Chris Taylor to Hermits: YOUR INDUSTRY IS DYING BECAUSE OF PIRACY

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]If what you say is true, then why developers continue to leave? Put 2 and 2 together Vandel...Cute_Red_Panda

I have not one logical foundation of my claim except the departue of PC developers going to console. Honestly, that's all I really need. Your evidence is nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers...

[QUOTE="Coyo7e"]Deflection. In the very article youuse to site PC gamings growth, in the very same sentence in witch they mention massive growth they also say "massive piracy Nobody is denying that piracy exists everywhere. I am sure NIntendo thinks it is a big problem. But PC dev's are changing focus from PC's to consoles and I think that sucks. Because it is a big problem.Keep running circles around all the facts and only use those that support your ideals.The ideal that stealing is ok because people have always stolen games, and PC dev's are just greedy because they are already making a profit.Vandalvideo

That comment really says it all.

Because they force you to buy rehashed crap?

I would not trust you with 5 dollars.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Vylence"]Actually I can, any game developer who payed for CD protection lost money to piracy, any game which has a CD key lost money to piracy. And you keep pointing out these amazing Indy developers, two does not a trend make. I can point out many more developers who are saying piracy is a big problem. And you still ignore that it would a negative that all blockbuster titles moved to consoles. Indy developers do not stay Indy developers if they make good games.Vylence

If there is no piracy why would they put CD protection on their games? You defy logic.

Link. Witchers CD protection. And I do not se how you can say anthing about Sins since it just came out and we do not know what the sales will be like.

Its just as bad as how Hermits want to kill the middle man, they want people to lose jobs just because they themselves are too lazy or afraid to leave their house.wok7

That comment really says it all.Because they force you to buy rehashed crap?I would not trust you with 5 dollars.Coyo7e

[QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]If what you say is true, then why developers continue to leave? Put 2 and 2 together Vandel...Noldorin2646

I have not one logical foundation of my claim except the departue of PC developers going to console. Honestly, that's all I really need. Your evidence is nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers...

These devs are leaving the PC because they failed at what they set out to do: giving an innovative product to PC gamers.

Talk about elitism...Who put you in the position to say they haven't? Yet, PC gamers rather pirate the game...Where is the logic in that?

[QUOTE="Noldorin2646"][QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]If what you say is true, then why developers continue to leave? Put 2 and 2 together Vandel...Cute_Red_Panda

I have not one logical foundation of my claim except the departue of PC developers going to console. Honestly, that's all I really need. Your evidence is nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers...

These devs are leaving the PC because they failed at what they set out to do: giving an innovative product to PC gamers.

Talk about elitism...Who put you in the position to say they haven't? Yet, PC gamers rather pirate the game...Where is the logic in that?

I hope you guys know how much your blowing this topic out of proportion. Starting to become amusing.

Well, no matter what people say, it's undeniable that PC games sales are way lower than their console counterparts. Many PC devs are already switching to consoles, it's only a matter of time before it dies.NWA_31

[QUOTE="Coyo7e"]That comment really says it all.Because they force you to buy rehashed crap?I would not trust you with 5 dollars.Vandalvideo

You have condoned piracy time and time again in this thread.

The fact that you continue to do it, apparently without knowledge you are doing it, is what is sad.

If I asked to hold 5 bucks for me I am sure you would find a way to rationalize your right to spend it on yourself.'

This is the reason most store surveillance is directed at the employee more then the customer.

I hope you guys know how much your blowing this topic out of proportion. Starting to become amusing.

HoldThePhone

I don't want PC to die. I'm an advid PC gamer, but to say PC is doing okay, and see developers turn their backs on it is moronic. WAKE UP!!!! The PC is in a Crysis....:P

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Coyo7e"]That comment really says it all.Because they force you to buy rehashed crap?I would not trust you with 5 dollars.Coyo7e

You have condoned piracy time and time again in this thread.

The fact that you continue to do it, apparently without knowledge you are doing it, is what is sad.

If I asked to hold 5 bucks for me I am sure you would find a way to rationalize your right to spend it on yourself.'

This is the reason most store surveillance is directed at the employee more then the customer.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Coyo7e"]That comment really says it all.Because they force you to buy rehashed crap?I would not trust you with 5 dollars.Coyo7e

You have condoned piracy time and time again in this thread.

