Digital Foundry hands on with actual PS4 - Some games sub 30fps

[QUOTE="AM-Gamer"]

[QUOTE="Krelian-co"]

ofc they are not, they are middle end pcs, if you believe consolites you are making your first mistake

UnknownSniper65

God hermits are such morons, you honestly expect launch titles to look outstanding and run smooth? They spend 3 quaters of there dev time on incomplete hardware. The 360 hard problems running quake 4 at 30fps and the game looks like complete trash compared to other 360 titles by todays standards.

I think its pretty unreasonable that developers can't get a decent framerate on set hardware. It hints towards the fact that the hardware isn't as great as people were originally thinking. Both consoles are running mid range AMD HD 7000 series GPUs. The Xbox One's equivalent GPU is an AMD HD7770 which gets beaten in benchmarks by the Nvidia GTX 480 from 2010. I remember a couple of months back EA was touting that next generation consoles were a full generation a head of gaming PCs, it seems its the other way around. The difference isn't going to be as huge as people think it is going to be especially if you've been gaming on PC. I haven't seen anything in the launch line ups of either consoles that couldn't have been done in the past two years on PC.

If VGleaks's GPU clock speed info is correct, Xbox One's equivalent GPU would be AMD FirePro W5000 i.e. 7770's 1.2 TFLOPS are NOT backed by 48 TMUs.

Current GCNs has 16 stream processors to 1 TMU ratio.

I'll post another 768 stream processor GCN i.e. AMD FirePro W5000 SKU.

Notice FirePro W5000's 102 GB/s video memory bandwidth almost matches VGLeaks' eSRAM memory bandwidth.

Some gaming benchmarks for AMD FirePro W5000.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/workstation-graphics-card-gaming,review-32643-9.html

7850 = 45.

W5000 = 33.

With Crysis 2, ROPs issue is minor i.e. 10 CU scale down from 7870 GE's results roughly matches 7770 GE's results.

7870 GE's 52.3 fps / 20 CUs = 2.615 x 10 CUs = 26.15 fps which roughly matches 7770's 25.9 fps result. This is for testing my scaling theory vs actual results.

FirePro W5000's 12 CUs (825 Mhz) scales down from Radeon HD 7850's 16 CUs (860 Mhz).

7850's 45.3 fps / 16 CUs (860Mhz) = 2.831 x 8 CUs = 22.65 fps which roughly matches 7750's 21.5 fps result. 7750 is clocked at 800Mhz. This is another test for my scaling theory vs actual results.

If we use the 7850 and 7750 as the two points for the "line of best fit", FirePro W5000 falls into the expected slot for 12 CUs @ 825 Mhz.

My 12 CU scale down = 33.97 fps

Actual FirePro W5000 = 33 fps.

So at the absolute most they have one month to raise Killzone which is at 25-30 fps, Drive Club which is at 20 fps, and Knack going below 30 fps to have all those games get to the 60 fps mark. You have to remember they need time after doing optimization to do the final touches, put the game on blu-rays, and ship them around the world.

Turn 10 is doing 1080p 60 fps so that is 40 fps better then what Drive Club does when too many things happen on screen. Also before anyone mentions Dead Rising you are comparing a third party game for X1 to three first party games for PS4. First party games will have the correct specs far longer then third party.

This is why I have not done my preorder yet. While I am greatly leaning towards PS4 for a few reasons, none of the reasons are because it has the games that look to be the best.

CanYouDiglt

[QUOTE="Truth_Hurts_U"]

[QUOTE="ReadingRainbow4"]

lol. Oh man...

Tessellation

Would fit the 20-30% slower fact gathering from what info we have.

[QUOTE="Tessellation"]No need to since the downgrade rumor has been confirmed to be bullshit already,no reports,no confirmations either just speculations.Truth_Hurts_U

More miss infomation.

You must be the king of it.

Just this once I'll give you a bone since you like them. ***Cough, Xbone***

OS x 3 said to take 10% of GPU power.

DDR3 20%+ slower then GDDR5.

Reduction in shader cores... 20% (I think that's the number)... Because of the ESDRAM.

