@zaryia: No tantrum on my part. I'm simply pointing them out. I've seen dozens of tantrums from you specifically in various threads from the last couple years.
It generally starts with you trashing other people's opinions. They disagree with you. There's a back and forth. You eventually throw a tantrum because people don't capitulate to your whims. Rinse and repeat.
Whatever. I have a strong PC and I'll probably end up buying a PS5 for exclusives - unless they do something like MS is doing by releasing all of their games on PC which would be kind of nice.
@zaryia: No tantrum on my part. I'm simply pointing them out. I've seen dozens of tantrums from you specifically in various threads from the last couple years.
It generally starts with you trashing other people's opinions. They disagree with you. There's a back and forth. You eventually throw a tantrum because people don't capitulate to your whims. Rinse and repeat.
While discussing Gears of War 4, reviewer Jimmy Thang said, "In terms of pure image fidelity, it surprisingly looked better than our high-end gaming PC equipped with a GTX 1080 running the game maxed out, as it offered extra dynamic shadows that don't seem to be available on the PC.
How does Radeon VII mean anything for consoles....its expensive as shit.
One X is the power of a video card over half its cost, I had the same power like 1-2 years prior yet I paid the price of a One X for it.
When Anaconda comes in a couple years it could easily have 2070 level performance, a techincally people can pay to have 1-2 years prior for the cost of an Anaconda. And last time I checked a 2070 was near 1080 Ti, so PC people paid a small fortune to have that level of graphics years prior, makes no difference for consoles, cause consoles are consoles not PCs.
So is 2060 to 2070 level power lame in consoles in 2021? People who have it now paying a shit ton to have it, and people who owned a 1080 Ti payed out the ass for it, just like anyone with 2080 Ti pay out both asshole and dickhole, and chances are even PS6 won't have 2080 Ti performance.
How does Radeon VII mean anything for consoles....its expensive as shit.
One X is the power of a video card over half its cost, I had the same power like 1-2 years prior yet I paid the price of a One X for it.
When Anaconda comes in a couple years it could easily have 2070 level performance, a techincally people can pay to have 1-2 years prior for the cost of an Anaconda. And last time I checked a 2070 was near 1080 Ti, so PC people paid a small fortune to have that level of graphics years prior, makes no difference for consoles, cause consoles are consoles not PCs.
So is 2060 to 2070 level power lame in consoles in 2021? People who have it now paying a shit ton to have it, and people who owned a 1080 Ti payed out the ass for it, just like anyone with 2080 Ti pay out both asshole and dickhole, and chances are even PS6 won't have 2080 Ti performance.
Xbox One X's ~281 mm2 size GPU already has 44 CUs without VII's features
1. Rapid Pack Math (octo rate INT4, quad rate INT8, dual rate FP16/INT16) and half rate FP64 features. FP64 is useless for games. VII includes Machine Learning instruction set and Microsoft has DirectML APIs for Machine Learning capable hardware.
Polaris IP has it's pack math feature. but using pack math feature reduces the available ALU for full FP32 data elements. This problem was fixed on Vega IP.
2. High bandwidth cache below L2 cache. Mostly useless for games.
3. 64 ROPS.
X1X GPU (2MB L2 cache for TMU + 2MB render cache for ROPS) ~= Vega 64's unified 4MB L2 cache for TMU and ROPS.
Xbox One X's ~281 mm2 size GPU is built on 16 nm process node
VII's ~331 mm2 size GPU is built on 7 nm process node. Cutting out VII's workstation features could reduce VII into Xbox One X's 281 mm2 GPU size.
According to TSMC/AMD, 7nm delivers 50 percent reduce power consumption at the same clock speed and logic gates complexity (e.g. 1536Mhz) when compared to 16 nm,
7nm+ has another 10 percent power consumption reduction.
AMD could fit Xbox One X with game console optimised Vega 64 based on VII's and 7nm+ improvements.
It's question on reducing CU count for higher clock speed to improve rasterization power e.g. 48 CU at 1710 Mhz or 1800Mhz instead of 64 CU at 1536 Mhz.
MI60 (full VII with 64 CU active) has 1800Mhz with 64 CU and 300 watts and 44 CU version is 68 percent of 300 watts, hence 200 watts. Navi 12 has 40 CU and has less than 200 watts. At the same clock speed e.g. 1800Mhz the relationship between 44 CU and 64 CU resembles R9-390X's 44CU with 64 ROPS vs Fury X's 64 CU with 64 ROPs which R9-390X can get close to Fury Pro with 56 CU.
I love how people who know jack shit about hardware try and debate about it.
