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Wanting deep and quality games is never a bad thing. However, expecting them all the time is asinine.
Redmoonxl2
True words from a true gamer. Also, if we got them all the time we probably wouldn't appreciate them nearly as much, anyway. That concept applies to life itself. The more you get something the less you are likely to appreciate it. Besides. It also gives us all plenty to gripe about, lol!
Oh of course, almost every console game is geared towards the casual game. The most casual game the PC has that is not a card game or puzzle is World of Warcraft. So the PC could never wave the casuals banner as effectively as consoles.
The most "hardcore" games on consoles are usually the niche games, like most of the JRPGs. Actually that is all that is coming to mind. It isn't that JRPGs are hard, it is just you have to follow a complex story and sometimes memorize patterns. Which aren't particularly fun for casual gamers.
cametall
*BEEP* WRONG! :P
That's what your impression is but it's very false, that's just what most casual gamers think but it couldn't be further from the truth.
There are 2 types of core JRPG's, ones focues on complex stories and others on combat systems.
Here are some core JRPG games that focus on combat.
Princess Crown
Dragon Force *first battle in the game too*
Too bad they rarely come out, and if they do they're ALWAYS a cookie cutter stragey RPG.
However Odin Sphere *sequel to Princess Crown* was finally a breath of freash air. :)
[QUOTE="norfair_dweller"]The problem with some hardcores is that they believe the world revolves around them and, therefore, developers should cater to them and only them.jethrovegas
Your attitude disgusts me.
We created gaming, and we are not some small fringe group; hardcores make up the majority of the sales in the games industry.
Do you think that 4 million casuals went out and purchased Gears of War?
Do you think that 3 million casuals went out and bought Oblivion?
Do you think that 1.7 million casuals went out and bought Dead Rising?
Do you think that of the 18 million people that bought GTA: San Andreas, that the majority were "casuals"?
Hardcores are the lifeblood of gaming.
All the games you listed are labeled as hardcore gamers but it doesnt mean just hardcore bought it.
I know a lot of casuals, if they hear about a game that is good, they will buy it and play it for a couple of days then stop. And yes, casuals ate GTA:SA. I cant believe how many kids and gangster wannabes bought this game.
[QUOTE="tegovoltio"]So you are saying wanting deep and quality games is a bad thing? Ok, you's saying let's all root for quick buck games and cheap ports, if that's what you are impliyng.Redmoonxl2
Wanting deep and quality games is never a bad thing. However, expecting them all the time is asinine.
Can't expect a MGS in every game the same way you can't expect an Apocalypse Now in every movie.
That's true, and I never said that, I enjoy casual games as well but it's the TC who is saying flat out that wanting this type of games is gonna kill gaming, the same as those who say all casual games will kill it.
[QUOTE="joel_101"][QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]thank you, you prove my point...LOL
OpGenesis
I guess it's settled then. you truly are stupid. Unless I just read my own post wrong, lol. And, uh, just how did I prove your point? Are you sure you aren't illiterate, too?
for trying to be a hardcore gamer when your not. your trying so hard to convince everyone you one. LOL
[QUOTE="Redmoonxl2"][QUOTE="tegovoltio"]So you are saying wanting deep and quality games is a bad thing? Ok, you's saying let's all root for quick buck games and cheap ports, if that's what you are impliyng.tegovoltio
Wanting deep and quality games is never a bad thing. However, expecting them all the time is asinine.
Can't expect a MGS in every game the same way you can't expect an Apocalypse Now in every movie.
That's true, and I never said that, I enjoy casual games as well but it's the TC who is saying flat out that wanting this type of games is gonna kill gaming, the same as those who say all casual games will kill it.
Incorrect. It was clearly implied by CJ that a complete focus on hardcore gaming would hurt the industry. He also stated that bringing in new gamers with pick up and play games is more important than trying to please the needy pre-existing fans, which is true.
While it's true that full blown focusing on one of the two sides would kill the industry, CJ is not implying that we should do so while the other side gets looked down on. The thread was merely created to counter whatever criticism casual gaming is receiving from the hardcore, which are in the wrong if they truly want casual gaming lessen to the point where it's not even noticeable.
[QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="joel_101"][QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]thank you, you prove my point...LOL
joel_101
I guess it's settled then. you truly are stupid. Unless I just read my own post wrong, lol. And, uh, just how did I prove your point? Are you sure you aren't illiterate, too?
for trying to be a hardcore gamer when your not. your trying so hard to convince everyone you one. LOL
Well, first let us start by saying that your gramer sucks. The correct spelling is you're. Not your, idiot. If you can't use the right grammer than you shouldn't even be typing let alone talking to me.
Second, who has to convince anyone? Is that just some BS you conjured up just because my account is brand new? How would you know if I am hardcore or not? You say I'm trying so hard to convince everyone. Excuse me while I conrinue to point out that you obviosly have th IQ of an Iguana. I've been playing video games since I was 4 you dipsh*t. And haven't missed much along the way.
