Let's squash this myth that PC gaming isnt much more expensive than consoles.

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

Realistically i have no idea what i would have spent otherwise, the need to upgrade for PC games always came well before the need to upgrade to browse the web.

The same argument can be made for consoles though.... everyone pretty much needed to buy a dvd player around the time of PS2... so you could easily subtract the cost of a comparable dvd player. Which probably brings the ps2 down to around a $100 cost premium.

and format standards were changing again around the time of the PS3, so you can subtract the cost of a blu ray player off the price of a launch ps3. Which also bring the ps3 down to around a $200 cost premium.

so we can say a $300 cost premium for gaming on consoles over a 12 year period.

markinthedark

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

No i've never bought a stand alone DVD player in my life. Oh I had one thrown in for free when I bought my new TV but thats whats known as a sweetner :). That DVD player is still working today, some 6 years later.

I also know that PS2's were horrible for playing DVD's on, had problems with reliability of the drive and were region locked. This is why everyone you know has a stand alone player :P.

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

Realistically i have no idea what i would have spent otherwise, the need to upgrade for PC games always came well before the need to upgrade to browse the web.

The same argument can be made for consoles though.... everyone pretty much needed to buy a dvd player around the time of PS2... so you could easily subtract the cost of a comparable dvd player. Which probably brings the ps2 down to around a $100 cost premium.

and format standards were changing again around the time of the PS3, so you can subtract the cost of a blu ray player off the price of a launch ps3. Which also bring the ps3 down to around a $200 cost premium.

so we can say a $300 cost premium for gaming on consoles over a 12 year period.

markinthedark

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

You are trying to change the argument again. You cannot discount from the price of a console due to it's hardware. If that is the case, at the time a PS3 came out, you should have paid close to $1500 as Blu-Ray players were in that price range. You make assumptions as to who would have bought what when the new consoles were coming out. Not true. I think the $50 DVD-ROM I bought in 2003 was a better deal than paying for a $200+ stand alone player not to mention it futureproofed my PC at the time.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

we are talking about being able to play current retail games... i dont know of any of those that can be downloaded for free.

and the select group of big titles which are responsible for the vast majority of console software sales... usually have a $10-20 game credit available for preordering.

1080pOnly

Yes we are and the process is extremely simple, not going to be explained by me, and is the reason piracy is such a problem on PC. Now you start with pre-ordering...which is great if the game doesn't flop hard but this is also countered by PC titles also having pre-order bonuses. I just bought Amnesia: The dark descent, full retail price £10.39 through Steam.

Face it man, console games cost more than PC games - it's a fact known by everyone here really and i'm not sure how you can argue against it.

depends on the gamer... only PC games i have bought this gen are Starcraft 2, Stalker and Oblivion all retail. So for me it costs me roughly $53.33 per PC game purchased.

In all honesty i guess i dont know... i havent bought enough PC games to make a fair judgement... and outside of the big releases i usually buy console games when they become heavily discounted.

like i said this is a real grey area... because alot of it depends on how savvy the gamer in question is at saving money.

but this is all in reference to USA prices... its my impression the difference is far greater in other parts of the world.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

WhiteKnight77

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

You are trying to change the argument again. You cannot discount from the price of a console due to it's hardware. If that is the case, at the time a PS3 came out, you should have paid close to $1500 as Blu-Ray players were in that price range. You make assumptions as to who would have bought what when the new consoles were coming out. Not true. I think the $50 DVD-ROM I bought in 2003 was a better deal than paying for a $200+ stand alone player not to mention it futureproofed my PC at the time.

thats because everyone is making assumptions that people would need to buy PCs... as if PCs are like food and without them you die.

nobody needs a PC... you can goto the public library if there is a dire PC emergency. So if you get to subtract the cost of an optional utility PC build cost from the cost of a gaming PC, it only makes sense to subtract the optional stand alone dvd/blu ray player cost from a console.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

1080pOnly

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

No i've never bought a stand alone DVD player in my life. Oh I had one thrown in for free when I bought my new TV but thats whats known as a sweetner :). That DVD player is still working today, some 6 years later.

