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I never said arguing over sales doesn't benefit me. I just said that sales do not benefit me.Like games benefit me.
angelkimne
Sales always benefit gamers. If there are no sales, do you think you would have games like Halo 3, GTA IV, and MGS IV? Game companies aren't in this business for charity, you know.
Otherwise, you get games like Okami, Psychonauts, Shenmue, etc. that don't get revivals or sequels.
[QUOTE="mistervengeance"][QUOTE="mjarantilla"][QUOTE="mistervengeance"]hannah montana sells more records than audio slave at the moment. does that mean she is a better singer than chris cornell?
abercrombie and fitch sells millions of pre-ripped jeans for 70 bucks
mcdonalds sells millions of hamburgers
sales do not equal quality. usually, one correllates with the other, but by any means you would have to ignorant to think that just because something sells it's better than the other thing.
mjarantilla
People usually don't buy only ONE hamburger. Nor do they buy from only ONE artist, or only ONE clothing manufacturer. Such purchases are not investments, and therefore that argument is worthless and irrelevant. You'd be better to compare such purchases with game purchases. Oh, and lookit that, what games sell the most on an individual title basis? Overly hyped 360 games.
However, people DO generally buy only one television at a time, only one car at a time, only one PC at a time, just as they generally buy only one console at a time. In other words, when it comes to purchases of expensive "investment" items such as electronics, people tend to be much more scrutinizing, and you often see the products with the best balance of cost-vs-benefits rise to the top. They choose what best suits them, and people have overwhelmingly chosen the Wii.
you're giving people too much credit. most people buy the wii because it's the cool thing to have right now, and it's cheap, not because the benefits outweigh the costs. these are the reasons that things in my earlier posts sell more than real quality products.
First, YOU are not giving them enough credit. People know what's good for them better than you do, especially with something like personal entertainment.
Second, being cheap IS one of the benefits. Or do you think that cost should never be factored into investment purchases? That's why they are called "investments."
Third, "being cool" is definitely another benefit, especially when you consider the social nature of most Wii gaming. I'll bet one of the big reasons why people buy the Wii is so that other people will come over to play it with them. Why, then, should "being the cool thing to have right now" NOT be considered a positive quality of the Wii?
Fourth, unless you can prove that 99% of the people who buy Hannah Montana would never buy Audioslave, or 99% of the people who buy McDonalds would never buy any other kind of food, then your comparisons are still worthless. There is a fundamental difference in someone's decision-making when it comes to buying consumable, frequently replaced products like music, clothing, and food, compared to when they are buying expensive, long-lasting appliance products like electronics.
no, people don't know what's good for them. they know what's cool to have, what's healthy and not, etc. ultimately they trust the experts to tell them what's good for them.
the vast majority of people buy the wii because
1. it's cheap
2. it's novel
3. it's "cool" to have it right now.
MOST people don't go, "hey if i buy the wii i can get novel gameplay with the wiimote, the games are cheaper, the online is free, etc. but i guess if i do do this, i will miss out on things like next gen physics online and sound."
people will weigh the costs and benefits, but to the average person, the cost will be just the price, and the benefit will just be having a cool object. they honestly won't even take a look at the games that are on it or anything; instead just electing to buy what the media tells them is in, wii fit, etc.
[QUOTE="angelkimne"]I never said arguing over sales doesn't benefit me. I just said that sales do not benefit me.Like games benefit me.
Zhengi
Sales always benefit gamers. If there are no sales, do you think you would have games like Halo 3, GTA IV, and MGS IV? Game companies aren't in this business for charity, you know.
Otherwise, you get games like Okami, Psychonauts, Shenmue, etc. that don't get revivals or sequels.
I know but it's the game that caused the sales, not the sales that caused the games.no, people don't know what's good for them. they know what's cool to have, what's healthy and not, etc. ultimately they trust the experts to tell them what's good for them.the vast majority of people buy the wii because
1. it's cheapmistervengeance
People don't blindly buy a multi-hundred-dollar piece of electronic hardware because "it's cheap." Maybe if the Wii cost $150 or less, but $200+, people pause, think, and weigh their options, even if it's for a split-second.
2. it's novelmistervengeance
That's right, it is. Whether it's novel in practice or just novel in promise, it's still a novel concept. Now you have to ask yourself, why would people "take the leap" and buy into a product that we can all say is still only "novel in promise"? The answer is at the bottom of this post.