Even if somehow the ESDRAM made up for the DDR3. You still looking @ around 20-30% less preformance.

How disappointing. Xbone games are already running at native 1080p and 60fps and it's weaker. What are Sony devs doing? They should have the most recent dev kits by now.

[QUOTE="faizan_faizan"][QUOTE="ActicEdge"]

Ram doesn't fix framerates. I don't understand how such a simple concept like RAM is so misunderstood. This is shit you learn in grade 10 programming.

ActicEdge

Which should never be a problem on consoles because your ram pool is fixed. You know exactly how much you are going to be working with and its speed and specs. This should never ever be a problem on consoles and I would wager the majority of framerate issues on consoles are not ram induced. Insufficient RAM should tank framerates on PC but then, it would stand to reason you are probably fighting a pretty close battle with minimum spec RAM. My point is you can't fix most problems by just throwing more ram at it. Cows man, and Lemmings too, straight up frighten me with their logic.

How disappointing. Xbone games are already running at native 1080p and 60fps and it's weaker. What are Sony devs doing? They should have the most recent dev kits by now.

On what planet is more RAM = more bandwidth?Kinthalis

People are so picky with FPs and what not that won't really affect the gameplay much over all in the end. Sigh...does it come to this? FPS? Damn son. I'm not even trying to defend Sony but if Microsoft has the same issues, hell with it. Play the game and enjoy it.Bloodseeker23

The hell are you smoking? Performance directly affect gameplay, it's the graphics that don't.

[QUOTE="Bloodseeker23"]People are so picky with FPs and what not that won't really affect the gameplay much over all in the end. Sigh...does it come to this? FPS? Damn son. I'm not even trying to defend Sony but if Microsoft has the same issues, hell with it. Play the game and enjoy it.rjdofu

The hell are you smoking? Performance directly affect gameplay, it's the graphics that don't.

LOL Clownzone I'm more interested in multiplats at the PS4 launchRR360DD

Playing multiplats on a console... smh

People are so picky with FPs and what not that won't really affect the gameplay much over all in the end. Sigh...does it come to this? FPS? Damn son. I'm not even trying to defend Sony but if Microsoft has the same issues, hell with it. Play the game and enjoy it.Bloodseeker23

Of course it matters lmao, its a huge factor. That's why cod plays so smoothly with it's tight controls because it maintains 60 fps on console. Battlefield, etc. etc. feels like shit at 30 fps.

[QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"]

[QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Inexcusable for a next-gen console. Still have a few months of polish, but come on. I thought we were past 30fps.Stevo_the_gamer

Then you were rather naive.

Lighting, textures and poly counts sell games, not frame rate.

60 fps helps COD maintain popularity, but it does basically nothing to bring in new people. Most games don't have the luxury of a gargantuan pre-existing community, so they have to look impressive from a distance.

[QUOTE="rjdofu"]

[QUOTE="Bloodseeker23"]People are so picky with FPs and what not that won't really affect the gameplay much over all in the end. Sigh...does it come to this? FPS? Damn son. I'm not even trying to defend Sony but if Microsoft has the same issues, hell with it. Play the game and enjoy it.faizan_faizan

The hell are you smoking? Performance directly affect gameplay, it's the graphics that don't.

It doesn't affect gameplay.rjdofu

[QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"][QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"]

Then you were rather naive.

Lighting, textures and poly counts sell games, not frame rate.

Cherokee_Jack

60 fps helps COD maintain popularity, but it does basically nothing to bring in new people. Most games don't have the luxury of a gargantuan pre-existing community, so they have to look impressive from a distance.

[QUOTE="rjdofu"]It doesn't affect gameplay.faizan_faizan

[QUOTE="faizan_faizan"][QUOTE="rjdofu"]It doesn't affect gameplay.rjdofu

60 fps is a huge selling point for games on consoles. Why do you think devs were bragging about battlefield and titanfall being 60 fps on console. (I'm sure there were many others.) 30 fps plays and feels like rubbish for first person shooters.yanni1

Right, which is why I said it helps COD maintain popularity.