Third, why should I or anyone even listen to someone like you anyway? You're simple. You're a casual who seems to think you understand both sides of the spectrum. You have to actually experience it first, retard Trying actually being a hardcore gamer before you try to disprove someone else as not being one. It helps.
Forth, once again you are obviously just stupid. How can you expect anyone to take you serious when you obviously haven;t even figured out how to put your profile pic up even though yo've had an account since May? I just made mine today and figured it out pretty frikkin' quick.
Fifth, if there is anything that needs to be proven it's that you don't know half the sh*t you think you do. You have said absolutely nothing in this entire thread that makes your posts even close to credible. So, like I said. Just shut it.
So, on that final note I will let you know that you are now soiled with my sperm all over you for being a NUTBAG. So, rub it in b**ch. It's good for the skin. REAL good... :)
[QUOTE="Redmoonxl2"][QUOTE="tegovoltio"][QUOTE="Redmoonxl2"][QUOTE="tegovoltio"]So you are saying wanting deep and quality games is a bad thing? Ok, you's saying let's all root for quick buck games and cheap ports, if that's what you are impliyng.tegovoltio
Wanting deep and quality games is never a bad thing. However, expecting them all the time is asinine.
Can't expect a MGS in every game the same way you can't expect an Apocalypse Now in every movie.
That's true, and I never said that, I enjoy casual games as well but it's the TC who is saying flat out that wanting this type of games is gonna kill gaming, the same as those who say all casual games will kill it.
Incorrect. It was clearly implied by CJ that a complete focus on hardcore gaming would hurt the industry. He also stated that bringing in new gamers with pick up and play games is more important than trying to please the needy pre-existing fans, which is true.
While it's true that full blown focusing on one of the two sides would kill the industry, CJ is not implying that we should do so while the other side gets looked down on. The thread was merely created to counter whatever criticism casual gaming is receiving from the hardcore, which are in the wrong if they truly want casual gaming lessen to the point where it's not even noticeable.
Huh? So ''CJ'' isn't the TC now? The one that clearly put on the title ''hardcores'' are killing gaming? He tells us to ''imagine'' if only hardcore games were made and makes a good point but then he follows and says that casualisation is ''ok'' and that it's ok that hardcore get extinct.
I only said a gaming industry would last longer focusing on casuals rather than hardcores. I never said gaming would last forever if hardcores were excluded.
[QUOTE="tegovoltio"][QUOTE="Redmoonxl2"][QUOTE="tegovoltio"]So you are saying wanting deep and quality games is a bad thing? Ok, you's saying let's all root for quick buck games and cheap ports, if that's what you are impliyng.Redmoonxl2
Wanting deep and quality games is never a bad thing. However, expecting them all the time is asinine.
Can't expect a MGS in every game the same way you can't expect an Apocalypse Now in every movie.
That's true, and I never said that, I enjoy casual games as well but it's the TC who is saying flat out that wanting this type of games is gonna kill gaming, the same as those who say all casual games will kill it.
Incorrect. It was clearly implied by CJ that a complete focus on hardcore gaming would hurt the industry. He also stated that bringing in new gamers with pick up and play games is more important than trying to please the needy pre-existing fans, which is true.
While it's true that full blown focusing on one of the two sides would kill the industry, CJ is not implying that we should do so while the other side gets looked down on. The thread was merely created to counter whatever criticism casual gaming is receiving from the hardcore, which are in the wrong if they truly want casual gaming lessen to the point where it's not even noticeable.
he clearly put on the title that hardcores are killing gaming. He also makes a good point when he tells us to ''imagine'' if there were only hardcore games, but then he follows and says that the casualisation is ok and that it's ok for hardcore to get extinct, so that sounds like saying if only casual games exist it would be a good thing.
I only said a gaming industry would last longer focusing on casuals rather than hardcores. I never said gaming would last forever if hardcores were excluded.
CJL13
Read my repost and see why it sounds as if you did.
[QUOTE="CJL13"]I only said a gaming industry would last longer focusing on casuals rather than hardcores. I never said gaming would last forever if hardcores were excluded.
tegovoltio
Read my repost and see why it sounds as if you did.
I suppose I should've added that though an industry would do better focusing on casuals, it would still eventually kill gaming.
Huh? So ''CJ'' isn't the TC now? The one that clearly put on the title ''hardcores'' are killing gaming? He tells us to ''imagine'' if only hardcore games were made and makes a good point but then he follows and says that casualisation is ''ok'' and that it's ok that hardcore get extinct.
tegovoltio
You're digging for things that aren't just there. The casualization of gaming simply means a greater focus on that market, not abadoning the hardcore market completely.
Also, "obsolete" does not mean "extinct". By saying "obsolete", he's merely implying that just focusing on him (Hardcore gamer) is not really viable in today's market.
