And some people thought Deus Ex:HR was going to be "consolized"

If something is on a console and happens to not be as good as before, its "consolized". Of course Half-Life 2, Bioshock and Oblivion are completely ignored so that hermits can bring up BC2 and CoD over and over again, ironically CoD4 was on all consoles and was the best of the franchise and yet they also ignore that in favor of bringing up MW2. MAG ( a PS3 exclusive title with 256 gamers and tactical squad elements) is also ignored so that BF2 can be brought up over and over.

Damn double standards. FYI, I love PC gaming but I hate hypocrisy.

If something is on a console and happens to not be as good as before, its "consolized". Of course Half-Life 2, Bioshock and Oblivion are completely ignored so that hermits can bring up BC2 and CoD over and over again

SPYDER0416

Consolized just means loosing PC specific traits. It doesn't always mean the game is bad because of it. Prime example of consolization is RainbowSix. When it was PC franchise it was insanely deep, very realistic arcade shooter. THen the series got consolized and turned into simple arcade shooter without any signs of realism or tactical depth. But this just makes Vegas a bad Rainbow Six game, this doesn't change the fact that it's a great game when judged on it's own merits.

Similiar things happened to PC only franchises before (altough it was much rarer) and despita lack of consoles involvement it was still hated byy old fans. Best example: Lords of the Realm 3, beautiful, fun and extremely original title on it's own, but extremely dumbed down compared to previous games.

It's silly to blame fans though, they were fans of a certain series for a reason, so it's natural they don't like it when they are getting something completely different.

I highly doubt this game will be anything like the first. There is no way they are going to make another game like Deus Ex for consoles. It wouldn't sell. Its too hard, too complicated and requires you to actually think on your toes. It may be more complicated than most shooters out there right now, but I doubt anything about it is "emergent" like the first one. I think the developer is doing a very good job at giving us the illusion that it is like the first.

I highly doubt this game will be anything like the first. There is no way they are going to make another game like Deus Ex for consoles. It wouldn't sell. Its too hard, too complicated and requires you to actually think on your toes. It may be more complicated than most shooters out there right now, but I doubt anything about it is "emergent" like the first one. I think the developer is doing a very good job at giving us the illusion that it is like the first.

foxhound_fox

It looks to be a good game in its own right, however I am really not sure about certain angles the developers are approaching it.

Seriously 'lots of cutscenes' to give the game narrative structure? Come on guys, do gamers need to be a spoonfed 'cinematic' onscreen drama bastardised from film in Deus Ex?

I haven't played the original Deus Ex games but I'm still interested in Human Revolution. Are the older games any good? Do they still hold up today or have they aged badly? And how is Deus Ex 2 : Invisible Storm?

I haven't played the original Deus Ex games but I'm still interested in Human Revolution. Are the older games any good? Do they still hold up today or have they aged badly? And how is Deus Ex 2 : Invisible Storm?

fend_oblivion

"...and they called it a mine... A MINE!"

[QUOTE="fend_oblivion"]

I haven't played the original Deus Ex games but I'm still interested in Human Revolution. Are the older games any good? Do they still hold up today or have they aged badly? And how is Deus Ex 2 : Invisible Storm?

Dahaka-UK

lol True that.

But would I enjoy it if the above didn't apply to me?

[QUOTE="edinsftw"]

looks like it has the art style of fear

7ojistix

I get a Blade Runner (movie) vibe from it.

Also, could the PC version be the new graphics kind? 'Cause damn it looks pretty damn slick.

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"][QUOTE="fend_oblivion"]

I haven't played the original Deus Ex games but I'm still interested in Human Revolution. Are the older games any good? Do they still hold up today or have they aged badly? And how is Deus Ex 2 : Invisible Storm?

fend_oblivion

lol True that.

But would I enjoy it if the above didn't apply to me?

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"][QUOTE="fend_oblivion"]

I haven't played the original Deus Ex games but I'm still interested in Human Revolution. Are the older games any good? Do they still hold up today or have they aged badly? And how is Deus Ex 2 : Invisible Storm?

fend_oblivion

lol True that.

But would I enjoy it if the above didn't apply to me?

To be honest I wish it were a bit more consolized.

There's far too many menus and options to go through it seems and now the HUD looks a bit intrusive imo whereas it looked almost non-existent in previous videos and I really liked that.

[QUOTE="NaveedLife"]

[QUOTE="loadedboon"]

Like I said it is made with consoles in mind so I don't need to wait to know how the game will turn out.

loadedboon

Yeah consoles never have deep gameplay or anything good on them :roll:.

Name me one console game with deep and complexgameplay?

[QUOTE="loadedboon"]

[QUOTE="NaveedLife"]

Yeah consoles never have deep gameplay or anything good on them :roll:.

Supabul

Name me one console game with deep and complexgameplay?

[QUOTE="Supabul"][QUOTE="loadedboon"]

Name me one console game with deep and complexgameplay?

GeneralShowzer

To be honest I wish it were a bit more consolized.

