Adrian Chmielarz destroys Polygon's editor

so if it turns out there were people of color because of slaves...wouldn't the world (interwebs) fucking explode if they put black slaves into the game

Well I guess, but I think if your last impression of "SJW" was the mentioned article then you would of course be upset with them.

But pretty much anyone who uses the internet frequently is going to be in their own bubble, it's profitable for google, facebook, twitter, etc.

@lostrib: Highly likely. If these devs had made the same game based on Southern Europe around the same-ish time period (though for the full effect it would need to be from the 1500's onward) that's exactly what you'd see. Black slaves, asian "brides" (brought as slaves of course, mostly from Japan if I recall correctly) and filthy rich merchants, slave traders and nobility.

But what about the Elves, Dwarves, trolls and monsters and their timelines of existence involving historical accuracy?

All part of Norse/Slavic mythology and as much a reality to people of the time as the Christian-Judeo beliefs were to those that followed them. You need only see parts of Iceland or Ireland still where people refuse to build roads or cut down trees so as not offend fairies or trolls to know that they were very real to people.

Yup. In fact there was a pretty cool indie-ish movie a few years ago called Troll Hunter based on the same mythology ( as far as I can tell). Go watch it dudes, it's cool! :)

@Desmonic: Yea that "movie" was boss. :) (was on netflix so no excuses people!)

@-God-: omg we finally agree on something!

"Ivan Drago is cliche because he is a boxer" was basically an assertion you made, i just provided an obvious example that contradicts it (Every important character in those films is a boxer).

If you can explain how, in your opinion, the troll relates to Russia other than drinking vodka - i'm all ears.

Also, Drago is a character in an Amercan cold war era movie. This game is made by Poles. You know, those fellas who are about as much into vodka as Russians.

The whole Witcher universe is based on slavic culture, something also shared by both.

Everyone drinks vodka in that universe.

I mean, even the most ultra-hipster SJW victim-complexed Russians couldn't draw the line between the troll and supposed prejudice against Russians that you did.

Think about that for a minute or twenty.

Russia is a place where Witcher is bigger deal than fucking Star Wars.

Understanding that, CDPR actually handles Russian localization for those games in-house, and it's basically the best way to play them after the original, Polish VO.

But who am i kidding, of course they'll do anything to spite their biggest fanbase outside of Poland, right?

Interesting stuff for sure.

@Desmonic: It was a weird mythological Jurassic Park in it's way. Worth a watch certainly.

The ogre is Russian. Your argument doesn't make much sense.

The ogre (Russian), is loud, stupid and obsessed with Vodka. The American character (Gerald), is a handsome man who has sex with many beautiful woman saving the world as the aspirational anti-hero.

Much of Europe hates Russia, this is fact. Poland specifically moves away from them over here, where it's safer. Making Russia the bad guy or fool, perpetuates Americanized conditioning.

@WilliamRLBaker: Good thing though William since this whole saga started more and more are ridiculing this sort of nonsense. They are aware of it, unafraid, and even boisterous about attacking the sort of willful ignorance we are seeing from polygon and kotaku. People aren't getting away with it any more.

The first two can be more easily attributed to Americans.

Since there's no moonshine, they have to make do with local beverage, vodka.

Troll is American confirmed.

You're saying Americans are sterile mutants who were sold off to a cult by their parents, that are looked down upon by everyone surrounding them their whole life?

Woah there.

@R10nu said:

@uninspiredcup said:

@R10nu said:

If you can explain how, in your opinion, the troll relates to Russia other than drinking vodka - i'm all ears.

The ogre is Russian. Your argument doesn't make much sense.

The ogre (Russian), is loud, stupid and obsessed with Vodka.

The first two can be more easily attributed to Americans.

Since there's no moonshine, they have to make do with local beverage, vodka.

Troll is American confirmed.

@uninspiredcup said:

The American character (Gerald)

You're saying Americans are sterile mutants who were sold off to a cult by their parents, that are looked down upon by everyone surrounding them?

Woah there.