I swear people really need to read and not react.
Well, first let us start by saying that your gramer sucks. The correct spelling is you're. Not your, idiot. If you can't use the right grammer than you shouldn't even be typing let alone talking to me.
OpGenesis
First, it's grammar. Not gramer. Second, it's correctgrammar. Not rightgrammar. If you're gonna be smart about spelling and grammar, might as well be smart about diction too.
[QUOTE="tegovoltio"]Huh? So ''CJ'' isn't the TC now? The one that clearly put on the title ''hardcores'' are killing gaming? He tells us to ''imagine'' if only hardcore games were made and makes a good point but then he follows and says that casualisation is ''ok'' and that it's ok that hardcore get extinct.
Redmoonxl2
You're digging for things that aren't just there. The casualization of gaming simply means a greater focus on that market, not abadoning the hardcore market completely.
Also, "obsolete" does not mean "extinct". By saying "obsolete", he's merely implying that just focusing on him (Hardcore gamer) is not really viable in today's market.
I swear people really need to read and not react.
It does imply that at first he said it does too. And why isn't it viable? Because many devs. would take the easy way out to make quick buck? And still some ppl would just buy just about whatever that is? I really don't see that as a good thing
And, ok, say the focus on those games actually happens. How long would it take for the actual good casual games to desapear and devs. just make more and more rehash and weak games that not even many casuals would like? That would be true death of it . I really don't see why those games should become obsolete.
I'm glad that as long as there are commited devs. who are willing to put a game with great content, that what the TC says doesn't happens.
Imagine if the only songs that existed were the stuff that was played only on MTV.
That would be such a boring world of music. I wouldn't want gaming to be that way. I dont think anyone here believe casual/non-gamers will kill gaming, just that they'll make hardcore games very rare. It'll kill their gaming preference.
XaosII
Second post, and it's already nailed.
The question people should ask themselves is, if these new types of"non games" make far more money for devs than the traditional hardcore games (and they're cheaper to make, to boot) why would devs make hardcore games? They wouldn't, this is why it's possible that we'll see a shift from the development of quality games (in the eyes of nongamers) to more profitable "non games." WHile sales will be good, the quality will suffer. Devs will make what will make them the most money, end of story. This new non-game market (it's different than casual gaming, too. Don't get them confused) opens up a very easy "out" for them. THis bigger this market gets, the more non games we'll see and the less quality games will be made,
It's logic.
[QUOTE="jethrovegas"]Hardcores made this industry what it is. Who the hell do you think buys the most games and software?
Ontain
casual gamers as a whole buy many more games than hardcores.
They don't buy games, they buy "games." Crap like Wii Fit, Wii Play, Mario Party 8, etc. It's a disgrace and it's what is going to kill the console industry.
It does imply that at first he said it does too. And why isn't it viable? Because many devs. would take the easy way out to make quick buck? And still some ppl would just buy just about whatever that is? I really don't see that as a good thingtegovoltio
Full blown focus on big budget 10 million + dollar games just isn't viable, especially when...
A.) Gaming is not accessible enough to pull in 1 million players for every title all the time.
B.) "Quick buck" or not, casual games with low budgets and high profits are needed to fund those high profile games people like you love to hype.
And, ok, say the focus on those games actually happens. How long would it take for the actual good casual games to desapear and devs. just make more and more rehash and weak games that not even many casuals would like? That would be true death of it . I really don't see why those games should become obsolete.tegovoltio
Hypothetical questions with no real answers. Seems like you're dead set in thinking that more accessible and cheap games will equal future crap after crap.
I wonder if Puzzle Quest would exist if the game had a proposed 20 million dollar budget with 5 years of development...
By the way, we've been living with rehashes for years.
I'm glad that as long as there are commited devs. who are willing to put a game with great content, that what the TC says doesn't happens.tegovoltio
Again, CJ is not saying hardcore gaming shouldn't exist, he's merely implying that it should be focused on less to draw in new people. Not that hard to comprehend.
[QUOTE="OpGenesis"]Well, first let us start by saying that your gramer sucks. The correct spelling is you're. Not your, idiot. If you can't use the right grammer than you shouldn't even be typing let alone talking to me.
x_boyfriend
First, it's grammar. Not gramer. Second, it's correctgrammar. Not rightgrammar. If you're gonna be smart about spelling and grammar, might as well be smart about diction too.
I agree. That what my other post was about. Stupid people will do that to you. They get stupid an indirectly lower your intelligence in the process, lol. And I definitely already know and understand what you said. But, stupidty is contagious, lol!
[QUOTE="Ontain"][QUOTE="jethrovegas"]Hardcores made this industry what it is. Who the hell do you think buys the most games and software?
Gamer46
casual gamers as a whole buy many more games than hardcores.