3. it's "cool" to have it right now.mistervengeance
it's been "cool" to have it for almost two years. Products don't stay popular for that long if there isn't some deep desire within the market for what it represents.
MOST people don't go, "hey if i buy the wii i can get novel gameplay with the wiimote, the games are cheaper, the online is free, etc. but i guess if i do do this, i will miss out on things like next gen physics online and sound."mistervengeance
That's because MOST people don't care about next gen physics, online, or sound. Maybe this fact simply escapes your little hardcore gamer mind, but in the end, graphics, hi-fi audio, physics, etc., are all just fluff. They are NOT IMPORTANT.
On an intrinsic level, most people understand this. And you can't claim it's because they just don't know what the 360 and PS3 offer them. After all, there are about four times as many ads for 360/PS3 games than there are for Wii games, and they all feature gameplay footage, real testimonials, and adrenaline-pumping action. All other things being equal, the 360 and PS3 should have outsold the Wii, or at least they should have seen much improved sales following their respective price drops. But they haven't. Why? Because people don't want the so-called "benefits" the 360 and PS3 offer. Those benefits are worthless to them, because they DON'T offer anything significant.
people will weigh the costs and benefits, but to the average person, the cost will be just the price, and the benefit will just be having a cool object.mistervengeance
Incorrect, not with major purchases like electronics. See below.
they honestly won't even take a look at the games that are on it or anything; instead just electing to buy what the media tells them is in, wii fit, etc.mistervengeance
They will not look at specifics, but they WILL look at general aspects of the product's design philosophy. The decision-making happens on a subconscious level, and at that level, when we're talking about long-term investments like electronics, the question being asked is, "Does this fit into my life the way I currently live?" A product like the Wii inspires people to imagine what the future of gaming can be like, and that's what they buy.
That brings us back to what I asked before: What does it say about the state of the rest of the gaming industry if the vast majority of people are more willing to buy into something as nebulous as a mere PROMISE, a mere FIGMENT of something different and new than to maintain the status quo?
I'll tell you what it says: it says that the gaming industry is in trouble, and the so-called "hardcore" who epitomize and venerate the status quo are part of the problem.
[QUOTE="mistervengeance"]no, people don't know what's good for them. they know what's cool to have, what's healthy and not, etc. ultimately they trust the experts to tell them what's good for them.the vast majority of people buy the wii because
1. it's cheapmjarantilla
People don't blindly buy a multi-hundred-dollar piece of electronic hardware because "it's cheap." Maybe if the Wii cost $150 or less, but $200+, people pause, think, and weigh their options, even if it's for a split-second.
it's 30 bucks cheaper than a 360, and when the salesman tells them it already comes with a game they're sold. fact is if the wii wasn't cheaper than the other two consoles there's no reason it would sell. and not just NA, i'm talking about the world. people have lives to live, your average guy that doesn't have an HDTV is not going to notice the difference in graphics and sound even if a gamestop guy shows him between the wii and 360 with that price difference. 80 bucks is a lot of money to to a lot of people.
2. it's novelmistervengeance
That's right, it is. Whether it's novel in practice or just novel in promise, it's still a novel concept. Now you have to ask yourself, why would people "take the leap" and buy into a product that we can all say is still only "novel in promise"? The answer is at the bottom of this post.
the only game that has proved the wiimote to be a novel idea that has some promise is warioware.just about every other game on the wii would have benefitted more from next gen grapics and sound than from waggle. more examples? SSBB: doesn't even use waggle. SMG, NMH: make minimal use of waggle. MP3: uses waggle to hide the REAL improvements that could have taken place such as more immersive sound and graphics, more enemies, more challenging physics puzzles, etc.
3. it's "cool" to have it right now.mistervengeance
it's been "cool" to have it for almost two years. Products don't stay popular for that long if there isn't some deep desire within the market for what it represents.
that doesn't change the fact that it sells because it's the cool. you know it does. if it sold because of what it is, every soccer mom in the united states wouldn't have it.