The fact that you continue to do it, apparently without knowledge you are doing it, is what is sad.

If I asked to hold 5 bucks for me I am sure you would find a way to rationalize your right to spend it on yourself.'

This is the reason most store surveillance is directed at the employee more then the customer.

Vandal has yet to condone piriacy. He was saying why Ut3 and Supcom didn't sell.

[QUOTE="HoldThePhone"]

I hope you guys know how much your blowing this topic out of proportion. Starting to become amusing.

Cute_Red_Panda

I don't want PC to die. I'm an advid PC gamer, but to say PC is doing okay, and see developers turn their backs on it is moronic. WAKE UP!!!! The PC is in a Crysis....:P

[QUOTE="Noldorin2646"][QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"]If what you say is true, then why developers continue to leave? Put 2 and 2 together Vandel...Cute_Red_Panda

I have not one logical foundation of my claim except the departue of PC developers going to console. Honestly, that's all I really need. Your evidence is nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers...

These devs are leaving the PC because they failed at what they set out to do: giving an innovative product to PC gamers.

Talk about elitism...Who put you in the position to say they haven't? Yet, PC gamers rather pirate the game...Where is the logic in that?

It is the logic of self interest only. Everything else be damned, I deserve this and that, and if you don't give me what I want I can take it and that is my right.

The philosophy of a coward.

[QUOTE="Coyo7e"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Coyo7e"]That comment really says it all.Because they force you to buy rehashed crap?I would not trust you with 5 dollars.Vandalvideo

You have condoned piracy time and time again in this thread.

The fact that you continue to do it, apparently without knowledge you are doing it, is what is sad.

If I asked to hold 5 bucks for me I am sure you would find a way to rationalize your right to spend it on yourself.'

This is the reason most store surveillance is directed at the employee more then the customer.

I tried explaining this to Coyo7e as well, he doesn't get it.

People pirate good games. Good games sell well.

People don't pirate bad games. Bad games sell poorly.

Piracy is bad, but you are acting like it's an act of terroism or something ridiculously overblown.

[QUOTE="Cute_Red_Panda"][QUOTE="HoldThePhone"]

I hope you guys know how much your blowing this topic out of proportion. Starting to become amusing.

Vandalvideo

I don't want PC to die. I'm an advid PC gamer, but to say PC is doing okay, and see developers turn their backs on it is moronic. WAKE UP!!!! The PC is in a Crysis....:P

lol. I like you...I would buy you if I could.

Talk about elitism...Who put you in the position to say they haven't? Yet, PC gamers rather pirate the game...Where is the logic in that?

Cute_Red_Panda

From the top of my head, the only devs I know that has announced their abandoning the PC platform is Epic and to some extent, Gas Powered Games. So take a look at the situation rationally.

First off, let's look at what Epic's saying about piracy. UT3 is an online shooter, without a proper CD Key, you can't play online. I seriously doubt that hundreds of thousands would pirate UT3 just to play against bots. No, UT3 sold poorly because it didn't offer fans any incentive to buy the new game, so they said, "meh, it's just 2k4 with prettier graphics and some of the best modes taken out." Hence, Epic failed at making a quality product.

[QUOTE="HoldThePhone"]

I hope you guys know how much your blowing this topic out of proportion. Starting to become amusing.

Cute_Red_Panda

I don't want PC to die. I'm an advid PC gamer, but to say PC is doing okay, and see developers turn their backs on it is moronic. WAKE UP!!!! The PC is in a Crysis....:P

What exactly is the hard evidence of PC dying or pirating destroying PC gaming? I know it hurts it, but lets be realistic.

To say pirating is destroying a developer is flat out ridiculous.

Online distribution says otherwise. THe PC currently accoutns for 30% of the entire industry, more than any individual platform.Vandalvideo

I don't know how many games were downloaded, do you have the numbers ? And 30% isn't exactly impressive, considering PC gaming has been around since the early 90s, while the other 70% are still pretty new.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"]Online distribution says otherwise. THe PC currently accoutns for 30% of the entire industry, more than any individual platform.NWA_31

I don't know how many games were downloaded, do you have the numbers ? And 30% isn't exactly impressive, considering PC gaming has been around since the early 90s, while the other 70% are still pretty new.