AMD's current graphics card have been bottlenecked for a few generations now....... why do you think Nvidia cards with a lower Tflop rating are just as fast if not faster?
If AMD just address the unbalanced nature of their architecture it would generate a huge performance increase (which they have already stated they are addressing them)
Vega 56 is just as fast as Vega 64 at the same clock speed despite vega 64 has more shader cores........ why???
When you understand the answer to that question you'll realise comparing Tflop count between current and upcoming AMD architectures is stupid.
@pc_rocks: An X1X stomps a 970. And you say I make up my own facts?
PC-Rock has a GTX970 which is why he defends it so much....... it's a trash GPU by todays standards and when run at the resolutions X1X runs games at it falls flat on it's face.
@ronvalencia: You spent a year+ telling us the Xbox One X GPU was equal to a GTX 1070. (and at one point you started talking 1080) What did we end up with???
Source
That's 1080p resolution
1. Gears of War 4 4K sustain 30 fps story mode, GTX 1060 and RX-580 fails to reach X1X's 4K results
2. Forza Motorsport 7 4K wet scenes sustain 60 fps, GTX 1060 and RX-580 fails to reach X1X's results
3. Far Cry 5 4K sustain 30 fps, GTX 1060 and RX-580 fails to reach X1X's results
4. Kill Instinct Season 3 4K nearly sustain 60 fps, GTX 980 Ti or GTX 1070 level. GTX 1060 fails to reach X1X's results.
At lower resolution like 1920x1080p, it's mostly CPU bound.
You are talking as if X1X is something special. X1X and Rx 580 share the same architecture 1X has 6tflop gpu and rx 580 a bit more so one can compare them. They will get similar results if the game is well optimized even at 4k
Here 4k forza horizon 4 similar settings to 1X and even the RX 570 is able to maintain a locked 30fps. X1X use 4xMsaa but its also using SSAO with medium/high quality setting which is a step below from what shown here
Here is Gears of war at 4k and rx 480 locked 30fps high settings . An rx 580 will get you an extra 5-10% more performance
1. Gears of War 4 4K sustain 30 fps story mode, GTX 1060 and RX-580 fails to reach X1X's 4K results
2. Forza Motorsport 7 4K wet scenes sustain 60 fps, GTX 1060 and RX-580 fails to reach X1X's results
3. Far Cry 5 4K sustain 30 fps, GTX 1060 and RX-580 fails to reach X1X's results
4. Kill Instinct Season 3 4K nearly sustain 60 fps, GTX 980 Ti or GTX 1070 level. GTX 1060 fails to reach X1X's results.
At lower resolution like 1920x1080p, it's mostly CPU bound.
You are talking as if X1X is something special. X1X and Rx 580 share the same architecture 1X has 6tflop gpu and rx 580 a bit more so one can compare them. They will get similar results if the game is well optimized even at 4k
Here 4k forza horizon 4 similar settings to 1X and even the RX 570 is able to maintain a locked 30fps. X1X use 4xMsaa but its also using SSAO with medium/high quality setting which is a step below from what shown here
Here is Gears of war at 4k and rx 480 locked 30fps high settings . An rx 580 will get you an extra 5-10% more performance
This is why stated Forza Motorsport 7's wet tracks NOT Forza Horizon 4.
MSI RX 480 Gaming X has 1316 Mhz (6.064 TFLOPS) overclocked while RX-580 has 1340 Mhz. MSI RX 480 Gaming X is nearly RX-580! Notice the minimum frame rate is 29.6. fps at high settings. Your benchmark's MSI RX-480 GX is NOT reference RX-480
X1X Gears of War 4 has higher graphics settings over XBO's version
Push graphical fidelity to the max. This mode uses Ultra Quality Textures, a wealth of new and improved graphical features all at 4K resolution (3840×2160) thanks to the power of Xbox One X. You’ll experience the same frame rates you’ve come to expect from Gears of War 4 – 30fps for Campaign and Horde .
Enhanced Light Shafts
Also known as God Rays, Enhanced Light Shafts provide true-to-life beams of sunlight in the world. Prepare for jaw dropping lighting as the God Rays peek through gaps in the canopy of trees above you, or in sunset conditions peeking through buildings and statues.
Dynamic Shadows
Shadows in Gears of War 4 are usually pre-defined by an artist to accurately reflect the shadows objects in the world would cast based on the lighting. On Xbox One X, dynamic shadows now react true to the lighting conditions and movement of objects – for example, trees blowing in the wind will cast an accurate moving shadow on the ground – bringing the world of Sera to life like never before.
