Microsoft's Xbox 360 strategy: buy now before you realize the problems

[QUOTE="njean777"][QUOTE="angelkimne"][QUOTE="njean777"]

Name one game that looks better then all ps3 games

angelkimne

what assassins creed is on ps3 what are you trying to say?

oh ok i was like WTF?

[QUOTE="Sihanouk"]

Remember the Red Ring of Death problem? Even though Microsoft management knew of the hardware problems, they still mass produced the consoles! Their strategy then? Encourage the gamers to buy Xbox 360 before they realize the problems.

Forward to 2008, the year Sony claims as the year of the PS3. Xbox 360 has fewer exclusives in 2008. It seems to have even fewer exclusives in 2009. Games are starting to look/sound equal or better on the PS3. Sony is claiming again and again that the PS3 is more future proof than Xbox 360. All of a sudden, Microsoft had two price cuts in one year.

What is going? How is this connected to the Red Ring of Death problem? Same strategy, folks. Encourage gamers to buy the 360 now before they fully realize the weaknesses of Xbox 360.

It may be a short-term smart strategy for Microsoft, but I dont' think it is a strategy that is good for consumers looking for the most value for their money. Comes 2009, the PS3's superiority in console power and first/second party investments will be even more obvious.

Phazevariance

No unfortunately, it doesn't work like that. If you had even the slightest idea of how the economy and a company works, you would know that the more you sell, the more you manufacturer; the more you manufactuer, the more material you use;, the more material you use, the bigger bulk and therefore cheaper the parts become. THAT is why they can have price drops.

Also, I havent seen a lot of multiplatform games looking better on the ps3 lately. The 360 has demonstrated its ability to match and beat out the PS3 in graphics, and for a console that was released a year earlier than the PS3, its still selling better, the PS3 is the real console in trouble. It's not a case of the SP3 is winning and MS is panicing, its a case of MS is winning and you are too fanboyish to realize that the almighty Sony isn't on top this generation.

I am not arguing that console prices get cheaper over time because of changes in hardware and efficiency in production. That much I already know. However, 2 price cuts in the span of a few months? You have to admit that Microsoft is tryng hard to stop Sony's momentum; after all, Sony's been leading in sales in all major territories in 2008.

Multiplatforms look the same or better on the PS3, though mostly the same, and that's because publishers purposely try to make the games look/sound as similar as possible. Remember when Id said that Rage will be better on the PS3 because the PS3 uses Blu-ray? Well, later on, that changed. Id now says some changes in content in Rage will make the game the same. In other words, Xbox 360's weaker hardware forces Id to change the content of the game. This is proof that Xbox 360 is preventing multiplatform games from being the best they can be.

Stop saying that Xbox 360 has matched and beaten the PS3 in graphics! This is not 2006 anymore. It's the PS3 games that are pushing the boundaries of graphics and sounds this generation. Photorealism. Animation. Cutscenes. Multiplayer size. Boss size. Movie like. Size of game contents. User generated contents. All are best/most on the PS3.

That's why Microsoft so drastically reduced the price of their consoles and plans to spend the most ever on marketing Xbox 360 this year, even though the casual games are lacking on Xbox 360. Microsoft knows that comes 2009, people will fully see that Xbox 360 is getting old compared to the PS3.

Mark my words. When it comes to PS3 vs. Xbox 360, PS3 owners will have the last laugh this generation.

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]With the massive sales of the PS2 you don't think that there were a lot of instances of DRE? The PS2 was selling more then the Wii at this point in its life.Pariah_001

Sony has just as many PS3s sold as the 360s that Microsoft admits are defective (at least 10 million), and yet the defective rate is less than 1%.

Great logic there.

Shinji Mikami was complaining about PS2's crap hardware while making RE4 man. You know when RE4 was out? Not only this Sony got hit by a ****action lawsuit for PS2 something MS hasn't recieved.Blackbond

First: Whatever Mikami said about the PS2, it had nothing to do with DRE.

Second: Microsoft was being served up with a ****action lawsuit before they added the warranty.

where was your PS2 warrenty?

Seems you missed the point. PS2 was selling at a much faster rate then even the Wii. Which would be a contributing factor to why there were so many DRE's I'm not talking about %'s of Consoles defective I'm talking about the number. And with a vastly larger User base of the PS2 in its 2nd year compared to the 360's it was bound to be in the ball park area give or take.

Yeah Shinji Mikami just ripped Sony, Square Enix and basically said that the whole PS2 was a piece of **** basically :roll:

Went on to say that they build them like crap so people would have to buy more of them or something in that context.

________________________________________

FROM SHINJI MIKAMI: CREATOR: RESIDENT EVIL - (Departed Capcom after Resident Evil 4 port announced for PS2. He is not involved with RE5)

''We all know the truth about Sony's consoles. If you don't, you have been living in a cave. DRE's or "Disc Read Errors" have become synonymous with Sony's poorly built machines. Some people even think they design their systems like this ON PURPOSE. And I am one of them.It's an idea called "Planned Obsolescence" and it's something automobile manufacturers have been doing for years.''...

Mikami worked with Sony for almost a DECADE, before he finally had the courage to speak out:

"Shinji Mikami, producer of Resident Evil and Devil May Cry, strongly criticized Sony and Square in a recent radio interview in Japan. Mikami accused Sony of purposely designing their consoles to break easily so that gamers will have to buy a replacement.He also said that Sony's high sales figures are helped by the fact that many gamers, himself included, have had to buy a second PlayStation and PlayStation 2."

From there, Mikami went on to accuse Sony of doing the same thing with their line of PCs, Walkmans, and cell phones. He asked why no one has complained about this and said that it was almost like cheating and committing a crime. The radio DJ tried to interrupt Mikami and shift the conversation to another topic, but when Mikami was asked if he thought SONY'S CUSTOMERS are FOOLISH, he replied, "YES."

____________________________

He isn't the only one who sees the truth here. Sony has already been SUED SUCCESSFULLY, several times, over issues relating to their shoddy products.

Here's a link to a Law Firm that has challenged Sony over their defective products. In July of 2002, the law firm of Sheller, Ludwig & Badey filled a "****Action Lawsuit" against Sony over defects in the Playstation 2 video game console. Essentially a "****Action Lawsuit" means that you have a LARGE ****GROUP of people to represent.

