If we count the PC in system wars, how did the PS2 win last gen?

[QUOTE="squirrel337"][QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Supafly1"]

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.NerdMan

PC always stays. It doesn't end a cycle like consoles, so that's why people don't take PC into consideration, even if it has the largest library of games.

Can you name them. It's not that I don't believe you, I'm just curious.

Current Gen AAA and AA Games by Platform

The 360 only has 6 exclusive AA titles? Is that chart really accurate? That is shockingly low, that leaves only 9 quality titles exclusive for the 360.

Lol the Wii seriously lacks games :P

^^i think you meant heard it quite often. lol

but to the point, of which there are quite a few.

firstly i think you CAN classify pc gaming generation. just see they gpu generations or you could count the differnet versions of shader models as a generations but any way they are not quite as distinct as the consoles but im sure they will do for the sake of this argument.

i believe the ps2 did win the console war and not the sytem war. i dont think without proper defintion of a pc generation you can say whether the pc has lost or not.

the resaon ms made a console was they believed that they could dominate it. much like there other products they start as with a really bad model (though the xbox was not bad) and they devolop it through several revisions and through marketing and other propoganda (made possible by their deeps pockets) they eventually push the other players to the background.from this side of the x360 launch it is hard to say that they will fail.

and pc gaming will never die infact as far as i know it is alive and kicking. it will be alive as long as there is some casual gamer playing solitaire.

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.CaseyWegner

nope.

the pc

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.CaseyWegner

nope.

the pc

casey how can you tell the PC won ? like how can statics show a pc was bought soley for gameing. and track sales that way ?

i think its only fair to count software sales on each system and if that is the case the PS2 did win. just like the DS is winning now

[QUOTE="Supafly1"]

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.Vandalvideo

PC always stays. It doesn't end a cycle like consoles, so that's why people don't take PC into consideration, even if it has the largest library of games.

and the ds and 360 has had more softwaresales then the PC.

and the ds and 360 has had more softwaresales then the PC.Hadoken_Kid

Current Gen AAA and AA Games by Platform

NerdMan

This looks legit to me. Kudos to whoever made this.

[QUOTE="deadmeat59"]if gaming pcs sell so great then why does ms want a console 2?Vandalvideo

no.....stop spreading misinformation.....its because game consoles are the center of the living room...if they let sony strong arm the living room and control the media experience of the home theater then its only a matter of time before they converge and start effecting windows....they do get profit and do control pc gaming ever since direct X became standard.......so stop with your lies

[QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]and the ds and 360 has had more softwaresales then the PC.Vandalvideo

sales is the main facter on who wins the system wars.

casey how can you tell the PC won ? like how can statics show a pc was bought soley for gameing. and track sales that way ?

i think its only fair to count software sales on each system and if that is the case the PS2 did win. just like the DS is winning now

Hadoken_Kid

oh, grant me restraint. :evil:

games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]and the ds and 360 has had more softwaresales then the PC.Hadoken_Kid

sales is the main facter on who wins the system wars.

never has been. never will.

[QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

casey how can you tell the PC won ? like how can statics show a pc was bought soley for gameing. and track sales that way ?

i think its only fair to count software sales on each system and if that is the case the PS2 did win. just like the DS is winning now

CaseyWegner

oh, grant me restraint. :evil:

games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales.

quote me whole i am responding to your statement PS2 did not win saleswise, and you said PC won saleswise,

[QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]and the ds and 360 has had more softwaresales then the PC.CaseyWegner

sales is the main facter on who wins the system wars.

never has been. never will.

then why is there 100's of NPD threads every month and many japanese media crate threads every week?

just cause you dont think so doesnt mean a vast majority of people in systemwars dont think so.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="deadmeat59"]if gaming pcs sell so great then why does ms want a console 2?Kronos6

no.....stop spreading misinformation.....its because game consoles are the center of the living room...if they let sony strong arm the living room and control the media experience of the home theater then its only a matter of time before they converge and start effecting windows....they do get profit and do control pc gaming ever since direct X became standard.......so stop with your lies

