Is Nintendo looking out for hardcore gamers?

[QUOTE="jetthrovegas"]:lol: No what's REALLY sad is people like you acting as if power is not a big deal in the progression of gaming, when in-fact it governs the majority of the features in a game that can be improved upon (ie, AI, physics, graphics).

Power has always been an important factor in the evolution of gaming...

Tsug_Ze_Wind

:roll: And then there's people like you, who don't dare to touch anything that doesn't live up to the impossible, ever-shiftingstandards of power, despite the fact that the weakest console has had the best games since the start.

There's gamers, and then there's, for lack of a better name, tech nerds. Tech nerds live in their little tech nerd world, where their enjoyment is derived solely from counting how many strands of hair can be displayed on a character's head.

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"]:lol: No what's REALLY sad is people like you acting as if power is not a big deal in the progression of gaming, when in-fact it governs the majority of the features in a game that can be improved upon (ie, AI, physics, graphics).

Power has always been an important factor in the evolution of gaming...

jetthrovegas

:roll: And then there's people like you, who don't dare to touch anything that doesn't live up to the impossible, ever-shiftingstandards of power, despite the fact that the weakest console has had the best games since the start.

There's gamers, and then there's, for lack of a better name, tech nerds. Tech nerds live in their little tech nerd world, where their enjoyment is derived solely from counting how many strands of hair can be displayed on a character's head.

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

Answers anyone?

[QUOTE="jetthrovegas"][QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"]:lol: No what's REALLY sad is people like you acting as if power is not a big deal in the progression of gaming, when in-fact it governs the majority of the features in a game that can be improved upon (ie, AI, physics, graphics).

Power has always been an important factor in the evolution of gaming...

afmsquid

:roll: And then there's people like you, who don't dare to touch anything that doesn't live up to the impossible, ever-shiftingstandards of power, despite the fact that the weakest console has had the best games since the start.

There's gamers, and then there's, for lack of a better name, tech nerds. Tech nerds live in their little tech nerd world, where their enjoyment is derived solely from counting how many strands of hair can be displayed on a character's head.

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

Answers anyone?

Pikmin, Animal Crossing, Mario Strikers, and Battlion Wars were not new IPs during the last gen?

Nintendo does produce new IPs during every gen, even though some choose to ignore them.

Nintendo will have plenty of new IPs for the Wii.

[QUOTE="afmsquid"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"][QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"]:lol: No what's REALLY sad is people like you acting as if power is not a big deal in the progression of gaming, when in-fact it governs the majority of the features in a game that can be improved upon (ie, AI, physics, graphics).

Power has always been an important factor in the evolution of gaming...

Shinobishyguy

:roll: And then there's people like you, who don't dare to touch anything that doesn't live up to the impossible, ever-shiftingstandards of power, despite the fact that the weakest console has had the best games since the start.

There's gamers, and then there's, for lack of a better name, tech nerds. Tech nerds live in their little tech nerd world, where their enjoyment is derived solely from counting how many strands of hair can be displayed on a character's head.

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

Answers anyone?

We have never been in this scenario before. We have never been in a scenario where the evolution of technology was completely ignored by a games company.

Cutting edge technology is just as important to the evolution of gaming as cutting edge development techniques.

Nintendo is holding the industry back by neglecting to give today's developers the cutting edge tech necessary to create better AI, physics, and graphics.

Please answer the questions...

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="afmsquid"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"][QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"]:lol: No what's REALLY sad is people like you acting as if power is not a big deal in the progression of gaming, when in-fact it governs the majority of the features in a game that can be improved upon (ie, AI, physics, graphics).

Power has always been an important factor in the evolution of gaming...

jetthrovegas

:roll: And then there's people like you, who don't dare to touch anything that doesn't live up to the impossible, ever-shiftingstandards of power, despite the fact that the weakest console has had the best games since the start.

There's gamers, and then there's, for lack of a better name, tech nerds. Tech nerds live in their little tech nerd world, where their enjoyment is derived solely from counting how many strands of hair can be displayed on a character's head.

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

Answers anyone?

We have never been in this scenario before. We have never been in a scenario where the evolution of technology was completely ignored by a games company.

Cutting edge technology is just as important to the evolution of gaming as cutting edge development techniques.

Nintendo is holding the industry back by neglecting to give today's developers the cutting edge tech necessary to create better AI, physics, and graphics.

Please answer the questions...

SMG still looks like a quality game despite not having the best graphics, physics etc compared to the 360/ps3.

but is it needed all the time? It can help but is it needed for just about every game?