Sheller, Ludwig & Badey is a legal practice that specializes in consumer defense. They have gone after many corporate giants in the past on such varied topics such as Consumer Fraud and Defective Products.

http://www.sheller.com/Practice.asp?PracticeID=109

________________________

Quote:

"The Complaint alleges that Sony Computer Entertainment America, Inc., marketed and promoted the PlayStation 2 unit-which was designed to function both as a game system and a DVD movie player-as a reliable and adequate DVD player when, in fact, the DVD player component suffers from a number of defects that prevents it from playing a wide-variety of DVD movies. The ****action also contends that Sony concealed the DVD playback defects from purchasers and required those who reported the problem to pay $120 to have their defective units repaired or replaced. The Complaint also charges that in spite of receiving these complaints, Sony has failed to warn new or existing purchasers about the defective DVD component."

_______________________

DEPARTMENT OF CONSUMER AFFAIRS, the United States' main consumer advocacy group. They too have dealt with Sony's shoddy products.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news03/playstation.html

The United States Department of Consumer Affairs is the most powerful group of its kind. Here's some interesting quotes from this article:

"My son bought a Sony Playstation 2 in September. By Christmas, it stopped working with a Disc Error, cannot read disc."

Here's another:

"Consumers have been complaining for more than a year that Sony's Playstation 2 video game machine stops reading DVDs and certain types of games, often when the unit is just a few months old."

Talk about a beautiful disaster bet you didn't expect this huh?

BB, you could have saved some for me. I couldn't even get tagged in this time! :cry:

in closing: buy a 360, gamers. you'll be glad you did.

Do you really want to turn this thread into a 360 vs ps3 graphics war like every other thread? Lets just assume that it even matches the ps3's top game that is available, and the fact that it was out a year earlier really beats ps3's delayed release into their faces.

No matter what game I choose, someone will post another competitors game that htey feel looks better, to which someone else will rebuttle with another 360 game that they feel trumps that other game in such and such category, and the figh tjust goes on forever, with NO end.

BAIT = fail

Phazevariance

Pitiful excuse. You're the one who put it out there dude.

[QUOTE="Pariah_001"][QUOTE="Blackbond"]With the massive sales of the PS2 you don't think that there were a lot of instances of DRE? The PS2 was selling more then the Wii at this point in its life.Blackbond

Sony has just as many PS3s sold as the 360s that Microsoft admits are defective (at least 10 million), and yet the defective rate is less than 1%.

Great logic there.

Shinji Mikami was complaining about PS2's crap hardware while making RE4 man. You know when RE4 was out? Not only this Sony got hit by a ****action lawsuit for PS2 something MS hasn't recieved.Blackbond

First: Whatever Mikami said about the PS2, it had nothing to do with DRE.

Second: Microsoft was being served up with a ****action lawsuit before they added the warranty.

where was your PS2 warrenty?

Seems you missed the point. PS2 was selling at a much faster rate then even the Wii. Which would be a contributing factor to why there were so many DRE's I'm not talking about %'s of Consoles defective I'm talking about the number. And with a vastly larger User base of the PS2 in its 2nd year compared to the 360's it was bound to be in the ball park area give or take.

Yeah Shinji Mikami just ripped Sony, Square Enix and basically said that the whole PS2 was a piece of **** basically :roll:

Went on to say that they build them like crap so people would have to buy more of them or something in that context.

________________________________________

FROM SHINJI MIKAMI: CREATOR: RESIDENT EVIL - (Departed Capcom after Resident Evil 4 port announced for PS2. He is not involved with RE5)

''We all know the truth about Sony's consoles. If you don't, you have been living in a cave. DRE's or "Disc Read Errors" have become synonymous with Sony's poorly built machines. Some people even think they design their systems like this ON PURPOSE. And I am one of them.It's an idea called "Planned Obsolescence" and it's something automobile manufacturers have been doing for years.''...

Mikami worked with Sony for almost a DECADE, before he finally had the courage to speak out:

"Shinji Mikami, producer of Resident Evil and Devil May Cry, strongly criticized Sony and Square in a recent radio interview in Japan. Mikami accused Sony of purposely designing their consoles to break easily so that gamers will have to buy a replacement.He also said that Sony's high sales figures are helped by the fact that many gamers, himself included, have had to buy a second PlayStation and PlayStation 2."

From there, Mikami went on to accuse Sony of doing the same thing with their line of PCs, Walkmans, and cell phones. He asked why no one has complained about this and said that it was almost like cheating and committing a crime. The radio DJ tried to interrupt Mikami and shift the conversation to another topic, but when Mikami was asked if he thought SONY'S CUSTOMERS are FOOLISH, he replied, "YES."

____________________________

He isn't the only one who sees the truth here. Sony has already been SUED SUCCESSFULLY, several times, over issues relating to their shoddy products.

Here's a link to a Law Firm that has challenged Sony over their defective products. In July of 2002, the law firm of Sheller, Ludwig & Badey filled a "****Action Lawsuit" against Sony over defects in the Playstation 2 video game console. Essentially a "****Action Lawsuit" means that you have a LARGE ****GROUP of people to represent.

Sheller, Ludwig & Badey is a legal practice that specializes in consumer defense. They have gone after many corporate giants in the past on such varied topics such as Consumer Fraud and Defective Products.

http://www.sheller.com/Practice.asp?PracticeID=109

________________________

Quote:

"The Complaint alleges that Sony Computer Entertainment America, Inc., marketed and promoted the PlayStation 2 unit-which was designed to function both as a game system and a DVD movie player-as a reliable and adequate DVD player when, in fact, the DVD player component suffers from a number of defects that prevents it from playing a wide-variety of DVD movies. The ****action also contends that Sony concealed the DVD playback defects from purchasers and required those who reported the problem to pay $120 to have their defective units repaired or replaced. The Complaint also charges that in spite of receiving these complaints, Sony has failed to warn new or existing purchasers about the defective DVD component."

_______________________

DEPARTMENT OF CONSUMER AFFAIRS, the United States' main consumer advocacy group. They too have dealt with Sony's shoddy products.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news03/playstation.html

The United States Department of Consumer Affairs is the most powerful group of its kind. Here's some interesting quotes from this article:

"My son bought a Sony Playstation 2 in September. By Christmas, it stopped working with a Disc Error, cannot read disc."

Here's another:

"Consumers have been complaining for more than a year that Sony's Playstation 2 video game machine stops reading DVDs and certain types of games, often when the unit is just a few months old."

Talk about a beautiful disaster bet you didn't expect this huh?

Six Sony walkmans A_Zombie bought that broke: $400

Three Playstation 2s that A_Zombie went through before finding a reliable one: $700

Total cost to get A_Zombie's Xbox 360 repaired for the RRoD: Priceless

For everything else there is a Blackbond card.

[QUOTE="Phazevariance"]Do you really want to turn this thread into a 360 vs ps3 graphics war like every other thread? Lets just assume that it even matches the ps3's top game that is available, and the fact that it was out a year earlier really beats ps3's delayed release into their faces.