MOST people don't go, "hey if i buy the wii i can get novel gameplay with the wiimote, the games are cheaper, the online is free, etc. but i guess if i do do this, i will miss out on things like next gen physics online and sound."mistervengeance
That's because MOST people don't care about next gen physics, online, or sound. Maybe this fact simply escapes your little hardcore gamer mind, but in the end, graphics, hi-fi audio, physics, etc., are all just fluff. They are NOT IMPORTANT.
if you honestly believe that i am just really sorry for you
On an intrinsic level, most people understand this. And you can't claim it's because they just don't know what the 360 and PS3 offer them. After all, there are about four times as many ads for 360/PS3 games than there are for Wii games, and they all feature gameplay footage, real testimonials, and adrenaline-pumping action. All other things being equal, the 360 and PS3 should have outsold the Wii, or at least they should have seen much improved sales following their respective price drops. But they haven't. Why? Because people don't want the so-called "benefits" the 360 and PS3 offer. Those benefits are worthless to them, because they DON'T offer anything significant.
no; it's because the wii is cool and it's cheap. what does your average joe hate about it? i mean come on; how many soccer moms and old people do you see with ps3's?
360 is the only console that is marketed full circle. hardcore games for the hardcore, and it even sells to a few casuals with halo, GTA, buzz it, viva pinata, etc.
people will weigh the costs and benefits, but to the average person, the cost will be just the price, and the benefit will just be having a cool object.mistervengeance
Incorrect, not with major purchases like electronics. See below.
people don't weigh the cost and benefits of getting an ipod. people don't weigh the cost and benefits of getting a tickle me elmo. the people that buy the wii because it's the cool thing to have aren't going to care about anything but price. they aren't going to compare other consoles to see which has the best cost/benefit ratio. they're going to buy the wii because it's cool right now.
they honestly won't even take a look at the games that are on it or anything; instead just electing to buy what the media tells them is in, wii fit, etc.mistervengeance
They will not look at specifics, but they WILL look at general aspects of the product's design philosophy. The decision-making happens on a subconscious level, and at that level, when we're talking about long-term investments like electronics, the question being asked is, "Does this fit into my life the way I currently live?" A product like the Wii inspires people to imagine what the future of gaming can be like, and that's what they buy.
... you're giving far far far too much credit to people. you must live in a very smart neighborhood or something. in the real world nobody cares about much besides price in these types of things. when people buy their children a toy, they don't weigh the cost and benefits of different brands of toy past price.
That brings us back to what I asked before: What does it say about the state of the rest of the gaming industry if the vast majority of people are more willing to buy into something as nebulous as a mere PROMISE, a mere FIGMENT of something different and new than to maintain the status quo?
people buy the wii because it's cool to have and because it's cheaper than the other two consoles.
I'll tell you what it says: it says that the gaming industry is in trouble, and the so-called "hardcore" who epitomize and venerate the status quo are part of the problem.
i don't get this statement.
[QUOTE="SeanBond"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
HarlockJC
Well said. As a lifelong Nintendo fan, I'm happy for the company, as they've brought quality gaming to so many for so long. However, this generation, they seem to have decided that I'm no longer among the people they wish to bring said "quality gaming" to, so I can't help but wish their casual strategy wasn't quite so popular. A Wii with slightly stronger hardware and more "hardcore" titles that sold worse would've made me much happier than the cheaper, casual-oriented console I own right now.
You state that Nintendo has not given you qulity games this gen. In less than two years you got Zelda, SMG, SSBB, Mario Kart, MP3, Paper Mario, Mario Strikers, soon Animal Crossing, Mario Baseball and Warioland. Anyone who owned the GC would be amazed by that many quality 1st and 2nd party titles in such a short period of time.
Also any Nintendo fan knows that if Nintendo had not tried something out of the box this gen they would have died in the console market.
I don't understand where all these high and might Nintendo fans can say the Wii has such a small number of titles and get upset by it. Did they forget about the GC so soon. Heck there was almost a 6 month gap when the GC came out where there were no games coming out at all. None
I used to think that but after Nintendo basically did nothing for the hardcore at E3 then said they would not announce any new games for the rest of the year, I'm starting to disagree.
Not this doom mongering bull crap again.Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
Stevo_the_gamer
o wii is crap the only reasons it is popular are
cheap
for like 5 year olds and young kids get what they want
people like the motion controls but after they find it is crap and sell the wii to get a ps3 or 360
[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Not this doom mongering bull crap again.Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
Al3x_n90
The doom mongering bull crap is true, sorry for you if you only own a wii :P
I only have a Wii and I'm not sorry about that.
What I find funny is the way we determine the console winner this gen. It was always about sales in the previous gens until the Wii started beating the PS3/360 in sales. Then those fanboys became frantic and decided ''Oh yea? Well sales aren't important anyways".