SMG still looks like a quality game despite not having the best graphics, physics etc compared to the 360/ps3.

Shinobishyguy

Better AI, better physics, and better graphics are a huge part of moving the industry forward.

Is the Wii lacking in those three areas? Yes or no.

Well, nintendos hardcore gamers are sheep. Sheep I'm sure will be happy when they get Brawl Galaxy and Prime 3. So yes.

Hardcore gamers other than sheep, no, I don't think so...

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"] but is it needed all the time? It can help but is it needed for just about every game?

SMG still looks like a quality game despite not having the best graphics, physics etc compared to the 360/ps3.

jetthrovegas

Better AI, better physics, and better graphics are a huge part of moving the industry forward.

Is the Wii lacking in those three areas? Yes or no.

Now answer this. Is it always needed for every game? If a game has great graphics physics andAI but the content of the game itself sucks, doesn't the game suck?

Try refering to that SMG example I gave.

I don't understand why people feel to label.

From what I've heard "hardcore" is looking to find the most indepth and skillful experience. And by that rule nobody in here is a hardcore gamer from the games they are "hyping".

Halo 3 and Killzone 2 aren't "hardcore" the previous entries in the series have been vastly inferior to Unreal Tournament and CounterStrike, and Day of Defeat by most of the shooter community.

Soul Caliber 4 isn't "hardcore" the series started off good but spent too much time listening to it's fans that it wounded up much less skillful then the original and either way the series has always been much less respected then other fighters such as Street Fighter III: Third Strike.

Blue Dragon, Eternal Sonata, and Final Fantasy XIII aren't "hardcore" since their combat systems are far inferior to other JRPG's such as Dragonforce Series, Princess Crown Series and Disgaea Series.

Hell I could go even further and saying if nobody plays simulation games such as Dangerous Waters, Microsoft Flight Simulator X, and Red Orchestra is a casual.

[QUOTE="jetthrovegas"][QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"] but is it needed all the time? It can help but is it needed for just about every game?

SMG still looks like a quality game despite not having the best graphics, physics etc compared to the 360/ps3.

Shinobishyguy

Better AI, better physics, and better graphics are a huge part of moving the industry forward.

Is the Wii lacking in those three areas? Yes or no.

Now answer this. Is it always needed for every game? If a game has great graphics physics andAI but the content of the game itself sucks, doesn't the game suck?

Try refering to that SMG example I gave.

This is another thing why do games need these things to be good?

Banjo-Tootie is still regarded by many as the greatest platformer of all-time. Final Fantasy VII, Grandia, and Skies of Arcadia are still regarded as many as the best JRPG's of all-time. Planescape Torment, Fallout 2, and Baldurs Gate II are still regarded by many as the best WRPG's of all-time. Street Fighter III: Third Strike is said to be technically the most advanced fighting game and always returns the most players at EVO.

In my opinion these things are just something companies say to get your attention just so they can sell their product. I've played many of these "next-gen" games but with an exception of Dead Rising none has shown me something that couldn't be done last gen. Most of the time I just see it adding to the presentation such as just having something fallover with better animation and some times can just be annoying like Lost Planet's A.I. when it seems to constantly use smoke grenades, cannons, and have them run everywhere without getting a shot at them.

Actually gaming back in the day used these things more then the game today. I remember when physics was an important aspect of Half-Life 1 and Deus Ex along with many other shooters as you had to push crates, slide down slopes, time to throw objects, etc. with physics. A.I. was harnessed in games like Black and White where your creature learned and morphed around it's environment. Graphics were used in new ways such as adding paintings in the background like in Final Fantasy VII or inventing new artstyles like cell-shading in Jet Set Grind or use some pseudo 3D look like Sonic Xtreme or Dragon Quest VII. Most games on retail just make the enemies seem real with their A.I. and have physics to have more things move when you shoot it.

Come to think of it these things have HURT gaming much more then HELPED gaming.

Doing these things killed 2D gaming, killed arcade games, killed small developers by making development costs go up, messed with many good genres such as the JRPG by having it instead of being 2D or 3D paramoa to going in 3rd person with mediocre level design, or the platformer which had much exploration and experimenting involved to just being linear and adding mindless tasks to acheive.

In my opinion quality gaming has been dying for years.

Just take a look at this chart.

http://vgchartz.com/japyearly.php?year=1995

And this is just the top 40 games in Japan that sold the most, imagine all the other games that weren't included in that list plus Western only releases such as Warcraft.

Just because you can do more in something doesn't make it better, if that were true then the Clone Wars would be a superior movie to the Empire Strikes Back due to the fact that it can do more and so more people with better special effects.

