US agents fire tear gas at southern border

Let them in and follow them? lol good luck with that, they don't even have social security numbers. *UNDOCUMENTED*

Companies get heavily fined and charged for paying/hiring illegals, its tax fraud. We do punish these companies when they are caught, this isn't new.

The damage done is you have tons of undocumented people leeching off our economy and sending that money out of the country, you also end up devaluing labor for people who are American by lowering wages. You also take a risk at letting in people who have done serious crimes, murderers, rapists, and pedophiles because you did not properly vet them. Same as how people who murder in america try to leave the country, again this is nothing new. Then you figure in healthcare, welfare, social services, and education for them.. Americans loose, no gains. The only people who benefit from illegals are the ones who want super cheap labor.

You agree they should be deported, but you think this is not the best way to handle it. So what is the best way in your opinion, amnesty?

@tryit: What purpose does it serve to continually copy multiple replies other than laziness? You think people read everything copied over and over again? No, they skip everything you write and won’t be bothered to read anything meaning your post was irrelevant.

Why do I need a tablet when my phone does everything it does but is more portable?

yawn....NFG

or for the love of god.

they are coming over here in a massive invasion level riot hord to do what EXACTLY?

to be hired by a bunch of Americans willing to pay money under the table. they going to walk to these shady places?

find the fuckers who are doing that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

simple

now...yes people who are not supposed to be here legally should be removed from here. but my question to you is this. How to do that exactly? I dont know or give a shit frankly. What I am intrested in is understanding what the problem ACTUALLY is, once that is clearly defined i can come up with a solution that solves the problem better then what is happening now. i dont give a **** about humans or humanity, so lets get that clear. I am intrested in very simply and concretely, cause and effect. what is the problem, what is the best solution. PEROID.

A. what is the exact and specific material problem? (what that means is what is the actual damange being done...measurable damage)

B. Then let me suggest a solution to that material problem.

It's like you just learned what words and ideas are and just put random stuff down.

lol I forgot i was talking to Tryit, I should have known his responses would just dissolve into dribble. I laid out the problem but he doesn't think its specific enough, I don't know what hes talking about at this point or know what he wants. I'm done

dont give up so easily its really not complicated.

A. identify the actual problem

B. identify the solution

C. Set aside ones childish view on fairness and just focus on materially what the problem is, not what is or is not fair.

Examples of NOT an 'actual problem' but more of child like concerns

A. my ego is hurt

B. I am afraid but I dont know why

C. It doesnt seem fair

D. They shouldnt be here

Examples of ACTUAL problems

A. They are in mass numbers physically attacking people

B. They are in large numbers spending a great deal of tax payer dollars

So what is the ACTUAL problem?

Trolling got old man.

@n64dd: "i dont give a **** about humans or humanity" - TryIt

its funny how emotional and easy to give up people on the right become.

then when they cant play hard ball they just cower in a corner with their friends and throw spit balls and complain about how unfair life is.

I KNOW my approach is right...you just need to answer the questions

If i understand the ACTUAL problem i feel confident I can find a better solution then what is being practiced now, by 'better' I dont mean 'more fair' I mean more likely to get the results you want with less effort.

Honestly, nobody knows what you're talking about.

It got old.

@nintendoboy16:

At least they're not firing live ammunition rounds at people. Still despite all this, more will come along down the line and to be frank, I'm glad the caravan came in the Trump era too. It's something that Trump needs to face.

You would have had to eliminate a bunch of people in the north as well. I guess you could have started with the people who started Unions.

you sound borderline autistic, if you are, I mean no offense seriously. You may just be trolling... im not sure

im sorry but this conversation is going no where bud.

the thing is I have found the best way to change something is to remove the motivation.

if the reason they are coming here in the first place is addressed then they will not come here anyway

So make the USA worse than Mexico...

who is hiring them? where do they get the money? who is giving them free shit?

remove that, then coming here is about as attractive as being a homeless person on the streets

see?

lol. I have no ego really so all that drivel is meaningless to me.

but if you want to talk about why do they come here in the first place I would be excited to do that if you are not afraid to do so

Instead of making the perfect government, why don't we just make it illegal for them to come here and enforce the laws in place?

because its easier to remove the motivation then it is to try to prevent people from coming here for reasons that we are enabling in the first place!

its like literally going to the candy store, picking up the candy, placing it outside and saying 'this is for you' 'but i will stop you if you try and come and get it'

Tryit doesn't seem to understand its impossible to ban ALL undocumented labor, its already illegal but its still going to happen, when we catch them we will punish them. its like banning murder, yeah its illegal but it still happens.