Seriously all the consoles are fun, ubt its the fanboys that take the fun out f them.
[QUOTE="Al3x_n90"][QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Not this doom mongering bull crap again.Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
Kuhu
The doom mongering bull crap is true, sorry for you if you only own a wii :P
I only have a Wii and I'm not sorry about that.
What I find funny is the way we determine the console winner this gen. It was always about sales in the previous gens until the Wii started beating the PS3/360 in sales. Then those fanboys became frantic and decided ''Oh yea? Well sales aren't important anyways".
Seriously all the consoles are fun, ubt its the fanboys that take the fun out f them.
That;'s because previously the console with the most/best games usually sold the most, so we've never really had to think about how we determine the winner... Until now.
Is the Wii winning?
Objectively (sales): Yes.
Subjectively (games): Depends on personla opinions.
So I'd say yes. It is winning.
[QUOTE="SeanBond"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
HarlockJC
Well said. As a lifelong Nintendo fan, I'm happy for the company, as they've brought quality gaming to so many for so long. However, this generation, they seem to have decided that I'm no longer among the people they wish to bring said "quality gaming" to, so I can't help but wish their casual strategy wasn't quite so popular. A Wii with slightly stronger hardware and more "hardcore" titles that sold worse would've made me much happier than the cheaper, casual-oriented console I own right now.
You state that Nintendo has not given you qulity games this gen. In less than two years you got Zelda, SMG, SSBB, Mario Kart, MP3, Paper Mario, Mario Strikers, soon Animal Crossing, Mario Baseball and Warioland. Anyone who owned the GC would be amazed by that many quality 1st and 2nd party titles in such a short period of time.
Also any Nintendo fan knows that if Nintendo had not tried something out of the box this gen they would have died in the console market.
I don't understand where all these high and might Nintendo fans can say the Wii has such a small number of titles and get upset by it. Did they forget about the GC so soon. Heck there was almost a 6 month gap when the GC came out where there were no games coming out at all. None
And Harvest Moon: Tree of Tranquility is going to be released as well. Anyway, I agree with you Harlock. I'm really happy with all the games that have been releaseed and that are going to be released. It's awesome.
[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Not this doom mongering bull crap again.Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
Al3x_n90
The doom mongering bull crap is true, sorry for you if you only own a wii :P
I also own a 360 and the wii's casual direction isn't effecting the steady flow of great titles coming out for it.That is why the whole "wii is killing gaming" mentality is a bunch of doom mongering bullcrap.
it's 30 bucks cheaper than a 360mistervengeance
Well, OMFG, it's 10% cheaper than the 360! ZOMGZORZ!
and when the salesman tells them it already comes with a game they're sold. fact is if the wii wasn't cheaper than the other two consoles there's no reason it would sell. and not just NA, i'm talking about the world. people have lives to live, your average guy that doesn't have an HDTV is not going to notice the difference in graphics and sound even if a gamestop guy shows him between the wii and 360 with that price difference. 80 bucks is a lot of money to to a lot of people.mistervengeance
the only game that has proved the wiimote to be a novel idea that has some promise is warioware. just about every other game on the wii would have benefitted more from next gen grapics and sound than from waggle. more examples? mistervengeance
Ooookay....let me repeat myself since my point apparently escaped you:
Why would people "take the leap" and buy into a product that we can all say is still only "novel in promise"?
SSBB: doesn't even use waggle. SMG, NMH: make minimal use of waggle. MP3: uses waggle to hide the REAL improvements that could have taken place such as more immersive sound and graphics, more enemies, more challenging physics puzzles, etc.mistervengeance
More enemies? Metroid Prime isn't about having "more enemies," it's about explorations. Yet another fundamental misunderstanding by you.
Physics puzzles? No such thing. Complex physics interactions is too difficult to predict, which makes puzzles impossible to plan. The only games to use physics puzzles are Half-Life 2 and Portal, and both use very simplistic puzzles that Metroid Prime could easily duplicate. Oh yes, and this is yet another fundamental misunderstanding on your part.
that doesn't change the fact that it sells because it's the cool. you know it does. if it sold because of what it is, every soccer mom in the united states wouldn't have it.mistervengeance
Didn't I just say that? Of course it's "cool." But it's cool for a reason. A reason which escapes your little mind because you, like most System Wars fanboys, are not normal.
if you honestly believe that i am just really sorry for youmistervengeance
Go ahead. It doesn't make me wrong. Actually, it makes me realize that you are simply that much more superficial than normal people.
no; it's because the wii is cool and it's cheap.mistervengeance
Keep repeating that like a mantra. Maybe you'll self-hypnotize yourself into a permanent trance and remove yourself from the gene pool.
what does your average joe hate about it? i mean come on; how many soccer moms and old people do you see with ps3's?mistervengeance
You mean how many normal people do I see with PS3s? Not many. That's a GOOD thing. It means they realize just how irrelevant the PS3 (and 360) really are in their lives.