Another thing that is annoying, as well as deeply offensive is making the dwarf characters Scottish. Not only is it insulting towards Scottish people, it's insulting to Dwarfs, implying they are Scottish. Many Dwarfs, such as Peter Dinklage, are actually American.

For the most part this is why I never bothered to sign up to gaf. That entire forum over there is a circle jerk with oversensitive mods.

Nevertheless, Neogaf can do what they want and I don't want to sign up there and i can ridicule them so that's that.

I had no idea they were like that over there. All I've ever heard from gamers here was how "great" that place was. Now I'm glad I never bothered trying to get in to a place like that.

You've used the term "Social Justice Warrior", so now I have to assume you're a #gamergate proponent, aka, a low-life, misogynistic POS.

Never liked using the term "SJW" or what have you. I don't care about Gamergate or whoever is anti-gamergate. Just seems people are bored, and need something to talk about. You see it in Games Discussion, nothing ever happens. Just a bunch of people posting tweets and 15 minute long videos. Not interested.

I'm just a bit annoyed by how political stuff gets brought up all the time now. It wasn't like this a couple of years ago. I blame social media. Twitter. I like Twitter, but it has given everyone a voice, for better or worse. Just too much drama in my video games. I don't mind people arguing about stuff. They're free to, but jeez, it's gone a bit of the deep end, hasn't it? Just chill out. Stop getting offended over nothing. Have a beer, a smoke, a .. whatever helps you relax, and stop pissing about on Twitter.

As far as that article goes, yeah, Arthur got smacked. Good read.

Social Justice Warrior might be the dumbest fucking "insult term" ever created and/or popularized by the internet. How is warrioring in favour of social justice an insult? Jackasses

Its like choosing to call people that misdirect their anger regarding race issues "Anti-Racism Crusaders"...... THATS A POSITIVE NAME AND SOMETHING WE ALL SHOULD BE, you stupid motherfuckers!

EDIT crap wrong thread lol

Welcome to System Wars, where almost every term is misused or perverted to mean something different than intended. I hate the term "weaboo" because here it's used to insult anyone who like anything Japanese instead of someone who only likes Japanese products while shitting on anything that isn't.

There's about a million other terms that are ill used here too. You just have to put on your stupid hat when walking through the SW door.

@Bigboi500: :P

Love that gif. :P One of my favorite Simpsons episodes too.

You need to belong to GamerGate to believe that SJWs are idiots?

"Social Justice Warrior" is dog-whistle term recently popularized and co-opted by #gamergate.

The plot of The Witcher basically tells of a portal to another world that the people crossed into.

This world is the World of The Witcher.

So that is how normal humans got mixed in with Elves, Dwarves and other creatures.

Could you imagine the Brouhaha that would kick up. You'd need a very comfy chair and a very large bucket of pop corn for that one.

Not to derail the topic but I have seen some people get offended by the term "SJW," or being called a "SJW." Is it a stupid insult? Yes. But are people offended by it? Yes.

So yeah, more like: Welcome to the Internet.

Personally I always thought SJW was a very nice way to call someone.

I mean we're talking about people who are fighting for social justice! How noble! Social Justice Warriors! I don't see how it can be taken as an insult, ignoring the attributed meaning it has on the internet.

When people are talking about sjws they usually mean the authoritative left. The type of people that are so hyper progressive to the point where they become bigoted themselves

There is nothing wrong with social justice, It is something that is needed. but the people who swear by it up and down tend to be the loudest

Agreed somewhat. I mainly just point to Johnathan McIntosh's tweets as an example. That guy has issues.

I grew to dislike these radical leftists almost as much as social conservatives, (Hypocrisy, stuck in a bubble, mob mentality, and my favorite, "Listen and Believe" LOL).

I'm also glad I don't have twitter.

@Seabas989: they'd probably just put you on the block list, gotta make sure the echochamber doesn't have any cracks right?

True. :P

Plus they would call me a conservative, right winger that hates diversity lol.

