GT5 AI debunk vid.

[QUOTE="Kane04"][QUOTE="crusadernm"]I don't trust fanboys vids. Reviewers everywhere are saying GT5 AI is really bad. So looking at ur post history. You bias in favor for the PS3 or GT5 so I cant bellieve what you say either .GreySeal9

What does being middle aged have to with anything?

Ageism?

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="Kane04"] I trust what i with my own eyes when i play it, the video is just turns opinions into FACTS, what else do you call something thats right there on your face in several different tracks and corners and on different weather conditions? GT5 AI is competent, video PROVES it, i'll believe that over some review wrote by an underpaid middle age guy.Kane04

What does being middle aged have to with anything?

Ageism?

Of course. You like GT so you see what you want to see. Maybe reviewers don't feel that damage on premium models is better than F3.

But you didn't answer my question. What does being middle aged have to do with anything?

[QUOTE="Riverwolf007"]

heh, i guess my answer to stuff like this is congrats, your game with no friends list support, no mechanical damage in sp, non-working online, no leaderboards, 80% recycled cars, dozens of copy pasted premiums, pop in, 50 min install that hardly improves load times, horrid music that we have all turned off, clunky last gen ui,limited tuning options, 5 year dev time, shipped unfinished and with a chore laden grind fest gt mode has good ai.

does it not upset anyone that gt5 has literally set the racing genre back by half a decade? no? ok that's cool i guess.

Kahuna_1

Yeah I regret my purchase but sticking with it a for a few weeks has helped make it a little more enjoyable. It just isnt streamlined like Forza 3. And some of those standard models are so damn ugly I honestly think they look worse than the PS2 models because the upscaling blurs and jags them to hell and back.

getting xp in arcade mode(since arcade mode was actually fun) getting xp online(and getting online to work lol) even leaderboards would be some incentive to keep it since it's a blast to compare your leguna seca times (or whatever course) with your friends and try to beat them.

Interesting, certainly debunked the video. I don't think it debunked the notion that the game has wacky AI mechanics. I don't think this test proves much about either game, and I don't think something like this is easy at all to test other than just by instinct and feeling it out as you play in regular gameplay.

Also, this is the kind of tests you would use to benchmark AI in the first place. Building your AI based off test data solely from tests like this leads to AI that works adequately, but not perfectly, it's really hard to get to the point where you have AI that can operate at the full, and dynamic gameplay level. But this would simply function as one of many tests a dev would do while testing AI to see how they react.

[QUOTE="crusadernm"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

As far as I can see, reviewers didn't call it really bad. They just said it was not all that good.

GreySeal9

LOL. what's the difference.

Are you serious with this?

Since when does not all that good have to mean terrible.

Not all that good can simply mean lackluster.

Why am I explaining this?

If I told you this meal doesn't taste good, I hope to God you can infer that I'm also saying the meal is bad.

[QUOTE="johny300"]

[QUOTE="madsnakehhh"]

A youtube video and suddenly the media have lied??? :|

Kane04

Gt5 handles 16 cars

But anyway, seems to me this thread is more lemmings damage control than anything, yes GT5 scored lowered, be happy all you want in the real world GT5>Forza 3 and thats what matters when I fancy a drive.Kane04

the video is amazing and has total changed my opinion on the AI in GT5. before i watched the video i was convinced that the AI was spinning me off at the start or had no idea that i was even on the track. turns out its all my fault and GT5 is perfect

dog_dirt

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="crusadernm"]

LOL. what's the difference.

crusadernm

Are you serious with this?

Since when does not all that good have to mean terrible.

Not all that good can simply mean lackluster.

Why am I explaining this?

If I told you this meal doesn't taste good, I hope to God you can infer that I'm also saying the meal is bad.

Maybe that's the case for you, but not everybody, so your analogy fails.

There are some foods that one might think isn't particularly good, but doesn't taste bad either.

You are presenting an either/or fallacy. There is a middle ground between good and bad. I don't see why you're having difficulty understanding that.