360 is the only console that is marketed full circle. hardcore games for the hardcore,mistervengeance
LOL at the 360 having hardcore games. Sorry, but no. It has almost no hardcore games. The few that it has, like BioShock, it shares with the PC. The vast, vast majority of its games are adolescent games created to indulge in violent fantasies, nothing more. Those aren't hardcore.
and it even sells to a few casuals with halo, GTA, buzz it, viva pinata, etc.mistervengeanceAnd you wonder why the 360's sales are tanking.
people don't weigh the cost and benefits of getting an ipod.mistervengeance
Yes, they do. If they didn't, then people would own ten iPods apiece.
people don't weigh the cost and benefits of getting a tickle me elmo.mistervengeance
A Tickle Me Elmo costs about $40. That puts it squarely within the price range of a consumable, not an investment.
You really have a problem understanding these concepts, don't you? I'm guessing you haven't gone to college yet.
the people that buy the wii because it's the cool thing to have aren't going to care about anything but price.mistervengeance
*sigh*
Have you hypnotized yourself yet?
they aren't going to compare other consoles to see which has the best cost/benefit ratio.mistervengeance
Oh yeah, absolutely. They totally DON'T see the hundred 360s and PS3s stacked up next to it.
they're going to buy the wii because it's cool right now.mistervengeance
You are getting very...very....sleeeeeepy.
... you're giving far far far too much credit to people. you must live in a very smart neighborhood or something.mistervengeance
Yes. It's called Earth. You must live on the moon.
in the real world nobody cares about much besides price in these types of things. when people buy their children a toy, they don't weigh the cost and benefits of different brands of toy past price.mistervengeance
Immaturity, a lack of respect for adults' judgements, an inability to understand the notion of value. I sense a teenager's bitterness towards his/her parents.
people buy the wii because it's cool to have and because it's cheaper than the other two consoles.mistervengeance
.....snoooooorrrrrreeeee......
i don't get this statement.
mistervengeance
Of course you don't.
*pats mistervengeance on the head patronizingly and smiles*
What? is there a new definition of winning or something?
Largest marketshare = win.
Is there something I missed?
heretrix
Yes. You missed the screaming, crying hardcore fanboys who want to rewrite the rules because THIS time, it doesn't suit them.
[QUOTE="heretrix"]What? is there a new definition of winning or something?
Largest marketshare = win.
Is there something I missed?
mjarantilla
Yes. You missed the screaming, crying hardcore fanboys who want to rewrite the rules because THIS time, it doesn't suit them.
I didn't miss that. I just ignore it.I'm not into the Wii at all, but anybody that thinks it isn't winning isn't worth paying attention to.
hey guys if the wii fanboys enjoy playing 2 games a year and sales for the rest, leave them be. apprantly "sales" is the best game ever made......gongytron
for the short-sighted people: sales brings more games... not immediately, they take time, but patience is obviously something that is lacking in some people
[QUOTE="gongytron"]hey guys if the wii fanboys enjoy playing 2 games a year and sales for the rest, leave them be. apprantly "sales" is the best game ever made......ogvampire
for the short-sighted people: sales brings more games... not immediately, they take time, but patience is obviously something that is lacking in some people
Honestly, I'm a big Wii fan, but I think that the "sales brings more games" part of your statement won't come true until the Wii 2.
[QUOTE="ogvampire"][QUOTE="gongytron"]hey guys if the wii fanboys enjoy playing 2 games a year and sales for the rest, leave them be. apprantly "sales" is the best game ever made......mjarantilla
for the short-sighted people: sales brings more games... not immediately, they take time, but patience is obviously something that is lacking in some people
Honestly, I'm a big Wii fan, but I think that the "sales brings more games" part of your statement won't come true until the Wii 2.
maybe. although i do see more and more announcements from devs saying that they will work on games for the Wii
[QUOTE="Al3x_n90"][QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Not this doom mongering bull crap again.Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
Kuhu
The doom mongering bull crap is true, sorry for you if you only own a wii :P
I only have a Wii and I'm not sorry about that.