I also know that PS2's were horrible for playing DVD's on, had problems with reliability of the drive and were region locked. This is why everyone you know has a stand alone player :P.

i actually used my ps2 as my main dvd player, and only occasional gamed on it. I to this day use my ps2 to watch dvds in the bedroom. Guess i got one of the good ones.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

markinthedark

You are trying to change the argument again. You cannot discount from the price of a console due to it's hardware. If that is the case, at the time a PS3 came out, you should have paid close to $1500 as Blu-Ray players were in that price range. You make assumptions as to who would have bought what when the new consoles were coming out. Not true. I think the $50 DVD-ROM I bought in 2003 was a better deal than paying for a $200+ stand alone player not to mention it futureproofed my PC at the time.

thats because everyone is making assumptions that people would need to buy PCs... as if PCs are like food and without them you die.

nobody needs a PC... you can goto the public library if there is a dire PC emergency. So if you get to subtract the cost of an optional utility PC build cost from the cost of a gaming PC, it only makes sense to subtract the optional stand alone dvd/blu ray player cost from a console.

Nobody needs a console. I can just constantly go to my friend's house and use his :roll:

Worthless argument.

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

markinthedark

No i've never bought a stand alone DVD player in my life. Oh I had one thrown in for free when I bought my new TV but thats whats known as a sweetner :). That DVD player is still working today, some 6 years later.

I also know that PS2's were horrible for playing DVD's on, had problems with reliability of the drive and were region locked. This is why everyone you know has a stand alone player :P.

i actually used my ps2 as my main dvd player, and only occasional gamed on it. I to this day use my ps2 to watch dvds in the bedroom. Guess i got one of the good ones.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

You are trying to change the argument again. You cannot discount from the price of a console due to it's hardware. If that is the case, at the time a PS3 came out, you should have paid close to $1500 as Blu-Ray players were in that price range. You make assumptions as to who would have bought what when the new consoles were coming out. Not true. I think the $50 DVD-ROM I bought in 2003 was a better deal than paying for a $200+ stand alone player not to mention it futureproofed my PC at the time.

Eggimannd

thats because everyone is making assumptions that people would need to buy PCs... as if PCs are like food and without them you die.

nobody needs a PC... you can goto the public library if there is a dire PC emergency. So if you get to subtract the cost of an optional utility PC build cost from the cost of a gaming PC, it only makes sense to subtract the optional stand alone dvd/blu ray player cost from a console.

Nobody needs a console. I can just constantly go to my friend's house and use his :roll:

Worthless argument.

your right, nobody does... Im just saying if you are gonna subtract utility costs outside of gaming from a gaming rig, you have to substract utility costs outside of gaming from consoles... no more no less.

or subtract nothing and judge them at face value. Which seems like the most obvious way to go about it... but it seems like everyone is turning something simple into a convoluted mess.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

No i've never bought a stand alone DVD player in my life. Oh I had one thrown in for free when I bought my new TV but thats whats known as a sweetner :). That DVD player is still working today, some 6 years later.

I also know that PS2's were horrible for playing DVD's on, had problems with reliability of the drive and were region locked. This is why everyone you know has a stand alone player :P.

roxlimn

i actually used my ps2 as my main dvd player, and only occasional gamed on it. I to this day use my ps2 to watch dvds in the bedroom. Guess i got one of the good ones.

I was mostly busy playing PC games during those years. I only own about 6 or 7 ps2 games.

markinthedark: Actually, people are just trying to compare apples to apples, based on their personal experiences. Just because you don't game a lot and apparently live in a cave doesn't mean that the rest of us do.roxlimn

i think ill just ignore you from now on, at least the other guys make some variety of sense.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

thats because everyone is making assumptions that people would need to buy PCs... as if PCs are like food and without them you die.

nobody needs a PC... you can goto the public library if there is a dire PC emergency. So if you get to subtract the cost of an optional utility PC build cost from the cost of a gaming PC, it only makes sense to subtract the optional stand alone dvd/blu ray player cost from a console.

Eggimannd

Nobody needs a console. I can just constantly go to my friend's house and use his :roll:

Worthless argument.