They don't buy games, they buy "games." Crap like Wii Fit, Wii Play, Mario Party 8, etc. It's a disgrace and it's what is going to kill the console industry.
So every game that appeals to casuals is crap? I suppose GTA San Andreas is crap then.
[QUOTE="Gamer46"][QUOTE="Ontain"][QUOTE="jethrovegas"]Hardcores made this industry what it is. Who the hell do you think buys the most games and software?
CJL13
casual gamers as a whole buy many more games than hardcores.
They don't buy games, they buy "games." Crap like Wii Fit, Wii Play, Mario Party 8, etc. It's a disgrace and it's what is going to kill the console industry.
So every game that appeals to casuals is crap? I suppose GTA San Andreas is crap then.
The term "casual game" is different from the term "non game."
Brain training, Wii Fit, etc - those are "non games." Games that appeal to "everyone" ("everyone" only in theory seeing as a huge portion of "hardcore" gamers are instantly turned off by them.) Your mother, your sister, your grandparents, etc.
Casual games include GTA, Madden, Halo, etc. Usually, the only things that differentiated casual games from certain hardcore games in the past was the size of their fanbases.
This new breed of game is clearly in a different category and appeals to a different market (namely, people who never played games at all before the creation of this new genre within the last two years. "Casual gamers," on the other hand have been playing games for the past two decades... just the most popular, mainstream franchises and typicallynothing else.)
man, you might just have a point here. I agree.Think about it, we constantly want games to best the best damn things ever. Those games take time, and they are few and far between for developers.
Think back to the 80s where arcade games were coming out like crazy and everyone wanted to play them. That's the same thing that Nintendo is trying to accomplish, they're trying to go back to the days where the most hardcore games were SMB and Pac-Man, yet were easy to pick up and play.
Imagine if only hardcore games were made, we'd have hardly any games and though they'd be good, they would appeal to about 2% of people. If a game sold bad, the developer that madeit would be pretty much screwed. Though there are measures to prevent that now, it'd be pretty much what was going on in 83. Now if you try to make games that appeal to casuals/non-gamers, sure 2% of people won't buy them, but the percent that will will be a hell of a lot higher than 2%, plus those games would be cheaper.
Casuals and non-gamers won't kill gaming, they outnumber the hardcores, with game sales increasing, it's coming clear that casuals and non-gamers are preserving gaming. It's a harsh reality to accept, but the casualization of gaming may just be what can help it. Hardcores like me have become obsolete and needy.
CJL13
you know, its kinda like the toy and comics industry in a small way(now bear with me). I used to own a comicbook shop, and i realized some things from that season of my life. Its like when a new toy is coming out, and it gets alot of hardcore hype. So everyone, esp the collocters(which i believe that the toy collecter = hard core, you know?) rushes out to by said toy. so heres the sad part: What about the kids??? ive seen hardcore collecters rush, and i mean RUUUUSH out to the toy store, like wall mart or something thats open pretty late, and these peopz would get there at like 3 in the morning and by out all of the toys......lol........and the poor kids would get there the next morning or maybe after school, and it would be like an old western seen with dust and tumbleweeds in the isles....all the toys gone...and the kids are like WTF!!!!! and someone has to tell them....lol.....ohhh sorry kid...a bunch of adults(or hardcores) came in last night and wiped us out...lol.
IDK, its just funny, and the same thing happens with hype also....a game is hyped soooooooo bad and toooo early in some cases that it just loses something. anywayz, thats just my thoughts. peace bro
[QUOTE="tegovoltio"]It does imply that at first he said it does too. And why isn't it viable? Because many devs. would take the easy way out to make quick buck? And still some ppl would just buy just about whatever that is? I really don't see that as a good thingRedmoonxl2
Full blown focus on big budget 10 million + dollar games just isn't viable, especially when...
A.) Gaming is not accessible enough to pull in 1 million players for every title all the time.
B.) "Quick buck" or not, casual games with low budgets and high profits are needed to fund those high profile games people like you love to hype.
And, ok, say the focus on those games actually happens. How long would it take for the actual good casual games to desapear and devs. just make more and more rehash and weak games that not even many casuals would like? That would be true death of it . I really don't see why those games should become obsolete.tegovoltio
Hypothetical questions with no real answers. Seems like you're dead set in thinking that more accessible and cheap games will equal future crap after crap.
I wonder if Puzzle Quest would exist if the game had a proposed 20 million dollar budget with 5 years of development...
By the way, we've been living with rehashes for years.
I'm glad that as long as there are commited devs. who are willing to put a game with great content, that what the TC says doesn't happens.tegovoltio
Again, CJ is not saying hardcore gaming shouldn't exist, he's merely implying that it should be focused on less to draw in new people. Not that hard to comprehend.