Increased Draw Distances
With the power of Xbox One X, we can maintain higher resolution textures at a further distance than ever before – creating a higher fidelity picture and crisper world around you, even on the horizon.
Superior Reflections
We’ve pushed our surface space reflections even further to look closer to as you would expect in real life. Reflective surfaces now have a higher definition reflection of your character – whether that’s in a mirror-like reflection of water, or the muddied color reflective nature of metal. It looks especially awesome on the DeeBee’s metallic armor!
Enhanced Character Textures
With our higher resolution textures now available on console thanks to Xbox One X, characters show more detail from head to toe. They’ve never looked better!
MS used X1X GPU's TMU superiority while you shown "high" graphics settings
Foliage draw distance: XBO has high settings, X1X has setting upgrade e.g. ultra
Light shaft quality: XBO has high settings, X1X has setting upgrade e.g. ultra
light scattering quality: XBO has high settings
bloom quality: XBO has high settings
Volumetric lighting: XBO has medium settings
Bloom and lens flare quality: XBO has high settings
Dynamic shadows: XBO has ultra settings, X1X has setting upgrade i.e. beyond ultra. Microsoft using X1X's extra memory bandwidth advantage.
Contact shadows: XBO has medium-high settings, X1X has setting upgrade e.g. high(?)
Screen space reflections: XBO has medium settings, X1X has setting upgrade e.g. high(?) or ultra
Depth of field: XBO has high settings
Sub-surface scattering: XBO has high settings
Textures: X1X has ultra settings, Microsoft using X1X's TMU and extra memory bandwidth advantage.
RX-580 or MSI Gaming X RX-480's frame rates will be reduced below your shown benchmark when some of it's graphics settings are set to ultra.
At Ultra settings, R9-390X (5.9 TFLOPS with the same raster power as Fury Pro/Fury X) smashed RX-480's 5.83 TFLOPS. Fury X's 8.6 TFLOPS was nearly useless when R9-390X's has 5.9 TFLOPS.
If R9-390X was with Polaris IP, R9-390X would be even better GCN e.g.
1. L2 cache from 1MB to 2MB. Many modern games could exceed 1MB L2 cache storage. X1X GPU's ROPS has 2MB render cache which is missing with Polaris IP.
2. Second generation delta color compression. R9-390X doesn't have delta color compression.
NAVI 12 with 40 CU and 256bit GDDR6 would be PC market's update for R9-390X class GCN complementing VII SKU i.e. R9-390X with VII + Navi updates.
R9-390X with VII's 1800Mhz scaling lands on Titan X Pascal (slowest GP102 variant) LOL.
Fury X with VII's 1800Mhz scaling lands above Titan X Pascal (slowest GP102 variant) with estimated 60 fps which is about GTX 1080 Ti or RTX 2080 level.
Been saying it for a while. I just don't see a substantial performance increase over the XXbone for $400 any time soon.
At 1536 Mhz 64 ROPS, that's 2.62X over X1X's ROPS setup.
At 1800 Mhz 64 ROPS, that's 3.07X over X1X's ROPS setup.
Significant performance gains for games with ROPS read-write bias or ROPS bound. Smaller performance gains when games has TMU read-write path optimizations
The core reason for AMD's async compute shader marketing i.e. workaround for GCN's ROPS bound problems. GTX 1080 Ti/RTX 2080 TI are good for both ROPS and TMU read-write workloads.
@zaryia: I have literally rekt you in every debate we have ever been in.
You spin shit in 5 different directions and then have an absolute meltdown and apparently the entire forum sees it. After you get wasted you will cling on one particular point of an argument and make someone prove you wrong on something that was completely irrelevant to the original conversation.
The left is responsible for far more deaths overall.
1. Then why did you deny the fact I stated about right vs left terrorism? You shouldn't have done that. You screwed up and lost the debate due to it. Then you kept going on and on how the studies were false. You sealed the deal.
2. Citation? I need numbers that the left is responsible for more deaths.
The left is at over 100 million so let me know when the right matches that.
That isn't the modern American left we were discussing, rofl what the hell am I reading.
@zaryia said:
@blackhairedhero:
The right does commit more terror deaths than the left.
@blackhairedhero said:
@zaryia: No they don't.
You shouldn't have said this. You were wrong.
You literally lost that thread by trying to say those 3 studies were wrong continuously. You even tried to say Islam was the left and any terrorism for them counted in the left pool.
You lost badly. You're now even spinning again ITT.
@zaryia: You just said communism isn't left wing. You are a dunce.
