How things are changing.

Ori and the blind Forest .9

Hot line Miami 2 . 9

Olli Olli 2. 8

Hell Divers. 8

Halo Mater chief collection 6

The order 5

This is a big indication on what is happening this gen,smaller budget games in cases with pixelated graphics style beating proven series and new comers with big budgets.

I think this gen some of the best games ever will be indies,and is a shame so many people step on them,out of fanboys...

The message is clear a game doesn't nee to be huge and great looking to be fun.

You're right, tormentos.

Welcome to 2011 tomatoes.

Trolling aside, yeah, indie games focused on maximizing their gameplay assets are easily able to outdo their more repetitive, constricted AAA counterparts, though I still love both.

I wonder if AAA titles get held up to a higher standard amongst reviewers and there for score "lower".. I doubt this but it is interesting to see how it's changed.

This has been happening for a while now

Graded on a different scale. Your thread is irrelevant

Only reason why Halo MCC got that low is because of the MP at launch. At this moment in time it's just a 9

It definitely is interesting. I'm one of of those people who pretty much ignores all the major yearly rehashes apart from maybe Assassin's Creed. Maybe this will ultimate result in the big publisher crash everyone is predicting as game design does a full circle. Maybe it's a nostalgia thing?

edit: this comment aimed towards smaller games getting good scores in general.

Honestly PC gamers have been saying this for years now and its great that console gamers are listening finally. I love that the indie scene has burst onto consoles so spectacularly this gen, its so good for gaming in general. Indies aren't the same as big blockbusters, they don't have the same graphics or budget, but that doesn't mean they are any less enjoyable.

I think that console gaming had been in danger of stagnating and you were seeing the big publishers just rinsing and repeating the same games and type of games over and over. Not only is it great for all of us but hopefully it will inspire new generations of designers to create more gems and that the only option isn't working for one of the big gaming monoliths and putting out FIFA or AC or COD year after year.

Here's to gaming and everyone having a better experience.

Yeah you explained it better than I did lol Probably some of it down to AA developers pretty much evaporating through the course of last gen too. It's seems like it's either indie or AAA now.

Nope, The Master Flop Collection is a 6.

But you can go ahead and keep telling yourself that it's a 9 if that helps you sleep better at night.

@

I completely agree with you on the point. But as I said to the P2M guys, I don't get much time to game anymore. I spent a lot of money on new systems. I'd like to use the game time I do have on games that show off to some degree the power of the systems. That doesn't mean I wont play indies. But I will not wet my pants over a large portion of the library being indies. That Sony quote someone put up in the Ori thread about making less AAA games because of the rising costs of AAA is completely true. And with Sony's financials understandable.

i'd still play most AAA games over indie games, with a few very minor exceptions AAA are superior to indies and thus graded differently.

@tormentos: MCC scored badly because online was broken. Entirely different than "The Flop: 1886".

If there was an "Uncharted box set", and it flopped for the same reason, you'd be defending it with your last breath.

lmfao, I see what you did there.

@sts106mat: I don't hate the idea of metacritic but I do hate metacritic itself. Taking reviews from any tom, dick and harry website, both the clear shill sites and the ones looking for click bait hits, is so, so bad. I wish they'd cut their list down of acceptable sites and just stick to them.

This is a good thing. AAA games need another kick in the ass. They can't just keep relying on the same conventions as last gen (Order) or be unfinished messes at launch (MCC). Innovation is needed, not more production values.

The thing is we can have both, it's usually the publishers who are too afraid to take a risk and allow their AAA devs to push some innovation. If anything AAA games have become even less complex as they were a few years ago as publishers keep underestimating the market and believe the only way to make profit is to build games for the lowest common denominator and expand the market to the casuals.

That or they are doing the exact same thing with a slightly different spin to keep selling to the same audience (CoD, Battlefield). That's not a bad thing. Fans of a series want to keep playing their favorite series. The issue is when publishers get caught up on only delivering sequels to established products. Then we get stagnation. New IPs are needed.

This E3 I'm expecting more new IPs. Devs have now had 2 years with the new hardware. The PS4 and Xbox One now have large enough user bases to justify skipping PS3/360 versions of new games. This is when the new IPs will start rolling. Devs and publishers don't want to start new IPs on old consoles.

Maybe this is something new for the PlayStation fans and PS4 but the Xbox 360 had some of the best indie arcade type games. And yes they were overlooked by the fanboys, so this is nothing new to be honest. Remember these indie arcade type games didn't come out for the Xbox 360 until a couple years after launch, the same thing is happening with the Xbox One but this time it seems like they're really doing a quality check.

The Xbox 360 has over 3300 indie games:

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Games/XboxIndieGames?pagesize=90&SortBy=TopRated

and that's not including the arcade greats like Shadow Complex, State of Decay, and so on:

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/Games/XboxArcadeGames?SortBy=TopRated&PageSize=90

So I could understand why a Sony fan will mainly feel this is something new since they probably never experienced this last gen. Not even something like listwars could accurately compare the quantity and quality for last gen. It's still early in the generation, the big games are still coming but this situation is not new, nothing is changing. #GreatmessAwaits

All those indie games suck. No always online. Stupid single player no one wants to play. They should be multiplayer only. Where's the day one DLC and microtransactions? Sorry without those elements they won't get any of my easily earned money.

No one steps on indies, they take the piss out of consoles relying on them, because they are being used as fillers. No one is buying a £300 - £400 console for indie games. My Steam is full of them. They are cool extras but that is all they are... Extras.