1) No, we shouldn't put up for that. If more ppl demanded quality titles instead of buying whatever, the ''non gamers'' who really could care less about the deep and actually good games, we would see how so many that other type games would fund themselves and quick bucks wouldn't be necessary. Simple as that, quick buck and crappy ports games aren't good, it's not that hard to get.
2) Yes I'm bringing hypotetical situations just like the TC when he tells us to ''imagine''
3) I know he isn't, what I said was directed to that mostly casual focus (even more than it has been all this time) he is implying.
azrealhk
That's all well and good and all. But, I probably won't ever become "casual". I'll go straight to "none". This I am sure of. As for others I can't say but I know what I will wind up doing. My days as a hardcore won't end until my fingers can't handle it anymore, LOL!
Besides, a true gamer is something in the heart. That ain't just somethin' that fades away with time or kids or "priorities". That is the kind of thing that forever is a part of you if it's real. A casual gamer is someone who considers playing video games as something they "do". A hardcore gamer is someone who thinks of playing video games as a piece of who they are. Anyone who follows on the footsteps of those things you mentioned was probably never a true gamer in the first place. They might have been so addicted that they couldn't put the controller down, lol. But, I can tell you that they weren't really as true of a gamer as they thought they were if they actually go "casual" as you say.
1) No, we shouldn't put up for that. If more ppl demanded quality titles instead of buying whatever, the ''non gamers'' who really could care less about the deep and actually good games, we would see how so many that other type games would fund themselves and quick bucks wouldn't be necessary. Simple as that, quick buck and crappy ports games aren't good, it's not that hard to get.
2) Yes I'm bringing hypotetical situations just like the TC when he tells us to ''imagine''
3) I know he isn't, what I said was directed to that mostly casual focus (even more than it has been all this time) he is implying.
tegovoltio
1) Sorry, but like it or not, you are not thinking realistically. This would be akin to movie studios spending 300 million on every movie they make. Sometimes you need the "Daddy Day Care" of the world in order to get the "Star Wars" of the world.
2) However, you are certainly coming to conclusions without any backing. It's very easy to see hardcore gaming keeping growth from happening since we had to deal with it for years now.
3) Again, he's asking for a more focus on the casual market, not the complete focus on that same market. Yet again, this is much ado about nothing.
Imagine if the only songs that existed were the stuff that was played only on MTV.
That would be such a boring world of music. I wouldn't want gaming to be that way. I dont think anyone here believe casual/non-gamers will kill gaming, just that they'll make hardcore games very rare. It'll kill their gaming preference.
XaosII
100% on the mark
Too bad Nintendo are still putting out great games with long gaps aswell. You'll still get the great games we (hardcores) want but to fill in the time there will be LOADS of TRASH to ignore or indulge, your choice. PS2 did the same it's just that the trash beck then was still ment for gamers not their moms.
[QUOTE="tegovoltio"]1) No, we shouldn't put up for that. If more ppl demanded quality titles instead of buying whatever, the ''non gamers'' who really could care less about the deep and actually good games, we would see how so many that other type games would fund themselves and quick bucks wouldn't be necessary. Simple as that, quick buck and crappy ports games aren't good, it's not that hard to get.
2) Yes I'm bringing hypotetical situations just like the TC when he tells us to ''imagine''
3) I know he isn't, what I said was directed to that mostly casual focus (even more than it has been all this time) he is implying.
Redmoonxl2
1) Sorry, but like it or not, you are not thinking realistically. This would be akin to movie studios spending 300 million on every movie they make. Sometimes you need the "Daddy Day Care" of the world in order to get the "Star Wars" of the world.
2) However, you are certainly coming to conclusions without any backing. It's very easy to see hardcore gaming keeping growth from happening since we had to deal with it for years now.
3) Again, he's asking for a more focus on the casual market, not the complete focus on that same market. Yet again, this is much ado about nothing.
It's not a matter of like it or not, the studios that make those games might push gaming sales but they kill the quality, it's not a good thing like he says.
He already did point out negativity on a completely hardcore market on his second point . But it's very easy as well to see ppl buying a lot of rehash as well that damages quality titles it's not that hypothetical, you can take examples of it that happens right now.
And again, I don't see a bigger focus on these games (even bigger than it is right now and has been before) as something that's positive as you do for said reasons.
[QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]well i'm a casual gamer. and i play those games. so they are casual games.
games like WOW, God of War, HL2, Halo.
Does it helps you sleep at night calling yourself hardcore, when your realy not.
OpGenesis
First of all while I didn't like Gears Epic IS considered "hardcore" with Unreal Tournament. If you were talking about generically garbage shooters like Halo or Lost Planet I'd whole heatedly agree, but Unreal Tournament is a top tier PC franchise.
Finally, someone ELSE who understands the "not all that greatness" that is "Halo". Thank you so much for saying that. I can truly see you are a being of REAL intelligence.
