Face it. Blu-Ray is NEEDED! ***edited with new dev comments***

Ironically the only reason Blu-Ray is needed is because Blu-Rays read speed is so slow they have to duplicate information on the disc.TellDaddy

And that is why I won't but a PS3 at this price point. 

[QUOTE="TekkenMaster606"]Some people can't stop and look more than a year or two ahead of them. But when your favorite console maker is known for short lifespans, why should you?XboxUnderground

short lifespans/

the xbox lifespan was TOO LONG

personally I think consoles should be 3 years between releases 

lol, you realize the gaming business would fall apart don't you?  The sweet spot is when the hardware drops in price to the point casuals take the plunge and buy into the console.  If you kill the console right when they migh tbe thinking of buying one, that means you are stuck with only hardcore gamers essentially.  Not exactly the way to expand your business if you ask me.

[QUOTE="TekkenMaster606"]Some people can't stop and look more than a year or two ahead of them. But when your favorite console maker is known for short lifespans, why should you?makingmusic476

But to let the fanboys tell the story you would think that MS has a loooong track record of short spanned consoles, which is false. Everyone with open eyes know that the Xbox1 was just a test console, a venture to see if they could compete in a market foreign to them.

Now that we have the 360 that launched in 05 (the beginning of the next-gen era), we have the Sony clan hyping and trying to make a case about Blu-ray and how people who are happily playing HD games on DVD-9 (PC , 360) need to look into the future...Well guess what brainiacs the full lifecycle of the 360 will be complete by 2010-11 while the PS3 will finally be at full capacity ready to show its fans what they waited for over the years...basically its too damn late to the dance!!!!

Next gen is the era where consoles will need to evolve to the greater capacity disk or digital distribution, not now....Blu-ray for gaming now is the equivalent of a company pushing CD as a needed format during the 16-bit era as a rival to the Genesis and SNES....The reason Blu-ray hasnt became the standard this gen is very simple: too expensive tech, not enough performance, currently offering nothing more to the consumer to win them over to the new format other than blind fanboys.

I said it once and I'll continue saying it until Sony proves otherwise...When the PS3 has a AAA title that clearly screams to the world BLU-RAY IS NEEDED FOR GAMING!!!! Only then will I accept the DVD-9 is a obsolete format, otherwise Sony is just blowing smoke!!!

Game On... 

Some of you are getting way too hung up on the word "needed". Obviously nothing is "needed", you can get by on old CD-ROMS or MiniDiscs if that's what you choose. Are these things beneficial? Would all the multiplats made for a DVD9 benefit from being designed for a larger format? Of course.

If all you can do is debate the word needed, there isn't a debate.  

D_Znuhtz

[QUOTE="Itagaki"]

The screen resolution for Xbox 360 games will be in high definition, so the pre-rendered movies are going to be pretty large. If we encoded the Dead or Alive 4 trailer from E3 in high definition in a quality acceptable to us, it will easily be about 2GB. [...] With DOA4, we'll be using the disc's capacity to its full extent. We started development on DOA4 pretty early, and we didn't know what disc format the Xbox 360 was going to adopt. So when we learned about it, we were really knocked out.

makingmusic476

:| A trailer is pretty much 10 billion pictures flashed one after another, that's why a trailer takes up so much space. Rendering something on the engine takes much less space.

[QUOTE="D_Znuhtz"]

Some of you are getting way too hung up on the word "needed". Obviously nothing is "needed", you can get by on old CD-ROMS or MiniDiscs if that's what you choose. Are these things beneficial? Would all the multiplats made for a DVD9 benefit from being designed for a larger format? Of course.

If all you can do is debate the word needed, there isn't a debate.

makingmusic476

Blu-Ray isn't needed. PS3 comes with a standard HDD, games could come on CDs you'd just need to install the game. 

[QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="D_Znuhtz"]

Some of you are getting way too hung up on the word "needed". Obviously nothing is "needed", you can get by on old CD-ROMS or MiniDiscs if that's what you choose. Are these things beneficial? Would all the multiplats made for a DVD9 benefit from being designed for a larger format? Of course.

