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64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

*triehard drivel*
Slashless

uh huh. Just couldn't be happy with a good thing could you.

12 years ago

9534

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Member since 2011 • 9534 Posts

*butthurt damage control*
jg4xchamp

You try too hard champ. I miss when you were funny. :(

Oh wait you were never funny.

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

You try too hard
Slashless

12 years ago

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Member since 2005 • 35966 Posts

[QUOTE="BPoole96"]
[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"] NV is exempt, I suppose, simply because Obsidian is in on the document.FrozenLiquid

I didn't even realize that Obsidian was working on this. I'm not as big of a fan of theirs as Slashless is but New Vegas was awesome and one of the very true RPGs this gen

I haven't played New Vegas, partly coz I don't have time, partly coz Fallout 3 was boring. I keep hearing it's awesome, though, from people who knew what RPGs were like before this generation. You might have just tipped me over the cliff to purchase it :P

Man go buy it! And make sure to get the OLD WORLD BLUES DLC to! (best dlc ever).

I did not like Fallout3 at all, but New Vegas I loved!

Fallout3 I had to force myself to beat it and get to the end, and could not go through a 2nd time all the way. With New Vegas though? I have beat it 7 times! And thinkign of installing it again :P

Don't let F3 put you off of New Vegas bud :cool:

12 years ago

9534

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Member since 2011 • 9534 Posts

jg4xchamp

Woah for a second there I mistook you for Theguardian what with the unfunny Supernatural gif.

12 years ago

13555

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#106 FrozenLiquid

Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="smerlus"]Sadly I have to agree with SciFiRPGFan's statement about Wasteland 2 needing to be a critical success and more importantly a financial success to turn the head of BioWare/Bethesda execs. Not only do i think it would have to sell well but I think it would have to turn the genre on its head, meaning that if the next BioWare/Bethesda game came out and seemed watered down in comparison, then it would sell less due to the new found interest in Wasteland 2's supposedly deeper RPG mechanics... Slim chance. However I hope it's still the kind of success needed to cement Kickstarter as a great avenue to make these kinds of games and also a viable alternative to the crappy publsiher model we have today. Imagine BioWare churning out Mass Effect 4: Kart Racer edition and on the side, working a Kickstarter Project. (meh...I'd still be kind of leary because i've lost all faith in BioWare) On the otherhand if this game flops or other games like Shadowrun Returns flops/fails to be released, then it would pretty much destroy a lot of faith that people have in Kickstarter funded games.

Well after watching all the marketing videos in succession, away from the hype of fans and the internet claiming they are still RPGs (I suppose I mixed up fans such as AdobeArtist to be what Bioware themselves said), I have to retract that it won't turn Bioware's head. I mean, Bioware are creating interactive stories with shooting elements. They say as much in all the pre-release hype. Even if Wasteland 2 were to sell several million copies of the game, Bioware's already decided to go off on another tangent.

I read one interview where a BioWare exec stated that RPGs have evolved and what BioWare creates are still RPGs because they still have decision making. It seems that is all that they consider to be an RPG now.

I also remember reading professional reviews who said as much. Hook, line and sinker. Now with a recommendation from kozzy and other fans, I'm gonna deffo purchase New Vegas very soon.

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

what with the unfunny gif.
Slashless

12 years ago

9534

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Member since 2011 • 9534 Posts

Damn it Guardian stop that sh!t

@Frozen: Enjoy! :)

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

Damn it Guardian stop that sh!t
Slashless

[spoiler] God if this was the old TOU, I'd be working on another suspension right now. [/spoiler]

12 years ago

9534

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Member since 2011 • 9534 Posts

I would've been banned.

I'm surpised I'm not banned yet. The mods love me. <3

12 years ago

13555

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#111 FrozenLiquid

Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

Jensen Ackles prettyboi face annoys the hell outta me

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

Jensen Ackles prettyboi face annoys the hell outta meFrozenLiquid

I can throw in some Sam Winchester for you. Know how much you love that guy

[spoiler] Those gifs are clutch. Forgot I had these for that one stretch when I wanted all my posts to be a gif. [/spoiler]

12 years ago

13555

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#113 FrozenLiquid

Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"]Jensen Ackles prettyboi face annoys the hell outta mejg4xchamp

I can throw in some Sam Winchester for you. Know how much you love that guy

[spoiler] Those gifs are clutch. Forgot I had these for that one stretch when I wanted all my posts to be a gif. [/spoiler]

:lol: I love how the camera man had trouble tilting up to frame Padalecki.

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

So you installing New Vegas or what? Go ham. Do hardcore mode.

12 years ago

13555

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#115 FrozenLiquid

Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

Fvck off with those gifs man, let's be serious now :lol: Nah I'll wait 'til the Ultimate Edition goes on sale, besides got other games to finish with little time to do it in. I swear playing Mass Effect 3 has probably caused some production f*ck up somewhere down the line and I'm gonna pay for it.