This guy is good at changing his arguments. The title of this thread that he started is about quashing a myth that PC gaming isn't as cheap as console gaming, yet when presented with facts, he changes said argument. Gaming includes hardware and software. You cannot game if you do not have the hardware if all you have is the software and vice versa, yet he, with others, want to restrict the argument to just hardware. On the hardware front, he wants to argue that he can buy a RROD X360 and then buy a kit to fix it, yet PC gamers cannot buy used or older new hardware to build a PC that will play a game in graphic quality to a console. At this point in the game, I want to say he is trolling with these threads like this.

If he wants to present an argument, then he needs to accept the argument on apples to apples terms and not an apples to oranges terms.

[QUOTE="roxlimn"]markinthedark: Actually, people are just trying to compare apples to apples, based on their personal experiences. Just because you don't game a lot and apparently live in a cave doesn't mean that the rest of us do.markinthedark

i think ill just ignore you from now on, at least the other guys make some variety of sense.

[QUOTE="Eggimannd"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

thats because everyone is making assumptions that people would need to buy PCs... as if PCs are like food and without them you die.

nobody needs a PC... you can goto the public library if there is a dire PC emergency. So if you get to subtract the cost of an optional utility PC build cost from the cost of a gaming PC, it only makes sense to subtract the optional stand alone dvd/blu ray player cost from a console.

WhiteKnight77

Nobody needs a console. I can just constantly go to my friend's house and use his :roll:

Worthless argument.

This guy is good at changing his arguments. The title of this thread that he started is about quashing a myth that PC gaming isn't as cheap as console gaming, yet when presented with facts, he changes said argument. Gaming includes hardware and software. You cannot game if you do not have the hardware if all you have is the software and vice versa, yet he, with others, want to restrict the argument to just hardware. On the hardware front, he wants to argue that he can buy a RROD X360 and then buy a kit to fix it, yet PC gamers cannot buy used or older new hardware to build a PC that will play a game in graphic quality to a console. At this point in the game, I want to say he is trolling with these threads like this.

If he wants to present an argument, then he needs to accept the argument on apples to apples terms and not an apples to oranges terms.

my ridiculous points, were in response to ridiculous points.

what is the apples to apples terms? retail price of PC gaming rigs over 10 years to retail price of owning a gaming console over 10 years? yes lets do that.

but then i get these arguments saying "oh well you can get tons of deals on steam so PC gaming is cheaper" but if you try to show money saving techniques that console gamers can use "no thats stupid consoles gamers can only buy full priced retail games".

when people subtract the cost of a regular non gamin pc from a gaming pc... well thats just good sense. But if you try to subtract the utility cost from a console... "well thats just stupid, nobody buys stand alone dvd players"

Every scenario presented is always best case scenario PC vs worst case scenario console... and anytime i try to bring those scenarios a little more in line with each other you snap and say its ridiculous.

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

[QUOTE="roxlimn"]markinthedark: Actually, people are just trying to compare apples to apples, based on their personal experiences. Just because you don't game a lot and apparently live in a cave doesn't mean that the rest of us do.roxlimn

i think ill just ignore you from now on, at least the other guys make some variety of sense.

ok let me try one of these arguments of yours...

looks like you dont know anything about gaming, maybe you should open your eyes for once and notice whats going on. Your completely wrong because your opinion differs with mine... and im always right.

/perfectly well articulated and backed up argument

[QUOTE="Eggimannd"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

thats because everyone is making assumptions that people would need to buy PCs... as if PCs are like food and without them you die.

nobody needs a PC... you can goto the public library if there is a dire PC emergency. So if you get to subtract the cost of an optional utility PC build cost from the cost of a gaming PC, it only makes sense to subtract the optional stand alone dvd/blu ray player cost from a console.

WhiteKnight77

Nobody needs a console. I can just constantly go to my friend's house and use his :roll:

Worthless argument.

This guy is good at changing his arguments. The title of this thread that he started is about quashing a myth that PC gaming isn't as cheap as console gaming, yet when presented with facts, he changes said argument. Gaming includes hardware and software. You cannot game if you do not have the hardware if all you have is the software and vice versa, yet he, with others, want to restrict the argument to just hardware. On the hardware front, he wants to argue that he can buy a RROD X360 and then buy a kit to fix it, yet PC gamers cannot buy used or older new hardware to build a PC that will play a game in graphic quality to a console. At this point in the game, I want to say he is trolling with these threads like this.