30%. For a single platform. With 6 other platforms included in that. That is what I call very good.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"]Online distribution says otherwise. THe PC currently accoutns for 30% of the entire industry, more than any individual platform.NWA_31

I don't know how many games were downloaded, do you have the numbers ? And 30% isn't exactly impressive, considering PC gaming has been around since the early 90s, while the other 70% are still pretty new.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"]Online distribution says otherwise. THe PC currently accoutns for 30% of the entire industry, more than any individual platform.NWA_31

I don't know how many games were downloaded, do you have the numbers ? And 30% isn't exactly impressive, considering PC gaming has been around since the early 90s, while the other 70% are still pretty new.

Thats not all you need. Besides, there is a relatively small ammount of developers making games for consoles. Oh and your turn of phrase is wrong. PC developers aren't going to consoles, they're becomming multiplat, just like every console developer is doing as well. You people have this exact same problem. However, the PC still retains the most exclusives. I like how you dismiss five of the most influential companies in the PC gaming industry, the NPD, and numerous satistics as "nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers". If you can't disprove what I'm saying, then I suggest you quit trying, because you're just digging your holedeeper. Things I've proven so far: A) THe PC accounts for 30% of the entire game sales. B) The PC's sales are not declining, in fact, theres been a 12% increase in sales since 2006. C) The PC has the most announced exclusives and highly rated titles. D) Indie developers are selling multi-million copies in their first month without any issues from piracy. So heres an idea, come back when you have some evidence.Vandalvideo

A) The PC acounts for less than a third of all game sales, yet has a user base of nearly 300million acording to your same sources. Consoles have considerbly less and account for greater than 2/3s.

B) Meanwhile Console games were up 46%, and if you would take out Wow from the PC numbers I wouldn't be suprised if that increase dropped to 6%.

C) The PC has the most exclusively lost titles and high ratings.

D) And you act like the Indy developers are the answer when an Indy developer is never going to stay an Indy developer.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Thats not all you need. Besides, there is a relatively small ammount of developers making games for consoles. Oh and your turn of phrase is wrong. PC developers aren't going to consoles, they're becomming multiplat, just like every console developer is doing as well. You people have this exact same problem. However, the PC still retains the most exclusives. I like how you dismiss five of the most influential companies in the PC gaming industry, the NPD, and numerous satistics as "nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers". If you can't disprove what I'm saying, then I suggest you quit trying, because you're just digging your holedeeper. Things I've proven so far: A) THe PC accounts for 30% of the entire game sales. B) The PC's sales are not declining, in fact, theres been a 12% increase in sales since 2006. C) The PC has the most announced exclusives and highly rated titles. D) Indie developers are selling multi-million copies in their first month without any issues from piracy. So heres an idea, come back when you have some evidence.Vylence

A) The PC acounts for less than a third of all game sales, yet has a user base of nearly 300million acording to your same sources. Consoles have considerbly less and account for greater than 2/3s.

B) Meanwhile Console games were up 46%, and if you would take out Wow from the PC numbers I wouldn't be suprised if that increase dropped to 6%.

C) The PC has the most exclusively lost titles and high ratings.

D) And you act like the Indy developers are the answer when an Indy developer is never going to stay an Indy developer.

Tell Chris that GAMING INDUSTRY the last 5-10 years making so many profits that WHOLE africa could feed for 10 years or more.

Also tell him that PIRACY or NOT they are making so much profit that i bet "AT LEAST" the headquarters of each company got 4-5Ferraris already,1-2mansions to live,make vacations on best hotels around the world and they got so many millions already that EVEN the childs of the childs of their childs will be millionares.

TELL him to DROP the prices to a number that is "logical" and give very nice MP and good extras that legal owners might wanna have and POP,PIRACY will drop dramatically.You cant say there wont be anymore.But will be so less than now.

Because if a game costs (including marketing) around 10M (estimated price for majority others maybe cost 40M $$ (very few games- others 50.000 $$(call me Puzzle quest??) and they selling 1M pieces,we are talking about 60M to 70M $$ here.Take out all the extra costs and we are talking about 30-50M in their pockets/company's bank!!!Imagine titles that selling more than 2-4-6 Millions !!! We are talking about CRAZY profits here...!!