12 years ago

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Member since 2008 • 8625 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"] Caesar's Legion is against corruption which actually made me almost respect them if it wasn't for the rape and pillage part. They do have certain morals that the other factions lacked but it's hard to get over their actions. Talking to some of the merchants on how the Legion was protecting them against bandits while the NCR was just worried about protecting themselves was also honorable but...Slashless

Honestly, the NCR is just a parallel of Caesar's Legion, save the fact Caesar's Legion is outspoken about what they are/what they stand for while NCR blinds the people into thinkintg they're the "good" guys when honestly they're just as power hungry and can do just as bad as Ceasar's Legion. Caesar's Legion flips you off. NCR buys you a candybar then punches your dog. :P

I would've done more Caesar playthroughs if it wasn't for the fact that Boone doesn't like me when I do. :P

I disagree, NCR is much better than Caesar's Legion. They killed almost everyone in a town just for trying to be neutral. They constantly enslave people. They treat women like crap. NCR is definitely power hungry, but they are generally good.

So you installing New Vegas or what? Go ham. Do hardcore mode.
jg4xchamp

I did hardcore mode my first playthrough and all it did was annoy me. The gameplay of the game honestly isn't that great so why make it harder?

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

I liked the idea of having to preserve resources and sh1t. It's one of the few times I was willing to suffer the annoyance of some cheap difficulty.

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"]Fvck off with those gifs man, let's be serious now :lol: Nah I'll wait 'til the Ultimate Edition goes on sale, besides got other games to finish with little time to do it in. I swear playing Mass Effect 3 has probably caused some production f*ck up somewhere down the line and I'm gonna pay for it.

Mass Effect 3: What could have been.

12 years ago

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#119 SciFiRPGfan

Member since 2010 • 694 Posts

[QUOTE="SciFiRPGfan"]
(stuff)
FrozenLiquid

You know, I was looking for the stuff that pointed to Bioware and Bethesda talking about how amazing their RPG stuff was, but I actually couldn't find it. At all. In that sense, my argument completely capitulates. But watching all these videos just excites me more about Wasteland 2. All these damn Skyrim and ME videos are all about 'storytelling'; taking storytelling to the next level, how technology can make storytelling better, how you can make your character your own through storytelling. And about the gameplay? Both Todd Howard and Casey Hudson made bashful admittances to a more action-oriented experience. Even the SW:TOR videos I thought claimed to be the next level of MMORPG was just about 'interactive storytelling'. So no, inExile won't be kicking any balls, because there are no balls to kick. For the most part, I concede my argument. Except for the bit about 'what is a better RPG'. Hell no, that argument can fvck off. Your grilling me about finding evidence to my claims is proof in and of itself that Bioware and Bethesda can't even admit to creating roleplaying games anymore, so this whole 'it depends on someone's definitino of an RPG' is utter crap. Yeah, and Earth's moon is only a satellite depending on people's definition of a satellite. It could be a sun if people believed it hard enough. At least Mr. Hudson and Mr. Howard concede otherwise.

Welp, just for the record, it's not like I wouldn't want them to implement more RPG elements. To the contrary, I would love that. Heck, I had a way longer argument than this one here on SW with one guy about how even such thing as inclusion of inventory could have benefited Mass Effects. =) So I am all for most of known traditional RPG elements and more ways how to solve quests and such.

It's just that a) I don't see that happening anytime soon, b) can live without them and c) don't care to what genre will the game belong as long as I would enjoy it. But I'll definitely keep an eye on Wasteland 2.

As for what is and what isn't an RPG... What to say... the definitions among people will most likely vary for some time whether you or I or anyone else like it or not. E.g. do you consider Deus Ex to be an RPG? Its creator, Warren Spector does and he has rhetoric somewhat similar to people who oppose the idea, that gameplay mechanics are an important determinat of a genre, like Adobe Artist who made a thread about it very recently. But personally, I would probably call it a hybrid just like Mass Effects. But who would be right or wrong and according to whom?

And at the end of the day, one can still make a point about liking or not liking or missing something in the game without mentioning the term RPG - e.g. I miss inventory in Mass Effects and would want to see it there regardless of whether it is considered to be an RPG element or not. And IMO that's clearer and more accurate way of expressing opinions about something. And that's the approach I prefer. So, if you insist on "your definition" of RPGs and on claim that Bioware, Bethesda, maybe CD Projekt Red or Eidos Montreal are not making (proper?) RPGs anymore... be it. I'll leave that to folks who care about it.

Also, is it really my PC / browser / whatnot or does that link in OP not work properly? Not like it was hard find it, but I recommend checking the OP's link.

12 years ago

15265

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#120 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] Hypocrite much? I always find it funny that you use reviews to dictate how good a company is but you're the first person to make a topic in the PGD and System Wars forums when a reviewer says something you don't like. Dragon Age 1 for PC is one of those BioWare games that rated over a 90 yet you claim it's over rated... could some of the other scores accidentally be over inflated or is this just a coincidence. I mean I know you love Dragon Age 2 and its paltry 79 score. So why do you stand by scores so much when you don't even believe they dictate quality?

