Trump vs... sports athletes

You see, the problem with playing with narratives - and pandering to concepts that are beyond you fellow Canadian - is that you start reaching, and reaching poorly. The idea of "unarmed" has the innate message of innocence, yet were it so, we wouldn't have (for example) this particular charge in the People's Republic of California; 245 (a)(4).

Now, after reading such charge, let me explain to you the parameters of deadly force; deadly force can be used in self defense when the officer has reasonable cause to believe that there is imminent danger of death or great bodily injury, or in defense of another, or to prevent an escape when the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect has committed (or attempted to commit) a violent felony involving the threat of death or great bodily injury and when the officer has reasonable cause to believe that the felony suspect to be apprehended may cause death or great bodily injury to an officer or another person should the suspect escape.

Can you think of any scenario where an unarmed man could potentially inflict great bodily injury upon someone? Let's think on this hear, and not the obvious beat-down or curb stomping which I've ran into before. For example, person A has person B in a chokehold and is attempting to actively suffocate person B. A responding officer is within every right to use their flashlight, boot, firearm, knife, etc, use whatever means necessary to save person B's life, which may include a flashlight going through person A's face. Should person A perish from such a move, then the officer will have to articulate why that person's headlock was placing person B in imminent danger of death or GBI.

Now, that's just obvious scenarios. What about the appearance of having a weapon? A rather local agency, Fresno PD, was in the spotlight regarding their shooting back in 2016 of Dylan Noble. Both officers were cleared of any wrongdoing because of the perception and body language Dylan showcased was reasonable for officers to use deadly force.

Keyboard warriors can pander to the unarmed mantra, but Constitutional Law and case law will always reign supreme.

That was pretty stupid of Trump. Shouldn't he be more focused on Little Rocket Man?

I don't care much about this whole sportsball thing, but this is pretty much my feeling. Our president seems to have a fundamental misunderstanding of what forms of protest should be acceptable.

None of that disproves anything anyone has said, though and is going off on a tangent. Why did you waste mine and yours time posting that?

Are there situations where going after someone without a gun is okay? Yeah, obviously, no one is disputing that. But it does seem to be happening in the most innocuous situations like the case of Tamir Rice. And cops seem utterly incapable of self-reflection otherwise they wouldn't be suffering an image crisis.

Also, please stop using the phrase "fellow Canadian". The "fellow" in front means that you too are also Canadian but you aren't. You can't even correctly use a simple phrase yet are pretending to lecture on the law lol what a joke.

@perfect_blue:

It's called presenting "context" my fellow Canadian. As in one can understand the multitude of parameters which negate the whole innocent "unarmed" mantra. Indeed, as I clearly showed, it's not a smoking gun to be "innocent" merely because he or she is unarmed. You see, it is why the "use of force" given to us by Constitutional Law outlines what is. People, such as keyboard warriors, love typing away "unarmed" to drive their narrative all the while living in an alternative universe. It actually reminds me of the climate change deniers; strongly attached to one component and holding on for dear life. It's pure comedy. ;)

Now, if you want to drive a narrative using one myopic incident, then drive on fellow civilian Canadian. Educate me on law enforcement, use of force, training, etc. In fact, why not have it as a live debate? What do you say?

I agree with him on this. I don't want this crap in my football. Keep.all teams in locker room until after the anthem

Yes. Unfortunately.

So you're Canadian? Otherwise you sentence makes no sense.

No one respects fake president idiot. Ha ha.

@Chutebox: Sports have throughout history been a Black American vector to bring attention and combat racism. They realize you want them to literally "Sit down shut up and entertain me". They are a lot smarter than you give them credit for...

If you want to ignore black Americans, than stick to Winter Sports. xD

@wizard: Wow, some leaping you took there

He's more or less just defending the status quo when it comes to policing. Doesn't take criticism well and doesn't consider different ideas when it comes to policing.

@HoolaHoopMan:

I'm more than open to different ideas so long as they make sense, or have practical application. Perhaps create a topic on your ideas with respect to improving or changing certain aspects of law enforcement? I can think of a variety of different ways to improve policing - some you may like, others you may not. The problem here though is that we have delved fairly far off topic from the original direction of the thread.

This post, everything is going to crap and people are focused on the most silly crap.

This is more hypocrisy and only shows that in America only certain people are allowed to complain as far as the right is concerned. Also jeez trump is a baby

Some statistics.

You are 110x more likely to die from contaminated food in this country than you are terrorism and you’re 22x as likely to die of a brain eating amoeba.

