Bohemia: For Every 3 Legit Sales of Arma 2, There Are 100 Piracy Attempts

[QUOTE="WilliamRLBaker"]

lol your wrong man PC piracy is at a complete minimum its the 360 piracy thats bad oh the pc version gets released a month or more earlier always but since there is no crack for it they cant play it...etc..etc

loosingENDS

360 piracy is bad ?

The whu did Fabllefield 3 sell 2.5 million on 360 and only 500K on PC ?

Piracy seems 100x worst on PC imo

Lies, treacherous lies. We all know PC piracy doesn't exist bar a few isolated cases.

Do you even know what type of game ArmA is? Bohemia is considered lucky for the sales they get with a game like that.

NoodleFighter

So they're considering going multiplat?

So they're considering going multiplat?

nameless12345

Probably not for a while in (this gen) consoles. It's kind of like a flight sim where there's so many things to keep track of over a huge geographical area, all in real time. Next-gen? Perhaps.

So they're considering going multiplat?

nameless12345

An 360 port of Arma 2 has been in the planning ever since the game got released on PC, but I haven't heard any updates in such a long time that I don't think it's gonna happen anymore, at least not this gen.

I always wondered how that game would be possible on consoles, anyway. Even on high end PCs it's a massive system hog, and the control scheme is so complex that literally every button on the keyboard (and the mouse) is used for some action.

Ding ding ding thats what I was getting at. A game like battlefield that is more accessible is easily going to attract more users then a game like Arma.

NoodleFighter

That doesn't coincide with why there were so many attempts by pirates to play it online which is totally out of proportion to ARMA 2's sales numbers. If they find it useful enough then they should buy it. I can hazard a guess on who might want to pirate ARMA 2 and it won't be your typical gamer.

ARMA 2 on its own is a pretty okay training tool much like Falcon 4, FSX, and X-Plane 9. Heck, if I was an insurgent-in-training (or a draftee in some army), I can set up a scenario with the editor, practice that a few times in singleplayer, practice even more in multiplayer where there's "live" AI, and finally see where in the real-world that scenario may apply.

The funny thing is that there actually is a free version of Arma 2 which you can legitimatley play online. Looks like those pirates aren't too bright :P

Whether the numbers are accurate or not, it's still always a sad reminder to me that people pirate great games from smaller devs. Military sims may be a niche market, but not as niche as their sales would suggest. Without the financial backing of a huge publisher, they need all the revenue they can get to improve future games.

An 360 port of Arma 2 has been in the planning ever since the game got released on PC, but I haven't heard any updates in such a long time

DraugenCP

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

Are you honestly implying that those games did not lose sales due to piracy? I can say truthfully that when Crysis came out that pirated copies were the norm as opposed to real copies in my dorm. I think that maybe one person brought it while everyone else played it. Without the pirated version I can guarantee that at least two or three more people would have brought it.

ChubbyGuy40

No one bought it as no one could run it. Your dorm =/= actual numbers. That's an incredibly weak argument considering you don't have any numbers with you.

And? It's not like those 100 pirates had any intentions of purchasing the game. They didnt lose a sale so why do they care?

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

Are you honestly implying that those games did not lose sales due to piracy? I can say truthfully that when Crysis came out that pirated copies were the norm as opposed to real copies in my dorm. I think that maybe one person brought it while everyone else played it. Without the pirated version I can guarantee that at least two or three more people would have brought it.

marq4porsche

No one bought it as no one could run it. Your dorm =/= actual numbers. That's an incredibly weak argument considering you don't have any numbers with you.

There are many creators out there who find piracy to actually have a positive effect on the sales of their product.

Piracy is a blanket term for way too many things. Yes, "lost sale" does fall under that blanket, but so do a hundred other ideas as well.

And? It's not like those 100 pirates had any intentions of purchasing the game. They didnt lose a sale so why do they care?