If he wants to present an argument, then he needs to accept the argument on apples to apples terms and not an apples to oranges terms.

What if I prefer renting new games for $8 at my local Blockbuster? What if I want to play a used copy of Gears of War? Compare the prices used copies of Gears are going for on half.com or amazon.com for PC and 360, and you'd see the 360 version is going for much cheaper (best price $5 for consoles, $15 for PC). But if you take another title the reverse might be true and the PC version may be cheaper. But then selling a used copy of any PC game is technically against most games' EULA and could be grounds for copyright infringement... just one example of how nuanced the argument gets.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="Eggimannd"]

Nobody needs a console. I can just constantly go to my friend's house and use his :roll:

Worthless argument.

markinthedark

This guy is good at changing his arguments. The title of this thread that he started is about quashing a myth that PC gaming isn't as cheap as console gaming, yet when presented with facts, he changes said argument. Gaming includes hardware and software. You cannot game if you do not have the hardware if all you have is the software and vice versa, yet he, with others, want to restrict the argument to just hardware. On the hardware front, he wants to argue that he can buy a RROD X360 and then buy a kit to fix it, yet PC gamers cannot buy used or older new hardware to build a PC that will play a game in graphic quality to a console. At this point in the game, I want to say he is trolling with these threads like this.

If he wants to present an argument, then he needs to accept the argument on apples to apples terms and not an apples to oranges terms.

my ridiculous points, were in response to ridiculous points.

what is the apples to apples terms? retail price of PC gaming rigs over 10 years to retail price of owning a gaming console over 10 years? yes lets do that.

but then i get these arguments saying "oh well you can get tons of deals on steam so PC gaming is cheaper" but if you try to show money saving techniques that console gamers can use "no thats stupid consoles gamers can only buy full priced retail games".

when people subtract the cost of a regular non gamin pc from a gaming pc... well thats just good sense. But if you try to subtract the utility cost from a console... "well thats just stupid, nobody buys stand alone dvd players"

Every scenario presented is always best case scenario PC vs worst case scenario console... and anytime i try to bring those scenarios a little more in line with each other you snap and say its ridiculous.

You cannot deduct the price of a console if you bought a stand alone DVD player. It is a one use item whereas the console is a multiuse item just like a PC is. I never said anything about no one buying stand alone DVD players. I actually have 3 of them now (one actually records DVDs too and one is an HD DVD player). I still have a DVD-ROM in my PC, but because I have a stand alone players does not remove the cost of the DVD-ROM from my gaming PC.

Console gamers need to come up with new arguments about gaming. You present the same tired arguments about why console gaming is supposedly better than PC gaming when those arguments are no longer valid. They are in this thread along with other threads, but when presented in it's own thread, it is ignored even moreso.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

This guy is good at changing his arguments. The title of this thread that he started is about quashing a myth that PC gaming isn't as cheap as console gaming, yet when presented with facts, he changes said argument. Gaming includes hardware and software. You cannot game if you do not have the hardware if all you have is the software and vice versa, yet he, with others, want to restrict the argument to just hardware. On the hardware front, he wants to argue that he can buy a RROD X360 and then buy a kit to fix it, yet PC gamers cannot buy used or older new hardware to build a PC that will play a game in graphic quality to a console. At this point in the game, I want to say he is trolling with these threads like this.

If he wants to present an argument, then he needs to accept the argument on apples to apples terms and not an apples to oranges terms.

SakusEnvoy

What if I prefer renting new games for $8 at my local Blockbuster? What if I want to play a used copy of Gears of War? Compare the prices used copies of Gears are going for on half.com or amazon.com for PC and 360, and you'd see the 360 version is going for much cheaper (best price $5 for consoles, $15 for PC). But if you take another title the reverse might be true and the PC version may be cheaper. But then selling a used copy of any PC game is technically against most games' EULA and could be grounds for copyright infringement... just one example of how nuanced the argument gets.