Now as far as that moron who said some garbage about me sleeping better at night cause I seem to "think" I'm hardcore you can just shut it. Don't let this Level 1 fool you. I've been in the loop for years and you couldn't even begin to comprehend what I could say to you. Just because you are a casual gamer doesn't automatically make the games that you play "casual". You are provong yourself to be just as typical as the people that I was talking about before. How could you even think to say I'm not hardcore when you probably have never even been it yourself you frikkin' casual. I'll tell you what. I'm gonna pull a random idiot out of my hat. I'll wager you a few hundred bucks that it turns out to be you.
LOL what an awesome comeback! That was truly genious!
[QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="joel_101"][QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]thank you, you prove my point...LOL
joel_101
I guess it's settled then. you truly are stupid. Unless I just read my own post wrong, lol. And, uh, just how did I prove your point? Are you sure you aren't illiterate, too?
for trying to be a hardcore gamer when your not. your trying so hard to convince everyone you one. LOL
Golly Chun-Li, just stop talking, no one even knows what the freak your talking about.
[QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]well i'm a casual gamer. and i play those games. so they are casual games.
games like WOW, God of War, HL2, Halo.
Does it helps you sleep at night calling yourself hardcore, when your realy not.
JudgementEden
First of all while I didn't like Gears Epic IS considered "hardcore" with Unreal Tournament. If you were talking about generically garbage shooters like Halo or Lost Planet I'd whole heatedly agree, but Unreal Tournament is a top tier PC franchise.
Finally, someone ELSE who understands the "not all that greatness" that is "Halo". Thank you so much for saying that. I can truly see you are a being of REAL intelligence.
Now as far as that moron who said some garbage about me sleeping better at night cause I seem to "think" I'm hardcore you can just shut it. Don't let this Level 1 fool you. I've been in the loop for years and you couldn't even begin to comprehend what I could say to you. Just because you are a casual gamer doesn't automatically make the games that you play "casual". You are provong yourself to be just as typical as the people that I was talking about before. How could you even think to say I'm not hardcore when you probably have never even been it yourself you frikkin' casual. I'll tell you what. I'm gonna pull a random idiot out of my hat. I'll wager you a few hundred bucks that it turns out to be you.
LOL what an awesome comeback! That was truly genious!
He called him a frikkin' casual. Haha. That almost sounded racist.
[QUOTE="JudgementEden"][QUOTE="OpGenesis"][QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]well i'm a casual gamer. and i play those games. so they are casual games.
games like WOW, God of War, HL2, Halo.
Does it helps you sleep at night calling yourself hardcore, when your realy not.
x_boyfriend
First of all while I didn't like Gears Epic IS considered "hardcore" with Unreal Tournament. If you were talking about generically garbage shooters like Halo or Lost Planet I'd whole heatedly agree, but Unreal Tournament is a top tier PC franchise.
Finally, someone ELSE who understands the "not all that greatness" that is "Halo". Thank you so much for saying that. I can truly see you are a being of REAL intelligence.
Now as far as that moron who said some garbage about me sleeping better at night cause I seem to "think" I'm hardcore you can just shut it. Don't let this Level 1 fool you. I've been in the loop for years and you couldn't even begin to comprehend what I could say to you. Just because you are a casual gamer doesn't automatically make the games that you play "casual". You are provong yourself to be just as typical as the people that I was talking about before. How could you even think to say I'm not hardcore when you probably have never even been it yourself you frikkin' casual. I'll tell you what. I'm gonna pull a random idiot out of my hat. I'll wager you a few hundred bucks that it turns out to be you.
LOL what an awesome comeback! That was truly genious!
He called him a frikkin' casual. Haha. That almost sounded racist.
Yeah, i "lol" on that part. I used to try to rip people a new one for their stupid "opinions". I kept getting moderated though. But this guy should win an award!
[QUOTE="azrealhk"]OpGenesis
That's all well and good and all. But, I probably won't ever become "casual". I'll go straight to "none". This I am sure of. As for others I can't say but I know what I will wind up doing. My days as a hardcore won't end until my fingers can't handle it anymore, LOL!
Besides, a true gamer is something in the heart. That ain't just somethin' that fades away with time or kids or "priorities". That is the kind of thing that forever is a part of you if it's real. A casual gamer is someone who considers playing video games as something they "do". A hardcore gamer is someone who thinks of playing video games as a piece of who they are. Anyone who follows on the footsteps of those things you mentioned was probably never a true gamer in the first place. They might have been so addicted that they couldn't put the controller down, lol. But, I can tell you that they weren't really as true of a gamer as they thought they were if they actually go "casual" as you say.
what are you sayin'?!?!?
i mean, gaming is a hobby!!! Family comes first, school or career, religion....friends too....waaaay before gaming....none of us where born in this life to live alternate lives in games...
Think about it, we constantly want games to best the best damn things ever. Those games take time, and they are few and far between for developers.