If all you can do is debate the word needed, there isn't a debate.

thirstychainsaw

Blu-Ray isn't needed. PS3 comes with a standard HDD, games could come on CDs you'd just need to install the game. 

People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.Japanese_Monk

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On.... 

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On.... 

[QUOTE="makingmusic476"]

[QUOTE="Itagaki"]

The screen resolution for Xbox 360 games will be in high definition, so the pre-rendered movies are going to be pretty large. If we encoded the Dead or Alive 4 trailer from E3 in high definition in a quality acceptable to us, it will easily be about 2GB. [...] With DOA4, we'll be using the disc's capacity to its full extent. We started development on DOA4 pretty early, and we didn't know what disc format the Xbox 360 was going to adopt. So when we learned about it, we were really knocked out.

thirstychainsaw

:| A trailer is pretty much 10 billion pictures flashed one after another, that's why a trailer takes up so much space. Rendering something on the engine takes much less space.

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.makingmusic476

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard. 

Game On... 

[QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard. 

Game On... 

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

[QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard. 

Game On... 

Team Ninja, Bioware, and Factor 5 are not Sony's yes-men. You say that Blu-Ray will be the disk format to use for the generation after this one, yet then you say it'll die this gen?

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.makingmusic476

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On... 

[QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On... 

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.CJL13

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Team Ninja, Bioware, and Factor 5 are not Sony's yes-men. You say that Blu-Ray will be the disk format to use for the generation after this one, yet then you say it'll die this gen?

You missed the point completely young padawan...Blu-ray would have been a great format to intorduce next gen, but its pointless now....Its the equivalent of someone trying to introduce the overly expensive 1gb flash drive during a era when 3.5 floppies were more than enough. You are paying for a format that the industry as a whole is not supporting. No games have been created or even mentioned that can clearly make a case for the need of a blu-ray disk. The content that claimed to need the extra space does not perform, look, or extend the experience anymore than plain ole DVD.

You are buying hype, a movie format, nothing applicable for gaming this gen!

Game On.....

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.makingmusic476

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked. 

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On... 

MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.Fruity_Fantasy

Heh, Sony was in the business before MS (console-wise)

[QUOTE="Fruity_Fantasy"]MS and Nintendo have been involved in the gaming biz a lot longer than SOny , so I couldn't care if Sony or some uneducated cow thinks it is needed.aaron6581230

Heh, Sony was in the business before MS (console-wise)

I do believe the person said GAMING BIZ, not console biz.... Gaming has always been about format quality vs. price. Reading is funadamental.

Game On... 

People like you need to realize that Blu Ray is NOT needed. At this point, it's just nice to have. When the average game fills a DVD 9 and multiple disc games become a standard, then a higher capacity disc format will be necessary. In a few years when the aforementioned conditions are met, then Blu Ray will be necessary.

Bottom line, as long as games are still fitting on DVD 9's with space to spare, Blu Ray will not be necessary.

The_Game21x

I once heard someone say on these forums "if technology was left up to people like you, we'd still have black and white TVs".

[QUOTE="The_Game21x"]

People like you need to realize that Blu Ray is NOT needed. At this point, it's just nice to have. When the average game fills a DVD 9 and multiple disc games become a standard, then a higher capacity disc format will be necessary. In a few years when the aforementioned conditions are met, then Blu Ray will be necessary.

Bottom line, as long as games are still fitting on DVD 9's with space to spare, Blu Ray will not be necessary.

Evil-Zero86

I once heard someone say on these forums "if technology was left up to people like you, we'd still have black and white TVs".

Im sure you would be the same person trying to a give a cellphone to Alexander Gram Bell. Technology will progress at its own pace, there is no need for blu-ray this gen....The industry has shown and proved this point with each game that launches this gen.

Game On... 

[QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked. 

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On... 

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.CJL13

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked. 

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On... 

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

Necessary if you want only 1 disc... irrelevant if you just want to play the dam game.

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.CJL13

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked.

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On...