No matter what game I choose, someone will post another competitors game that htey feel looks better, to which someone else will rebuttle with another 360 game that they feel trumps that other game in such and such category, and the figh tjust goes on forever, with NO end.

BAIT = fail

Pariah_001

Pitiful excuse. You're the one who put it out there dude.

I don't know if you noticed. but there was a big, color post...just 3 posts up.

directed at you, specifically.

don't know of you saw that...

[QUOTE="Pariah_001"][QUOTE="Phazevariance"]Do you really want to turn this thread into a 360 vs ps3 graphics war like every other thread? Lets just assume that it even matches the ps3's top game that is available, and the fact that it was out a year earlier really beats ps3's delayed release into their faces.

No matter what game I choose, someone will post another competitors game that htey feel looks better, to which someone else will rebuttle with another 360 game that they feel trumps that other game in such and such category, and the figh tjust goes on forever, with NO end.

BAIT = fail

Dreams-Visions

Pitiful excuse. You're the one who put it out there dude.

I don't know if you noticed. but there was a big, color post...just 3 posts up.

directed at you, specifically.

don't know of you saw that...

The color post was so pretty... I just couldn't miss it! :shock: This is coming from a blind man! :P

BB, you could have saved some for me. I couldn't even get tagged in this time! :cry:

in closing: buy a 360, gamers. you'll be glad you did.

Dreams-Visions

Don't worry I've put everyone on notice about whats going to happen from now on:lol:

Dreamsvisions and BlackBond...."WE'RE TAKING OVER!!! :twisted:

But really it is my fault. The guy called me out so I had to show him the truth. Saying that Mikami never mentioned anything about the DRE problems was just flat out a lie that I had to point out.

Oh and Yoshi and Mutenpika are dying in the IRC :lol:

[QUOTE="Sihanouk"][QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="Sihanouk"][QUOTE="Nagidar"][QUOTE="Sihanouk"]

Everyone NOW has heard of it. Just about everyone, if you want to be technical. However, it took Microsoft a year and a half to admit the problems. They even shut down the forum on their site when gamers complain about hardware issues in the beginning. There is no way anyone can defend Microsoft and their sneaky methods in dealing with hardware issues, at least during the first two years.

Nagidar

You mean like SONY's DRE?

DRE was a much, much less pravelent/troublesome than RROD. Still, two wrongs don't make a right.

What? SONY had to be SUED before they would even admit there was a problem...

Still,I repeat: DRE was a much, much less pravelent/troublesome than RROD. Still, two wrongs don't make a right.

No, it wasn't, I went through 3 PS2's within a 6 month time frame and don't say it wasn't as troublesome, because it was SO troublesome, SONY was sued over it.

As did I. The reason DRE was so wide-spread is because early PS2s used glass lenses while newer ones (2002+) used plastic lenses that would melt under the same use experienced by the PS2s with glass lenses. The Best Buy rep explained to me that they've gotten back PS2s that only lasted 6 months tops.

RROD is worse but was handled better by an order of magnitude better compared to DRE, so I haven't hand to spend my own money which makes me a happy camper as apposed to going through 3 PS2s in the span of 2 years. Thank you $ony!

The color post was so pretty... I just couldn't miss it! :shock: This is coming from a blind man! :P

A_zombie

Sometimes I forget that you are legally blind.

Six Sony walkmans A_Zombie bought that broke: $400

Three Playstation 2s that A_Zombie went through before finding a reliable one: $700

Total cost to get A_Zombie's Xbox 360 repaired for the RRoD: Priceless

For everything else there is a Blackbond card.

A_zombie

Yes its over 9000.

[QUOTE="Dreams-Visions"]

BB, you could have saved some for me. I couldn't even get tagged in this time! :cry:

in closing: buy a 360, gamers. you'll be glad you did.

Blackbond

Don't worry I've put everyone on notice about whats going to happen from now on:lol:

Dreamsvisions and BlackBond...."WE'RE TAKING OVER!!! :twisted:

But really it is my fault. The guy called me out so I had to show him the truth. Saying that Mikami never mentioned anything about the DRE problems was just flat out a lie that I had to point out.

Oh and Yoshi and Mutenpika are dying in the IRC :lol:

Mr. Bond is in the building

Swagga on a hundred, thousand TRILLION

Noone on the corner has swagga like us..

I love it when threads backfire. I love it like Donald Trump loves new money.

[QUOTE="A_zombie"]

The color post was so pretty... I just couldn't miss it! :shock: This is coming from a blind man! :P

Blackbond

Sometimes I forget that you are legally blind.

Six Sony walkmans A_Zombie bought that broke: $400

Three Playstation 2s that A_Zombie went through before finding a reliable one: $700

Total cost to get A_Zombie's Xbox 360 repaired for the RRoD: Priceless

For everything else there is a Blackbond card.

A_zombie

Yes its over 9000.

I add my A_Zombie card to play

:p

[QUOTE="A_zombie"]

The color post was so pretty... I just couldn't miss it! :shock: This is coming from a blind man! :P

Blackbond

Sometimes I forget that you are legally blind.

Six Sony walkmans A_Zombie bought that broke: $400

Three Playstation 2s that A_Zombie went through before finding a reliable one: $700

Total cost to get A_Zombie's Xbox 360 repaired for the RRoD: Priceless

For everything else there is a Blackbond card.

A_zombie

Yes its over 9000.

*examines thread carefully*

Ah, sweet success. Criticalsuccess. We roll 20's. We may have ego, but we've got reality on our side.

There's no way around it. In this situation, the 360 comes out on top. Swing and a miss, thank you for your time, come again another day. I'd like to get some target practice in, too.

*snip*

Talk about a beautiful disaster bet you didn't expect this huh?

Blackbond

Didn't expect what? That you piled cherrypicked articles on top of each other and placed strategically highlighted, but misleading, quotes in your post?

1) I thought you were talking about the development stage of RE4; saying he had a DRE in the process. So, my bad. But...Uh...Yeah, where exactly does the article say he experienced the error himself? All I see is hearsay on his part. I can get a ton of articles with Itagaki saying the same stuff and would mean absolute jack.

2) ****Action lawsuits are lodged against Microsoft all the time. Some go through while some don't. What exactly do you think this says about your attempt to spot-light Sony with a lawsuit which they decided to settle and a few others you're trying to pad your case with. Are you trying to say that everyone that settles is guilty of what they're being charged with? That sounds like more Blackbond logic. If you were educated on thi, you'd know that, sometimes, it would cost less to settle than to fight a case. Companies don't like stretching out controversey more than they have to.