Fizzman

In other words "For every 3 copies we actually sold, we hoped to sell 100". Get off the piracy case the people who pirate never had an intention of buying in the first place so it was never a lost sale and no stats or figures will or can ever show proof of the piracy damaging gaming because there is no baseline to work off of.JohnF111

Software pirates are one of the most manifested indicators that this truly is the "entitlement generation". Our ancestors are rolling over in their graves.

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]In other words "For every 3 copies we actually sold, we hoped to sell 100". Get off the piracy case the people who pirate never had an intention of buying in the first place so it was never a lost sale and no stats or figures will or can ever show proof of the piracy damaging gaming because there is no baseline to work off of.Bruin1986

Software pirates are one of the most manifested indicators that this truly is the "entitlement generation".

Saying pirates had no intention of purchasing the game, isn't exactly condoning what they do :?

Unfortunately, the facts just aren't there as to whether they had an intention to purchase the game or not, or whether some did later on. Piracy will never go away, that's just a part of life. It sucks, but it's there.

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]In other words "For every 3 copies we actually sold, we hoped to sell 100". Get off the piracy case the people who pirate never had an intention of buying in the first place so it was never a lost sale and no stats or figures will or can ever show proof of the piracy damaging gaming because there is no baseline to work off of.Bruin1986

Software pirates are one of the most manifested indicators that this truly is the "entitlement generation". Our ancestors are rolling over in their graves.

Watch this video. It's very insightful on what piracy is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Qkyt1wXNlI

It's sad to see that a dev's work is being pirated so liberally. Hopefully someone in the future will find a system that actually acts against piracy, unlike much of the things some publishers have been trying.

Yet there are many people who I know that built computers because of crysis. Yeah going from my experience I see it as a test sample. Even if those two or three people I know who could have gotten it didn't due to piracy, then there was an effect. Just because you support piracy, don't let it blind you to the effects it has on our industry. And that effect is overall a negative one for consumer and developer alike.

marq4porsche

No you can't. That's a seriously poor test example. I bought a game yet my friend downloaded it. I guess that means for every copy, someone downloads an illegal copy of it as well. They could of gotten it, but you can't prove they would have.

No I don't support piracy and I never said I did. You can't prove piracy equates to a lost sale, and since you can't you shouldn't be hounding it as such. These devs are asking for bigger sales from a market that isn't as big as they want it to be.

There was some study that said like 1 every 2000 is a lost sale without counting GAINED sales, free advertisement (word of mouth) and so on. But Piracy in general is a topic where no one can for sure say what would happen. Well ok people can say one thing for sure. Your game will not suddenly sell a equal number to the pirated copies more then before as pirates download everything and by everything i mean everything.KalDurenik

That's the whole idea everyone, and the industry needs to get through their heads. Many people already do understand it.

Piracy CAN equal a lost sale for sure, but piracy can also equal sooooooooo maaaany other things it's crazy.

Piracy to an author by the name of Neil Gaiman meant seeing his book sales up 300% in that region (where he personally put his book up for free on the web) the following month. Piracy to Gabe Newell means he should improve his Steam service to make it better than the pirated copies, and with doing so he's come out and stated that Russia is the 2nd largest European market for Steam (and Russia is incredibly incredibly notorious for being pirate central).

Those who get what piracy is find success despite its existance. Those who don't get it only end up hurting themselves. Companies like Ubisoft who, since implimenting their DRM, have seen a 90% decrease in piracy, but also a drop in legit sales are an example of a company who does not get it.

Pretty pathetic considering all the sales and competition between digital distribution platforms these days. Why pirate when you can pick up a game for cheap AND support the people behind it?Hexagon_777

Because piracy means a whole lot more things than just "lost sale"?

This is absolutely disgraceful, I'm disappointed in you hermits. Chrome-

You should be disappointed at the pirates, not the gamers.

Total spun the wrong way its attempts, that means it could be 10 people trying 10 times.

I'm going to stay out of the whole is piracy hurting pc gaming, or is it wrong debate

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

No one bought it as no one could run it. Your dorm =/= actual numbers. That's an incredibly weak argument considering you don't have any numbers with you.

SW__Troll

There are many creators out there who find piracy to actually have a positive effect on the sales of their product.