It's unacceptable to have so many full retail games flopping. Sony and MS aren't delivering on what they promised. Cows defending indies is the same as bending over and taking it up the ass, because you guys are making excuses JUST so the situation doesn't look as bad as it actually is.

Sony and MS are fucking assholes if they think they can charge us this much for consoles and give us indies.

On the PC, they're in the right place. But then the PC has shit loads of everything, so it's okay to have these cool extras. But it is not okay to charge a lot for a consoles and rely on indie games. They were never meant for that.

If this was the PlaystationTV or the new Nvidia Sheild thing, then they seem better suited in price and hardware for that sort of a game.

@lostrib: Yea but it doesn't count until cows say it does. Are you new here?

I like both.

Indies aren't the savior everyone wants to make them out to be....but, yes, some of them are very good.

Indie games are a nice distraction but I bought a console for the AAA games. Thankfully I bought Xbox One. Can't wait for Tomb Raider, Halo 5, Quantum Break, Forza 6, Gears of War 4 etc etc

Dude, I think eltormo is a blithering idiot. But this is not a fanboy thread. Quit looking for an argument. The Order ended up being mediocre at best. Yep, a flop. MCC, a franchise where online is a HUGE part of the experience? Yeah, that's shoddy. Both were disappointments.

Indies can be just as redundant and lazy. OH look 8 bit graphics. Oh look a depressing dark story involving cute characters. Oh look super hard difficulty. Oh look an homage to your favorite old video game. Oh look another typical predictable indie game. Oh look how over priced this game is.

They are a compliment to AAA games rather than an alternative.

Unless you own a Vita then it's all you got. ZING.

TC is dropping truth bombs all over and lems are scared.

lol

They are different, though - MCC is a collection of already released AAA games. It scored badly because of poor conversion of the multiplayer. The Order flopped because it was just a shitty game. A "remastered" Order: 1886 would not do any better.

Um yeah, MCC got panned because of a buggy online. Nothing to do with the actual content - unlike the Corridor which was boring and had garbage gameplay and was short and lacked value.

Bad example to use.

I still want to play The Order 1886 the most out of those games. I'm strange I guess. To each his own.

Nice score for Ori, gotta get it

Are you actually taking sense? I'm so proud of you.

Yes, and multiplayer is a large part of the Halo franchise. Shitty execution is shitty execution. Don't make excuses. It just makes you biased, like eltormo.

Although I really like indie pixelated 2D games a lot, but I don't seem able to concede that my taste is horribly bad for liking The Order and MCC despite the overwhelming consensus (of the gaming media and gamers in general) that they are of a considerably lower entertainment value than those indie games.

Indie games compliment an already existing library of AAA games. A major console having to rely on them, be it the Xbox or Playstation, at the start of a generation when the libraries are dismal at best is incredibly underwhelming. I wouldn't put a $10 game on the same pedestal as a $60 game though.

I just want to point out, this statement only holds true if Nintendo is ignored entirely.

This, except I have a PS4 and will get the X1 down the road.

but also because I am old, I am 40, I started gaming when PONG came out for christ sake. I played multiple generations of 2D side scrolling games and the like. I got my fill of that shit. Period. This is fucking 2015 not 1985. Gimme big beautiful 3D AAA awesomeness.

I am glad that the people out there who didn't live through those gens are enjoying those types of games but like I said. Been there, done that.

I didn't buy a new console or build a PC to play games I can play on my phone.

Love indies and at them all the time.Binding of issac rebirth, rogue legacy, transistor, terraria, zen pinball 2, geometry wars 3, super stardust ultra, velocity 2x, etc... All rock!

What I want more of is actual jrpgs. It seems like every gen takes 2-3 years before the systems get them. Ps3 ais getting tales of zestria this uear, why not release on both ps3 and ps4? I will buy it either way but damn jrpgs are so few and far between.

1. No one said a game has to be AAA budget with lifelike graphics to be "fun".

2. Most Indie and full retail games are developed on different levels and have review criticism that reflect those standards

3. About this statement, "This is a big indication on what is happening this gen,smaller budget games in cases with pixelated graphics style beating proven series and new comers with big budgets."

Or

perhaps those big budget games just weren't that good and got scores that reflect that?

DONE/

I highly look forward to playing Rime but If I have to choose even my most anticipated indie is going to take a back seat to games like Bloodborne, MGS5, Final Fantasy XV, STREET FIGHTER V and UC4. High profile games are the reason why we people upgraded to begin with, the indies are just supposed to be the icing on the cake.

@GamingTitan: I am 36 and disagree with everything u just said. I am thrilled with indies and indie rpg kickstarters. I don't need graphics I need depth!

When last gen or before games have more depth than current gen games there is a problem. Thank god for indies and kickstarters games like wasteland 2, pillars of eternity etc... they are bringing back old school depth and thinking, game play and fun. Graphics are overrated...and I grew up on apple 2 and intellivison when I was a kid...sad that old pc games from the 80s are sometimes more advanced that AAA games today.

Also stop tacking on multiplayer to everything. Wolfenstien new order was so great because it didn't have it. That was a sleeper AAA gem.

Indies are fine when they're free on psn, xbox, and under $6 on steam. I really want Ori but find it hard to spend $20 on it.

I never spend full price for aaa games either though. guess I'm just cheap.

But, it's not a new game, it's a collection of remastered games. If Halo 5 flopped, then it should be included on this list.

No argument about depth and the lack of it. I want it all though, I want the depth but wrapped up in a 3D AAA gorgeous game.

Coundn't agree more about the MP.