against government.. Which he is suggesting. That is my point.. That because they don't have a understanding of what government is or what not, they are anarchists.

sSubZerOo

I AM TALKING ABOUT ALL FORMS Of government as a blanket idea.. Your completely going after something unrelated due to you misinterpreting what I said.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

Well, what do you mean by disbelief? If you mean disbelief in an affirmative sense, as in "I believe there is no..." or "I believe A is false".

If this is what you mean, you are incorrect. All atheists lack a belief in a god, some atheists have a belief there is no god. It's the broader definition. It's sort of like Christians and Catholics.

SgtKevali

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]I did not coin the term. It does call for the disbelief in a god. And really is lacking a belief so much different to that idea?LJS9502_basic

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]I did not coin the term. It does call for the disbelief in a god. And really is lacking a belief so much different to that idea?LJS9502_basic

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

Nothing odd about that. "I don't know ether way" is what it boils down to.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

ihateaynrand

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

worlock77

Nothing odd about that. "I don't know ether way" is what it boils down to.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"]Don't be ridiculous. To be against government is to have a bad opinion on it.ihateaynrand

I AM TALKING ABOUT ALL FORMS Of government as a blanket idea.. Your completely going after something unrelated due to you misinterpreting what I said.

By having no idea of government automatically makes them anarchist.. Which as ridiculous as claiming they are atheist.. They don't have the faculties to make the decision either way..

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]I did not coin the term. It does call for the disbelief in a god. And really is lacking a belief so much different to that idea?LJS9502_basic

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

Exactly, I'm using atheism in a broad or generic sense, whereas you're using it in a specific sense.

SgtKevali

I like the specific sense more.

But, yeah, that's a good conclusion.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

Yes, if you lack a belief in god, you aren't saying there is no god neccessarily. You could be of the position that maybe a god exists, while still not having a belief in god.

SgtKevali

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

I AM TALKING ABOUT ALL FORMS Of government as a blanket idea.. Your completely going after something unrelated due to you misinterpreting what I said.

sSubZerOo

By having no idea of government automatically makes them anarchist.. Which as ridiculous as claiming they are atheist.. They don't have the faculties to make the decision either way..

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Meh.....it can also be a generic term. Though I find it odd that one would lack a belief while allowing there is a god.LJS9502_basic

Uses of words change.

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Meh.....it can also be a generic term. Though I find it odd that one would lack a belief while allowing there is a god.LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]
Exactly, I'm using atheism in a broad or generic sense, whereas you're using it in a specific sense.

SgtKevali

Uses of words change.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="ihateaynrand"]'Allowing there is a God' =/= 'Being of the position that maybe a God exists'. You should know this by now.ihateaynrand

I think we are all born Nihilists.

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] I'm using it the way it was intended to be used. Whether someone along the line tried to change the meaning....and it's not accepted as the definition then I don't see the argument. Personally, were I an atheist I'd be offended that one promoted that I put no thought into my decision. Buy maybe that's just me....and others don't mind being compared to an infant that cannot grasp the decision.

LJS9502_basic

Uses of words change.

The fact that the ideas of strong and weak atheism exist and are prevalent show that the usage has changed.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

Uses of words change.

SgtKevali

The fact that the ideas of strong and weak atheism exist and are prevalent show that the usage has changed.

[QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Atheism hasn't actually changed just because a few people try to fit the word in other ways. Had the word changed dramatically and conclusively.....the dictionary would notate that. They do adapt to modern language.

LJS9502_basic

The fact that the ideas of strong and weak atheism exist and are prevalent show that the usage has changed.

No.

Weak atheists lack a belief in god, but can have no assertive position on the matter.

Strong atheists essentially believe there is no god. However, strong atheists are a subgroup of weak atheists, which are essentially atheists in general.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="SgtKevali"]

The fact that the ideas of strong and weak atheism exist and are prevalent show that the usage has changed.

SgtKevali

No.

Weak atheists lack a belief in god, but can have no assertive position on the matter.

Strong atheists essentially believe there is no god. However, strong atheists are a subgroup of weak atheists, which are essentially atheists in general.

Are newborns that are being baptized atheists? No, if they were, they wouldn't be baptized at that time.