You are twice as likely to be struck by lightning in this country as you are to be a black person, armed or unarmed, who is shot and killed by police.

Perhaps it is possible that in both cases, the panic over the 'crisis' is manufactured? Maybe we should worry about getting killed by cops and terrorists about half as much as we worry about lightening and amoebas?

Careful stevos default tactic is make comment, refuse to back it up, post silly one liner, and then mod you

So you want to supress how they express themselves? Are you that easily offended?

@Chutebox: It's only "leaping" because you have (and have demonstrated) and incredibly poor understanding of the purpose of protest and historical context. You "muh flaggers" and "muh football" people all think the same.

Nobody here is saying that we don't hold police responsible for misconduct. What I am saying is that to assume police officers should be experts at every situation is not realistic. Training can't prepare you for every possible situation that comes up, and police officers are still humans. I expect them to treat us like human beings, too, but when they are being portrayed as bloodthirsty racists that want to murder black people any chance they can get away with it, they're probably going to be worried about whether or not they are going to come home from their next shift. It also doesn't help when we talk about how we should have better quality police officers, but then we have the biggest critics of the police unwilling to join the force.

Don't tell me about how you can't compare military training to police training. I've been in the Army 18 years, deployed to Iraq three times, and deployed to Afghanistan once. All of the training we did didn't prepare us for every situation we faced, and people that had absolutely no business in the military still made it through training. Chelsea Manning, for example made it through basic training and did a few months in Iraq (never leaving base, her entire time was working inside of a SCIF) before being arrested for giving classified information to Wikileaks.

There are enough similarities between the military and the police (not just the training) that an estimated 19 percent of police officers are veterans. Not all people in the military have been to war, some do four to six years without a single deployment, and some people that deploy sit on a base never to see anything that even resembles combat. Going back to police officers, in some situations, the time they spend trying to verify if someone has a gun in their hand versus a screwdriver may be all it takes for them to be going home in a body bag.

Something similar in both situations is that the quality of training could depend on funding. Are cities that complain that their officers don't get enough training willing to have their taxes raised to pay for that extra training? Are they also willing to have their taxes raised to increase their pay, getting more people who may be a better fit to serve as officers to apply?

No, it's not bullshit, because I lived through it. I had several family members and friends that were told that the cops (especially the white ones) loved to shoot black men and I would be lucky to make it to 21 without being arrested or shot by a cop. Black cops were called Uncle Toms. I was even called an Uncle Tom for joining the military by some people, although I was fortunate enough not to be called that by family and close friends.

The problem started in America with corrupt cops that terrorized minorities in the past long before any of us were born. The problem with that is even though a lot of officers are trying to do the right thing, those people that keep telling their kids that cops are corrupt aren't helping them when they get older and are facing an officer that is a good person. When good officers are fearing for their life because people are targeting them based on what they were told growing up, as well as the words of some of the more extreme factions of BLM, then we have a serious problem.

This goes back to above, with the racist cops that do dirt because of their personal feelings screwing it up for the rest of them. Mark Fuhrman, for example, may have been a huge reason OJ Simpson is looking at being a free man next month instead of being locked up in a California prison, if not already executed by now. The officers that beat Rodney King were a huge help as well, since how could Marcia Clark ask a jury full of minorities to convict a black man that was arrested by the same police department that almost beat another black man to death?

Racist cops giving the rest of the force a bad name is the reason why minorities in poor areas don't trust the police. If we can keep those racist cops out of the force, then maybe in a few years we can build the trust, and not have minorities worried about being shot during a traffic stop, or officers worried about being shot because they pulled someone over. But that also requires minorities to stop telling their kids that the cops are out to get them, and telling their family and friends that only Uncle Toms join the force, which ends up causing the majority of officers in their neighborhoods to be white officers that live on the other side of town.

@Mercenary848: Lol I don't give a shit. I get that they want to protest for their cause and that's fine. I just think the way they are doing it is stupid

@wizard: Literally nothing you said is true bud. Good luck to ya

Maybe trump shouldn't have opened his big mouth and this protest wouldn't have happened.

I don't like that the president thinks he can dictate what a private business can/should do with their employees.

@LJS9502_basic: I'm mainly referring to the whole kneeling/sitting thing.

I get that players are upset with what he said.

@Chutebox: Oh? Sports haven't historically been a way to protest injustice? Where did you get your history degree? Good luck to you as well, psychosis is a condition that should rapidly be medicated.

@wizard: Nothing you said about me is true. Come on, man. I was obviously not talking about history...