3) Your complaint against Sony is that they allegedly make shoddy products. Not that they decide to settle some cases and lose others. In which case, my citation of Microsoft being threatened by a ****action lawsuit meets the standard of your 'faulty hardware' case. You can not write it off simply because Microsoft avoided being confronted on it in the court room. Lord know you wouldn't let Sony get away with that.

4) What exactly does citing the specialty of the law form supposed to prove about the validity of the claims or the true statistics of the defective product? ****action lawsuits only need a few people to be considered ****action. In the case of Microsoft's ****action lawsuit on the other hand, we already have them admitting to the existence of an inert defect, so it's not as much of a stretch to suppose the numbers against them in the case were much larger.

5) Noting the status of the PS2's "vastly larger userbase" in conjunction with your claim that the PS2's DRE error was just as prevalent as RROD does not actually prove that there were substantially voluminous reports of errors. That's a logical fallacy--Especially since the DRE was not actually something that was based on the systems processes as was the case with RROD. DRE meant that the system discriminated between disk types according to the versatility of the laser. This is in stark contrast the 360s notorious overheating. Which one do you honestly believe would pop up more?

yea.

I don't know if you noticed. but there was a big, color post...just 3 posts up.

directed at you, specifically.

don't know of you saw that...

Dreams-Visions

No. I didn't see it. Because I was too busy responding to one that came before it on the previous page (I have my viewer set to 50 posts).

Judge not, lest ye be judged.

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]

*snip*

Talk about a beautiful disaster bet you didn't expect this huh?

Pariah_001

Didn't expect what? That you piled cherrypicked articles on top of each other and placed strategically highlighted, but misleading, quotes in your post?

1) I thought you were talking about the development stage of RE4; saying he had a DRE in the process. So, my bad. But...Uh...Yeah, where exactly does the article say he experienced the error himself? All I say is hearsay on his part. I can get a ton of articles with Itagaki saying the same stuff.

2) ****Action lawsuits are lodged against Microsoft all the time. Some go through while some don't. What exactly do you think this says about your attempt to spot-light Sony with a lawsuit which they decided to settle and a few others you're trying to pad your case with. Are you trying to say that everyone that settles is guilty of what they're being charged with? That sounds like more Blackbond logic. If you were educated on thi, you'd know that, sometimes, it would cost less to settle than to fight a case. Companies don't like stretching out controversey more than they have to.

3) Your complaint against Sony is that they allegedly make shoddy products. Not that they decide to settle some cases and lose others. In which case, my citation of Microsoft being threatened by a ****action lawsuit meets the standard of your 'faulty hardware' case. You can not write it off simply because Microsoft avoided being confronted on it in the court room. Lord know you wouldn't let Sony get away with that.

4) What exactly does citing the specialty of the law form supposed to prove about the validity of the claims or the true statistics of the defective product? ****action lawsuits only need a few people to be considered ****action. In the case of Microsoft's ****action lawsuit on the other hand, we already have them admitting to the existence of an inert defect, so it's not as much of a stretch to suppose the numbers against them in the case were much larger.

5) Noting the status of the PS2's "vastly larger userbase" in conjunction with your claim that the PS2's DRE error was just as prevalent as RROD does not actually prove that there were substantially voluminous reports of errors. That's a logical fallacy--Especially since the DRE was not actually something that was based on the systems processes as was the case with RROD. DRE meant that the system discriminated between disk types according to the versatility of the laser. This is in stark contrast the 360s notorious overheating. Which one do you honestly believe would pop up more?

lol i always laugh at your post saying everyone is wrong because they can't "prove" or they can't spell or use grammar correctly. last time i checked this isn't a school essay, anyway you do go through a lot of trouble trying to say someone is wrong yet you don't have "proof either" same things you say to others can be said about you, just stop.

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

yoshi_64

You heard? Is this what Microsoft consumers do? They hear about stuff that they consider a positive reinforcement to their camp and then relay the hearsay as fast and excitedly as possible?

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]

*snip*

Talk about a beautiful disaster bet you didn't expect this huh?

Pariah_001

Didn't expect what? That you piled cherrypicked articles on top of each other and placed strategically highlighted, but misleading, quotes in your post?

1) I thought you were talking about the development stage of RE4; saying he had a DRE in the process. So, my bad. But...Uh...Yeah, where exactly does the article say he experienced the error himself? All I see is hearsay on his part. I can get a ton of articles with Itagaki saying the same stuff and would mean absolute jack.

2) ****Action lawsuits are lodged against Microsoft all the time. Some go through while some don't. What exactly do you think this says about your attempt to spot-light Sony with a lawsuit which they decided to settle and a few others you're trying to pad your case with. Are you trying to say that everyone that settles is guilty of what they're being charged with? That sounds like more Blackbond logic. If you were educated on thi, you'd know that, sometimes, it would cost less to settle than to fight a case. Companies don't like stretching out controversey more than they have to.

3) Your complaint against Sony is that they allegedly make shoddy products. Not that they decide to settle some cases and lose others. In which case, my citation of Microsoft being threatened by a ****action lawsuit meets the standard of your 'faulty hardware' case. You can not write it off simply because Microsoft avoided being confronted on it in the court room. Lord know you wouldn't let Sony get away with that.

4) What exactly does citing the specialty of the law form supposed to prove about the validity of the claims or the true statistics of the defective product? ****action lawsuits only need a few people to be considered ****action. In the case of Microsoft's ****action lawsuit on the other hand, we already have them admitting to the existence of an inert defect, so it's not as much of a stretch to suppose the numbers against them in the case were much larger.

5) Noting the status of the PS2's "vastly larger userbase" in conjunction with your claim that the PS2's DRE error was just as prevalent as RROD does not actually prove that there were substantially voluminous reports of errors. That's a logical fallacy--Especially since the DRE was not actually something that was based on the systems processes as was the case with RROD. DRE meant that the system discriminated between disk types according to the versatility of the laser. This is in stark contrast the 360s notorious overheating. Which one do you honestly believe would pop up more?

Hey, check this, just recently I called MS support and they allowed me to ship my RRoD'd 360 to Mesquite, Texas for FREE. I mean, they do this for FREE! When I went through 3 PS2's that DRE'd on me, they didn't want to life a finger, "Uh yeah, you're gonna have to fork 200 bucks over and buy another PS2 if you want to finish Disgaea, sir."

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

Pariah_001

You heard? Is this what Microsoft consumers do? They hear about stuff that they consider a positive reinforcement to their camp and then relay the hearsay as fast and excitedly as possible?