What I find funny is the way we determine the console winner this gen. It was always about sales in the previous gens until the Wii started beating the PS3/360 in sales. Then those fanboys became frantic and decided ''Oh yea? Well sales aren't important anyways".
Seriously all the consoles are fun, ubt its the fanboys that take the fun out f them.
This is really annoying, i remember that the GC had very good games, some are excellent, but no, that doesnt matter at all, because it was 3rd on the sales and Nintendo sucks, now the Wii still have great games with (lets be honest) lot of shovelware, and its winning, but no, now that doesnt matter, cause, well, Nintendo still sucks according to the fanboys, seriously guys, Nintendo is winning, Deal with it.
This is really annoying, i remember that the GC had very good games, some are excellent, but no, that doesnt matter at all, because it was 3rd on the sales and Nintendo sucks, now the Wii still have great games with (lets be honest) lot of shovelware, and its winning, but no, now that doesnt matter, cause, well, Nintendo still sucks according to the fanboys, seriously guys, Nintendo is winning, Deal with it.
madsnakehhh
The Gamecube had fewer quality games than the other consoles
Gamerankings AA and up rated games :
PS2: 200 +
Xbox: 200 +
GC: 106
[QUOTE="gongytron"]hey guys if the wii fanboys enjoy playing 2 games a year and sales for the rest, leave them be. apprantly "sales" is the best game ever made......ogvampire
for the short-sighted people: sales brings more games... not immediately, they take time, but patience is obviously something that is lacking in some people
Coming from a console that has weaker hardware on par with that of a PS2 and is selling the most. You'd think developers could push games out for the Nintendo Wii much faster. Yet games for PS3 and XBOX360 are coming out in droves. Why? Nintendo doesn't care about you thats why.
[QUOTE="HarlockJC"][QUOTE="SeanBond"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
SeanBond
Well said. As a lifelong Nintendo fan, I'm happy for the company, as they've brought quality gaming to so many for so long. However, this generation, they seem to have decided that I'm no longer among the people they wish to bring said "quality gaming" to, so I can't help but wish their casual strategy wasn't quite so popular. A Wii with slightly stronger hardware and more "hardcore" titles that sold worse would've made me much happier than the cheaper, casual-oriented console I own right now.
You state that Nintendo has not given you qulity games this gen. In less than two years you got Zelda, SMG, SSBB, Mario Kart, MP3, Paper Mario, Mario Strikers, soon Animal Crossing, Mario Baseball and Warioland. Anyone who owned the GC would be amazed by that many quality 1st and 2nd party titles in such a short period of time.
Also any Nintendo fan knows that if Nintendo had not tried something out of the box this gen they would have died in the console market.
I don't understand where all these high and might Nintendo fans can say the Wii has such a small number of titles and get upset by it. Did they forget about the GC so soon. Heck there was almost a 6 month gap when the GC came out where there were no games coming out at all. None
The problem isn't the complete lack of titles, it's the lack of titles that justify the Wii; the majority of games you just listed don't seem like they'd play or even look all that different if played on a Gamecube (with Zelda, a port, being the most obvious evidence of this). The issue is that the new IPs that Nintendo is working on, the new titles that actually use the Wii to its full extent (or at least justify it as some sort of "revolution") are targeted towards non-gamers, not traditional gamers. It's almost as if they're churning out formulaic sequels to their old titles to keep the old guard happy, while using their think tank to target the new casual fanbase that's making them such a hit.
thats my main problem with the wii the above poser (Harlock) was basicaly saying, "they have given you some games shut up" but the problem is these games are either relly bad rehash games (like mariocart ot SSBB, yes that too) infact the only decent sequal i have seen on the Wii is SMG (MP3 is a tired old formula)
the problem is that waht you say looks good on paper but when you actually get to playing them you find that you have not only done all this before last gen, but that it even looks exactly the same
thats not even mentioning the casul and kiddy issues.
[QUOTE="Kuhu"][QUOTE="Al3x_n90"][QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Not this doom mongering bull crap again.Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
madsnakehhh
The doom mongering bull crap is true, sorry for you if you only own a wii :P
I only have a Wii and I'm not sorry about that.