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

You are straddling the fence on the issue, either Blu-ray is needed or it isnt. The industry has proven its is not needed to make great HD games this gen. Just as I mentioned in previous posts that there are a few devs that feel space may become a problem, but overall they are doing alot of barking and thats it, no action is being taken to push for a more capacity format. None of the devs mentioned has said they obsolutely, 100% refuse to support a format that they deem obsolete. They are just mumbling all the way to the bank with their DVD-9 game titles....voices unheard under the sound of the cash registers ringing of their games!!!

During the 16-bit era there were a few companies that attempted to do with CD what Sony is currently doing with blu-ray, trying to FORCE a standard, and not let it develop naturally. During those days you would hear quotes from Sega and other early CD supporters claim cartridges were running out of room for the content they want to create.....the only problem was they were a generation too early!!! All CD based systems tanked horribly and devs refused to leave to standard format of the cartridge. Only once the industry as a whole considered the possibilities of a greater capacity format (the following generation) did CD began to take off as the standard for consoles.

I dont know where you are getting all this "PS3 will fail/die" talk, Im talking about Blu-ray falling off the map this gen as a viable format. Sony can try again next gen when it will be required to have more content than a DVD can hold, but not now and not anytime soon (as clearly indicated by the content coming this gen).

Game On... 

[QUOTE="CJL13"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked.

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On...

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

You are straddling the fence on the issue, either Blu-ray is needed or it isnt. The industry has proven its is not needed to make great HD games this gen. Just as I mentioned in previous posts that there are a few devs that feel space may become a problem, but overall they are doing alot of barking and thats it, no action is being taken to push for a more capacity format. None of the devs mentioned has said they obsolutely, 100% refuse to support a format that they deem obsolete. They are just mumbling all the way to the bank with their DVD-9 game titles....voices unheard under the sound of the cash registers ringing of their games!!!

During the 16-bit era there were a few companies that attempted to do with CD what Sony is currently doing with blu-ray, trying to FORCE a standard, and not let it develop naturally. During those days you would hear quotes from Sega and other early CD supporters claim cartridges were running out of room for the content they want to create.....the only problem was they were a generation too early!!! All CD based systems tanked horribly and devs refused to leave to standard format of the cartridge. Only once the industry as a whole considered the possibilities of a greater capacity format (the following generation) did CD began to take off as the standard for consoles.

I dont know where you are getting all this "PS3 will fail/die" talk, Im talking about Blu-ray falling off the map this gen as a viable format. Sony can try again next gen when it will be required to have more content than a DVD can hold, but not now and not anytime soon (as clearly indicated by the content coming this gen).

Game On... 

I just feel that Blu-Ray will be needed before this gen ends, and these comments prove it.

[QUOTE="thirstychainsaw"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="D_Znuhtz"]

Some of you are getting way too hung up on the word "needed". Obviously nothing is "needed", you can get by on old CD-ROMS or MiniDiscs if that's what you choose. Are these things beneficial? Would all the multiplats made for a DVD9 benefit from being designed for a larger format? Of course.

If all you can do is debate the word needed, there isn't a debate.

makingmusic476

Blu-Ray isn't needed. PS3 comes with a standard HDD, games could come on CDs you'd just need to install the game.

5GB a game on a 60GB hard drive? You could install ten games and still have space left over, the PS3's hard drive is also upgradable. Blu-Ray isn't needed on the 360. Games are already in high definition and when was the last time we didn't have multiple disced games? The SNES? 

RIGHT NOW blu ray I THINK is a luxury, MGS4 could be done on multiple DVD9s I would hope if not then there is a problem.

PCs will never need blu ray cause they keep pushing for larger hardrives i mean 2X500GB = 1TB FTW.

So I would say Blu Ray isn't NEEDED and if it is an absolute for a game then there is an issue.

Now down the road who knows how advance games get perhaps it may be NEEDED but RIGHT NOW it isn't I mean the 360 is doing fine and it doesn't have blu ray.

The physics behind blu ray is a lot more efficient (slower at this point yes, but smarter) than DVD though which is why I do admire the technology. 

Or games will go back to cartridges FLASH DRIVE GAMES FTW YES lol.