:|

What he said was true. Are your tactics to act ignorant and pray it goes away or what?

lol i always laugh at your post saying everyone is wrong because they can't "prove" or they can't spell or use grammar correctly. last time i checked this isn't a school essay, anyway you do go through a lot of trouble trying to say someone is wrong yet you don't have "proof either" same things you say to others can be said about you, just stop.skulper34

Projection much? Where have I tried to correct anyone's grammar or spelling?

As I said on the previous page to....Someone. There's something known as the "burden of proof." Whoever posits what he or she considers to be fact must be supported by proof.

It is their job to prove something to me. Not the other way around.

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

yoshi_64

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]

*snip*

Talk about a beautiful disaster bet you didn't expect this huh?

Pariah_001

Didn't expect what? That you piled cherrypicked articles on top of each other and placed strategically highlighted, but misleading, quotes in your post?

1) I thought you were talking about the development stage of RE4; saying he had a DRE in the process. So, my bad. But...Uh...Yeah, where exactly does the article say he experienced the error himself? All I say is hearsay on his part. I can get a ton of articles with Itagaki saying the same stuff.

2)****Action lawsuits are lodged against Microsoft all the time. Some go through while some don't. What exactly do you think this says about your attempt to spot-light Sony with a lawsuit which they decided to settle and a few others you're trying to pad your case with. Are you trying to say that everyone that settles is guilty of what they're being charged with? That sounds like more Blackbond logic. If you were educated on thi, you'd know that, sometimes, it would cost less to settle than to fight a case. Companies don't like stretching out controversey more than they have to.

3) Your complaint against Sony is that they allegedly make shoddy products. Not that they decide to settle some cases and lose others. In which case, my citation of Microsoft being threatened by a ****action lawsuit meets the standard of your 'faulty hardware' case. You can not write it off simply because Microsoft avoided being confronted on it in the court room. Lord know you wouldn't let Sony get away with that.

4) What exactly does citing the specialty of the law form supposed to prove about the validity of the claims or the true statistics of the defective product? ****action lawsuits only need a few people to be considered ****action. In the case of Microsoft's ****action lawsuit on the other hand, we already have them admitting to the existence of an inert defect, so it's not as much of a stretch to suppose the numbers against them in the case were much larger.

5) Noting the status of the PS2's "vastly larger userbase" in conjunction with your claim that the PS2's DRE error was just as prevalent as RROD does not actually prove that there were substantially voluminous reports of errors. That's a logical fallacy--Especially since the DRE was not actually something that was based on the systems processes as was the case with RROD. DRE meant that the system discriminated between disk types according to the versatility of the laser. This is in stark contrast the 360s notorious overheating. Which one do you honestly believe would pop up more?

1) No I said he was whining about DRE even when deving RE4. And PS2 was out for a while when RE4 was being made man. Where in the article does it say he experienced it himself?

"He also said that Sony's high sales figures are helped by the fact that many gamers, himself included, have had to buy a second PlayStation and PlayStation 2."

2) Show me one against the 360 please. MS sure as hell ain't Saints but show me one against the 360.

3) Don't make up my complaints for me I never really complained man. You made the comment about Mikami never said anything about DRE and now here's proof that he did. The rest well that just came along for the ride.

4) They were not served with a C1ass Action lawsuit because they put out the warrenty. Sony said tough luck with PS2. What does citing the speciality of the law do? Hey I'm studying English and writing a paper I'm in the citing mood.

5) DRE, RROD, they both suck it really doesn't matter cause your system won't work with either. Which one do I think happened more? DRE of course. So many more PS2's in circulation then 360's man. PS2 came out in 2000 and yet Mikami was whining about PS2 hardware some time before 2005 when RE4 for Cube came out man.

You can snip all you want. Bottom line is that you were dead wrong. You said Mikami didn't mention anything about DRE and you were FACTUALLY wrong. I have no interest for an opinion to an opinion based discussion. You're initial statement was blown away with 1000 nukes.

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

Pariah_001

You heard? Is this what Microsoft consumers do? They hear about stuff that they consider a positive reinforcement to their camp and then relay the hearsay as fast and excitedly as possible?

Here

Here

Here

That is all

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

Pariah_001

You heard? Is this what Microsoft consumers do? They hear about stuff that they consider a positive reinforcement to their camp and then relay the hearsay as fast and excitedly as possible?

Yet Mr. Bear doesn't lie. He was pretty maaaaaaaaad with Sony. They wouldn't repair the PS2's DRE problems, despite it being Sony's fault in the beginning. MS loved Mr. Bear so much, they repaired his 360 when it got RROD for free and so Mr. Bear didn't have to blow them up. :D

Hey, check this, just recently I called MS support and they allowed me to ship my RRoD'd 360 to Mesquite, Texas for FREE. I mean, they do this for FREE! When I went through 3 PS2's that DRE'd on me, they didn't want to life a finger, "Uh yeah, you're gonna have to fork 200 bucks over and buy another PS2 if you want to finish Disgaea, sir."

A_zombie

Hwy look! Anecdote! That proves everything you say!

It's also nice to know how courageous Microsoft is by jumping into the business with the tune, "Our goal is to show the consumers of this generation that we have the most speedy refurbishing system. Matters of reliability are secondary to promoting the perception that we actually care to sell products that don't break."

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

Pariah_001

You heard? Is this what Microsoft consumers do? They hear about stuff that they consider a positive reinforcement to their camp and then relay the hearsay as fast and excitedly as possible?

i have a 360 and i wanted to buy a ps3 i hate ms for the rrod it could have been avoided i want to get a ps3 just for bluray but what is the point when i can get a nice bluray player for almost the same and would have a longer lifespan? i'm not picking favorites here. microsoft is full of it and i baught a 360 knowing of rrod just like everyone else "it wont happen to me" and it did twice. sony on the other hand since the beginning i hated how they lied about how so advanced the ps3 was that they compared their console to a super computer, i don't remember if i read it here or an article but it was years ago. im sure microsoft said the same thing, but sony just took it further by saying the cell does this and that. now look at 360's exclusives like gears of war, and what is ps3's best looking game? killzone 2? i admit killzone 2 looks more realistic due to it's animation however different art style, but my point is....

sony made it seem like ps3 would have graphics beyond anything and 120fps.... killzone 2 should be a breeze on the ps3 but it's not running at 120fps neither is mgs4

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

StingerVXIII

Wait so people can't call PS2 jrpg king without hearing crap about hiding behind a last-gen system or PS2 being last-gen. Yet its ok for people to hide behind DRE when people call the 360 most faulty console this gen? Hey everybody! DRE is a last-gen problem. Lets try sticking to THIS generation of gaming. SW hypocrisy never fails :lol:StingerVXIII

Wait so people can't call PS2 jrpg king without hearing crap about hiding behind a last-gen system or PS2 being last-gen. Yet its ok for people to hide behind DRE when people call the 360 most faulty console this gen? Hey everybody! DRE is a last-gen problem. Lets try sticking to THIS generation of gaming. SW hypocrisy never fails :lol:StingerVXIII

Sony's Customer service has always been downplayed by many since day 1 of the PS1. MS is new to the game, but their first widespread problem, and they actually are doing something about it. Rawr!