Yeah and as a vet I'd never do that myself but still serving the country should mean you understand that people have a right to express themselves. Unless the NFL tells them as employees they can't do it then fans should stop whining.

I love how Trump is backpedaling with his tweets while trying to defend himself at the same time for his asinine statement.

There's a reason why presidents used to never give their opinion on wedge issues outside of the oval office.

What's the idiot doing now?

Do you realize how dense you come off in most of your posts? You are one of the few users I feel is just incapable of thinking on a higher level. What is a smart way to protest? This is peaceful, doesn't disrupt anyone's lives, and it points out the conformists like you who only worry about their own convenience.

@Mercenary848: Then stop replying to my posts dumbass.

I couldn't give two shits about your opinion of me.

@Gaming-Planet: What he saying?

@LJS9502_basic: @Chutebox:

The tweet contradicts itself.

Context: http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20800784/nfl-players-coaches-owners-kneel-lock-arms-national-anthem

@Gaming-Planet: Ah lol. Thanks bud

Here's the thing, one of my best friends is a cop and another family friend is a police chief for a major metro area. Your rhetoric is nothing like theirs which is a bit alien to me. The US policing system lacks a lot of standards that other 1st world nations have and any time a situation arises the blame is quickly placed on other parties. What people are fed up with is accountability.

The police aren't supposed to be an occupying force. They're supposed to be a part of the community and in many ways (depressingly) they're seen as a countering presence to it. I'm not saying that I have all the answers, I can only say that the US doesn't seem to have the best applications of it given the results. If we can all agree that the present situation isn't working then we can probably start working on improving the situation.

You are showing an in-congruence in your words and actions. If you really did not care about my opinion then you would have ignored me, instead of posting an outburst. I feel like to a certain degree you realize that you lack a certain level of critical thinking skills to tackle human issues in a rational manner. Other then your boorish analysis that "oh this issue does not affect me, so it must be stupid; and disrupts FOOTBALL", I feel like you can not come to any conclusions about reality outside of your narrow minded view. I pity anyone who goes through life with that type of infantile egocentric interpretation of reality.

I'll add one more to the counter of "how many posts will Stevo make while still not defending or explaining his first post. Keep it up, you may hit a record here.

He actually explained multiple scenarios backed by years of experience and exposure. You just keep saying the same vague shit over and over to make yourself feel better.

You liberal pussies make it too easy sometimes.

also.

Anyone see Josh Norman's interview? Haha

Lol he never responded to what I was talking about, but of course all you know how to do is insult. I know it is tough for you to comprehend a lot of things so I'll give you a break. Just try harder next time.

So it's perfectly alright when white supremacists parade around with Nazi flags, spew vile, hateful rhetoric and run over bystanders, and that we shouldn't judge them since they're misunderstood and "very fine people."

But black athletes kneeling during the national anthem to protest the injustices that still plague black people are "sons of bitches" and should lose their jobs and be booed.

More proof that Trump is living, breathing enema.

Oh whatever. You're just mad your sportsball team sucks and won't make be making it to the Superfinals this year.

Not true! My team does really well in the fifth quarter especially on those 2 meter drives. I see big things for the Oakland-Wait-They're-LA-No-Now-They're-Oakland-Again-Nope-They're-Las-Vegas-Soon-Shit-Really?!?! Raiders this year! GO SPORTSBALL SPORTS TEAM! To the superfinals then to King Cheetos's house in Washington.

Lol, this just makes the left look incredibly anti-American to a lot of people.

Even funnier:

@Nick3306: N64 is his cheerleader always assuming he provided proof when he hasn't.

@Nick3306: Didn’t you after him for saying “try harder”?

shut the ---- up and RESPECT AMERICA!11212!!!!!!

as an aside. if people spent 1% the effort they do bitching about people protesting on actually trying to make the country better, there would be little need left for people to protest.

How about this.

Police can no longer have semi-autos, revolvers only. What does this do? It forces them to learn how to aim and only use bullets when necessary. If we look at many studies and reports done, police shoot worse than your average redneck. This would also change these situations where we see an unarmed citizen being shot 3 times after a cop fires an entire clip at them.... or if theres multiple cops, someone shot 8 times with 5 police dumping entire clips. .... its almost as if they have no clue how to properly aim and fire.... as if theyre gang bangers using the point and click click click method.

I feel like this could help in so many situations, a cop knowing they have limited bullets might make them think twice about murdering unarmed or undeserving citizens.

Out of touch millionaires and billionaires.