I believe that polygon post clickbait reviews now. They create controversy by pushing on the GamerGate button and this attracts both sides of the argument.

@Seabas989: hell you could be black, trans, or any type of minority or marginalized group and they'd still talk over you like they know better

When will SJW's start protesting against Taco Bell or Chipotle as they portrait Mexican's only eat taco's and burritos?

I find this one pretty disturbing too, considering the guy I heard for the first time got the Witcher 3 review

I don't know a lot about the witcher series, but depending on the time period of the witcher 3 it's possible to add other races to the game that were present during the time period the game took place in while still not getting out of the context of the game and the books it was inspired from, but I don't think it matters much. I do take issue with that one statement Adrian said in his piece where he mentioned that reviews like that Polygon review are poisonous to the gaming industry.I thought that statement was hyperbolic. I don't think this review has any effect on the gaming industry. Some of the controversial stuff mentioned in the review may turn a small amount of potential witcher 3 buyers away, but it won't have any effect on the actual gaming industry.He didn't need to write that in that article.

The hypocrisy in Arthur Gies is strong. Member of Suicide Girls that was angry with the way Bayonetta was portrayed. Now angry with misogyny in The Witcher 3, a game where witches rule the world.

@IgGy621985 said:

I find this one pretty disturbing too, considering the guy I heard for the first time got the Witcher 3 review

I think he was being sarcastic?

He's a complete idiot. His twitter just has him ranting on and on about politics in video games and people who criticize gamergate.

I'm just going to guess that he takes offense because CDprojekt and his team are from Poland. He's criticizing a review for a game he hasn't even played. If this were any other game, then he'd probably just say something stupid on twitter and move on.

@kaealy: I sincerely hope.

The time period itself, if translated into our own, seems to be up to the 1400's..maybe 1500's (mind you that the games have some more modern weapons and devices thrown into the mix as part of the fantasy).

In any case, people of different colour in Northern/Central Europe were not a common thing until recently (and by recently I mean the past 2 centuries at best). Those countries were never invaded by the Moors like most of Southern Europe and repealed the Mongols and it's traces somewhat successfully (as in, they didn't leave massive influences on those lands like the Roman Empire did for example).

That's what most people seem to miss. Yes, in Southern Europe people of different colour (not necessarily black, mostly brown) were somewhat common depending on which country you were (Portugal, Spain, Italy, Greece and a few more). They were not however representative populations and were true minorities. In Portugal the majority of the descendants of the Moorish invasions ended up mixing with the local population and after a century or two their most prominent feature - the brown skin- had vanished. Despite all that, like I said in another post, when the explorers made contact with many African tribes they were still "shocked" by their black colour.

Northern/Central Europe? At best you had some decent populations of Jewish people. And the ones residing over Europe (which had been there for some time by the 1400's-1500's) were white. So they weren't treated as people of different colour but as people of different religion (which in those days wasn't all that much better, unless you had economical power, which they did). You also had nomadic people like the Romaji, but as far as I'm aware they didn't venture much into to the North.

So in the actual real world inspiration for the series, little to no people of colour makes sense. If the series was based on Southern Europe this criticism would be completely valid. The "but it's fantasy!" argument would make sense if the series wasn't so grounded in our own reality (the morality, the religious/political/economical issues, the allegories depicting racism and bigotry, etc). For example, Dragon Age manages to pull it off because it rarely feels as anything in it fits our own reality (granted I'm just starting Inquisition).

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As for the rest of the post, I honestly don't care. As I've said I refuse to give Polygon any clicks (and mostly because of issues like these). If they want to be on the frontline of these discussions (which I think are a healthy thing if done correctly) they need to first learn how to discuss. Hyperbole is not an argument. Sensationalism is not an argument. Presenting issues without any facts behind them is not an argument. Having a one sided view on X topic with no "fair" chance of rebuttal is not a discussion. It's blatant clickbait which I refuse to support.

Sorry for the long post btw :P

Can we please send this #gamergate thread back to the GGD sticky thread where it belongs? This topic has nothing to do with System Wars.