There's far too many menus and options to go through it seems and now the HUD looks a bit intrusive imo whereas it looked almost non-existent in previous videos and I really liked that.

amaneuvering

[QUOTE="amaneuvering"]

To be honest I wish it were a bit more consolized.

There's far too many menus and options to go through it seems and now the HUD looks a bit intrusive imo whereas it looked almost non-existent in previous videos and I really liked that.

Supabul

[QUOTE="Supabul"][QUOTE="amaneuvering"]

To be honest I wish it were a bit more consolized.

There's far too many menus and options to go through it seems and now the HUD looks a bit intrusive imo whereas it looked almost non-existent in previous videos and I really liked that.

Dahaka-UK

.

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"][QUOTE="Supabul"] Wait so it menus that make PC games deep and complexSupabul

.

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"][QUOTE="Supabul"] Wait so it menus that make PC games deep and complexSupabul

.

[QUOTE="Supabul"]

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"] There are many examples of games being toned down so consolites can get a more cinamatic experience aka go watch a movie. It's not simply a case of oh keyboard and mouse is highly custimizable! Games themselves lose freedom, depth, content and challenge so the consolites get their 5 hour eye candy. Though I'm not going to say this issue is exclusive to PC games only. Games in general get screwed over because the masses have lower standards

.Dahaka-UK

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"][QUOTE="Supabul"] So longer games with bad graphcs hard difficulty and loads of menus make PC gaming deep and complex

Supabul

Demons Souls is deep and complex because ?

Complex games make PC gaming more complex. Consoles have limited control and the console audienceapparently can't handle anything more complex than "press X for something awesome to happen"

These are only some of the ones I've played. And I'm not really a hardcore gamer.

I still say it is consolized. The fact that the classic medkits are missing says something (and if they were in there, they would be in such abundance you could sink 50 aircraft carriers with the amount you see in one level).ExESGO

People say stuff like this.

But in Deus Ex 1 you can quicksave every minute, and reload your game if things go wrong and you take too much damage.

How is that in ANY way different to pulling back and waiting for health to regen?

If anything quicksaving and loading seems like a much noobier thing than regenerating health.

Yes the game is an utter masterpiece if you look past the graphics.Dahaka-UK

I'm sure you will.Rockman999

What about Deus Ex 2?

[QUOTE="Dahaka-UK"]

Yes the game is an utter masterpiece if you look past the graphics.fend_oblivion

What about Deus Ex 2?

So now that I've proven untainted PC games are more complex you make sarcastic comments? As i told you this are only games I've played, it doesn't even scratch the surface. I haven't played EvE online or Hearts of Iron 3, or any simulation games.GeneralShowzer

don't get me started on Europa Universalis or Hearts of Iron, I remember finishing up all the tutorials and not know how the hell should I play the games

when I think deep and complex PC games, I think Hearts of iron and Europa Universalis

[QUOTE="fend_oblivion"]

What about Deus Ex 2?

GeneralShowzer

I disagree, Deus Ex 2 was a great game in it's own right imo, it scored an 8 on gamespot and it's the score it deserves imo

[QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"]

when I think deep and complex PC games, I think Hearts of iron and Europa Universalis

[QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"][QUOTE="fend_oblivion"]

What about Deus Ex 2?

ohthemanatee

I disagree, Deus Ex 2 was a great game in it's own right imo, it scored an 8 on gamespot and it's the score it deserves imo

Well i played Deus Ex 1 and Deus Ex 2 this year for the first time. The first one was engaging, exiting, amazing. Deus Ex 2 was three steps back. I quit somewhere in the middle because i was so bored.GeneralShowzer

well, you did go from a solid 9.5 (maybe even a perfect 10) to an 8.0 game

it's only natural to feel disapointed

BTW, what were the first two games you posted? the shooter ones

also: Drakensang, is it worth buying it?

So now that I've proven untainted PC games are more complex you make sarcastic comments? As i told you this are only games I've played, it doesn't even scratch the surface. I haven't played EvE online or Hearts of Iron 3, or any simulation games.GeneralShowzer

[QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"]So now that I've proven untainted PC games are more complex you make sarcastic comments? As i told you this are only games I've played, it doesn't even scratch the surface. I haven't played EvE online or Hearts of Iron 3, or any simulation games.Supabul

like what?

I have yet to see any console game with the complexity of Hearts of Iron or Europa Universalis

[QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"]So now that I've proven untainted PC games are more complex you make sarcastic comments? As i told you this are only games I've played, it doesn't even scratch the surface. I haven't played EvE online or Hearts of Iron 3, or any simulation games.Supabul

Case point Civilization Revolution among enough games to warrant the term being so widely used, for such a long time now.

This isn't to say the console games are bad mind you.

[QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"] Well i played Deus Ex 1 and Deus Ex 2 this year for the first time. The first one was engaging, exiting, amazing. Deus Ex 2 was three steps back. I quit somewhere in the middle because i was so bored.ohthemanatee

well, you did go from a solid 9.5 (maybe even a perfect 10) to an 8.0 game

it's only natural to feel disapointed

BTW, what were the first two games you posted? the shooter ones

also: Drakensang, is it worth buying it?