What economics and success of gaming hes talking about? Isnt gaming success? Arent profits so high that compete the best movies of the world? WTH hes trying to say now? We all know that for companies the more $$ the better!! Now is PC fault or they are so greedy? I think both,but greed first!!!

As a gamer, i dont mind at all if they want their games on consoles too. Why not ? Thats good for consoles and gaming too. But developers/companies must give us something SPECIAL if they want our "Millions" so easy.Not ,one of the same games with better graphics. Thats why games like World of Warcraft sold already 10M boxes of WoW + 10M boxes of BC ++ 10M x 12$$ every month.!!! (Even if i dont like WoW i admit its superiority over other MMORPGs). Was something special and making a profit.Thats it.nothing more,nothing less.

Drop prices or make a game worth of the "millions" gamers would offer to you. Otherwise,go cry and release your games on every single platform in order to make the multi-millions you wished for.

Well, no matter what people say, it's undeniable that PC games sales are way lower than their console counterparts. Many PC devs are already switching to consoles, it's only a matter of time before it dies.NWA_31

Thats just it even if it becomes a niche market pc gaming will still exist in some form or another simply because it has to exist for console gaming to survive and technological advancement in the pc market in general to suceeded. To let pc gaming die is like slitting the throat of all gaming (pc or console). Console games need the developments made by pc gaming market and pc gaming market needs console gaming to get people interested in gaming so some of that (the userbases) transfers over into the pc gaming market.

If consolites really want pc gaming to die then be prepared to suffer some pretty harsh consequences that will see the industry in very bad times till pc gaming some how recovers cause developers realized exactly what they are doing to there own industry or there is a serious technology revolution on console where developers can make serious technological advancements like pc gaming market does.

It would be a very very bad day if the pc gaming market collapsed and it would be felt for decades.

Tell Chris that GAMING INDUSTRY the last 5-10 years making so many profits that WHOLE africa could feed for 10 years or more.

Also tell him that PIRACY or NOT they are making so much profit that i bet "AT LEAST" the headquarters of each company got 4-5Ferraris already,1-2mansions to live,make vacations on best hotels around the world and they got so many millions already that EVEN the childs of the childs of their childs will be millionares.

TELL him to DROP the prices to a number that is "logical" and give very nice MP and good extras that legal owners might wanna have and POP,PIRACY will drop dramatically.You cant say there wont be anymore.But will be so less than now.

Because if a game costs (including marketing) around 10M (estimated price for majority others maybe cost 40M $$ (very few games- others 50.000 $$(call me Puzzle quest??) and they selling 1M pieces,we are talking about 60M to 70M $$ here.Take out all the extra costs and we are talking about 30-50M in their pockets/company's bank!!!Imagine titles that selling more than 2-4-6 Millions !!! We are talking about CRAZY profits here...!!

What economics and success of gaming hes talking about? Isnt gaming success? Arent profits so high that compete the best movies of the world? WTH hes trying to say now? We all know that for companies the more $$ the better!! Now is PC fault or they are so greedy? I think both,but greed first!!!

As a gamer, i dont mind at all if they want their games on consoles too. Why not ? Thats good for consoles and gaming too. But developers/companies must give us something SPECIAL if they want our "Millions" so easy.Not ,one of the same games with better graphics. Thats why games like World of Warcraft sold already 10M boxes of WoW + 10M boxes of BC ++ 10M x 12$$ every month.!!! (Even if i dont like WoW i admit its superiority over other MMORPGs). Was something special and making a profit.Thats it.nothing more,nothing less.

Drop prices or make a game worth of the "millions" gamers would offer to you. Otherwise,go cry and release your games on every single platform in order to make the multi-millions you wished for.

AzatiS

Another person who thinks it is ok to steal because the company is still making a profit.

Give me what I want or I will steal it......

The sophistication of a 3rd grader.

[QUOTE="AzatiS"]

Tell Chris that GAMING INDUSTRY the last 5-10 years making so many profits that WHOLE africa could feed for 10 years or more.