Think back to the 80s where arcade games were coming out like crazy and everyone wanted to play them. That's the same thing that Nintendo is trying to accomplish, they're trying to go back to the days where the most hardcore games were SMB and Pac-Man, yet were easy to pick up and play.
Imagine if only hardcore games were made, we'd have hardly any games and though they'd be good, they would appeal to about 2% of people. If a game sold bad, the developer that madeit would be pretty much screwed. Though there are measures to prevent that now, it'd be pretty much what was going on in 83. Now if you try to make games that appeal to casuals/non-gamers, sure 2% of people won't buy them, but the percent that will will be a hell of a lot higher than 2%, plus those games would be cheaper.
Casuals and non-gamers won't kill gaming, they outnumber the hardcores, with game sales increasing, it's coming clear that casuals and non-gamers are preserving gaming. It's a harsh reality to accept, but the casualization of gaming may just be what can help it. Hardcores like me have become obsolete and needy.
CJL13
hardcores are the backbone of this industry. They comprise far more than 2% of the industry, and they spend much more money than casuals.
[QUOTE="Dencore"][QUOTE="joel_101"]well i'm a casual gamer. and i play those games. so they are casual games.
games like WOW, God of War, HL2, Halo.
Does it helps you sleep at night calling yourself hardcore, when your realy not.
OpGenesis
First of all while I didn't like Gears Epic IS considered "hardcore" with Unreal Tournament. If you were talking about generically garbage shooters like Halo or Lost Planet I'd whole heatedly agree, but Unreal Tournament is a top tier PC franchise.
Finally, someone ELSE who understands the "not all that greatness" that is "Halo". Thank you so much for saying that. I can truly see you are a being of REAL intelligence.
Now as far as that moron who said some garbage about me sleeping better at night cause I seem to "think" I'm hardcore you can just shut it. Don't let this Level 1 fool you. I've been in the loop for years and you couldn't even begin to comprehend what I could say to you. Just because you are a casual gamer doesn't automatically make the games that you play "casual". You are provong yourself to be just as typical as the people that I was talking about before. How could you even think to say I'm not hardcore when you probably have never even been it yourself you frikkin' casual. I'll tell you what. I'm gonna pull a random idiot out of my hat. I'll wager you a few hundred bucks that it turns out to be you.
or.....you could pull out a mirror
what i understand about hardcore and not hardcore......is that there is no nationally recognized grade or formulized proof whether one is hardcore or not; it is just ones own understanding of what it means and their correlation to it.
i have had many systems and for i while i didnt back nintendo....and i always thought that the most hardcore fanboys where nintendos fanboys...you know, the ones that dressed up as mario and luigi the night before launch day.....they are as bad a huge starwars fanboys...
but again that is just my understanding.....
halo CE may not seem hardcore to some and may to others....but to tell you the truth i have played that game so many times so many ways....trying to do something different and interesting like trying to keep every member of my troop alive during a whole level once....which i almost did.....took for-fricken-ever....
anyways, i have also played games like gears....C&C...and HL1, 2 and CS (this is a whole nother story)
Exactly.The topic cretor seem to just pull numbers from no where!! for the hard-core gamer population to be 2% they must be freaking extreme. I wonder what exactly defines hardcore for the topic creator. And why is demanding better games a bad thing.are we to turn in to fanboys who simply follow fads like the wii????
music doesn't take a team of 150+ just to make one song..
mtron32
Exacly. That's why mainstream music will never kill niche one, but casual games can kill hardcore ones
I wonder if Puzzle Quest would exist if the game had a proposed 20 million dollar budget with 5 years of development...
Redmoonxl2
On the other hand without the constant drive toward casual games we might have got Warlords5 instead of PuzzleQuest :)
Exactly.The topic cretor seem to just pull numbers from no where!! for the hard-core gamer population to be 2% they must be freaking extreme. I wonder what exactly defines hardcore for the topic creator. And why is demanding better games a bad thing.are we to turn in to fanboys who simply follow fads like the wii????
Great_Ragnarok
why is the wii a fad...i think it isnt....
dang, i remember hating on the PS2 for the same reasons and supporting my powerful xbox!!!
i isnt a fad, anyone who says so says it out of opinion for their is no evidence.
Who says that quality games wont come out of the wii. Who says that we cant demand better games from the wii....and who says what game is better and why...honestly i am tired of all the games coming outfor the 360...except for some interesting ones...and i find myself excited for some games coming for wii...half the time i find myself disconnected....i cannot see what these soselfproclaimed "hardcore" are seeing. Is the wii ruining gaming? I think not. this has been done before and didnt ruin gaming then, why will it now. Gaming was dying; gamers were becoming a small reject niche...nintendo proved this with stats...and actually cared to dare a new strategy...to change. In fact if the did the same as MS and Sony the would have done a sega...and i am glad we havnt lost nintendo.
i didnt like them at first but why not....i have enjoyed my wii...have new experiences that i would never have guessed i would experience...and i look forward to lots of titles and i am even curious to try some of the types of games i usually avoid and whatnot.
so i dont understand all of this hate all of a sudden.