Devs only brag about framerate to us, because we realize the significance of it. The average COD player would have no clear idea what 30 fps or 60 fps means. It improves their experience with the game once they sit down and play it, but they would never look at some new shooter and say "Well that game's 60 fps, I gotta get me that!" 

[QUOTE="yanni1"] 60 fps is a huge selling point for games on consoles. Why do you think devs were bragging about battlefield and titanfall being 60 fps on console. (I'm sure there were many others.) 30 fps plays and feels like rubbish for first person shooters.Cherokee_Jack

Right, which is why I said it helps COD maintain popularity.

Devs only brag about framerate to us, because we realize the significance of it. The average COD player would have no clear idea what 30 fps or 60 fps means. It improves their experience with the game once they sit down and play it, but they would never look at some new shooter and say "Well that game's 60 fps, I gotta get me that!" 

Anything that has some sort of technical relavance to a games performance would go over the head of any casual gamer, not just cod.

But people who have a clue understand how important it is to maintain 60 fps for first person shooters. Battlefield 3 on xbox and ps3 is proof of that, it's horrible.

All optimization happens in the last couple of months before release...never judge a game on it's E3 build unless the game is coming out next month or something

It's very early days yet, and at least they were brave enough to show them working on actual ps4's unlike xbone where they were on pc using windows 7 and a far higher graphics card than what a xbone will have in it.  xbone are being very sneaky with what their showing. rumour has it that titan fall isn't even an exclusive and will be coming to ps4 later it's a timed exclusive. still waiting to see any worth while first party games yet from microsoft. same goes for sony really, but like others are saying history time and time again the start of the generation doesn't prove nothing when it comes to games look at the last of us and then look at saints row 2 such a massive difference. and there loads. can't wait tho.

This is just proof that PS4 is inferior like I've always said.

This is just proof that PS4 is inferior like I've always said.

jimmypsn

[QUOTE="jimmypsn"]

This is just proof that PS4 is inferior like I've always said.

faizan_faizan

[QUOTE="faizan_faizan"][QUOTE="jimmypsn"]

This is just proof that PS4 is inferior like I've always said.

jimmypsn

These Games still have months till release and will get optimized so I'm not worried about performance... its good though these games were running on actual PS4 hardware !!

It's very early days yet, and at least they were brave enough to show them working on actual ps4's unlike xbone where they were on pc using windows 7 and a far higher graphics card than what a xbone will have in it. xbone are being very sneaky with what their showing. rumour has it that titan fall isn't even an exclusive and will be coming to ps4 later it's a timed exclusive. still waiting to see any worth while first party games yet from microsoft. same goes for sony really, but like others are saying history time and time again the start of the generation doesn't prove nothing when it comes to games look at the last of us and then look at saints row 2 such a massive difference. and there loads. can't wait tho.

bezza2011

Your statement is not accurate.

Read http://www.exophase.com/60348/hey-listen-a-story-about-xbox-one-demos/

That was a single demo unit, a single developer. Following the publishing of the picture, Michael Wilford went to Twitter to explain that the decision to use PC hardware was solely made by Twisted Pixel, the developers of LocoCycle.

These Games still have months till release and will get optimized so I'm not worried about performance... its good though these games were running on actual PS4 hardware !!

Malta_1980

[QUOTE="Malta_1980"]

These Games still have months till release and will get optimized so I'm not worried about performance... its good though these games were running on actual PS4 hardware !!

o0squishy0o

X1 has eSRAM which is faster than eDRAM. SRAM doesn't have refresh overheads like DRAM type technology.ronvalencia

Hey, it's the guy showing bench of lopsided scores for 1 benchmark... How you doing?

Still stuck on that whole ESRAM thing? Thought I told you to look up 5100 vs 5200... Oh and you forgot about that GT 650m.

Welcome back.

Pretty bad graphics for not even a launch game too. killzowned24

***Pukes in mouth***

Ewwhhaa... Nasty.

Sub 30 FPS too.

[QUOTE="Malta_1980"]

These Games still have months till release and will get optimized so I'm not worried about performance... its good though these games were running on actual PS4 hardware !!

o0squishy0o

Well l hope then all games will be running smoothly at 30fps which is good enough for me although 60fps would be ideal !!