Also tell him that PIRACY or NOT they are making so much profit that i bet "AT LEAST" the headquarters of each company got 4-5Ferraris already,1-2mansions to live,make vacations on best hotels around the world and they got so many millions already that EVEN the childs of the childs of their childs will be millionares.

TELL him to DROP the prices to a number that is "logical" and give very nice MP and good extras that legal owners might wanna have and POP,PIRACY will drop dramatically.You cant say there wont be anymore.But will be so less than now.

Because if a game costs (including marketing) around 10M (estimated price for majority others maybe cost 40M $$ (very few games- others 50.000 $$(call me Puzzle quest??) and they selling 1M pieces,we are talking about 60M to 70M $$ here.Take out all the extra costs and we are talking about 30-50M in their pockets/company's bank!!!Imagine titles that selling more than 2-4-6 Millions !!! We are talking about CRAZY profits here...!!

What economics and success of gaming hes talking about? Isnt gaming success? Arent profits so high that compete the best movies of the world? WTH hes trying to say now? We all know that for companies the more $$ the better!! Now is PC fault or they are so greedy? I think both,but greed first!!!

As a gamer, i dont mind at all if they want their games on consoles too. Why not ? Thats good for consoles and gaming too. But developers/companies must give us something SPECIAL if they want our "Millions" so easy.Not ,one of the same games with better graphics. Thats why games like World of Warcraft sold already 10M boxes of WoW + 10M boxes of BC ++ 10M x 12$$ every month.!!! (Even if i dont like WoW i admit its superiority over other MMORPGs). Was something special and making a profit.Thats it.nothing more,nothing less.

Drop prices or make a game worth of the "millions" gamers would offer to you. Otherwise,go cry and release your games on every single platform in order to make the multi-millions you wished for.

Coyo7e

Another person who thinks it is ok to steal because the company is still making a profit.

Give me what I want or I will steal it......

The sophistication of a 3rd grader.

If thats what you understood from my post then QQ. No comment

[QUOTE="Coyo7e"]You are blind if you can see the shift from PC dev's to consoles.If you are happy getting console ports on your PC, then by all means, things are just wonderful...Vandalvideo

Why do people site the move of PC developers to developing for consoles also signify the death of PC gaming. The fact of the matter is that PC gaming is only 1 of 4 gaming platforms (not counting handhelds). To me it is not that unreasonable for a gaming developer to want to develop on different plaforms of similar power to reach a much greater audience.

The fact of the matter is game development is getting more and more expensive, and if that expense can be offset by developing on multiple platforms developers will do so. The fact that multi-platform games are still coming to the PC just proves the fact that there is still enough money to be made in PC gaming to make it worth the effort.

The fact that games that used to be released on only one platform last generation like NG and DMC are now being released on multiple platforms just goes to show that it is not only from the PC platform that devs are expanding but from all other platforms.

If PC developers want to use piracy as their reasons for developing for the consoles then that is up to them, because lets face it piracy IS a problem in PC gaming. What baffles me is why they feel the need to imply that this is something new or declare that PC gaming is in decline or dieing because of it.Piracy is nothing new, yet there are hundreds if not thousands of PC software developers out there (both gaming and application) that continue to not only survive but make descent profit.

To me it is ludicrous to put all the blame on piracy for a software that fails to sell. I mean who among you can honestly say that the poor sales of UT3 was solely because of game Piracy. Also lets not forget that UT3 did no better on the PS3, what is their reason behind that? How about if it does not do so well on the 360, are we going to hear them complaining about the 360 then?

Thats numbers for the current generation, and includes all platforms like handhelds. 30% of the overall industry is amazing, much higher than any other platfomr.Vandalvideo

You got a link or something ? I highly doubt that, especially since games like Pokemo, WiiPlay and Halo have been selling like crazy and how we keep hearing about how the PC is suffering from illegal downloads.

Both console and PC gaming has been around since the 80's :| To say it's not impressive just shows you failed at math or can't grasp numbers correctly. So the fact that 5 other platforms take up 70% combined isn't impressive that only one platform can take up as much as 30%? karasill

[QUOTE="HoldThePhone"]

I hope you guys know how much your blowing this topic out of proportion. Starting to become amusing.