Have you even watched the video?johny300

Yep, i did, it only debunked that Forza 3 vs GT5 comparison video, however, i fail to see the prove against the media.

It's sad how far fanboys will go to defend/attack games.

Wasdie

[QUOTE="crusadernm"]

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Are you serious with this?

Since when does not all that good have to mean terrible.

Not all that good can simply mean lackluster.

Why am I explaining this?

GreySeal9

If I told you this meal doesn't taste good, I hope to God you can infer that I'm also saying the meal is bad.

Maybe that's the case for you, but not everybody, so your analogy fails.

There are some foods that one might think isn't particularly good, but doesn't taste bad either.

You are presenting an either/or fallacy. There is a middle ground between good and bad. I don't see why you're having difficulty understanding that.

Dude, as Freud once said. sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. No need to overanalyze things. LOL.

Plus this doesn't make any sense: "There are some foods that one might think isn't particularly good, but doesn't taste bad either."

how long has it been since GT5 flopped? and people are still damage controlling?ohthemanatee

Yeah pretty much. It's hard to let go for some people. 6 years of waiting can do that to you.

its amazing how many people made comments in this thread without waching the video first.

[QUOTE="johny300"]

[QUOTE="madsnakehhh"]

A youtube video and suddenly the media have lied??? :|

Kane04

really? because it seems to me that only cows make the counter claim

but hey, you only see what you want to see

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="crusadernm"]

If I told you this meal doesn't taste good, I hope to God you can infer that I'm also saying the meal is bad.

crusadernm

Maybe that's the case for you, but not everybody, so your analogy fails.

There are some foods that one might think isn't particularly good, but doesn't taste bad either.

You are presenting an either/or fallacy. There is a middle ground between good and bad. I don't see why you're having difficulty understanding that.

Dude, as Freud once said. sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. No need to overanalyze things. LOL.

Plus this doesn't make any sense: "There are some foods that one might think isn't particularly good, but doesn't taste bad either."

I'm not over analyzing anything. I am stating simple logic. There can be a middle ground between good and bad. What about that is complicated to you?

Also, how is that Freud quote in any way relevant?

Lastly, the bolded phrase makes perfect sense. It means that a person is apathetic to the taste of a certain good. It's not nasty to them, but it's not something that has a particularly pleasing taste. Again, you are presenting a simplistic either/or, which is a fallacy.

why do people put garbage music with videos. Thats my only question.

Since the AI in Forza 3 is adjustable I am not sure how you compare the two... what you need to show is the 250 hour video of some poor sod playing the same race over and over Again get from level 25 to level 40.

[QUOTE="Kane04"][QUOTE="johny300"] Have you even watched the video?

bushidotu

Gt5 handles 16 cars

It's par for SW to attack the TC rather then watch the vid.

I would like to see a draft AI compairison myself.... I dont park my car on a turn in the middle of a race :P

I would like it if BOTH AIs would avoid back quarter panels when they get beat from late breaking. :lol:

[QUOTE="ohthemanatee"]how long has it been since GT5 flopped? and people are still damage controlling?crusadernm

Yeah pretty much. It's hard to let go for some people. 6 years of waiting can do that to you.

[QUOTE="crusadernm"]

[QUOTE="ohthemanatee"]how long has it been since GT5 flopped? and people are still damage controlling?ZoomZoom2490

Yeah pretty much. It's hard to let go for some people. 6 years of waiting can do that to you.

back on topic, this video doesn't prove that the media outlets were right or wrong (like some people claimed) it does however prove that that the Forza 3 youtube video was wrong (which is what the video intended)

why do people put garbage music with videos. Thats my only question.

Chogyam

[QUOTE="Chogyam"]

why do people put garbage music with videos. Thats my only question.

JohnF111

[QUOTE="JohnF111"][QUOTE="Chogyam"]

why do people put garbage music with videos. Thats my only question.