What I find funny is the way we determine the console winner this gen. It was always about sales in the previous gens until the Wii started beating the PS3/360 in sales. Then those fanboys became frantic and decided ''Oh yea? Well sales aren't important anyways".
Seriously all the consoles are fun, ubt its the fanboys that take the fun out f them.
This is really annoying, i remember that the GC had very good games, some are excellent, but no, that doesnt matter at all, because it was 3rd on the sales and Nintendo sucks, now the Wii still have great games with (lets be honest) lot of shovelware, and its winning, but no, now that doesnt matter, cause, well, Nintendo still sucks according to the fanboys, seriously guys, Nintendo is winning, Deal with it.
What do you expect, this whole board is being run by children. You can't expect perfect good behaviour. But yes, it is annoying.
People are just in denial mode this generation.
[QUOTE="ogvampire"][QUOTE="gongytron"]hey guys if the wii fanboys enjoy playing 2 games a year and sales for the rest, leave them be. apprantly "sales" is the best game ever made......Dahaka-UK
for the short-sighted people: sales brings more games... not immediately, they take time, but patience is obviously something that is lacking in some people
Coming from a console that has weaker hardware on par with that of a PS2 and is selling the most. You'd think developers could push games out for the Nintendo Wii much faster. Yet games for PS3 and XBOX360 are coming out in droves. Why? Nintendo doesn't care about you thats why.
Games for the PS3 and 360 were started three or four years ago when everyone assumed that the PS3 and 360 would win. Of course they're coming out now.
thats my main problem with the wii the above poser (Harlock) was basicaly saying, "they have given you some games shut up" but the problem is these games are either relly bad rehash games (like mariocart ot SSBB, yes that too) infact the only decent sequal i have seen on the Wii is SMG (MP3 is a tired old formula)
the problem is that waht you say looks good on paper but when you actually get to playing them you find that you have not only done all this before last gen, but that it even looks exactly the same
thats not even mentioning the casul and kiddy issues.
thegoldenpoo
you say that those games are bad, but quite alot of people disagree with you... like for instance the fact that all those 'bad rehashes' scored higher than their previous installments
[QUOTE="thegoldenpoo"]thats my main problem with the wii the above poser (Harlock) was basicaly saying, "they have given you some games shut up" but the problem is these games are either relly bad rehash games (like mariocart ot SSBB, yes that too) infact the only decent sequal i have seen on the Wii is SMG (MP3 is a tired old formula)
the problem is that waht you say looks good on paper but when you actually get to playing them you find that you have not only done all this before last gen, but that it even looks exactly the same
thats not even mentioning the casul and kiddy issues.
ogvampire
you say that those games are bad, but quite alot of people disagree with you... like for instance the fact that all those 'bad rehashes' scored higher than their previous installments
this is all my opinion, you can't deny the criminal similarites in mario kart and even some stripping down for the casuals. if you take to most swerious gamers with a wii they won't have touched it in months. thats the situation with most of my freinds and people i know.it the fact that the gameplay is no different than it was with the game cube.RagashahsThe gameplay isn't different? You mean like the difference between Halo 1, and Halo 3? Or are you comparing to the differences between DMC 3 and 4? Gran Turismo 2 and GT5 Prolouge? What you are saying is you dont like any games at all then correct?
[QUOTE="ogvampire"][QUOTE="thegoldenpoo"]thats my main problem with the wii the above poser (Harlock) was basicaly saying, "they have given you some games shut up" but the problem is these games are either relly bad rehash games (like mariocart ot SSBB, yes that too) infact the only decent sequal i have seen on the Wii is SMG (MP3 is a tired old formula)
the problem is that waht you say looks good on paper but when you actually get to playing them you find that you have not only done all this before last gen, but that it even looks exactly the same
thats not even mentioning the casul and kiddy issues.
thegoldenpoo
you say that those games are bad, but quite alot of people disagree with you... like for instance the fact that all those 'bad rehashes' scored higher than their previous installments
this is all my opinion, you can't deny the criminal similarites in mario kart and even some stripping down for the casuals. if you take to most swerious gamers with a wii they won't have touched it in months. thats the situation with most of my freinds and people i know.Nintendo wants the game console to "disappear" into a household. Meaning, they want it to be treated like any other entertainment device, like a DVD player or an MP3 player: something you use only when you feel like it.