I guess only time will tell what format is truly needed.  

http://gamesfirst.com/?id=1132

/thread

wmc540

I knew someone would dredge up that old tripe. Allow me to debunk it (yet again)...

A few weeks ago, the Xbox 360 modding community figured out a way to pull raw data dumps from the Xbox 360 discs, giving the scene access to their raw sizes. Unfortunately, we don't have the data for every game in the launch line-up; in fact, we only have the data from 4, which is hardly statistically representative. Still, we work with what we have.

These are the sizes that we know:

• Condemned: 3.9 GB
• Madden 06 NFL: 3.3 GB
• Dead or Alive 4: 5 GB
• NBA 06: 4.5 GB

Average: 4.18 GB or 49% of the DVD9 capacity.

fanboy article

The sizes are incorrect for the games he has listed and we can now take a look at the average size of all the launch games:

Condemned: 7.3GB

Madden 06 NFL: 6.5GB

DOA 4: 4.4GB

NBA 06: 4.4GB

PDZ: 6.6GB

PGR3: 7.1GB

COD2: 7.3GB

Need for Speed: Most Wanted: 5.6GB

King Kong: 6.5GB

GUN:7GB

Kameo: 7.1GB

THAW: 6.9GB

Quake 4: 5.1GB

Ridge Racer 6: 5.5GB

Tiger Woods PGA Tour 06: 5.1GB

Amped 3: 7.2GB

FIFA 06: 4.2GB

NHL 2K6: 4.6GB

NBA Live: 6.9GB

( source )

Average (of all launch games): 6.4GB, 75% of DVD9's capacity.

Assuming the authors growth rate of 77% is correct by the end of the Xbox 360's life span the average game should be 11.2GB or 2 DVD9s.

Blu-ray isn't needed.  Blu-ray is a costly, extra prephiral that is NOT needed for today's games. The people who say that Blu-ray is needed are just biased.

Hideo Kojima COULDN'T EVEN FILL A SINGLE DVD. Read me, and I shall repeat for fanboys; HE COULD NOT FILL A SINGLE DVD. He filled it about halfway. And him saying that Blu-ray is too small? :lol: Get outta here, Kojima. By the way, the three people the TC posted are associated and paid by Sony to say this. No actual unbiased game developer / publisher has said you needed Blu-ray this gen. As an example, Gears of War only took about 5 GB of data. Gears of War currently has the best graphics in any game right now, and it only takes up half a DVD and it took 2 years to make. If anything (and it rarely will) goes over the 9 GB limit, COMPRESS IT. Then it'll fit on a DVD.

/Thread. 

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="CJL13"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.CJL13

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked.

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On...

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

You are straddling the fence on the issue, either Blu-ray is needed or it isnt. The industry has proven its is not needed to make great HD games this gen. Just as I mentioned in previous posts that there are a few devs that feel space may become a problem, but overall they are doing alot of barking and thats it, no action is being taken to push for a more capacity format. None of the devs mentioned has said they obsolutely, 100% refuse to support a format that they deem obsolete. They are just mumbling all the way to the bank with their DVD-9 game titles....voices unheard under the sound of the cash registers ringing of their games!!!

During the 16-bit era there were a few companies that attempted to do with CD what Sony is currently doing with blu-ray, trying to FORCE a standard, and not let it develop naturally. During those days you would hear quotes from Sega and other early CD supporters claim cartridges were running out of room for the content they want to create.....the only problem was they were a generation too early!!! All CD based systems tanked horribly and devs refused to leave to standard format of the cartridge. Only once the industry as a whole considered the possibilities of a greater capacity format (the following generation) did CD began to take off as the standard for consoles.

I dont know where you are getting all this "PS3 will fail/die" talk, Im talking about Blu-ray falling off the map this gen as a viable format. Sony can try again next gen when it will be required to have more content than a DVD can hold, but not now and not anytime soon (as clearly indicated by the content coming this gen).

Game On... 

I just feel that Blu-Ray will be needed before this gen ends, and these comments prove it.