When did I even say that DA2 is even great? I didn't. It is a rushed and incomplete game. It was the narrative aspects and the willingness of Bioware to go outside the narrative box which I applaud and teh character cast is great and a huge improvement over Origins.

You've consistantly said Dragon Age 2 is a better game than Dragon Age 1. You always praise Dragon Age 2 and you talk crap about Dragon Age 1. So in essence you enjoy a game rated a 79 more than a game rated a 91.

WRONG I said they were about even, both 8.0 RPGs....but DA2 has a STRONGER STORY AND CHARACTERS...learn my position before you bash.

12 years ago

13555

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#121 FrozenLiquid

Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"]Fvck off with those gifs man, let's be serious now :lol: Nah I'll wait 'til the Ultimate Edition goes on sale, besides got other games to finish with little time to do it in. I swear playing Mass Effect 3 has probably caused some production f*ck up somewhere down the line and I'm gonna pay for it.

Mass Effect 3: What could have been.

Meh, Garrus made it bearable. Reasons why you didn't like it? I swear every other day you throw a curveball so I can never understand your tastes in games. I have to ask though coz Bioware took a gamble with their mandatory boy scout character and added some chilli flakes to it. James Vega, yes or no?

12 years ago

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#122 Kandlegoat

Member since 2009 • 3147 Posts

[QUOTE="Kandlegoat"]
[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] I don't get where they are coming with this mentality, it felt similar to playing fo3, the story may have been better but due to the desert the gameplay crawled along dieing under a hot sun.cain006

New Vegas:

Meaningful Choices that are morally gray and have actual consequences

Factions that arent simply just "good guy and bad guys"

More open ended gamplay

Stats and Character builds that are more meaningful

Environments and settlements that are actually logical instead of an amusement park of post apocalyptic cliches.

better writing

Fallout 3:

Teddy Bear Launchers

Level Scaling

Transformers

An annoying disc jockey with magical powers allowing him to sleep and still do a radio show.

Caesar's Legion is pretty much pure evil. They're sexist, slave owners, and openly murder people for not following them and their rules. The other choices are kinda hard to choose, but there's really nothing redeaming about Caesar. And Three Dog is pretty cool, definitely more fun than Mr. New Vegas. I agree that New Vegas is much better though.

There's not too much I can say that Slashless and Smerlus didnt already address.

But yeah while I agree among the factions, Caesar's Legion happens to be the most direct and vicious,there is atleast reasons behind Caesar's idealogies despite how extreme the methods are.Not to mention,it's open enough for the player to decide whether they can sympathize with these said idealogies or not.

Regardless, Caesar is alot better written character than President "muahaha let's poison the water" Eden.

And Wayne Newton >Three Dog, get the fvck out with that bullh*t bro :cool:

12 years ago

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#123 KalDurenik

Member since 2004 • 3736 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] When did I even say that DA2 is even great? I didn't. It is a rushed and incomplete game. It was the narrative aspects and the willingness of Bioware to go outside the narrative box which I applaud and teh character cast is great and a huge improvement over Origins.

You've consistantly said Dragon Age 2 is a better game than Dragon Age 1. You always praise Dragon Age 2 and you talk crap about Dragon Age 1. So in essence you enjoy a game rated a 79 more than a game rated a 91.

WRONG I said they were about even, both 8.0 RPGs....but DA2 has a STRONGER STORY AND CHARACTERS...learn my position before you bash.

DA2 had a good story and good characters O.o? Or well "stronger"? If i remember correctly i found it so bad that i had to continue to play... just to see if it could get any worse (it did). Do that make the game good?

12 years ago

13555

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#124 FrozenLiquid

Member since 2007 • 13555 Posts

[QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="SciFiRPGfan"]
(stuff)
SciFiRPGfan

You know, I was looking for the stuff that pointed to Bioware and Bethesda talking about how amazing their RPG stuff was, but I actually couldn't find it. At all. In that sense, my argument completely capitulates. But watching all these videos just excites me more about Wasteland 2. All these damn Skyrim and ME videos are all about 'storytelling'; taking storytelling to the next level, how technology can make storytelling better, how you can make your character your own through storytelling. And about the gameplay? Both Todd Howard and Casey Hudson made bashful admittances to a more action-oriented experience. Even the SW:TOR videos I thought claimed to be the next level of MMORPG was just about 'interactive storytelling'. So no, inExile won't be kicking any balls, because there are no balls to kick. For the most part, I concede my argument. Except for the bit about 'what is a better RPG'. Hell no, that argument can fvck off. Your grilling me about finding evidence to my claims is proof in and of itself that Bioware and Bethesda can't even admit to creating roleplaying games anymore, so this whole 'it depends on someone's definitino of an RPG' is utter crap. Yeah, and Earth's moon is only a satellite depending on people's definition of a satellite. It could be a sun if people believed it hard enough. At least Mr. Hudson and Mr. Howard concede otherwise.