Cute_Red_Panda

I don't want PC to die. I'm an advid PC gamer, but to say PC is doing okay, and see developers turn their backs on it is moronic. WAKE UP!!!! The PC is in a Crysis....:P

[QUOTE="Vylence"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] Thats not all you need. Besides, there is a relatively small ammount of developers making games for consoles. Oh and your turn of phrase is wrong. PC developers aren't going to consoles, they're becomming multiplat, just like every console developer is doing as well. You people have this exact same problem. However, the PC still retains the most exclusives. I like how you dismiss five of the most influential companies in the PC gaming industry, the NPD, and numerous satistics as "nothing more than rhetoric to pious PC gamers". If you can't disprove what I'm saying, then I suggest you quit trying, because you're just digging your holedeeper. Things I've proven so far: A) THe PC accounts for 30% of the entire game sales. B) The PC's sales are not declining, in fact, theres been a 12% increase in sales since 2006. C) The PC has the most announced exclusives and highly rated titles. D) Indie developers are selling multi-million copies in their first month without any issues from piracy. So heres an idea, come back when you have some evidence.Vandalvideo

A) The PC acounts for less than a third of all game sales, yet has a user base of nearly 300million acording to your same sources. Consoles have considerbly less and account for greater than 2/3s.

B) Meanwhile Console games were up 46%, and if you would take out Wow from the PC numbers I wouldn't be suprised if that increase dropped to 6%.

C) The PC has the most exclusively lost titles and high ratings.

D) And you act like the Indy developers are the answer when an Indy developer is never going to stay an Indy developer.

The PC has lost the most exclusives out of any platform. And what you call relatively small is purely subjective. And PCs numbers should knock people out of the pool with 300million gamers on its side. Though consoles will sell more with less of an install base. Yes thats right Vandal those numbers you keep talking about are not making a splash when games like Halo3 can sell nearly 2.5 million in one day.

You keep maginifying one small aspect of the picture, when I would much rather believe the developers who have jobs in the industry. Which is where this discussion began.

You got a link or something ? I highly doubt that, especially since games like Pokemo, WiiPlay and Halo have been selling like crazy and how we keep hearing about how the PC is suffering from illegal downloads.NWA_31

Yes, but consoles are constantly changing hardwares and names, whereas PC remains PC. Sure, the hardware is also constantly being upgraded, but my point is that an old PC game like say, Doom is still part of that 30%, which is why it is unimpressive. In the future, you might want to think twice before telling others they failed.NWA_31

but my point is that an old PC game like say, Doom is still part of that 30%, which is why it is unimpressive. NWA_31

actually, if anything that makes it more impressive if the rest of the market consists of every handheld and console ever made.

The PC has lost the most exclusives out of any platform. And what you call relatively small is purely subjective. And PCs numbers should knock people out of the pool with 300million gamers on its side. Though consoles will sell more with less of an install base. Yes thats right Vandal those numbers you keep talking about are not making a splash when games like Halo3 can sell nearly 2.5 million in one day.You keep maginifying one small aspect of the picture, when I would much rather believe the developers who have jobs in the industry. Which is where this discussion began.Vylence

isn't DMC4 on pc?out0v0rder

The PC has lost the most exclusives out of any platform. And what you call relatively small is purely subjective. And PCs numbers should knock people out of the pool with 300million gamers on its side. Though consoles will sell more with less of an install base. Yes thats right Vandal those numbers you keep talking about are not making a splash when games like Halo3 can sell nearly 2.5 million in one day.

You keep maginifying one small aspect of the picture, when I would much rather believe the developers who have jobs in the industry. Which is where this discussion began.

Vylence

And you say PC is losing the most exclusives? Just name them, then.

And you're forgetting the PC sales curve. It's a lot smoother than that of consoles. Sure, Halo 3 sold over 2 million day one...but how about in March, at the six month mark? People still pay subscriptions to play WoW, so there must be a reason for it. And meanwhile, Crysis sales will probably hold steady as more and more gamers work themselves up to it in upgrades and new machines. Remember, PC sales are long term.