Piracy is a blanket term for way too many things. Yes, "lost sale" does fall under that blanket, but so do a hundred other ideas as well.

That's actually a very good point. Microsoft would NEVER be what they are today if it weren't for the massive piracy in the early days of Windows and Office. Piracy was a main factor in Microsoft establishing complete market dominance. When it was time to go legit guess what people bought?

[QUOTE="Fizzman"]

And? It's not like those 100 pirates had any intentions of purchasing the game. They didnt lose a sale so why do they care?

alexside1

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]In other words "For every 3 copies we actually sold, we hoped to sell 100". Get off the piracy case the people who pirate never had an intention of buying in the first place so it was never a lost sale and no stats or figures will or can ever show proof of the piracy damaging gaming because there is no baseline to work off of.Bruin1986

Software pirates are one of the most manifested indicators that this truly is the "entitlement generation". Our ancestors are rolling over in their graves.

Fabllefield 3

loosingENDS

WHA-*bang*

Freudian slip or was that intentional?

And? It's not like those 100 pirates had any intentions of purchasing the game. They didnt lose a sale so why do they care?

Fizzman

if they had no intentions of buying the game, they should of just played the demo. it is loss in sales. if they don't wanna pay for it, they shouldn't be able to play the full game.

they lost sales, because people where able to play the full verison without buying, why would you pay for something that you can get free?

[QUOTE="Fizzman"]

And? It's not like those 100 pirates had any intentions of purchasing the game. They didnt lose a sale so why do they care?

gamer-adam1

if they had no intentions of buying the game, they should of just played the demo. it is loss in sales. if they don't wanna pay for it, they shouldn't be able to play the full game.

they lost sales, because people where able to play the full verison without buying, why would you pay for something that you can get free?

"No intention of buying" the game does not mean "no intention of playing."

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

Yet there are many people who I know that built computers because of crysis. Yeah going from my experience I see it as a test sample. Even if those two or three people I know who could have gotten it didn't due to piracy, then there was an effect. Just because you support piracy, don't let it blind you to the effects it has on our industry. And that effect is overall a negative one for consumer and developer alike.

ChubbyGuy40

No you can't. That's a seriously poor test example. I bought a game yet my friend downloaded it. I guess that means for every copy, someone downloads an illegal copy of it as well. They could of gotten it, but you can't prove they would have.

No I don't support piracy and I never said I did. You can't prove piracy equates to a lost sale, and since you can't you shouldn't be hounding it as such. These devs are asking for bigger sales from a market that isn't as big as they want it to be.

Developers don't want it, so they do everything in their power to stop it, this is the result.

marq4porsche

The insane-DRM today is because developers DON'T know how to combat piracy.

Digital downloads are popular because they're cheaper, convenient, and bring games to areas publishers won't. If anything, that helps combat piracy.

[QUOTE="gamer-adam1"]

[QUOTE="Fizzman"]

And? It's not like those 100 pirates had any intentions of purchasing the game. They didnt lose a sale so why do they care?

lundy86_4

if they had no intentions of buying the game, they should of just played the demo. it is loss in sales. if they don't wanna pay for it, they shouldn't be able to play the full game.

they lost sales, because people where able to play the full verison without buying, why would you pay for something that you can get free?

"No intention of buying" the game does not mean "no intention of playing."

Then everyone should do that for everything digital then. "Eh, I never meant to buy it, but I still wanted to see it/listen to it/play it, so I'll go and get it anyway." Where in this line of reasoning is it right?

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

Developers don't want it, so they do everything in their power to stop it, this is the result.

ChubbyGuy40

The insane-DRM today is because developers DON'T know how to combat piracy.

Digital downloads are popular because they're cheaper, convenient, and bring games to areas publishers won't. If anything, that helps combat piracy.

It does help combat piracy. That is one of the primary reasons it exist. Similar to iTunes, it offers cheaper alternatives to retail, making it easier to access and making it so the user has less reason to go the piracy route.