360 is good and as a gamer i would have lost by not experiencing it....and alot more so with the wii...because its new and has proven to me that it WORKS. By god it works...and it is fun; motion has now made into games....
[QUOTE="Great_Ragnarok"]Exactly.The topic cretor seem to just pull numbers from no where!! for the hard-core gamer population to be 2% they must be freaking extreme. I wonder what exactly defines hardcore for the topic creator. And why is demanding better games a bad thing.are we to turn in to fanboys who simply follow fads like the wii????
anasbouzid
why is the wii a fad...i think it isnt....
dang, i remember hating on the PS2 for the same reasons and supporting my powerful xbox!!!
i isnt a fad, anyone who says so says it out of opinion for their is no evidence.
Who says that quality games wont come out of the wii. Who says that we cant demand better games from the wii....and who says what game is better and why...honestly i am tired of all the games coming outfor the 360...except for some interesting ones...and i find myself excited for some games coming for wii...half the time i find myself disconnected....i cannot see what these soselfproclaimed "hardcore" are seeing. Is the wii ruining gaming? I think not. this has been done before and didnt ruin gaming then, why will it now. Gaming was dying; gamers were becoming a small reject niche...nintendo proved this with stats...and actually cared to dare a new strategy...to change. In fact if the did the same as MS and Sony the would have done a sega...and i am glad we havnt lost nintendo.
i didnt like them at first but why not....i have enjoyed my wii...have new experiences that i would never have guessed i would experience...and i look forward to lots of titles and i am even curious to try some of the types of games i usually avoid and whatnot.
so i dont understand all of this hate all of a sudden.
360 is good and as a gamer i would have lost by not experiencing it....and alot more so with the wii...because its new and has proven to me that it WORKS. By god it works...and it is fun; motion has now made into games....
I think people are rather surprised that basically for gaming to be saved there had to be less focus on them. It's like being a star basketball player that while you do well you hurt the teamwork. For the team to stay you have to start passing the ball to other people where you can easily win games by yourself, but have to put your teammates into it too just to help a team.
[QUOTE="OpGenesis"]Couldn't agree with you more.
Dencore
How Kingdom Hearts outscored Odin Sphere and Halo outscored Counterstrike and everyone believes it, is just an embrassment to show how pathetic the "gaming" community really is.
Kingdom Hearts was one of my favorite games last gen, and was my favorite new series. I haven't played Odin Sphere yet though.
I agree with a lot of the original post. I think that if the only 2 options this gen were the "hardcore" 360 and PS3, gaming would be in big trouble. $400-$600 is not enticing to a lot of people for a hobby that then constantly needs $60 additions. People always say that Wii and PS2 and DS sell because of their prices, the oposite of that is that PS3, 360, and PSP don't sell because of their prices. This would mean a lot less gamers.
I'm not going to quote the gamespot article so let's say that 5% of gamers are that "heavy" gamers that buy 25-50 games. Yes a heavy gamer buys more games than a casual, but Heavy gamers as a group do not buy more games than casuals as a group because there are so many more people that fall into that catagory.
It always surprises me on here when people ask "How many games hare you getting this year?" and people only list the 3-5 hyped games. You guys are the "hardcore" that are supposed to be the backbone of the industry, but if you're only going to buy the top tier games, how does the industry survive?
Gamers enjoy playing games, not just the best games, not just the brightest games. I'm not saying that they play garbage, but a true gamer has a much wider definition of a "good game" than a "hardcore" gamer does.
Hardcores made this industry what it is. Who the hell do you think buys the most games and software?
This thread is a disgrace to the history of gaming.
jethrovegas
QFT
How Kingdom Hearts outscored Odin Sphere and Halo outscored Counterstrike and everyone believes it, is just an embrassment to show how pathetic the "gaming" community really is.Someone
Counterstrike is a mod, not a game worth paying full retail price for. I know it's really trendy and cool to hate Halo, but it actually IS an outstanding game and certainly better than Counterstrike. This is coming from someone who has participated in (and sucked at) CS tournaments.
Its simple really, hardcore gamers and casual gamers each keep a certain type of game genre alive.
Casual gamers are easily keeping games like Madden, Smackdown etc, alive, why? cause its something that they can pick up and play within 10 minutes.
I think maybe 35% of the gaming population has the patience, and sometimes the money to put up with great long games with expansion packs, mods and user-generated content.
Its hardcore gamers that keep franchises like Starcraft, Zelda, Final Fantasy, Most FPS, and other RTS games alive.
Think about it, if either audience were to disappear or be neglected, there'd be a million gamers whining about games being too easy or too hard.
:P and there I was about to type "softcore" in place of "casual" gamers.
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