Save System Wars in 2008

[QUOTE="TkLive"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

no. you were suspended for something else.

CaseyWegner

What are your thoughts about this thread, Casey?

i would very much like for there to be a post count minimum.

what about a minimum post count only for thread creators and not for posters?

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="TkLive"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

no. you were suspended for something else.

dk_2007

What are your thoughts about this thread, Casey?

i would very much like for there to be a post count minimum.

what about a minimum post count only for thread creators and not for posters?

Yeah, that's a good idea.

What about you need to at least have 50 non-moderated posts in System Wars and have not been moderated here within the last 30 days?

[QUOTE="bloodbore8"]

@ tklive:

Yeah, but it would at least be a little bit better. I say more mods, that, and someway to actually reward you if you're helping the GS community like gaining Gamespot level XP if you help out a mod or something.

bloodbore8

Can someone please reply to this?

Anyway, I think that you do get points for reporting someone.

[QUOTE="bloodbore8"][QUOTE="bloodbore8"]

@ tklive:

Yeah, but it would at least be a little bit better. I say more mods, that, and someway to actually reward you if you're helping the GS community like gaining Gamespot level XP if you help out a mod or something.

smokeydabear076

Can someone please reply to this?

Anyway, I think that you do get points for reporting someone.

I didn't know that.

I didn't know that.

bloodbore8

[QUOTE="bloodbore8"][QUOTE="bloodbore8"]

@ tklive:

Yeah, but it would at least be a little bit better. I say more mods, that, and someway to actually reward you if you're helping the GS community like gaining Gamespot level XP if you help out a mod or something.

smokeydabear076

Can someone please reply to this?

Anyway, I think that you do get points for reporting someone.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="TkLive"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

no. you were suspended for something else.

TkLive

What are your thoughts about this thread, Casey?

i would very much like for there to be a post count minimum.

Indeed, that would get rid of some of the ban dodgers and trolls: but I still see many users level 20+ that troll non-stop. It may not be that effective.

It would be quite effective. You're forcing posters to be mature and post in less-active (more easily watched) forums before being allowed into the two most active (and hard to regulate) forums. There are certainly a few higher-level trolls, but in general if it would reduce the number of ban-dodger, inexperience users, spammers, and the like who would be in the forum.

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"][QUOTE="TkLive"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

no. you were suspended for something else.

kcpp2b

What are your thoughts about this thread, Casey?

i would very much like for there to be a post count minimum.

What about everything else Sub said?

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

It would be quite effective. You're forcing posters to be mature and post in less-active (more easily watched) forums before being allowed into the two most active (and hard to regulate) forums. There are certainly a few higher-level trolls, but in general if it would reduce the number of ban-dodger, inexperience users, spammers, and the like who would be in the forum.

subrosian

Hey Sub you didn't answer my question...

Why can't we do both? Keep all these things like the systems and faction names etc... and you can have it your way to in another forum / board that you can lead? If your board grows huge surely it will steal from SW and it will maybe one day compete against it in sheer numbers but point is... why should we only have one way? Why impose more rules on people just cause you think it's right? Why not both?

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="bloodbore8"][QUOTE="bloodbore8"]

@ tklive:

Yeah, but it would at least be a little bit better. I say more mods, that, and someway to actually reward you if you're helping the GS community like gaining Gamespot level XP if you help out a mod or something.

Hoffgod

Can someone please reply to this?

Anyway, I think that you do get points for reporting someone.

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

CaseyWegner

And the realistic possibility of that happening? I haven't seen anything on GameSpot to suggest that the average SW member (or OT for that matter) has any deep respect for the TOU, or eliminating trolls by eliminating the response. Really we're both talking about removing the reward mechanism.

The question is - which is more effective - removing the attention reward by expecting every poster on SW to ignore the trolls, or restructuring the forum so that trolling is reduced in the first place?

Wow this thread is still going, huh? System Wars has been virtually the same for a while now. No need to screw it up.

I've been here for over three years. I'm just simply bored of making the same argument over and over again, which is why I rarely post in SW anymore.mis3ry

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

subrosian

And the realistic possibility of that happening? I haven't seen anything on GameSpot to suggest that the average SW member (or OT for that matter) has any deep respect for the TOU, or eliminating trolls by eliminating the response. Really we're both talking about removing the reward mechanism.

The question is - which is more effective - removing the attention reward by expecting every poster on SW to ignore the trolls, or restructuring the forum so that trolling is reduced in the first place?

Are you avoiding my question Sub cause I asked it like maybe a half dozen times now

[QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

subrosian

And the realistic possibility of that happening? I haven't seen anything on GameSpot to suggest that the average SW member (or OT for that matter) has any deep respect for the TOU, or eliminating trolls by eliminating the response. Really we're both talking about removing the reward mechanism.

The question is - which is more effective - removing the attention reward by expecting every poster on SW to ignore the trolls, or restructuring the forum so that trolling is reduced in the first place?