We are consumers and we have a right to feel technology should be more advanced than it currently is..bottom line it isnt and we need to deal with it!!!...Hell, if you asked me ten years ago if we would still sit in front of a tv with a standard controller and not interact in some virtual world (VR tech was really big in the early 90's), I would feel you wasnt thinking out of the box. 

But overall Blu-ray is not needed this gen and the industry has in no way, shape, or form has shown any support of the format.

Game On...

[QUOTE="CJL13"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="CJL13"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.FatalDomain

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked.

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On...

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

You are straddling the fence on the issue, either Blu-ray is needed or it isnt. The industry has proven its is not needed to make great HD games this gen. Just as I mentioned in previous posts that there are a few devs that feel space may become a problem, but overall they are doing alot of barking and thats it, no action is being taken to push for a more capacity format. None of the devs mentioned has said they obsolutely, 100% refuse to support a format that they deem obsolete. They are just mumbling all the way to the bank with their DVD-9 game titles....voices unheard under the sound of the cash registers ringing of their games!!!

During the 16-bit era there were a few companies that attempted to do with CD what Sony is currently doing with blu-ray, trying to FORCE a standard, and not let it develop naturally. During those days you would hear quotes from Sega and other early CD supporters claim cartridges were running out of room for the content they want to create.....the only problem was they were a generation too early!!! All CD based systems tanked horribly and devs refused to leave to standard format of the cartridge. Only once the industry as a whole considered the possibilities of a greater capacity format (the following generation) did CD began to take off as the standard for consoles.

I dont know where you are getting all this "PS3 will fail/die" talk, Im talking about Blu-ray falling off the map this gen as a viable format. Sony can try again next gen when it will be required to have more content than a DVD can hold, but not now and not anytime soon (as clearly indicated by the content coming this gen).

Game On... 

I just feel that Blu-Ray will be needed before this gen ends, and these comments prove it.

We are consumers and we have a right to feel technology should be more advanced than it currently is..bottom line it isnt and we need to deal with it!!!...Hell, if you asked me ten years ago if we would still sit in front of a tv with a standard controller and not interact in some virtual world (VR tech was really big in the early 90's), I would feel you wasnt thinking out of the box. 

But overall Blu-ray is not needed this gen and the industry has in no way, shape, or form has shown any support of the format.

Game On...

Maybe the reason is that the blu-ray format for games have only been released for HALF A YEAR. Give it time. Don't jump to conclusions at the beginning of the generation as there's still a long way to go. What you say isn't always fact

[QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="CJL13"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="CJL13"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"][QUOTE="makingmusic476"][QUOTE="FatalDomain"]

[QUOTE="Japanese_Monk"]People who say Bluray isnt needed are in denial. Lems im looking at you. Its funny how you guys can bash Wii for its poor grphx but then you act like something nex gen like 50 gb disk is no big deal. More space is always a plus. Thats why i like sony. They always push the next media format.aaron6581230

You like Sony just because you like Sony...simple as that!! You enjoy buying products that sound great on paper and tech demos but fail in lack of execution. The PS1 and PS2 were the only good products keeping Sony afloat over the last decade and they decided to bastardize their success with the PS3.

Blu-ray is not need for gaming this gen and the industry has already chose what format it will fully support this gen, DVD-9. If you doubt the logic, just look at the devs creating more content for plain ole "obsolete" DVD-9 while Blu-ray only gets attention from first and second party devs. If Sony had a winning format for gaming the industry would have ignored the 360 and Wii and immediately renewed their boarding pass on the Sony hype train....but obviously thats not the case so who is more knowledgable about what format is truely needed for gaming, devs, or blind fanboys?

Game On....

Quotes do not determine anything, action speaks louder than words. If the industry really felt Blu-ray was needed this gen, they wouldnt even consider any other console except the PS3 because it would be a unwise, pointless investment. We would see all of the great third party devs supporting blu-ray and the PS3 unaminously, not just a few loud mouthed devs that are either on the Sony payroll or pissed that console gaming is making them restructure their game support from being primarily PC. The concept of once exclusive Sony devs shifting focus to the obselete format of a 360 would be non-existent....if Blu-ray was really needed.