Welp, just for the record, it's not like I wouldn't want them to implement more RPG elements. To the contrary, I would love that. Heck, I had a way longer argument than this one here on SW with one guy about how even such thing as inclusion of inventory could have benefited Mass Effects. =) So I am all for most of known traditional RPG elements and more ways how to solve quests and such.

It's just that a) I don't see that happening anytime soon, b) can live without them and c) don't care to what genre will the game belong as long as I would enjoy it. But I'll definitely keep an eye on Wasteland 2.

As for what is and what isn't an RPG... What to say... the definitions among people will most likely vary for some time whether you or I or anyone else like it or not. E.g. do you consider Deus Ex to be an RPG? Its creator, Warren Spector does and he has rhetoric somewhat similar to people who oppose the idea, that gameplay mechanics are an important determinat of a genre, like Adobe Artist who made a thread about it very recently. But personally, I would probably call it a hybrid just like Mass Effects. But who would be right or wrong and according to whom?

And at the end of the day, one can still make a point about liking or not liking or missing something in the game without mentioning the term RPG - e.g. I miss inventory in Mass Effects and would want to see it there regardless of whether it is considered to be an RPG element or not. And IMO that's clearer and more accurate way of expressing opinions about something. And that's the approach I prefer. So, if you insist on "your definition" of RPGs and on claim that Bioware, Bethesda, maybe CD Projekt Red or Eidos Montreal are not making (proper?) RPGs anymore... be it. I'll leave that to folks who care about it.

Also, is it really my PC / browser / whatnot or does that link in OP not work properly? Not like it was hard find it, but I recommend checking the OP's link.

Deus Ex is an easy one: It's an action RPG. Action RPGs are difficult to discuss coz I find RPG fans are in two camps: ones who like real-time action, others who prefer turn-based action. I'm the latter, but what people of my camp need to realize is that real-time action doesn't necessarily void ARPGs of the title, especially if character building heavily changes play styIe. System Shock 2 and Deus Ex are fantastic ARPGs. Actually, a case study can be made between Deus Ex and Deus Ex: HR. To paint broad strokes, one is a RPG with light shooting elements, the other is a shooter with light RPG elements. I fixed the link in the OP. Here it is again

12 years ago

190586385885857957282413308806

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#125 190586385885857957282413308806

Member since 2002 • 13084 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] When did I even say that DA2 is even great? I didn't. It is a rushed and incomplete game. It was the narrative aspects and the willingness of Bioware to go outside the narrative box which I applaud and teh character cast is great and a huge improvement over Origins.

You've consistantly said Dragon Age 2 is a better game than Dragon Age 1. You always praise Dragon Age 2 and you talk crap about Dragon Age 1. So in essence you enjoy a game rated a 79 more than a game rated a 91.

WRONG I said they were about even, both 8.0 RPGs....but DA2 has a STRONGER STORY AND CHARACTERS...learn my position before you bash.

Point still stands that a 79 rated game is just as good in your eyes as a 91... So what's your stance about Obsidian games again? Oh yeah it's contradictory.

12 years ago

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#126 deactivated-61cc564148ef4

Member since 2007 • 10909 Posts

That got me quite excited. It ain't smack talk, it's an actual design document. So I have a feeling they will deliver

12 years ago

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Member since 2010 • 10498 Posts

Bioware is truly becoming the laughing stock of the industry :lol:

Wasteland 2 is looking to be pretty fvcking sweet, can't wait.

12 years ago

64057

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Member since 2006 • 64057 Posts

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"]Fvck off with those gifs man, let's be serious now :lol: Nah I'll wait 'til the Ultimate Edition goes on sale, besides got other games to finish with little time to do it in. I swear playing Mass Effect 3 has probably caused some production f*ck up somewhere down the line and I'm gonna pay for it.FrozenLiquid

Mass Effect 3: What could have been.

Meh, Garrus made it bearable. Reasons why you didn't like it? I swear every other day you throw a curveball so I can never understand your tastes in games. I have to ask though coz Bioware took a gamble with their mandatory boy scout character and added some chilli flakes to it. James Vega, yes or no?

I enjoyed it. It's just disappointing in spots. Ending becoming what it is(plus it reminds me of Battlestar Galactica's ending), and the shooting is still mad wooden. I loved the character moments in the game. What Bioware lacks in some consistency from a plot standpoint they usually make up for in characters. Garrus is bro status. James was chill I guess at times. I only remember him and garrus having that d1ck measuring contest on the ship with each others military records.

Just with Bioware it would have been nice if the gameplay was like more satisfying, and a little more variety. Outside of that I had fun shooting sh1t, and enjoying aspects of the games universe before it completely tanked.

12 years ago

155290

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Member since 2006 • 155290 Posts

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"][QUOTE="FrozenLiquid"][QUOTE="jg4xchamp"] It's a compliment. You should cherish it for an eternity. Lord knows you'll never be deserving of another one. Besides b1tched rolled sprained her ankle over the weekend. So I'm apparently the bad guy for finding that sh1t funny. So I had to settle for this and Thor.

Thor? You like that movie?

No. That movie was corny. The special effects were like out of Power Rangers or something. In fact I wish I watched The Power Rangers movie instead.