[QUOTE="A_zombie"]Hey, check this, just recently I called MS support and they allowed me to ship my RRoD'd 360 to Mesquite, Texas for FREE. I mean, they do this for FREE! When I went through 3 PS2's that DRE'd on me, they didn't want to life a finger, "Uh yeah, you're gonna have to fork 200 bucks over and buy another PS2 if you want to finish Disgaea, sir."

Pariah_001

Hwy look! Anecdote! That proves everything you say!

It's also nice to know how courageous Microsoft is by jumping into the business with the tune, "Our goal is to show the consumers of this generation that we have the most speedy refurbishing system. Matters of reliability are secondary to promoting the perception that we actually care to sell products that don't break."

Hmm, I admit... EVERYTHING breaks. But at least MS is doing SOMETHING about FIXING the DEFECTIVE products that had been SOLD to the CONSUMERS. Are you getting the point or do I have to draw a picture with a crayon to show it to you?

Here's the thing. MS knew they would lose more money if they extended the warranty and could make more money if they didn't. People would buy another 360. But MS is doing something about the overheating by releasing the recently released JASPER chips in their newer 360s.

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

Pariah_001

You heard? Is this what Microsoft consumers do? They hear about stuff that they consider a positive reinforcement to their camp and then relay the hearsay as fast and excitedly as possible?

Drop your pedantry and face the facts. No matter the comparitive damage between RROD and DRE, the fact remains that Microsoft handled the problem in such a way that it minimized the damage to the end users. On the other hand, Sony failed to address the problems they knew existed, and a large amount of people were left with no redress whatsoever.

Regardless of the prevalence, RROD has had much less of a negative impact on consumers than DRE. The end results in a win for Microsoft.

[QUOTE="StingerVXIII"][QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

yoshi_64

Wait so people can't call PS2 jrpg king without hearing crap about hiding behind a last-gen system or PS2 being last-gen. Yet its ok for people to hide behind DRE when people call the 360 most faulty console this gen? Hey everybody! DRE is a last-gen problem. Lets try sticking to THIS generation of gaming. SW hypocrisy never fails :lol:StingerVXIII

Wait so people can't call PS2 jrpg king without hearing crap about hiding behind a last-gen system or PS2 being last-gen. Yet its ok for people to hide behind DRE when people call the 360 most faulty console this gen? Hey everybody! DRE is a last-gen problem. Lets try sticking to THIS generation of gaming. SW hypocrisy never fails :lol:StingerVXIII

Sony's Customer service has always been downplayed by many since day 1 of the PS1. MS is new to the game, but their first widespread problem, and they actually are doing something about it. Rawr!

So can I call the PS2 the king of jrpg then?StingerVXIII

Go for it I don't care. Just makes your purchase of a PS3 more questionable though.

[QUOTE="skulper34"]lol i always laugh at your post saying everyone is wrong because they can't "prove" or they can't spell or use grammar correctly. last time i checked this isn't a school essay, anyway you do go through a lot of trouble trying to say someone is wrong yet you don't have "proof either" same things you say to others can be said about you, just stop.Pariah_001

Projection much? Where have I tried to correct anyone's grammar or spelling?

As I said on the previous page to....Someone. There's something known as the "burden of proof." Whoever posits what he or she considers to be fact must be supported by proof.

It is their job to prove something to me. Not the other way around.

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"][QUOTE="StingerVXIII"][QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

So I heard Sony really didn't do anything to resolve the PS2 DRE issues, but MS gives you repairs for free and extends the warranty for 3 years on RROD consoles? :o What quality service, right?

Yeah... Sony didn't care for it's consumers I bet... they never cared... they burned Mr. Bear. :cry:

StingerVXIII

Wait so people can't call PS2 jrpg king without hearing crap about hiding behind a last-gen system or PS2 being last-gen. Yet its ok for people to hide behind DRE when people call the 360 most faulty console this gen? Hey everybody! DRE is a last-gen problem. Lets try sticking to THIS generation of gaming. SW hypocrisy never fails :lol:StingerVXIII

Wait so people can't call PS2 jrpg king without hearing crap about hiding behind a last-gen system or PS2 being last-gen. Yet its ok for people to hide behind DRE when people call the 360 most faulty console this gen? Hey everybody! DRE is a last-gen problem. Lets try sticking to THIS generation of gaming. SW hypocrisy never fails :lol:StingerVXIII

Sony's Customer service has always been downplayed by many since day 1 of the PS1. MS is new to the game, but their first widespread problem, and they actually are doing something about it. Rawr!

Realize this. The PS2 being JRPG king = true

PS2 being JRPG king this gen = false.

Simply put, the PS2 isn't a factor this gen, it's no longer being advocated into the next gen cycle of gaming, now is it? Oh and one more thing, which is the obvious fact. Mr. bear wants to know why you are bringing this in, when you were iterating about the company's policy and image as a whole. Not a single system being singled out to be a single king of a single genre.

Rawr! Mr. Bear doesn't realize if you are merely playing this foolish or perhaps are just are. It's ok. We can blow things up later. :D

[QUOTE="Pariah_001"][QUOTE="A_zombie"]Hey, check this, just recently I called MS support and they allowed me to ship my RRoD'd 360 to Mesquite, Texas for FREE. I mean, they do this for FREE! When I went through 3 PS2's that DRE'd on me, they didn't want to life a finger, "Uh yeah, you're gonna have to fork 200 bucks over and buy another PS2 if you want to finish Disgaea, sir."

A_zombie

Hwy look! Anecdote! That proves everything you say!

It's also nice to know how courageous Microsoft is by jumping into the business with the tune, "Our goal is to show the consumers of this generation that we have the most speedy refurbishing system. Matters of reliability are secondary to promoting the perception that we actually care to sell products that don't break."

Hmm, I admit... EVERYTHING breaks. But at least MS is doing SOMETHING about FIXING the DEFECTIVE products that had been SOLD to the CONSUMERS. Are you getting the point or do I have to draw a picture with a crayon to show it to you?