They don't get profit from pc gaming. Direct X actually costs Microsoft money and so does Games for Windows. He isn't lieing, your just misinformed.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

casey how can you tell the PC won ? like how can statics show a pc was bought soley for gameing. and track sales that way ?

i think its only fair to count software sales on each system and if that is the case the PS2 did win. just like the DS is winning now

Hadoken_Kid

oh, grant me restraint. :evil:

games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales.

quote me whole i am responding to your statement PS2 did not win saleswise, and you said PC won saleswise,

you have to excuse casey..he has a tendancy to lean on the pc side when its convenient to an arguement

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="deadmeat59"]if gaming pcs sell so great then why does ms want a console 2?Kronos6

no.....stop spreading misinformation.....its because game consoles are the center of the living room...if they let sony strong arm the living room and control the media experience of the home theater then its only a matter of time before they converge and start effecting windows....they do get profit and do control pc gaming ever since direct X became standard.......so stop with your lies

[QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

casey how can you tell the PC won ? like how can statics show a pc was bought soley for gameing. and track sales that way ?

i think its only fair to count software sales on each system and if that is the case the PS2 did win. just like the DS is winning now

Kronos6

oh, grant me restraint. :evil:

games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales. games. not sales.

quote me whole i am responding to your statement PS2 did not win saleswise, and you said PC won saleswise,

you have to excuse casey..he has a tendancy to lean on the pc side when its convenient to an arguement

what's wrong with being correct? :?

[QUOTE="Kronos6"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="deadmeat59"]if gaming pcs sell so great then why does ms want a console 2?_Pedro_

no.....stop spreading misinformation.....its because game consoles are the center of the living room...if they let sony strong arm the living room and control the media experience of the home theater then its only a matter of time before they converge and start effecting windows....they do get profit and do control pc gaming ever since direct X became standard.......so stop with your lies

They don't get profit from pc gaming. Direct X actually costs Microsoft money and so does Games for Windows. He isn't lieing, your just misinformed.

oh i see....theres no licensing agreements involved when people use direct x for commercial use...i think you dont know how a business operates...of course games for windows costs money....every business opportunity costs money....you have to spend to create revenue......give me a break....

then why is there 100's of NPD threads every month and many japanese media crate threads every week?

just cause you dont think so doesnt mean a vast majority of people in systemwars dont think so.

Hadoken_Kid

because they're gaming related. games get far more attention. it's not even close.

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.CaseyWegner

nope.

the pc

Could you clarify what you mean here casey? Do you mean gaming PCs, like from alienware, dell, etc, or do you mean all pc sales?

[QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

then why is there 100's of NPD threads every month and many japanese media crate threads every week?

just cause you dont think so doesnt mean a vast majority of people in systemwars dont think so.

CaseyWegner

because they're gaming related. games get far more attention. it's not even close.

i think your misunderstanding me.

on page 1 of this thread someone said ps2 won last gen. you said "nope" they said salewise, then you still said no. then someone ask who won last gen(in relation to sales) if not Ps2. and you said "PC".

Now i agree games are better then sales. but that still doesnt take away from most people on here using sales.

and also i only responded to the fact you(which i assumed from reading your quotes stated PC won last gen for sales not PS2. and that is where i disagree with you.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

[QUOTE="Bromz"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.drewtwo99

nope.

the pc

Could you clarify what you mean here casey? Do you mean gaming PCs, like from alienware, dell, etc, or do you mean all pc sales?

THAT IS WHAT I WAS RESPONDING TOO . LOL

yes please clarify casey.

PS2 was loads better than PC. its gaming library actually consisted of more than 2-3 genres.

So Casey, do tell me, where do the DS and the PSP stand? This is System Wars after all. ;)Hexagon_777

Second and third, respectively. Ain't that a kicker? :lol:

[QUOTE="Supafly1"]

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]the ps2 didn't win. people just like to exclude things or make excusesto make their system look better.Vandalvideo

PC always stays. It doesn't end a cycle like consoles, so that's why people don't take PC into consideration, even if it has the largest library of games.