Wasn't the Power Rangers movie s*****?

12 years ago

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#130 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] You've consistantly said Dragon Age 2 is a better game than Dragon Age 1. You always praise Dragon Age 2 and you talk crap about Dragon Age 1. So in essence you enjoy a game rated a 79 more than a game rated a 91.

WRONG I said they were about even, both 8.0 RPGs....but DA2 has a STRONGER STORY AND CHARACTERS...learn my position before you bash.

Point still stands that a 79 rated game is just as good in your eyes as a 91... So what's your stance about Obsidian games again? Oh yeah it's contradictory.

Because the gameplay and world are better in DAO....however, DAO ages quite poorly and does not stand the test of time through its poor graphics and generic storyline. Nevermind the horrible balance problems the game has or the UNFOCUSED narrative where the characters have weak character development and are basically unimportant to th eplot outside Allister and Loghain. BOTH GAMES are far from great. And if a game doesn't vastly improve on the original, its lower MC scores anyway.

12 years ago

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#131 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="KalDurenik"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] You've consistantly said Dragon Age 2 is a better game than Dragon Age 1. You always praise Dragon Age 2 and you talk crap about Dragon Age 1. So in essence you enjoy a game rated a 79 more than a game rated a 91.

WRONG I said they were about even, both 8.0 RPGs....but DA2 has a STRONGER STORY AND CHARACTERS...learn my position before you bash.

DA2 had a good story and good characters O.o? Or well "stronger"? If i remember correctly i found it so bad that i had to continue to play... just to see if it could get any worse (it did). Do that make the game good?

DA2's story problems are mostly because the first act is unfinished and an entire plotline where either Bethany or mage Hawke are on the run from the Templars was cut. Game was rushed KOTOR II style plain and simple. The characters of DA2 have FAR better development, are far more multidimensional and morally complex, and are much more important to the plot. DAO characters are more one dimensional, have weak character development (hell they come in already mostly developed, all you do is tie up "loose ends") and are just not important to the story. They are just window dressing talking codex entries...a problem Bioware did have with its characters in the older games, characters that aren't the dueteragonist or the tritagonist.

12 years ago

190586385885857957282413308806

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#133 190586385885857957282413308806

Member since 2002 • 13084 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] WRONG I said they were about even, both 8.0 RPGs....but DA2 has a STRONGER STORY AND CHARACTERS...learn my position before you bash.

Point still stands that a 79 rated game is just as good in your eyes as a 91... So what's your stance about Obsidian games again? Oh yeah it's contradictory.

Because the gameplay and world are better in DAO....however, DAO ages quite poorly and does not stand the test of time through its poor graphics and generic storyline. Nevermind the horrible balance problems the game has or the UNFOCUSED narrative where the characters have weak character development and are basically unimportant to th eplot outside Allister and Loghain. BOTH GAMES are far from great. And if a game doesn't vastly improve on the original, its lower MC scores anyway.

So like I said...you only use review scores when it serves your argument right? All other times they're wrong.

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#134 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] Point still stands that a 79 rated game is just as good in your eyes as a 91... So what's your stance about Obsidian games again? Oh yeah it's contradictory.

Because the gameplay and world are better in DAO....however, DAO ages quite poorly and does not stand the test of time through its poor graphics and generic storyline. Nevermind the horrible balance problems the game has or the UNFOCUSED narrative where the characters have weak character development and are basically unimportant to th eplot outside Allister and Loghain. BOTH GAMES are far from great. And if a game doesn't vastly improve on the original, its lower MC scores anyway.

So like I said...you only use review scores when it serves your argument right? All other times they're wrong.

Nevermind DAO vs DA2 has NOTHING to do with Obsidan never releasing a game with critical acclaim. Your logic fails. .Face it Bioware has more clout in the industy than Obsidan and that is a fact. Really Obsidan fans are hypocrites....they want to gloss over flaws of Obsidan games, making excuses after excuses while judging harshly flaws in Bioware games. Bunch of lead coat wearers that should be thrown in the ditch.

12 years ago

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#135 190586385885857957282413308806

Member since 2002 • 13084 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] Because the gameplay and world are better in DAO....however, DAO ages quite poorly and does not stand the test of time through its poor graphics and generic storyline. Nevermind the horrible balance problems the game has or the UNFOCUSED narrative where the characters have weak character development and are basically unimportant to th eplot outside Allister and Loghain. BOTH GAMES are far from great. And if a game doesn't vastly improve on the original, its lower MC scores anyway.

So like I said...you only use review scores when it serves your argument right? All other times they're wrong.

Nevermind DAO vs DA2 has NOTHING to do with Obsidan never releasing a game with critical acclaim. Your logic fails. .Face it Bioware has more clout in the industy than Obsidan and that is a fact.

Why should I forget that you said a 79 rated game is about the same as a 91 rated game when we're talking about scores hypocrite? Funny I don't see InXile developers running to BioWare to help them make a real RPG. I don't see any of BioWare's employees interviewed as much as Chris Avellone, when the makers of South Park went to a company to create an RPG they went to Obsidian not BioWare...Hmmmm seems when people want to hear about real RPGs they go to Obsidian. interesting don't you think?