Graphics, Physics, and A.I. are not nearly important as Level Design, Core Gameplay, Polish, and Depth. Substance is everything, presentation is only eye candy.

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"][QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"] but is it needed all the time? It can help but is it needed for just about every game?

SMG still looks like a quality game despite not having the best graphics, physics etc compared to the 360/ps3.

Gunraidan

Better AI, better physics, and better graphics are a huge part of moving the industry forward.

Is the Wii lacking in those three areas? Yes or no.

Now answer this. Is it always needed for every game? If a game has great graphics physics andAI but the content of the game itself sucks, doesn't the game suck?

Try refering to that SMG example I gave.

Graphics, Physics, and A.I. are not nearly important as Level Design, Core Gameplay, Polish, and Depth. Substance is everything, presentation is only eye candy.

That's why I love the 360, it has all that and the eye candy.

That's why I love the 360, it has all that and the eye candy.

afmsquid

Please like what? Lost Planets level design was ridiculous you just press forward most of the time, I could say the same with Gears of War. The core gameplay of all the shooters are inferior to CounterStrike and Day of Defeat in the realm of skill from shooter tournaments and most shooter fans. It doesn't even have any platformers, Kameo is an action-adventure game, and even if it was a platformer the level design is sheer embrassment when comparing it to Banjo or Mario 64. Blue Dragon though coming out soon from what I've read and played in the demo the combat system is laughable compared to many JRPG's I've played, Oblvion is nothing but a hack-n-slash fest, it has what 2 fighitng games of the same gerne that both do little to the current system (though DoA4 improved a bit)? These are just a few examples. The 360 is drastically inferior in it's first 2 years to the PSone, Saturn, and SNES they aren't even comparable, then again pretty much every system past the Dreamcast has been (though the Dreamcast wasn't as good as the Saturn and SNES in my opinion).

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

jetthrovegas

I don't want them to be lacking enough to distract me, but other than that I couldn't care less unless it was a major necessary part of the game. (ex: Dead Rising)

Good enough?

[QUOTE="afmsquid"]

That's why I love the 360, it has all that and the eye candy.

Gunraidan

Please like what? Lost Planets level design was ridiculous you just press forward most of the time, I could say the same with Gears of War. The core gameplay of all the shooters are inferior to CounterStrike and Day of Defeat in the realm of skill from shooter tournaments and most shooter fans. It doesn't even have any platformers, Kameo is an action-adventure game, and even if it was a platformer the level design is sheer embrassment when comparing it to Banjo or Mario 64. Blue Dragon though coming out soon from what I've read and played in the demo the combat system is laughable compared to other JRPG's, Oblvion is nothing but a hack-n-slash fest, it has what 2 fighitng games of the same gerne that both do little to the current system (though DoA4 improved a bit)? These are just a few examples. The 360 is drastically inferior in it's first 2 years to the PSone, Saturn, and SNES they aren't even comparable, then again pretty much every system past the Dreamcast has been (though the Dreamcast wasn't as good as the Saturn and SNES in my opinion).

GRAW 2 had those, and I don't really care anymore for platformers. Oblivion was great, most immersive game I've ever played, and Command and Conquer 3 has piqued my interest more than any other game on all the systems you mentioned. Yes this is my opinion, and that's why I said that "I" love the 360.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"][QUOTE="jetthrovegas"]:lol: No what's REALLY sad is people like you acting as if power is not a big deal in the progression of gaming, when in-fact it governs the majority of the features in a game that can be improved upon (ie, AI, physics, graphics).

Power has always been an important factor in the evolution of gaming...

jetthrovegas

:roll: And then there's people like you, who don't dare to touch anything that doesn't live up to the impossible, ever-shiftingstandards of power, despite the fact that the weakest console has had the best games since the start.

There's gamers, and then there's, for lack of a better name, tech nerds. Tech nerds live in their little tech nerd world, where their enjoyment is derived solely from counting how many strands of hair can be displayed on a character's head.

I will ask you 3 simple questions. Your answers will speak for themselves:

Do you want the AI in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the physics in your games to be cutting edge?

Do you want the graphics in your game (think textures, enemies onscreen, draw distance, etc.) to be cutting edge?

If your answer to any of those questions is yes, then the Wii is not for you.

people dont understand that power does in fact play a big role, not the just the looks of games but physics, AI, gameplay at smooth speeds all come into play. also your motions on the controller. the Wii does have enough power, but as you can see even with a game like Resident Evil 4, the game has been dumbed down AI wise(according to most reviewers)