I have yet to see any console game with the complexity of Hearts of Iron or Europa Universalis

ohthemanatee

Don't misunderstand me, but when you talk about complexity are you referring to complexity of combat systems/mechanics or the complexity of buttons (or number of buttons)?

Steel Battalion is one of the few games that comes with its own controller with around 40 buttons. It's easily the most complex in terms of design and actual gameplay.

Again, I'm not arguing but was wondering as to what you mean by complexity.

[QUOTE="ohthemanatee"]

[QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"] Well i played Deus Ex 1 and Deus Ex 2 this year for the first time. The first one was engaging, exiting, amazing. Deus Ex 2 was three steps back. I quit somewhere in the middle because i was so bored.GeneralShowzer

well, you did go from a solid 9.5 (maybe even a perfect 10) to an 8.0 game

it's only natural to feel disapointed

BTW, what were the first two games you posted? the shooter ones

also: Drakensang, is it worth buying it?

I'll try them out then.

now that we have pretty much established that PC games can indeed be more complex there is something that I think gets overlooked and that's the trauma that certain genres can never work on consoles

For example, people criticize Halo Wars, calling it a simplistic RTS... which is a half-truth, sure, it's not complex or very deep, and people bash the game for it and I get that.

But I recently started playing Warhammre 40K dawn of war and I surprised to see that for the most part it felt like I was playing the same game with some minor changes, not only that, but some of the criticisms that you'll find on gamespot's Halo Wars' review are not even mentioned on Dawn of War (despite the fact that dawn of war has many of the same problems)

...just sayin'

[QUOTE="Supabul"][QUOTE="GeneralShowzer"]So now that I've proven untainted PC games are more complex you make sarcastic comments? As i told you this are only games I've played, it doesn't even scratch the surface. I haven't played EvE online or Hearts of Iron 3, or any simulation games.ohthemanatee

like what?

I have yet to see any console game with the complexity of Hearts of Iron or Europa Universalis

[QUOTE="ohthemanatee"]

I have yet to see any console game with the complexity of Hearts of Iron or Europa Universalis

fend_oblivion

Don't misunderstand me, but when you talk about complexity are you referring to complexity of combat systems/mechanics or the complexity of buttons (or number of buttons)?

Steel Battalion is one of the few games that comes with its own controller with around 40 buttons. It's easily the most complex in terms of design and actual gameplay.

Again, I'm not arguing but was wondering as to what you mean by complexity.

I'v never actually played steel Batallion and if you're going to defend a console's complexitiy, from what i've heard you picked the right game.

anyway, it envolves the mechanics, It's just... too much, it's hard to explain, for example:

when you invade an enemy region and defeat it's forces there you don't just suddenly own the region like in the Total war series, somehow the region is still loyal to the enemy kingdom despite the fact that my army rules it, and I have no idea how to change that despite it's 21 tutorials.

Then there's the fact that training an army is also very complicated, in most strategy games it's done by the click of a button, but no here, it takes a long time, you have to wait for your population to increase (which takes a long time) you need the money, the loyalty and you may actually never get any new troops in any of your regions, and it's not because of a unit cap, it's simply because you don't meet the necessary conditions

I tried to get into the game, I really tried, but I just couldn't handle it

P.S. I'm referring to Euopa Universalis 2

[QUOTE="ohthemanatee"]

[QUOTE="Supabul"] No theres games like that on console and handhelds, playing those games with a mouse and keyboard is not very complex, it easy to navigate menus with a mouse and when games get made for console trying to make the same experience work on a controller is a lot harder so menus and all the clutter has to be trimmed back, games don't get dumb down they get made for the type of controller the system uses, the mouse just offers far superior control for some types of gamesSupabul

like what?

I have yet to see any console game with the complexity of Hearts of Iron or Europa Universalis

Actually I was referring to Europa Universalis 2, not only that, but you just proved you have no idea how the game works

I'v never actually played steel Batallion and if you're going to defend a console's complexitiy, from what i've heard you picked the right game.

anyway, it envolves the mechanics, It's just... too much, it's hard to explain, for example:

when you invade an enemy region and defeat it's forces there you don't just suddenly own the region like in the Total war series, somehow the region is still loyal to the enemy kingdom despite the fact that my army rules it, and I have no idea how to change that despite it's 21 tutorials.

Then there's the fact that training an army is also very complicated, in most strategy games it's done by the click of a button, but no here, it takes a long time, you have to wait for your population to increase (which takes a long time) you need the money, the loyalty and you may actually never get any new troops in any of your regions, and it's not because of a unit cap, it's simply because you don't meet the necessary conditions

I tried to get into the game, I really tried, but I just couldn't handle it

P.S. I'm referring to Euopa Universalis 2

ohthemanatee

Phew, I thought for a moment you'd come back at me bearing fangs :P Thanks.

Yeah, I definitely understand what you mean now. I'd go crazy too. Last game that made my stop because it was too much was Sim City. Rectify one problem and boom, you're posed with another.

I thought Deus Ex was already tainted? I remember people were mad over Invisible War.