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#136 ChubbyGuy40

Member since 2007 • 26442 Posts

^Texasgoldrush in a nutshell.

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Nevermind DAO vs DA2 has NOTHING to do with Obsidan never releasing a game with critical acclaim. Your logic fails. .Face it Bioware has more clout in the industy than Obsidan and that is a fact. Really Obsidan fans are hypocrites....they want to gloss over flaws of Obsidan games, making excuses after excuses while judging harshly flaws in Bioware games. Bunch of lead coat wearers that should be thrown in the ditch.
texasgoldrush

You honestly can't tell if you're trolling or just delusional.

Bioware basically destroyed their best IP's at this point, after the fiasco's Dragon Age 2 and ME3. They have nothing left... Shot themselves in the foot so to speak.
Even the EC won't save the Mass Effect trilogy, it will just rub some more salt in the wounds.

Also, at least Obsidian still cares about it's fanbase, this can hardly be said about "End of Line" Bioware.

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#138 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] So like I said...you only use review scores when it serves your argument right? All other times they're wrong.

Nevermind DAO vs DA2 has NOTHING to do with Obsidan never releasing a game with critical acclaim. Your logic fails. .Face it Bioware has more clout in the industy than Obsidan and that is a fact.

Why should I forget that you said a 79 rated game is about the same as a 91 rated game when we're talking about scores hypocrite? Funny I don't see InXile developers running to BioWare to help them make a real RPG. I don't see any of BioWare's employees interviewed as much as Chris Avellone, when the makers of South Park went to a company to create an RPG they went to Obsidian not BioWare...Hmmmm seems when people want to hear about real RPGs they go to Obsidian. interesting don't you think?

Funny, I don;t see Obsidan games winning awards....oh wait, who destroyed who for RPG of the Year 2010...was it New Vegas or was it Mass Effect 2? Oh wait, ME2 compltely annihilated NV in both critics and reader awards. All you have is an RPG argument...thats it...but face it...just because it a "better RPG" doesn;t make it a "better game". Face it, which game has more clout KOTOR or KOTOR II, NWN or NWN2, Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol? Does ANYTHING Obsidian has done match the clout and the legacy that the Mass Effect trilogy alone has? Oh wait, nothing....hell Obsidan can't even make their own lore or their own IP without falling on their face, they have to use other peoples work. That make sequels to other companies games that set the world on fire. That it, thats their legacy.

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#139 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]
Nevermind DAO vs DA2 has NOTHING to do with Obsidan never releasing a game with critical acclaim. Your logic fails. .Face it Bioware has more clout in the industy than Obsidan and that is a fact. Really Obsidan fans are hypocrites....they want to gloss over flaws of Obsidan games, making excuses after excuses while judging harshly flaws in Bioware games. Bunch of lead coat wearers that should be thrown in the ditch.
Sagem28

You honestly can't tell if you're trolling or just delusional.

Bioware basically destroyed their best IP's at this point, after the fiasco's Dragon Age 2 and ME3. They have nothing left... Shot themselves in the foot so to speak.
Even the EC won't save the Mass Effect trilogy, it will just rub some more salt in the wounds.

Also, at least Obsidian still cares about it's fanbase, this can hardly be said about "End of Line" Bioware.

Oh wait, but ME3 is still highly acclaimed...so much for it being destroyed. Hell, even I am not a fan of the ending and does think it needs the EC, however, the entire saga still is one of the gens greatest achievements. Hell at least they create their own IPs, because they actually have creativity, instead of constantly using other peoples IPs. It is you that is delsuional.

12 years ago

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#140 190586385885857957282413308806

Member since 2002 • 13084 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] Nevermind DAO vs DA2 has NOTHING to do with Obsidan never releasing a game with critical acclaim. Your logic fails. .Face it Bioware has more clout in the industy than Obsidan and that is a fact.texasgoldrush

Why should I forget that you said a 79 rated game is about the same as a 91 rated game when we're talking about scores hypocrite? Funny I don't see InXile developers running to BioWare to help them make a real RPG. I don't see any of BioWare's employees interviewed as much as Chris Avellone, when the makers of South Park went to a company to create an RPG they went to Obsidian not BioWare...Hmmmm seems when people want to hear about real RPGs they go to Obsidian. interesting don't you think?

Funny, I don;t see Obsidan games winning awards....oh wait, who destroyed who for RPG of the Year 2010...was it New Vegas or was it Mass Effect 2? Oh wait, ME2 compltely annihilated NV in both critics and reader awards. All you have is an RPG argument...thats it...but face it...just because it a "better RPG" doesn;t make it a "better game". Face it, which game has more clout KOTOR or KOTOR II, NWN or NWN2, Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol? Does ANYTHING Obsidian has done match the clout and the legacy that the Mass Effect trilogy alone has? Oh wait, nothing....hell Obsidan can't even make their own lore or their own IP without falling on their face, they have to use other peoples work. That make sequels to other companies games that set the world on fire. That it, thats their legacy.