We were discussing modern right vs left terrorism in USA. Not Communism and mass murder in other countries, and how idiots think that it has anything to do with the modern American left. You just lost this debate (AGAIN) and now you're moving the goal post. I linked the thread so everyone can see you lose every thread vs me.
I linked Islamic terrorists with the left as you linked Christian theme attacks with the right. Once you do that the left has far more terror related deaths.
You refused to group the two because then you lose.
I linked Islamic terrorists with the left as you linked Christian themes attacks with the right. Once you do that the left has far more terror related deaths.
You refused to group the two because then you lose.
I didn't link anything with right wing Christian fundamentalist attacks. The 3 studies did. You then made up your own study and arbitrarily combined Islam with the left. No study did this, you did. I was simply following the data from the 3 studies. They said right wing was far far worse. I didn't combine or fudge any numbers.
You LOST.
3 studies > You. I won the debate. Like every thread.
right-wingers and white supremacists were responsible for 74 percent of the murders committed by political extremists in the United States over the past decade. Only 2 percent were committed by left-wing radicals.
What exactly do you mean by "high end Next gen graphics"?
Do you PC guys not realize that the best looking PC games are nothing more than upresed console ports?
As long as the base hardware of consoles is 4 to 6x higher than current 1.3 - 1.8TF systems there will indeed be high end next gen graphics.
2015's The Witcher 3 is still praised by PC fans as a spectacle of graphics, but even with all it's mods it's completely trashed by console exclusive Red Dead Redemption 2.
Can't believe how dumb some gamers are trying to make statements about things they don't understand.
Games developed ground up for 12TF systems >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Games developed ground up for 1.8TF systems
@zaryia: You posted studies from the SPLC a far left source that classified the proud boys( as white supremacist) even though they have gay black members.
You lose!
Just like when you said PC gamers are higher skilled. You lost that to..
@zaryia: You posted studies from the SPLC a far left source that classified the proud boys( as white supremacist) even though they have gay black members.
And The Cato Institute
And The Government Accountability Office.
You lost this debate. Nothing you say changes this fact.
@blackhairedhero said:
Just like when you said PC gamers are higher skilled. You lost that to..
1. Games. Not gamers. My paramount claim is competitive PC games are higher skill cap and ceiling, and far more numerous. Which is 100% true.
2. That wasn't a real study. It was an online CoD flash game that anyone could take.
@zaryia: It all uses the same data you dunce. It links Christian extremists to right wing ideology but fails to link Islam with the left grouping in it's own category. Three studies that use the same source and criteria for their findings.
You lose!
1. No their not. Fighting games would be number 1 in terms of skill cap and are dominant on PS4.
2. The original test wasn't an online flash game.
You love studies so much but won't accept this one!
@zaryia: It all uses the same data you dunce. It links Christian extremists to right wing ideology but fails to link Islam with the left grouping in it's own category. Three studies that use the same source and criteria for their findings.
I posted 3 studies from 3 highly reliable sources (one of them the Government of the United States) directly saying what I'm claiming. You couldn't counter or refute any of them with citation.
You lost the debate. There is no universe were that wasn't a clear loss.
@blackhairedhero said:
1. No their not. Fighting games would be number 1 in terms of skill cap and are dominant on PS4.
2. The original test wasn't an online flash game.
You love studies so much but won't accept this one!
1. Dozens of MOBA, RTS, FPS > 2 Fighting games. PC holds 90% of esports dominance. This isn't debatable,
https://www.esportsearnings.com/games
2. It wasn't peer reviewed and there was no methodology. I would never link such a survey/poll. No one would.
I do love studies. Reliable ones with factual data. I'm not going to say a CoD Black Ops II flash game is a proper verified study. That's silly, an online survey needs to link the methodology or peer reviewed source.
"My paramount claim is competitive PC games are higher skill cap and ceiling"
And it's true. Which is why PC holds 90%+ of e-sports.
P.S. Highest skill ceiling in the planet at the moment is KB/M Shooters, followed by extreme APM RTS games. Even if fighters were up there, there isn't enough and certainly not enough players. Each PC genre has millions more.
@zaryia: then why are PC gamers worse at shooters?
1. They aren't. There is no actual valid data showing this. That's not an actual study.
2. That's irrelevant, kb/m takes has a higher skillcap/ceiling than thumbsticks. Guess which system uses which. Like I said, Games > Gamers.
@blackhairedhero said:
Esports dominates on PC due to the popularity of the platform in Asia.
Because PC has several times the competitive players, genres, and games on Earth. PS4 has around 3, and a fraction of the competitive gamers. It simply doesn't have as many, and the few it does are low skill cap.
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