Here's the thing. MS knew they would lose more money if they extended the warranty and could make more money if they didn't. People would buy another 360. But MS is doing something about the overheating by releasing the recently released JASPER chips in their newer 360s.

Just forget it man. He was hit hard with a bunch of facts and statements directly from Mikami when he previously said Mikami said nothing about DRE and all he's doing is firing blindly at anything he can find.

The majority of use dealt with PS1 and PS2's hardware defects and stuck by them with no warrenties given by Sony but we stuck by them because they had the games.

Now MS has the games and we stick by them even with their faulty hardware. But that faulty hardware is replaced free of charged if it breaks.

I swear I'll never understand why some of these people just didn't by GC's and N64's back in the day. The determining factor will always be games and if you think the games are worth it you will always come back.

1) No I said he was whining about DRE even when deving RE4. And PS2 was out for a while when RE4 was being made man. Where in the article does it say he experienced it himself?

"He also said that Sony's high sales figures are helped by the fact that many gamers, himself included, have had to buy a second PlayStation and PlayStation 2."Blackbond

Second person? I want a direct quote that says he experienced it while developing the game. Considering devs use dev kits, that doesn't make sense.

2) Show me one against the 360 please. MS sure as hell ain't Saints but show me one against the 360.Blackbond

I already showed you one. And you decided it didn't count because Microsoft evaded it--Great logic there by the way. You're still avoiding the point: What does lawsuit, failed or otherwise, actually prove about the accused?

BTW: They settled with Immersion on the controller law suit. Sony fought that one out.

3) Don't make up my complaints for me I never really complained man. You made the comment about Mikami never said anything about DRE and now here's proof that he did. The rest well that just came along for the ride.Blackbond

What is it with you and the word "proof?" A second person article without a direct quote is not proof of anything.

You are the one here trying to make a case for Sony's allegedly "shoddy" hardware. You used that exact word. Emphasizing minutia for the sake of distracting from my point not actually help you. You are trying to avoid the fact that I pointed out that Microsoft avoided going into a lawsuit that they've already, themselves, admitted that there's warrant for.

4) They were not served with a C1ass Action lawsuit because they put out the warrenty. Sony said tough luck with PS2.Blackbond

Again. Where's the proof that they said "tough luck?" Defending against the lip-service that DRE was running rampant does not equate to saying "tough luck." It means that they don't agree that their statistic of defectiveness warrants a ****action lawsuit--At the very most. To properly posit that they're saying, "tough luck," you'd need to find a quote from them that acknowledges the error is inherent to the system--Which is not true.

I could find a much more significant example of Microsoft saying, "tough luck," to people who ask them, "I just want to buy a console I know won't die from the heating error you didn't iron out." About 10 million+ examples actually.

5) DRE, RROD, they both suck it really doesn't matter cause your system won't work with either. Which one do I think happened more? DRE of course. So many more PS2's in circulation then 360's man. PS2 came out in 2000 and yet Mikami was whining about PS2 hardware some time before 2005 when RE4 for Cube came out man.Blackbond

Again: You have no proof. You are indulging in a logical fallacy. You need solid numbers to actually make an argument such as this.

You can snip all you want. Bottom line is that you were dead wrong. You said Mikami didn't mention anything about DRE and you were FACTUALLY wrong. I have no interest for an opinion to an opinion based discussion. You're initial statement was blown away with 1000 nukes.Blackbond

And you can justify running away all you like, but that doesn't mean you're actually able to prove anything about DRE. You've presented your evidence atrociously. Your case is abysmal.

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]1) No I said he was whining about DRE even when deving RE4. And PS2 was out for a while when RE4 was being made man. Where in the article does it say he experienced it himself?

"He also said that Sony's high sales figures are helped by the fact that many gamers, himself included, have had to buy a second PlayStation and PlayStation 2."Pariah_001

Second person? I want a direct quote that says he experienced it while developing the game. Considering devs use dev kits, that doesn't make sense.

2) Show me one against the 360 please. MS sure as hell ain't Saints but show me one against the 360.Blackbond

I already showed you one. And you decided it didn't count because Microsoft evaded it--Great logic there by the way. You're still avoiding the point: What does lawsuit, failed or otherwise, actually prove about the accused?

BTW: They settled with Immersion on the controller law suit. Sony fought that one out.

3) Don't make up my complaints for me I never really complained man. You made the comment about Mikami never said anything about DRE and now here's proof that he did. The rest well that just came along for the ride.Blackbond

What is it with you and the word "proof?" A second person article without a direct quote is not proof of anything.

You are the one here trying to make a case for Sony's allegedly "shoddy" hardware. You used that exact word. Emphasizing minutia for the sake of distracting from my point not actually help you. You are trying to avoid the fact that I pointed out that Microsoft avoided going into a lawsuit that they've already, themselves, admitted that there's warrant for.

4) They were not served with a C1ass Action lawsuit because they put out the warrenty. Sony said tough luck with PS2.Blackbond

Again. Where's the proof that they said "tough luck?" Defending against the lip-service that DRE was running rampant does not equate to saying "tough luck." It means that they don't agree that their statistic of defectiveness warrants a ****action lawsuit--At the very most. To properly posit that they're saying, "tough luck," you'd need to find a quote from them that acknowledges the error is inherent to the system--Which is not true.

I could find a much more significant example of Microsoft saying, "tough luck," to people who ask them, "I just want to buy a console I know won't die from the heating error you didn't iron out." About 10 million+ examples actually.

5) DRE, RROD, they both suck it really doesn't matter cause your system won't work with either. Which one do I think happened more? DRE of course. So many more PS2's in circulation then 360's man. PS2 came out in 2000 and yet Mikami was whining about PS2 hardware some time before 2005 when RE4 for Cube came out man.Blackbond

Again: You have no proof. You are indulging in a logical fallacy. You need solid numbers to actually make an argument such as this.

You can snip all you want. Bottom line is that you were dead wrong. You said Mikami didn't mention anything about DRE and you were FACTUALLY wrong. I have no interest for an opinion to an opinion based discussion. You're initial statement was blown away with 1000 nukes.Blackbond

And you can justify running away all you like, but that doesn't mean you're actually able to prove anything about DRE. You've presented your evidence atrociously. Your case is abysmal.

Now move along, Mr. Bear realizes you are not worth any expendeture of energy. You continue to beat along the path, ignroe the facts and rely on jabberish statements with booOOooring repetition. Mr. Bear is not amused. Gooday. Fwee!

Second person? I want a direct quote that says he experienced it while developing the game. Considering devs use dev kits, that doesn't make sense.