Just like with used console games, the first sale doctrine allows the sale of PC games, and EULAs even state that it is allowable though one has to uninstall said software before the transfer of license can occur.

Just like with used console games, the first sale doctrine allows the sale of PC games, and EULAs even state that it is allowable though one has to uninstall said software before the transfer of license can occur.

WhiteKnight77

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Just like with used console games, the first sale doctrine allows the sale of PC games, and EULAs even state that it is allowable though one has to uninstall said software before the transfer of license can occur.

SakusEnvoy

my 360 = $300
my ps3 = $500
my TV = $400 (32" 1080p)

console gaming = $1200

my PC (in the same amount of time, once upgrade) = $1800

which reminds me, I need to upgrade to i5, triple channel RAM, mobo, and video card. guh. there's another grand I dont have.

[QUOTE="SakusEnvoy"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Just like with used console games, the first sale doctrine allows the sale of PC games, and EULAs even state that it is allowable though one has to uninstall said software before the transfer of license can occur.

roxlimn

I get the feeling that some people are implying just cause the start-up cost for consoles are cheaper that they're somehow better in turn.

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Just like with used console games, the first sale doctrine allows the sale of PC games, and EULAs even state that it is allowable though one has to uninstall said software before the transfer of license can occur.

SakusEnvoy

Here is the EULA for Microsoft's Flight Simulator:

Software Transfer. The initial licensee of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT may make a one-time permanent transfer of this EULA and SOFTWARE PRODUCT only directly to an end user. This transfer must include all of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT (including all component parts, the media and printed materials, any upgrades, this EULA, and, if applicable, the Certificate of Authenticity). Such transfer may not be by way of consignment or any other indirect transfer. The transferee of such one-time transfer must agree to comply with the terms of this EULA, including the obligation not to further transfer this EULA and SOFTWARE PRODUCT.MSFS EU LA

4. Program Transfer. You may permanently transfer all of your rights under this License Agreement, provided the recipient agrees to the terms of this License Agreement and you agree to remove the Program from your home or portable computer.Homeworld2 EULA

EULAs are also a way to try and circumvent provisions of copyright law and that includes the first sale doctrine. You can transfer or sell a PC game as long as you meet the requirements needed.

[QUOTE="locopatho"][QUOTE="roxlimn"]markinthedark: Actually, people are just trying to compare apples to apples, based on their personal experiences. Just because you don't game a lot and apparently live in a cave doesn't mean that the rest of us do.roxlimn

yea i never said that. But never let the truth get in the way of a good story. amirite?

[QUOTE="SakusEnvoy"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

Just like with used console games, the first sale doctrine allows the sale of PC games, and EULAs even state that it is allowable though one has to uninstall said software before the transfer of license can occur.

WhiteKnight77

Here is the EULA for Microsoft's Flight Simulator:

Software Transfer. The initial licensee of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT may make a one-time permanent transfer of this EULA and SOFTWARE PRODUCT only directly to an end user. This transfer must include all of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT (including all component parts, the media and printed materials, any upgrades, this EULA, and, if applicable, the Certificate of Authenticity). Such transfer may not be by way of consignment or any other indirect transfer. The transferee of such one-time transfer must agree to comply with the terms of this EULA, including the obligation not to further transfer this EULA and SOFTWARE PRODUCT.MSFS EU LA

4. Program Transfer. You may permanently transfer all of your rights under this License Agreement, provided the recipient agrees to the terms of this License Agreement and you agree to remove the Program from your home or portable computer.Homeworld2 EULA

EULAs are also a way to try and circumvent provisions of copyright law and that includes the first sale doctrine. You can transfer or sell a PC game as long as you meet the requirements needed.

[QUOTE="blue_hazy_basic"][QUOTE="xsubtownerx"] Didn't buy it.. :oops:xsubtownerx

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

Realistically i have no idea what i would have spent otherwise, the need to upgrade for PC games always came well before the need to upgrade to browse the web.