When it was time for CD and DVD to become the standard for gaming, the industry as a whole embraced these formats..Only Sony and its "yes-men" devs are on the only people on the Blu-ray hype train to the format graveyard.

Game On...

Also, you seem to think Itagaki and Mark Rein are on Sony's payroll. :?

Yes the industry embraced the formats which is why the N64 and GCN were not overly popular consoles during their generations. You see we live in a world where people have choices, but just because a dev makes a choice to not go with the status quo does not mean it will be successful. As you have clearly seen the Wii and 360 both use the "obsolete" format but are extremely successful, while the PS3 is struggling to prove itself.

The devs you mentioned may have had their gripes initally, but overall what format are they dedicated to dev for?...certainly isnt Blu-ray....Read and comprehend and stop trying to twist words into a meaning more convenient to support your clouded logic.

Game On...

Sorry but I disagree with you...During the 32-bit era CD was the format of choice for devs...The Saturn and PS1 were successful in implementing the technology for gaming while reducing devs costs. The N64 insisted that cartridges were the way to go and went against the grain of the industry which is why devs jumped ship and ran to Sonyland once the Saturn tanked.

Blu-ray does not have a 2:1 console support this gen where they can sit back and say its a successful format. Only the PS3 is using this format and it has been nothing but a technological nightmare for them. I would be willing to bet if Sony did not have so much invested in Blu-ray, they would have dropped it from the PS3 by now...but since they have to ride the storm of this investment, they will claim its the best thing since sliced bread....and its quite sad how the fanboys are hungry asking for seconds

Game On...

Just because the majority of consoles aren't using Blu-Ray doesn't mean it'll fail instantly. CDs were around since the 16-bit era and didn't do well then. However game developers are complaining about DVDs as you saw on the first page. Notice they are GAME developers not movie developers. So the game industry does consider Blu-Ray. No one complained about cartridges in the 16-bit war though because it fit their needs. However DVDs are running out of room. Blu-Ray is not a requirement, but it will become necessary well before the PS3 "Dies".

You are straddling the fence on the issue, either Blu-ray is needed or it isnt. The industry has proven its is not needed to make great HD games this gen. Just as I mentioned in previous posts that there are a few devs that feel space may become a problem, but overall they are doing alot of barking and thats it, no action is being taken to push for a more capacity format. None of the devs mentioned has said they obsolutely, 100% refuse to support a format that they deem obsolete. They are just mumbling all the way to the bank with their DVD-9 game titles....voices unheard under the sound of the cash registers ringing of their games!!!

During the 16-bit era there were a few companies that attempted to do with CD what Sony is currently doing with blu-ray, trying to FORCE a standard, and not let it develop naturally. During those days you would hear quotes from Sega and other early CD supporters claim cartridges were running out of room for the content they want to create.....the only problem was they were a generation too early!!! All CD based systems tanked horribly and devs refused to leave to standard format of the cartridge. Only once the industry as a whole considered the possibilities of a greater capacity format (the following generation) did CD began to take off as the standard for consoles.

I dont know where you are getting all this "PS3 will fail/die" talk, Im talking about Blu-ray falling off the map this gen as a viable format. Sony can try again next gen when it will be required to have more content than a DVD can hold, but not now and not anytime soon (as clearly indicated by the content coming this gen).

Game On... 

I just feel that Blu-Ray will be needed before this gen ends, and these comments prove it.

We are consumers and we have a right to feel technology should be more advanced than it currently is..bottom line it isnt and we need to deal with it!!!...Hell, if you asked me ten years ago if we would still sit in front of a tv with a standard controller and not interact in some virtual world (VR tech was really big in the early 90's), I would feel you wasnt thinking out of the box. 

But overall Blu-ray is not needed this gen and the industry has in no way, shape, or form has shown any support of the format.

Game On...

Maybe the reason is that the blu-ray format for games have only been released for HALF A YEAR. Give it time. Don't jump to conclusions at the beginning of the generation as there's still a long way to go. What you say isn't always fact

Im not a dev, you're not a dev!!!!! We have no say in what will be the next format for gaming.....The industry has clearly made a decision on what format it will support for next gen gaming and its DVD-9. You can have high hopes and wishful thinking about what format you would prefer, but overall the choice has been made. All Im doing is pointing out the obvious and trying to shed some light on this messy topic of personal preferences versus reality!!!