For the 3rd time it didn't happen while deving a game. I said it was still around when he was developing RE4 which was 3+ years after the PS2 had come out.

I already showed you one. And you decided it didn't count because Microsoft evaded it--Great logic there by the way. You're still avoiding the point: What does lawsuit, failed or otherwise, actually prove about the accused?

Man they must have done something positive to evade it :roll: If it never happend then you can't show me one as they did evade it.

What is it with you and the word "proof?" A second person article without a direct quote is not proof of anything.

Mikami's word isn't proof now?

You are the one here trying to make a case for Sony's allegedly "shoddy" hardware. You used that exact word. Emphasizing minutia for the sake of distracting from my point not actually help you. You are trying to avoid the fact that I pointed out that Microsoft avoided going into a lawsuit that they've already, themselves, admitted that there's warrant for.

And yet Sony didn't do enough to warrent avoiding a lawsuit. Had they offered a warrenty to cover it they would have avoided it as well.

Again. Where's the proof that they said "tough luck?" Defending against the lip-service that DRE was running rampant does not equate to saying "tough luck." It means that they don't agree that their statistic of defectiveness warrants a ****action lawsuit--At the very most. To properly posit that they're saying, "tough luck," you'd need to find a quote from them that acknowledges the error is inherent to the system--Which is not true.

By not doing anything to benifit the consumer over the situation man. They didn't do squat they let you tought it out. What more do you need? An apology lol?

I could find a much more significant example of Microsoft saying, "tough luck," to people who ask them, "I just want to buy a console I know won't die from the heating error you didn't iron out." About 10 million+ examples actually.

Like that 3 year warrenty and all those free 1 month LIVE things right?

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]5) DRE, RROD, they both suck it really doesn't matter cause your system won't work with either. Which one do I think happened more? DRE of course. So many more PS2's in circulation then 360's man. PS2 came out in 2000 and yet Mikami was whining about PS2 hardware some time before 2005 when RE4 for Cube came out man.Pariah_001

Again: You have no proof. You are indulging in a logical fallacy. You need solid numbers to actually make an argument such as this.

How do I have no proof lol. Mikami was whining about this situation while RE4 was in development for Gamecube. Now tell me when RE4 came out again?

You can snip all you want. Bottom line is that you were dead wrong. You said Mikami didn't mention anything about DRE and you were FACTUALLY wrong. I have no interest for an opinion to an opinion based discussion. You're initial statement was blown away with 1000 nukes.Blackbond

And you can justify running away all you like, but that doesn't mean you're actually able to prove anything about DRE. You've presented your evidence atrociously. Your case is abysmal.

First: Whatever Mikami said about the PS2, it had nothing to do with DRE.

Pariah_001

FROM SHINJI MIKAMI: CREATOR: RESIDENT EVIL - (Departed Capcom after Resident Evil 4 port announced for PS2. He is not involved with RE5)

''We all know the truth about Sony's consoles. If you don't, you have been living in a cave. DRE's or "Disc Read Errors" have become synonymous with Sony's poorly built machines. Some people even think they design their systems like this ON PURPOSE. And I am one of them.It's an idea called "Planned Obsolescence" and it's something automobile manufacturers have been doing for years.''...

Mikami worked with Sony for almost a DECADE, before he finally had the courage to speak out:

"Shinji Mikami, producer of Resident Evil and Devil May Cry, strongly criticized Sony and Square in a recent radio interview in Japan. Mikami accused Sony of purposely designing their consoles to break easily so that gamers will have to buy a replacement.He also said that Sony's high sales figures are helped by the fact that many gamers, himself included, have had to buy a second PlayStation and PlayStation 2."

From there, Mikami went on to accuse Sony of doing the same thing with their line of PCs, Walkmans, and cell phones. He asked why no one has complained about this and said that it was almost like cheating and committing a crime. The radio DJ tried to interrupt Mikami and shift the conversation to another topic, but when Mikami was asked if he thought SONY'S CUSTOMERS are FOOLISH, he replied, "YES."

Yup what did you say about Mikami not saying about DRE? And what did he say? That's right.

Hmm, I admit... EVERYTHING breaks. But at least MS is doing SOMETHING about FIXING the DEFECTIVE products that had been SOLD to the CONSUMERS. Are you getting the point or do I have to draw a picture with a crayon to show it to you?A_zombie

I don't know, do I have to use a stencil to express the fallacy of anecdotal evidence?

I could just as easily point out that Sony did repair a defective television I bought from them without a warranty (true story). Are you going to believe me or find my story representative of Sony's character? I sincerely doubt it. Either way, it makes no difference because it's anecdotal--It proves nothing.

Here's the thing. MS knew they would lose more money if they extended the warranty and could make more money if they didn't.A_zombie

This is more anecdotal evidence. And it's also an incorrect conclusion for the point you're trying to make. Class-action lawsuits, if big enough, could clean them out much more than an extended warranty. Considering they knew about the flaw beforehand and had hindsight of more class-action lawsuits, the situation is easily identified as the reverse of how you're characterizing it.

I find it hysterical that you're willing to forgive the fact that they were consciously selling you defective product and have the gall to put a 3 year cap on the warranty. My launch PS2 is still working and they think 3 years is enough for a console? Please.

My Sony products have been consistently reliable. That's why I'm defending them in general. I shouldn't have to inspect a company's return policy before I look at their actual product.

People would buy another 360. But MS is doing something about the overheating by releasing the recently released JASPER chips in their newer 360s.A_zombie

Uh huh. And Sony's putting in 60 nanometer chips in their newer PS3's when they don't have to. They're selling the PS3 at a loss. What's your real point here? MS shouldn't have to correct the problem; it just shouldn't be there.

[QUOTE="StingerVXIII"]So can I call the PS2 the king of jrpg then?Blackbond

Go for it I don't care. Just makes your purchase of a PS3 more questionable though.

[QUOTE="Blackbond"]

[QUOTE="StingerVXIII"]So can I call the PS2 the king of jrpg then?StingerVXIII

Go for it I don't care. Just makes your purchase of a PS3 more questionable though.

Not really because I went through my PS1 and its problems. I went through my PS2 and its problems. I decided to go through the 360 and its problems.

But heres the difference. The 360 improved over PS2 in the customer support area I don't have to pay to get my **** fixed. I don't have to buy the console over again. That is an improvement.

PS3 compared to PS2 in JRPGS. Oh wow I guess you could call that an improvement. There's Disgaea 3 and.....um....

SONY's PS2 strategy: Buy a PS2 before you realize the problems.

SONY's PS3 strategy: Buy a PS3 for Blu-ray.

Nagidar

what problems does the ps2 have???