Compare that to Microsoft and Sony's approach, which is to keep you playing as long and as hard and as often as possible. Is that really what people want the future of gaming to be?
Consider this analogy: Do YOU obsessively buy every new movie that comes out on DVD? I doubt it. Even if you were a hardcore videophile, you still wouldn't spend nearly as much time watching movies as many hardcore gamers spend playing video games.
Achievements, trophies, unlockables, downloadable content, etc. Instead of promoting gaming as a leisure activity to be enjoyed, the hardcore approach that MS and Sony espouse has transformed gaming into a skill to be perfected and obsessed over so that that obsessiveness can be exploited by corporations.
[QUOTE="ogvampire"][QUOTE="thegoldenpoo"]thats my main problem with the wii the above poser (Harlock) was basicaly saying, "they have given you some games shut up" but the problem is these games are either relly bad rehash games (like mariocart ot SSBB, yes that too) infact the only decent sequal i have seen on the Wii is SMG (MP3 is a tired old formula)
the problem is that waht you say looks good on paper but when you actually get to playing them you find that you have not only done all this before last gen, but that it even looks exactly the same
thats not even mentioning the casul and kiddy issues.
thegoldenpoo
you say that those games are bad, but quite alot of people disagree with you... like for instance the fact that all those 'bad rehashes' scored higher than their previous installments
this is all my opinion, you can't deny the criminal similarites in mario kart and even some stripping down for the casuals. if you take to most swerious gamers with a wii they won't have touched it in months. thats the situation with most of my freinds and people i know.you think MKWii is too similar to Mario Kart GC? you can say that, but you pretty much decide to overlook all the content that MKWii has added over its predecessor. if so, then you could say the same about quite alot of 360 games too. Halo3 anyone?
[QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]you hit the nail right on the head. How long can the wii hold on to the casuals?yup he did , and good QNintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
spencer_119
but seriously, I will never accept that we lose:P
Nintendo is winning, gamers are losing.
TheGrat1
Good. Gamers need to lose every once in a while.
[QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]Nintendo will win in the end.
Gamers will lose in the end.
Which do you care about more?
SeanBond
Well said. As a lifelong Nintendo fan, I'm happy for the company, as they've brought quality gaming to so many for so long. However, this generation, they seem to have decided that I'm no longer among the people they wish to bring said "quality gaming" to, so I can't help but wish their casual strategy wasn't quite so popular. A Wii with slightly stronger hardware and more "hardcore" titles that sold worse would've made me much happier than the cheaper, casual-oriented console I own right now.
but they have brought out quality
zelda TP, metroid prime 3, SSBB, super mario galaxy, maybe add Mario Kart Wii to the list
games like Wii Sports are only a bit shallower than Mario Party IMO
more games are on the horizon .. animal crossing, eventually more mario and zelda, pikmin 3, perhaps kid icarus, and hopefully more f-zero, starfox etc
nintendo haven't abandoned hardcore gamers .. they're just less focused on us .. can you blame them though, their titles like wii fit are selling loads .. they're a business and are in it to make money first and foremost
if they tried to cater to the traditional gamer like they did with the GC, then they may have died out / become a third party developer eventually
nintendo fans just need to have some patience .. and perhaps buy a 360/PS3 if they can, and relegate the wii to a secondary console if they're not using it that often
because eventually they may: want a wii / be glad they kept it / regret selling it and contemplate rebuying it
[QUOTE="mjarantilla"][QUOTE="TheGrat1"]Nintendo is winning, gamers are losing.
opex07
Good. Gamers need to lose every once in a while.
the last time Gamers lost, the console game market crashed.
last time i checked the videogame market was bigger than ever and its only expanding...
[QUOTE="opex07"][QUOTE="mjarantilla"][QUOTE="TheGrat1"]Nintendo is winning, gamers are losing.
ogvampire
Good. Gamers need to lose every once in a while.
the last time Gamers lost, the console game market crashed.
ok, so? last time i checked the videogame market was bigger than ever and its only expanding...
Expanding in the wrong way.[QUOTE="opex07"][QUOTE="mjarantilla"][QUOTE="TheGrat1"]Nintendo is winning, gamers are losing.
ogvampire
Good. Gamers need to lose every once in a while.
the last time Gamers lost, the console game market crashed.
last time i checked the videogame market was bigger than ever and its only expanding...
it was getting bigger before the crash as well.
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