Contrary to what you may believe I was one of those hopefuls during the Sega CD era (yes I bought a launch system!!) wanting to experience console gaming on the new CD format. But once the early induction of the format fizzled, later I realized it was too early and too expensive to become mainstream for console gaming during that era. Eventually, the format became standard but it wasnt until the following gen that begin with the leading consoles and devsfully supporting the format..... Blu-ray may have its chance to shine next gen, but as for this gen, it is not needed.

Game On....

I saw a bunch of blu-ray is not needed threads so I will bump this one with real devs not speculation. Here we see pgr4 devs saying dvd is too small.

"You won't see different times of day per city because this involves recreating all the textures again (one for day and one for night). Whilst this wasn't a problem for our dev team, it was a problem fitting all this data onto a single DVD." It goes on to say:"No full-on day cycles then, but some lighting tints to help set the mood."

So this feature that bizarre creations wanted and had implemented in the game was droppeddue to space constraints of dvd-9. I am sure with blu-ray that feature would be there along with more cars/tracks/audio ect.

Zelda: TP had 50-60 hours of gameplay, and it fit on a GC disk. :|HeedleGlavin

LAST GEN GAME

NO VOICE ACTING

ALL TEXXT TEXXT TEXXXT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

STANDARD DEFINITION

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH@!!!!

why are all you lemmings in denial?

when the creator of your BEST game just STATED that their projects were overflowing on DVD9...

you still DAMAGE CONTROL!!!!

ahhhh fanboys make my head hurt.

dont be mad you bought a crap system, the sooner you realize this, the sooner you'll be pickin up a ps3 .

why are all you lemmings in denial?

when the creator of your BEST game just STATED that their projects were overflowing on DVD9...

you still DAMAGE CONTROL!!!!

ahhhh fanboys make my head hurt.

dont be mad you bought a crap system, the sooner you realize this, the sooner you'll be pickin up a ps3 .

springz300

the irony of you calling someone a fanboy . . . . .

[QUOTE="springz300"]

why are all you lemmings in denial?

when the creator of your BEST game just STATED that their projects were overflowing on DVD9...

you still DAMAGE CONTROL!!!!

ahhhh fanboys make my head hurt.

dont be mad you bought a crap system, the sooner you realize this, the sooner you'll be pickin up a ps3 .

sonicare

the irony of you calling someone a fanboy . . . . .

that , i am not.

a guy that plays games, and prefers a certain console,.... that, i am

It seems like every other month a dev is saying dvd is too small it's really funny how fanboys can ignore the proof with levels and features being dropped for lack of space on the 360. The latest casualty is pgr4 dropping time of day for tracks. Also the lack of a standard hard drive with all 360's iscoming back to haunt the 360 as well.

News: PGR4 limited by small DVD size

By 2009-2010 PS3 AAA Titles Will Be Too Massive For Dvd's, Rockstar's exclusive will only fit on bluray

Bluray is an investment, PGR4 developer constrained by DVD.

face it it was never needed in the begginging :|wavebrid

How many devs have to say dvd is holding them back before you say it is needed then ??

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

Why don't people realize that David Jaffe with his "controversial" quote has it 100% right? Blu-Ray will undoubtedly help in the future, as games (and gaming) get bigger and bigger, and more technologically advanced. It's simple math.

But it isn't needed or necessary at this time, when games like Crysis and Mass Effect are considered top-of-the-line for this generation and somehow fit on one DVD, the latter being an exceptionally large game in content and the former the most technologically advanced game to date.

Jaffe said not including Blu-Ray would come back to bite him in the ass in 4 years, and 4 years ain't right now. In fact, the next Xbox might be out by then, since Microsoft has their consoles on 5-year cycles.

Zeliard9

The 360 came out in 2005 and in 2007 devs are having problems so if the next xbox does not hit till 2009/10 then dvd will seriouly hinder devs in 08,09,10 for sure.