So since we're going by awards you admit that Dragon Age 1 is leagues better than Dragon Age 2 right? I mean the same people handing out these awards said Dragon Age 2 sucked. Oh that's right...you only use websites when it suits your argument.

You do know clout means pull or influence right? Wouldn't developers and people with IPs going to Obsidian show that they have more influence? So far BioWare is the only company I know of making RPGs for dummies so I don't really see them influencing much.

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#141 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] Why should I forget that you said a 79 rated game is about the same as a 91 rated game when we're talking about scores hypocrite? Funny I don't see InXile developers running to BioWare to help them make a real RPG. I don't see any of BioWare's employees interviewed as much as Chris Avellone, when the makers of South Park went to a company to create an RPG they went to Obsidian not BioWare...Hmmmm seems when people want to hear about real RPGs they go to Obsidian. interesting don't you think?

Funny, I don;t see Obsidan games winning awards....oh wait, who destroyed who for RPG of the Year 2010...was it New Vegas or was it Mass Effect 2? Oh wait, ME2 compltely annihilated NV in both critics and reader awards. All you have is an RPG argument...thats it...but face it...just because it a "better RPG" doesn;t make it a "better game". Face it, which game has more clout KOTOR or KOTOR II, NWN or NWN2, Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol? Does ANYTHING Obsidian has done match the clout and the legacy that the Mass Effect trilogy alone has? Oh wait, nothing....hell Obsidan can't even make their own lore or their own IP without falling on their face, they have to use other peoples work. That make sequels to other companies games that set the world on fire. That it, thats their legacy.

So since we're going by awards you admit that Dragon Age 1 is leagues better than Dragon Age 2 right? I mean the same people handing out these awards said Dragon Age 2 sucked. Oh that's right...you only use websites when it suits your argument.

No, its because DA2 failed to improve on its predeccessor, plain and simple...also, DAO had only Demon's Souls as competition. DA2 had FAR more stronger competition such as Skyrim, Deus Ex, Dark Souls, and the Witcher 2. Hell, it may not have won if DA2 WAS better than DAO. And the once again, how about you admnit the fact that Obsidian just doesn't carry the same acclaim as Bioware.

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Member since 2010 • 10498 Posts

Oh wait, but ME3 is still highly acclaimed...so much for it being destroyed. Hell, even I am not a fan of the ending and does think it needs the EC, however, the entire saga still is one of the gens greatest achievements. Hell at least they create their own IPs, because they actually have creativity, instead of constantly using other peoples IPs. It is you that is delsuional.texasgoldrush

So weak, texas. As usual.

When it comes to making creative gameplay ideas, Obsidian is leagues ahead of Bioware. Hell, Mass effect has become nothing more than a Gears clone gameplay wise (and a bad one at that).

Why do you think companies flock to Obsidian to make RPG's ? Because they do it so good.
Bioware is just EA's little b*tch now, dancing to their tune. They mess up everything they've done for the past few years. Tortanic, ME3, DA2. All horrible.

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#143 190586385885857957282413308806

Member since 2002 • 13084 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"] Funny, I don;t see Obsidan games winning awards....oh wait, who destroyed who for RPG of the Year 2010...was it New Vegas or was it Mass Effect 2? Oh wait, ME2 compltely annihilated NV in both critics and reader awards. All you have is an RPG argument...thats it...but face it...just because it a "better RPG" doesn;t make it a "better game". Face it, which game has more clout KOTOR or KOTOR II, NWN or NWN2, Mass Effect or Alpha Protocol? Does ANYTHING Obsidian has done match the clout and the legacy that the Mass Effect trilogy alone has? Oh wait, nothing....hell Obsidan can't even make their own lore or their own IP without falling on their face, they have to use other peoples work. That make sequels to other companies games that set the world on fire. That it, thats their legacy.

So since we're going by awards you admit that Dragon Age 1 is leagues better than Dragon Age 2 right? I mean the same people handing out these awards said Dragon Age 2 sucked. Oh that's right...you only use websites when it suits your argument.

No, its because DA2 failed to improve on its predeccessor, plain and simple...also, DAO had only Demon's Souls as competition. DA2 had FAR more stronger competition such as Skyrim, Deus Ex, Dark Souls, and the Witcher 2. And the once again, how about you admnit the fact that Obsidian just doesn;t carry the smae acclaim as Bioware.

So DA2 is a crappier game right? I mean you're saying it didn't improve and the people you use to back up your argument said it's a crappy game. How are you able to try and sit there and argue that you have a point? Either admit that DA II is poor or that reviewers aren't a bench mark for quality. it's as easy as that. And i think that developers and people running to Obsidian over BioWare proves that they have acclaim and more clout.

12 years ago

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#144 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]
Oh wait, but ME3 is still highly acclaimed...so much for it being destroyed. Hell, even I am not a fan of the ending and does think it needs the EC, however, the entire saga still is one of the gens greatest achievements. Hell at least they create their own IPs, because they actually have creativity, instead of constantly using other peoples IPs. It is you that is delsuional.Sagem28

So weak, texas. As usual.