Makes more sense to just follow our immigration laws and lessen the problem that way. The alternative is just letting them all in, which fixes nothing but makes the problem worse.

you can speak to me directly, that kind of stuff really humors me when people try it :)

here is an undeniable fact.

by FAR media, people and the Right specifically spend Exponentially more time focused on the people coming here and almost ZERO time talking about the people who hire them...nearly no word at all whatsoever.

you will never solve any 'problem' of a mass scale 100% solid anymore then your home will never in a billion years ever have leaks. it will happen, but what do you focus on? the people, but ignore the people hiring? that is stupid

Go after the people who hire, and enforce the law.

Agreed?

@jeezers:

"Makes more sense to just follow our immigration laws and lessen the problem that way. The alternative is just letting them all in, which fixes nothing but makes the problem worse."

- So basically, you're proposing that we just do the same as always. Some will follow it and others won't.

yes!

if these people coming here is an actual measurable problem.

then yes...I am all for focusing most of the energy on the motivation which in this case would be the people who hire them.

However...if immigration is not a REAL problem then lets step back.

I am from Houston and I can say that in that city immigration does not appear to be a problem, in fact, it appears to be a boom to economy much like how the cheap labor of slavery was for the south.

AND focusing on the companies that hire them makes us look more responsible in the world image. it makes it look like we are willing to fix our own house before starting to do very unpopular things instead

People are always going to try to break the law, we cant change that, but we can enforce immigration laws better. Increase border security, make sure there are no incentives money wise by the government, deny them all assistance, food, housing, welfare, none of it. Increase penalties for hiring illegal aliens. We can do that. The laws aren't as bad as people think, it just looks bad because we have done a shit job enforcing them. It gets tricky though, especially with things like sanctuary cities. I am glad we are not doing catch and release any more, that was a joke.

@jeezers:

The system wouldn't fail time and time again if it weren't so obviously broken. That's why we need to revamp it. Even if you enforce the law as it already stands, it will always come down to who wants to enforce it and who doesn't. And that's where it goes to shit. You can't keep doing the same thing and expect different results.

And that's where Trump dropped the ball. Rather than making things better, he chose to just let the broken system run as it is and pretend that it would all work out.

the better approach in most problems is to remove the motivation.

you dont put candy outside your house and then expect raccons to not show up.

you dont bring heroin to a heroin addiction meeting.

the challenge however, is that as it turns out, there really isnt a lot of white people who want to pick strawberries

@tryit:

"the challenge however, is that as it turns out, there really isnt a lot of white people who want to pick strawberries"

- And that's where the plan falls flat on its face. If we're too successful scaring them away then those companies will have a hard time finding more workers of the same skill level.

@nepu7supastar7: Trump wants a wall, we will see if he can get it, will be tough since the democrats now have the house. President cant do much in regards to making a new system, thats congress's job. I know you feel like he dropped the ball I partially agree with you. Even though he hasn't fixed the immigration crisis, hes done more than any other president in my lifetime in regards too immigration, at least trump acknowledges its a problem and is pushing for something, whether your against or for a wall or stronger borders. At least hes talking about it, Clinton Bush and Obama just sat around with thumbs up their ass. Trump cant write new laws anyway, that's not the presidents job, its in congress's hands. so lets see what the democrats and republicans can come to an agreement on, I'm willing to bet nothing lol

the solution (I think) is

1. to become more conscious of the true cost of items. Can I get cheaper clothes if I have slave labor? likely but do I really need cheaper clothes?

2. understanding that we are in a world market, we compete globally, we can not compete by hiding in the sand saying 'go away I dont want your cheap labor I want to pay more for less'

ignoring these realities and not trying to even address the balance is the wrong direction.

but as it turns out, slave wage workers who are willing to come here on their own actually helps our economy.

@tryit:

Do you realize how ignorant you sound assuming just because someone is an illegal alien that they just pick strawberries, its actually insulting and racist. These illegals aren't brain dead to the point where they have to be field pickers. They do many jobs not just pick crops, that's ignorant as shit. The biggest influx of illegals in any field of work is with contractors which is the biggest industry in the country. It could be any job with physical labor, so quit the strawberry picking bullshit you bigot.