We already know that PC gaming wins every generation - the point is that the majority of console fanboys don't particularly care. If you want to call it fighting for second place, go right ahead - but the fact of the matter is that nobody but hermits feels it neccessary to even argue this point.

It just isn't fun to debate PC vs. console in the context of system wars. Nobody really cares.

[QUOTE="Hexagon_777"]So Casey, do tell me, where do the DS and the PSP stand? This is System Wars after all. ;)t3hTwinky

Second and third, respectively. Ain't that a kicker? :lol:

so i guess that makes cell phones number 1....cause cell phones play games

PS2 was loads better than PC. its gaming library actually consisted of more than 2-3 genres.

Pdiddy105

i think you just opened a can of worms there.

PC has lots of genre

flight sims

racing sims

shooters

rpgs

RTS

MMOs

minigames

socailgames(spades, hearts and poker, etc)

thats just off the top of my head.

i think i played just about as many PC games as PS2 games also.

[QUOTE="_Pedro_"][QUOTE="Kronos6"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="deadmeat59"]if gaming pcs sell so great then why does ms want a console 2?Kronos6

no.....stop spreading misinformation.....its because game consoles are the center of the living room...if they let sony strong arm the living room and control the media experience of the home theater then its only a matter of time before they converge and start effecting windows....they do get profit and do control pc gaming ever since direct X became standard.......so stop with your lies

They don't get profit from pc gaming. Direct X actually costs Microsoft money and so does Games for Windows. He isn't lieing, your just misinformed.

oh i see....theres no licensing agreements involved when people use direct x for commercial use...i think you dont know how a business operates...of course games for windows costs money....every business opportunity costs money....you have to spend to create revenue......give me a break....

You've raised a good point. I always thought these practices were illegal, because microsoft has a monopoly in the OS department. It does force direcx down gamers throats, because most other graphical programs are OpenGL.

its pretty much how they stay in business....you make these agreements and you keep direct x as a viable standard....keeping your OS as a standard....it only puts more money in your pockets in the long run....you spend money here and there but the benefits outweight the negatives.....thats why i cringe when i read a hermit's statement that microsoft doesnt benefit from pc gaming.....oh yes it does....in a very big way...those pc gaming benefits also benefit the xbox division because there are relationships in existance which carry over into that existing market....Kronos6

i don't even know anymore. i'm arguing over this same topic with multiple people in three different threads. the bottom line is that games > sales for determining the winner here.CaseyWegner

My question already got answered by reading that other thread. I saw in that chart that performance PC GPUs are outselling all the consoles. Thanks for all your help and clarification though. Hopefully it will sink in for some of us.

[QUOTE="Kronos6"]its pretty much how they stay in business....you make these agreements and you keep direct x as a viable standard....keeping your OS as a standard....it only puts more money in your pockets in the long run....you spend money here and there but the benefits outweight the negatives.....thats why i cringe when i read a hermit's statement that microsoft doesnt benefit from pc gaming.....oh yes it does....in a very big way...those pc gaming benefits also benefit the xbox division because there are relationships in existance which carry over into that existing market....Vandalvideo

no one said anything about owning....but controlling is a whole different monster...and right now microsoft controls pc gaming.....you cant argue it...so stop crying about it...your a hermit who doesnt want to admit his system is MICROSOFT.......no matter how bad you like it until something different comes along or until you decide on running your pc on another os and can run games (LEGALLY) on that system...then you are bound by microsoft...

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]i don't even know anymore. i'm arguing over this same topic with multiple people in three different threads. the bottom line is that games > sales for determining the winner here.drewtwo99

My question already got answered by reading that other thread. I saw in that chart that performance PC GPUs are outselling all the consoles. Thanks for all your help and clarification though. Hopefully it will sink in for some of us.

can you give me a link to that chart too so i can see ?

no one said anything about owning....but controlling is a whole different monster...and right now microsoft controls pc gaming....you cant argue it...so stop crying about it...your a hermit who doesnt want to admit his system is MICROSOFT.......no matter how bad you like it until something different comes along or until you decide on running your pc on another os and can run games (LEGALLY) on that system...then you are bound by microsoft...Kronos6

can you give me a link to that chart too so i can see ?