Chogyam

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="Kane04"] Point here, GT5 being bashed as inferior to Forza 3. I haven't seen anything but the crappy LOOKS on standard cars to complain about. Generally reviews have been given an impression of flawed AI, and i haven't read a review that tell the damage (on premium models) is better on GT5 compared to Forza 3. Considering the superior physics of GT5 on top of all that... I still don't get why 8.0 vs 9.5 But anyway, seems to me this thread is more lemmings damage control than anything, yes GT5 scored lowered, be happy all you want in the real world GT5>Forza 3 and thats what matters when I fancy a drive.JohnF111

Of course. You like GT so you see what you want to see. Maybe reviewers don't feel that damage on premium models is better than F3.

But you didn't answer my question. What does being middle aged have to do with anything?

actually it's the other way around

Actually yeah the AI in GT5 is horrible, I've been playing for a while and they don't seem to be able to actually see you. Wouldn't be so much of a problem if they weren't impervious to collisions... but they are.

Right, because one youtube video disproves hundreds of critics and thousands of gamers. Obviously all those gamers are lying lemmings in disguise who have never really played the game. either because they don't own a PS3, or they died of old age waiting for it to load.SteveTabernacle

after seeing this vid the gamespot staff better change GT5s review score to a 10!!!

after seeing this vid the gamespot staff better change GT5s review score to a 10!!!

MIYAMOTOnext007

This proves that GT5's AI is better than the original video comparison implied but not that it's actually good and in my experience, it's still rather awful.

So I assume everyone watched the video then? All it was trying to prove was that under certain situations, both games' AI can do well or get in trouble, which it did well. Under the same circumstances, Forza and GT5 both performed the same.

after seeing this vid the gamespot staff better change GT5s review score to a 10!!!

MIYAMOTOnext007

Why there is alot more wrong with GT5.

The graphics are worse than forza 3 in game = shadows track side details

The 1080p mode drops the frame rate and produces screen tearing

The standard cars look like gt4 1080p cars with poor cosmetic damage

The standard cars don't work in pic mode or zoomed in on replay mode

The hud sucks point blank it needs to be fixed or removed

No mechanical damage in single player after update

Poor support for the g25/27 sterring wheels

The online match making is rubbish,no clans,aand finding people sucks also ect

The game has been patch twice in as many weeks this game does not even get a 9 after the patches

lol I don't understand, anyone who actually owns Forza 3 and GT5 like myself knows a while ago that the A.I. is the exact same lol

All the video shows is that there actually *IS* AI, which at times I could see there might have been doubts that there is anything but programmed cars running laps. It's not terribly impressive that the AI cars can maneuver around STOPPED cars. :roll: You would think maneuvering around parked cars would be just bare minimum. Maybe for some it was necessary to point out the hypocricy of nailing GT5 in an area that Forza is also a little weak in. I DON"T CARE WHAT FORZA DOES. I just want to see improvements in Gran Turismo.

Example: In Nascar I am forced sideways because the AI guy behind me gets on the bumper (that is fine, happens exactly like that in Nascar, maybe I lost too much speed in the turn). But what wasn't fine was literally the ENTIRE FIELD behind basically T bones me as i'm skidding sideways, and then goes on their marry way in a straight line. CLEARLY with me skidding sideways in front of them most of the cars had time to react and slow down. On the replay they didn't even slow down, EVERY SINGLE CAR just barrelled right through the impact and kept going at the same pace eventually with enough force to just send me off the track into the grass while they stayed on their path. The problem is 2-fold. The AI was too stupid to not even react or slow down when there is a crash in front of them, and there was no damage or repurcussions to ANYONE from crashing into EACH OTHER - other than me who was just sent skidding into the grass. So basically as soon as I skidded the race was over and into last place 20+ seconds behind with NO chance to catch up. In reality a bunch more cars should have been off the track along with me because of the crash (actually in reality there would have been a caution as soon as I started skidding, but Gran Turismo wasn't attempting to get the rules of Nascar correct).

[QUOTE="MIYAMOTOnext007"]

after seeing this vid the gamespot staff better change GT5s review score to a 10!!!