When it comes to making creative gameplay ideas, Obsidian is leagues ahead of Bioware. Hell, Mass effect has become nothing more than a Gears clone gameplay wise (and a bad one at that).

Why do you think companies flock to Obsidian to make RPG's ? Because they do it so good.
Bioware is just EA's little b*tch now, dancing to their tune. They mess up everything they've done for the past few years. Tortanic, ME3, DA2. All horrible.

Yeah, but how often does Obsidan fail to deliver on the basics...they have all these gameplay ideas, but fall flat on the simplest things. Nevermind the idiotic clunkfest gameplay that was Alpha Protocol or the fact that DSIII may have very well been far weaker than its nothing special predeccessors. Nevermind that Obsidan hasn't made a gameplay mechanic that others follow. Bioware on the other hand, not only had engines that other designers used, but a robust save import system may very well be the future of RPGs. Nevermind CD Projeckt being influenced by Mass Effect when it comes to TW2, with its save import and dialogue system.

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Member since 2010 • 10498 Posts

Yeah, but how often does Obsidan fail to deliver on the basics...they have all these gameplay ideas, but fall flat on the simplest things. Nevermind the idiotic clunkfest gameplay that was Alpha Protocol or the fact that DSIII may have very well been far weaker than its nothing special predeccessors. Nevermind that Obsidan hasn't made a gameplay mechanic that others follow. Bioware on the other hand, not only had engines that other designers used, but a robust save import system may very well be the future of RPGs. Nevermind CD Projeckt being influenced by Mass Effect when it comes to TW2, with its save import and dialogue system.texasgoldrush

My god...

You are beyond saving, I feel sorry for you.

12 years ago

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#146 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="smerlus"][QUOTE="texasgoldrush"][QUOTE="smerlus"] So since we're going by awards you admit that Dragon Age 1 is leagues better than Dragon Age 2 right? I mean the same people handing out these awards said Dragon Age 2 sucked. Oh that's right...you only use websites when it suits your argument.

No, its because DA2 failed to improve on its predeccessor, plain and simple...also, DAO had only Demon's Souls as competition. DA2 had FAR more stronger competition such as Skyrim, Deus Ex, Dark Souls, and the Witcher 2. And the once again, how about you admnit the fact that Obsidian just doesn;t carry the smae acclaim as Bioware.

So DA2 is a crappier game right? I mean you're saying it didn't improve and the people you use to back up your argument said it's a crappy game. How are you able to try and sit there and argue that you have a point? Either admit that DA II is poor or that reviewers aren't a bench mark for quality. it's as easy as that. And i think that developers and people running to Obsidian over BioWare proves that they have acclaim and more clout.

Or the fact that Obsidan are free agents and not owned by anyone.....which allow other developers easier access. In contrast with Bioware who wants to do their own thing and their own IPs. Oh wait, nevermind....did LucasArts go to Obsidan to make an MMO? And even going by reviews.....79-82 doesn't make a game "poor".... Nevermind that, hell, my argument is not just reveiwers that put Bioware over Obsidan, but the general gaming public as well. Once again...Mass Effect 2 vs New Vegas, which game won more RPG of the Year READER awards? It wasn't New Vegas.

12 years ago

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Member since 2005 • 1000 Posts

i dont know how much wasteland sold, but me3 for a supposed huge game only sold around 3.5 million, the way it was marketed EA probably expected double that. anyway, i think wasteland 2 could outsell it over 3 platforms.

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Member since 2010 • 10498 Posts

In contrast with Bioware who wants to do their own thing and their own IPs. texasgoldrush

Only this is not true, anymore. Bioware has to listen to their mEAsters.

Face it, they're a shell of their former selfs.

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#149 texasgoldrush

Member since 2003 • 15265 Posts

[QUOTE="texasgoldrush"]
Yeah, but how often does Obsidan fail to deliver on the basics...they have all these gameplay ideas, but fall flat on the simplest things. Nevermind the idiotic clunkfest gameplay that was Alpha Protocol or the fact that DSIII may have very well been far weaker than its nothing special predeccessors. Nevermind that Obsidan hasn't made a gameplay mechanic that others follow. Bioware on the other hand, not only had engines that other designers used, but a robust save import system may very well be the future of RPGs. Nevermind CD Projeckt being influenced by Mass Effect when it comes to TW2, with its save import and dialogue system.Sagem28

My god...

You are beyond saving, I feel sorry for you.

Answer this question....which company's KOTOR is seen as one of the greatest RPGs of all time and which company's KOTOR is seen as a disappointment? Please, you are just an Obsidan fanboy blind to reality.

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Member since 2005 • 1000 Posts

i dont know how much wasteland sold, but me3 for a supposed huge game only sold around 3.5 million, the way it was marketed EA probably expected double that. anyway, i think wasteland 2 could outsell it over 3 platforms.

12 years ago

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