[QUOTE="Vylence"]The PC has lost the most exclusives out of any platform. And what you call relatively small is purely subjective. And PCs numbers should knock people out of the pool with 300million gamers on its side. Though consoles will sell more with less of an install base. Yes thats right Vandal those numbers you keep talking about are not making a splash when games like Halo3 can sell nearly 2.5 million in one day.You keep maginifying one small aspect of the picture, when I would much rather believe the developers who have jobs in the industry. Which is where this discussion began.Vandalvideo

MISCONCEPTION!? The PC has lost the most exclusives: FACT. Games which they would not have even thought about putting on a console they now develop first on the consoles. And so what Starcraft sold 15 million over its lifetime, so did GT4 according to others. And my lack of understanding of the PC market means I should not debate you? Meanwhile lead developers from your platform agree with me.

And Mario has had more games then any character on the PC, he's on the consoles.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Vylence"]The PC has lost the most exclusives out of any platform. And what you call relatively small is purely subjective. And PCs numbers should knock people out of the pool with 300million gamers on its side. Though consoles will sell more with less of an install base. Yes thats right Vandal those numbers you keep talking about are not making a splash when games like Halo3 can sell nearly 2.5 million in one day.You keep maginifying one small aspect of the picture, when I would much rather believe the developers who have jobs in the industry. Which is where this discussion began.Vylence

MISCONCEPTION!? The PC has lost the most exclusives: FACT. Games which they would not have even thought about putting on a console they now develop first on the consoles. And so what Starcraft sold 15 million over its lifetime, so did GT4 according to others. And my lack of understanding of the PC market means I should not debate you? Meanwhile lead developers from your platform agree with me.

And Mario has had more games then any character on the PC, he's on the consoles,

PS. GT4 only sold 9 million. And GT3's numbers are disputed because it was packed into the PS2 for some time. As for GTA games, they're across all platforms, including the PC.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Vylence"]The PC has lost the most exclusives out of any platform. And what you call relatively small is purely subjective. And PCs numbers should knock people out of the pool with 300million gamers on its side. Though consoles will sell more with less of an install base. Yes thats right Vandal those numbers you keep talking about are not making a splash when games like Halo3 can sell nearly 2.5 million in one day.You keep maginifying one small aspect of the picture, when I would much rather believe the developers who have jobs in the industry. Which is where this discussion began.Vylence

MISCONCEPTION!? The PC has lost the most exclusives: FACT. Games which they would not have even thought about putting on a console they now develop first on the consoles. And so what Starcraft sold 15 million over its lifetime, so did GT4 according to others. And my lack of understanding of the PC market means I should not debate you? Meanwhile lead developers from your platform agree with me.

And Mario has had more games then any character on the PC, he's on the consoles.

Spore, Call of duty (series started as a PC exclusive), Doom4, Populous, Sim City, Unreal Tournament, Starcraft (came out on the N64), Diablo, Hexen, World in Conflict, Super commander, The Elder book series. And those are the ones I could think off the top of my head.

Seems like almost all the big names in PC to me went sooner or later to console.

MISCONCEPTION!? The PC has lost the most exclusives: FACT. Games which they would not have even thought about putting on a console they now develop first on the consoles. And so what Starcraft sold 15 million over its lifetime, so did GT4 according to others. And my lack of understanding of the PC market means I should not debate you? Meanwhile lead developers from your platform agree with me And Mario has had more games then any character on the PC, he's on the consoles.Vylence

[QUOTE="Vylence"]MISCONCEPTION!? The PC has lost the most exclusives: FACT. Games which they would not have even thought about putting on a console they now develop first on the consoles. And so what Starcraft sold 15 million over its lifetime, so did GT4 according to others. And my lack of understanding of the PC market means I should not debate you? Meanwhile lead developers from your platform agree with me And Mario has had more games then any character on the PC, he's on the consoles.Vandalvideo

Ha Ha pal, yes you have proven me wrong in your head. Thats the same place piracy doesn't matter.

Seems like almost all the big names in PC to me went sooner or later to console. Vylence

Spore, Call of duty (series started as a PC exclusive), Doom4, Populous, Sim City, Unreal Tournament, Starcraft (came out on the N64), Diablo, Hexen, World in Conflict, Super commander, The Elder book series. And those are the ones I could think off the top of my head.

Seems like almost all the big names in PC to me went sooner or later to console.

Vylence