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

Developers don't want it, so they do everything in their power to stop it, this is the result.

marq4porsche

The insane-DRM today is because developers DON'T know how to combat piracy.

Digital downloads are popular because they're cheaper, convenient, and bring games to areas publishers won't. If anything, that helps combat piracy.

It does help combat piracy. That is one of the primary reasons it exist. Similar to iTunes, it offers cheaper alternatives to retail, making it easier to access and making it so the user has less reason to go the piracy route.

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

marq4porsche

And they put too much protection on it which hurts the legit customers. Put as much DRM as you want on it, but it's going to be cracked. The more you put on it, the more you encourage crackers to break it open. Legit customers are suffering from publisher/developer incompetence.

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

The insane-DRM today is because developers DON'T know how to combat piracy.

Digital downloads are popular because they're cheaper, convenient, and bring games to areas publishers won't. If anything, that helps combat piracy.

AdrianWerner

It does help combat piracy. That is one of the primary reasons it exist. Similar to iTunes, it offers cheaper alternatives to retail, making it easier to access and making it so the user has less reason to go the piracy route.

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

ChubbyGuy40

And they put too much protection on it which hurts the legit customers. Put as much DRM as you want on it, but it's going to be cracked. The more you put on it, the more you encourage crackers to break it open. Legit customers are suffering from publisher/developer incompetence.

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

The insane-DRM today is because developers DON'T know how to combat piracy.

Digital downloads are popular because they're cheaper, convenient, and bring games to areas publishers won't. If anything, that helps combat piracy.

AdrianWerner

It does help combat piracy. That is one of the primary reasons it exist. Similar to iTunes, it offers cheaper alternatives to retail, making it easier to access and making it so the user has less reason to go the piracy route.

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

I never said it was right. I always argued that it hurt the consumer. I don't like DRM as much as anyone. But I agree that there is a need to protect their software. What I did say was that it is a direct result of piracy being there. Ergo, no piracy, no DRM. DRM does not exist in a world with no piracy.

marq4porsche

There will always be DRM. That's foolish to think there would never be any if it wasn't for piracy.

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

I never said it was right. I always argued that it hurt the consumer. I don't like DRM as much as anyone. But I agree that there is a need to protect their software. What I did say was that it is a direct result of piracy being there. Ergo, no piracy, no DRM. DRM does not exist in a world with no piracy.

ChubbyGuy40

There will always be DRM. That's foolish to think there would never be any if it wasn't for piracy.

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

I never said it was right. I always argued that it hurt the consumer. I don't like DRM as much as anyone. But I agree that there is a need to protect their software. What I did say was that it is a direct result of piracy being there. Ergo, no piracy, no DRM. DRM does not exist in a world with no piracy.

marq4porsche

There will always be DRM. That's foolish to think there would never be any if it wasn't for piracy.

DRM is more than just copy protection.

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

There will always be DRM. That's foolish to think there would never be any if it wasn't for piracy.

ChubbyGuy40

DRM is more than just copy protection.

Yeah didn't they use it to kill off the used games market for PC :P

For every 2 sales there are at least 10.000 people who don't want to buy it and 1 who feels bad about buying it.

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

It is the RIGHT of the developer to protect their product. They developed these DRMs in a direct reaction to piracy, thanks for proving my point.

marq4porsche

And they put too much protection on it which hurts the legit customers. Put as much DRM as you want on it, but it's going to be cracked. The more you put on it, the more you encourage crackers to break it open. Legit customers are suffering from publisher/developer incompetence.

Piracy=giant robot

DRM=DMV

now see what happens...........

Pirates gonna pirate

Buyers gonna buy

simple as that

[QUOTE="ChubbyGuy40"]

[QUOTE="marq4porsche"]

I never said it was right. I always argued that it hurt the consumer. I don't like DRM as much as anyone. But I agree that there is a need to protect their software. What I did say was that it is a direct result of piracy being there. Ergo, no piracy, no DRM. DRM does not exist in a world with no piracy.

marq4porsche

There will always be DRM. That's foolish to think there would never be any if it wasn't for piracy.