The same argument can be made for consoles though.... everyone pretty much needed to buy a dvd player around the time of PS2... so you could easily subtract the cost of a comparable dvd player. Which probably brings the ps2 down to around a $100 cost premium.

and format standards were changing again around the time of the PS3, so you can subtract the cost of a blu ray player off the price of a launch ps3. Which also bring the ps3 down to around a $200 cost premium.

so we can say a $300 cost premium for gaming on consoles over a 12 year period.

markinthedark

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

markinthedark: Well then, let's hear it. The argument put forth was that in most cases, the cost of a gaming PC would not, in fact, be the same cost as purchasing one outright, since you're going to have a comp of some sort for other reasons, which would not be true for gaming-dedicated consoles. Did you not counter that by saying that this was not a reasonable assumption?roxlimn

its a reasonable assumption... in its premise...

the problem is the uneven application that it led to.

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

All games are sold under copyright law. Companies want gamers to think otherwise, which is the point of all of this EULA nonsense. I just opened my copy of RDR for PS3, and it says there that the game is licensed, not sold. BS.roxlimn

[QUOTE="markinthedark"]

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

You don't need a DVD or Bluray player but you need a PC in this modern world. PC's also came with DVD players so you would have to subtract that from the PC too equalling out the difference.

Ontain

So what you are saying is you have never purchased a stand alone dvd player in your life because you have always had a dvd drive on your PC?

im gonna call BS on that one. Everyone i know has a standalone dvd player in addition to a DVD drive on their pc.

PS2 launched right around the time DVD players were beginning to pickup steam.... it was actually rather perfectly timed as a substitute stand alone dvd player. Was one of the major reasons i bought one... i needed a dvd player at the time.

checked online 2003 is the first year dvd rentals outnumbered vhs rentals... so ALOT of people were in the market for dvd players in 2000 when the ps2 launched.

There is no uneven application. People don't generally have a gaming rig and also a productivity rig. They're generally the same thing, or the guy had two comps to begin with. People generally don't forgo having a DVD just because they have a 360. In fact, they're generally better advised to buy a DVD for viewing to preserve the life of their 360. This is true for PS3s now as well, since BluRay players have gone down in pricing. There is no uneven application here.roxlimn

Then maybe people should be generally advised to game on a separate PC since gaming rigs are far more prone to hardware failure due to all the parts being under tremendous stress and heat..... cant have your patient database down because you fried your cpu/gpu gaming, right?

that would be a generally nice and even application of the rule. Because if we cant assume a console can fill multiple roles, then we shouldnt assume a PC can either... seems like the fair way of going about things.

Or you can assume they can fulfill other roles... for both. Holding them to different standards is what we like to call uneven application, right?

If so, then PCs should also deduct the cost for BluRay player and DVD players, since they can also act as those. Still no relative gain for console costing.

Might also want to deduct the cost of an HDTV while we're at it, as well as telephone, calculator, phone listings, maps, and mp3 player.

PS2 launched right around the time DVD players were beginning to pickup steam.... it was actually rather perfectly timed as a substitute stand alone dvd player. Was one of the major reasons i bought one... i needed a dvd player at the time.

markinthedark

If so, then PCs should also deduct the cost for BluRay player and DVD players, since they can also act as those. Still no relative gain for console costing.roxlimn

If you can't find a computer that costs 600$ and can play every game made on very high you seriously are being ripped off.

If so, then PCs should also deduct the cost for BluRay player and DVD players, since they can also act as those. Still no relative gain for console costing.roxlimn

DVD as a format didnt pick up steam on PC until much later than the PS2. Im not even sure it was possible to connect a PC to a tv at the time.. which is why people wanted stand alone players... to watch movies on their tv. Even if they could, without the thiving internet economy of today those long cables would cost a fortune.

.... and none of the PC builds i see floating around ever have blu ray drives included... so its safe to say that price is naturally deduced.

[QUOTE="roxlimn"]If so, then PCs should also deduct the cost for BluRay player and DVD players, since they can also act as those. Still no relative gain for console costing.markinthedark

DVD as a format didnt pick up steam on PC until much later than the PS2. Im not even sure it was possible to connect a PC to a tv at the time.. which is why people wanted stand alone players... to watch movies on their tv.

.... and none of the PC builds i see floating around ever have blu ray drives included... so its safe to say that price is naturally deduced.