Why there is alot more wrong with GT5.

The graphics are worse than forza 3 in game = shadows track side details

The 1080p mode drops the frame rate and produces screen tearing

The standard cars look like gt4 1080p cars with poor cosmetic damage

The standard cars don't work in pic mode or zoomed in on replay mode

The hud sucks point blank it needs to be fixed or removed

No mechanical damage in single player after update

Poor support for the g25/27 sterring wheels

The online match making is rubbish,no clans,aand finding people sucks also ect

The game has been patch twice in as many weeks this game does not even get a 9 after the patches

[QUOTE="madsnakehhh"]

[QUOTE="johny300"] Have you even watched the video?johny300

Yep, i did, it only debunked that Forza 3 vs GT5 comparison video, however, i fail to see the proof against the media.

What it proves is that Forza 3 AI is no better than GT5.

[QUOTE="pimpog"]

[QUOTE="MIYAMOTOnext007"]

after seeing this vid the gamespot staff better change GT5s review score to a 10!!!

gaming25

Why there is alot more wrong with GT5.

The graphics are worse than forza 3 in game = shadows track side details

The 1080p mode drops the frame rate and produces screen tearing

The standard cars look like gt4 1080p cars with poor cosmetic damage

The standard cars don't work in pic mode or zoomed in on replay mode

The hud sucks point blank it needs to be fixed or removed

No mechanical damage in single player after update

Poor support for the g25/27 sterring wheels

The online match making is rubbish,no clans,aand finding people sucks also ect

The game has been patch twice in as many weeks this game does not even get a 9 after the patches

I can go on but what would be the point it would all be nitpicking to you right. This is also nitpicking 6 years and 100 million and two patches later in 2 weeks and the game still has so many problems. Now call me crazy but how can the standard cars that make up 80 % of the total cars in the game be a bonus ??

[QUOTE="Anastasia1997"][QUOTE="sinpkr"]

u guys just cant admit that JUST MAYBE Forza is a better game

dog_dirt

All in All

You do know that that a Game review is merely someone else's opinion of that game?

Only thing is that on Gamespot that person's opinion now represents the Site Opinion of the Game

Claim ownage with it, Sure, its the SW rules. But I don't really see any Comparing GT5 and Forza 3 side by side and going Forza 3 was the Better overall game. And If they Did, Not by a Point and a Half

Actually yeah the AI in GT5 is horrible, I've been playing for a while and they don't seem to be able to actually see you. Wouldn't be so much of a problem if they weren't impervious to collisions... but they are.

the_mitch28

Even though we just we're shown a Vid showing otherwise?

Interesting conclusion

[QUOTE="gaming25"][QUOTE="pimpog"]

Why there is alot more wrong with GT5.

The graphics are worse than forza 3 in game = shadows track side details

The 1080p mode drops the frame rate and produces screen tearing

The standard cars look like gt4 1080p cars with poor cosmetic damage

The standard cars don't work in pic mode or zoomed in on replay mode

The hud sucks point blank it needs to be fixed or removed

No mechanical damage in single player after update

Poor support for the g25/27 sterring wheels

The online match making is rubbish,no clans,aand finding people sucks also ect

The game has been patch twice in as many weeks this game does not even get a 9 after the patches

I can go on but what would be the point it would all be nitpicking to you right. This is also nitpicking 6 years and 100 million and two patches later in 2 weeks and the game still has so many problems. Now call me crazy but how can the standard cars that make up 80 % of the total cars in the game be a bonus ??

[QUOTE="pimpog"]

[QUOTE="gaming25"] The graphics look way better than GT5, and standard cars are a bonus. Also at least it has more wheel support (unlike Forza 3). Youre nitpicking a lot of stuff that arent that big of a deal.gaming25

I can go on but what would be the point it would all be nitpicking to you right. This is also nitpicking 6 years and 100 million and two patches later in 2 weeks and the game still has so many problems. Now call me crazy but how can the standard cars that make up 80 % of the total cars in the game be a bonus ??