Hadoken_Kid

http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/news/2007-04/jpr_aibs_trends_q4_2006.png

[QUOTE="Kronos6"]no one said anything about owning....but controlling is a whole different monster...and right now microsoft controls pc gaming....you cant argue it...so stop crying about it...your a hermit who doesnt want to admit his system is MICROSOFT.......no matter how bad you like it until something different comes along or until you decide on running your pc on another os and can run games (LEGALLY) on that system...then you are bound by microsoft...Vandalvideo

Windows is a microsoft platform......you run windows on your pc....your pc operates on a microsoft platform hence "operating system" end of story....maybe you should use a mac...and run wine so you can TRY and play bioshock

I don't understand that. According to stickies and everyone on system wars, it's a rule that PC counts as part of system wars. But when we crowned a winner last gen, PS2 was the winner? How so? PC sold the most, had the best online system, best control scheme (gamepad & KB/M) and of course best and most games. So if PC is indeed a part of system wars, didn't it win every single gen in every possible way since gaming was invented?manningbowl135

There is a difference between PC and Gaming PC. Just about everyone owns a PC but only a small percentage of the population own a Gaming PC. The lines get more blurred when you account for the fact that not all gaming rigs can run the best game. So what config = a gaming rig that lasts 4 years without an upgrade....... then do most people have the same or very similar config etc.

[QUOTE="NerdMan"]

Current Gen AAA and AA Games by Platform

drewtwo99

This looks legit to me. Kudos to whoever made this.

Wow. Whoever made it must've been a nerd...man.

Windows is a microsoft platform......you run windows on your pc....your pc operates on a microsoft platform hence "operating system" end of story....maybe you should use a mac...and run wine so you can TRY and play bioshock Kronos6

[QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

can you give me a link to that chart too so i can see ?

drewtwo99

http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/news/2007-04/jpr_aibs_trends_q4_2006.png

what bothers me about that chart is what exactly is a performance gpu....do they consider the ati x1400 in my core duo laptop to be a performance card?

[QUOTE="drewtwo99"][QUOTE="NerdMan"]

Current Gen AAA and AA Games by Platform

manningbowl135

This looks legit to me. Kudos to whoever made this.

Wow. Whoever made it must've been a nerd...man.

Hahaha, I can be really oblivious sometimes can't I?

[QUOTE="Kronos6"]Windows is a microsoft platform......you run windows on your pc....your pc operates on a microsoft platform hence "operating system" end of story....maybe you should use a mac...and run wine so you can TRY and play bioshock Vandalvideo

the fact of the matter is that the video card is interchangable....the OS system ISNT...and thats what you keep ignoring...you can keep pouting and crying...but your still wrong...

what you said is the equivalent to ...lemme see you play your 360 without a tv....lol...horrible comeback

[QUOTE="drewtwo99"][QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

can you give me a link to that chart too so i can see ?

Kronos6

http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/news/2007-04/jpr_aibs_trends_q4_2006.png

what bothers me about that chart is what exactly is a performance gpu....do they consider the ati x1400 in my core duo laptop to be a performance card?

The price determines the rating. $250 is a performance GPU, and is in line with lower end console prices.

the fact of the matter is that the video card is interchangable....the OS system ISNT...and thats what you keep ignoring...you can keep pouting and crying...but your still wrong...what you said is the equivalent to ...lemme see you play your 360 without a tv....lol...horrible comebackKronos6

[QUOTE="Kronos6"][QUOTE="drewtwo99"][QUOTE="Hadoken_Kid"]

can you give me a link to that chart too so i can see ?

drewtwo99

http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/news/2007-04/jpr_aibs_trends_q4_2006.png

what bothers me about that chart is what exactly is a performance gpu....do they consider the ati x1400 in my core duo laptop to be a performance card?

The price determines the rating. $250 is a performance GPU, and is in line with lower end console prices.

ah ok i overlooked that......