I dont give a **** if its racist or sounds racist. I am a racist so lets get that settled right now.

and yes...most of the immigrants coming from mexico are doing the equivalent of strawberry picking, dont be naive and delusional.

oh and i already know I am stupid and ignorant so no need to keep reminding me, just focus on the subject

I think at this point we can see the lack of critical thinking on the left. They don't care about the issues any more they just care that "Orange man bad" because the media told them so. From there nothing is off the table.

Breaking the law. Laws are fascist.

The country exercising it's national sovereignty by protecting it's borders. Nations and borders are fascist.

They are so unhinged and anti-american at this point, that i'm not sure the US will ever be the same.

At this point they can be convinced of just about anything, by saying three words"Orange man, bad."

Also don't forget Obama's border patrol used tear gas on the border in 2013 and I didn't hear or see any outcry. We have to protect our borders at all cost and people must enter this country legally. If these people were being peaceful then why is Mexico sending over 100 of them back for throwing rocks and breaking the law?

I can care less if these immigrants come into the country as long as they do it legally. Also if we let them storm the border and enter the country where the heck are they going to go, stay, live, and find work?

You said earlier that you are educated.

Nope I answered that question. You refused to answer mine.

Sad to see when brown people frighten Trumpettes but when white supremacists go on killing rampages, Jacanuk is okay with it.

not well educated.

i dont think I did. but glad to see you are wasting your time, energy and focus on me instead of better things :)

oh and by the way, 'educated' and 'intelligence' is not the same thing

Your story has been disproven. I wouldn't expect a conservative to have the brainpower necessary to understand that, but still.

Your question has already been answered. They tried to enter this country legally, but the Trump administration closed the border crossings where they were supposed to present themselves. Further, under U.S. asylum law, it doesn't matter where you enter or how you enter. Asylum claims are supposed to disregard point of entry in their consideration of applicants. So stop pretending this is all about holding to the letter of the law and just admit you don't want brown people in the country.

So anybody could claim asylum and just come in.

Yes. Problem?

Well if you want to be technical. They must seek asylum in the first country that offers it to them. Mexico offered asylum to all of them which they refused. You do not get to asylum shop the country you want, but you liberals tend to forget simple laws. Also Trump only closed the border for a few hours when they started acting up. That is the correct procedure to do when this happens. I didn't see you all complain when Obama tear gassed people on the border in 2013 so please stop already!

Also storming the border is not the way to you seek asylum. Throwing rocks and bottles at agents is another way you do not seek asylum. Remember Mexico arrested over 60 of these people for doing this so they are already breaking laws. So please stop pretending you know anything about asylum law and again quit using the racist shtick it is getting old. People like you always use this argument when you do not have any good points. Creating false narratives to prove points.

I have already said if these people do it in the correct manner I am more then happy for them to come to America.

Mexico has problems. What if you need asylum from Mexico?

Well by asylum laws you must take the first place that offers it to you. Then if you still have issues then you can seek asylum somewhere else, but you must become a resident first. Mexico is not in the shape that allows their population to ask for asylum so stop already. Not saying it is the perfect place to live, but come on man it is a vacation spot for many people.

No you can't just say I need asylum and it be granted. My god you people are idiots!

Wrong again. I'm sensing a pattern here.

They do not have to seek asylum in the first country that offers it to them. The country in which they are applying CAN consider whether or not they can reasonably be accepted for asylum in a country that has offered it to them. One of the conditions, though, is that they have to have a reasonable guarantee of safety and that the first country is able to host them in humane conditions, neither of which is the case with Mexico. Also, this is a provision of international law and in no way does Mexico offering asylum have any bearing on their ability to seek asylum in the U.S. under U.S. law.

As I've already stated multiple times, the Trump administration was closing border crossings and turning away migrants who presented themselves at border crossings long before they rushed the border.

Admit it, you don't care about whether the process adheres to the letter of the law, you don't want brown people in the country.

@LJS9502_basic: You said they should " deal with them" be more specific please.

Ironic considering what you said is not factual. You can just ask for asylum and then go through the procedure. But you don't have to prove it first.