Sub, I think you had it wrong when you said that the off topic threads, humor content, polls, best of threads, and such were a reward mechanism for trolls. Really, it's the attention reward, getting replies, receiving recognition, and as I said eariler, people saying they're the life blood of SW.

Basically the community sending the message that trolling is "cool" which is basically peer approval. And that is the primary motivation for trolling, not the aforementioned elements you wish to remove.

[QUOTE="subrosian"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

AdobeArtist

And the realistic possibility of that happening? I haven't seen anything on GameSpot to suggest that the average SW member (or OT for that matter) has any deep respect for the TOU, or eliminating trolls by eliminating the response. Really we're both talking about removing the reward mechanism.

The question is - which is more effective - removing the attention reward by expecting every poster on SW to ignore the trolls, or restructuring the forum so that trolling is reduced in the first place?

Sub, I think you had it wrong when you said that the off topic threads, humor content, polls, best of threads, and such were a reward mechanism for trolls. Really, it's the attention reward, getting replies, receiving recognition, and as I said eariler, people saying they're the life blood of SW.

Basically the community sending the message that trolling is "cool" which is basically peer approval. And that is the primary motivation for trolling, not the aforementioned elements you wish to remove.

And the people who have created those things are the same people who consider "trolling" to be an entertaining and acceptable part of System Wars. It's no coincidence, these topics being stickied does nothing beneficial for the forum. Trolling, spam, and advertising receive relatively light moderation - the bottom line comes down to preventing that reward-response.

These things I've mentioned are really off-topic in any case, they simply don't belong here any more than re-posting Penny Arcade or VGcats comics would belong here. There can be *no* outlet for "this is just a game" style posting within System Wars - the post-response-attention mechanism needs to be restructured.

-

The "ignore the trolls" view assumes an ideal world, my suggestion for restructuring deals with reality.

And the people who have created those things are the same people who consider "trolling" to be an entertaining and acceptable part of System Wars. It's no coincidence, these topics being stickied does nothing beneficial for the forum. Trolling, spam, and advertising receive relatively light moderation - the bottom line comes down to preventing that reward-response.

These things I've mentioned are really off-topic in any case, they simply don't belong here any more than re-posting Penny Arcade or VGcats comics would belong here. There can be *no* outlet for "this is just a game" style posting within System Wars - the post-response-attention mechanism needs to be restructured.

-

The "ignore the trolls" view assumes an ideal world, my suggestion for restructuring deals with reality.

subrosian

Again, I can't help but come back tothis thread and disagree.

It's a very generalized assumption to say that the same people "whom consider trolling an entertainment" are the same that "created those things". I for one enjoy the community builders but can't stand trolls. Blanket generalizations aren't the way you want to support your concepts. I also disagree with them being stickied does nothing for the forum. Some people enjoy said stickies, and they have the same rightto have enjoyment here as you do (I don't like the number of stickies but that besides the point it seems).

I agree with Adobe that the mentality of "feeding" (ie attention)the trolls is a bigger issue than the the supposed reward system that caters to trolls. I've seen best of threads that don't feed many trolls at all, and I wouldn't call all the "winners" of these very troll like either.

And as I said these OT topics are what I miss the most about this forum nowadays.

Talking isn't going to change the forum. In fact, nothing will. Dreams-Visions

[QUOTE="Dreams-Visions"]Talking isn't going to change the forum. In fact, nothing will. smokeydabear076

Sorry but I actually used to have that post styl around three years ago :P

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Dreams-Visions"]Talking isn't going to change the forum. In fact, nothing will. -RPGamer-

Sorry but I actually used to have that post styl around three years ago :P

But posting in pink sucks :S why would you do that?

[QUOTE="-RPGamer-"]

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Dreams-Visions"]Talking isn't going to change the forum. In fact, nothing will. astiop

Sorry but I actually used to have that post styl around three years ago :P

But posting in pink sucks :S why would you do that?

And the people who have created those things are the same people who consider "trolling" to be an entertaining and acceptable part of System Wars. It's no coincidence, these topics being stickied does nothing beneficial for the forum. Trolling, spam, and advertising receive relatively light moderation - the bottom line comes down to preventing that reward-response.

These things I've mentioned are really off-topic in any case, they simply don't belong here any more than re-posting Penny Arcade or VGcats comics would belong here. There can be *no* outlet for "this is just a game" style posting within System Wars - the post-response-attention mechanism needs to be restructured.

-

The "ignore the trolls" view assumes an ideal world, my suggestion for restructuring deals with reality.

subrosian

You point is valid when you dont like OFF-TOPIC comics in SW, but you make it sound as if you are against all the comics whatsoever they be.

It is only ironic when you support the comics in avant-game: "Maybe your gift is art - you don't write a lot of posts, but you bring a gaming comic you drew to Avant-Game".

Exactly! They put prisoners in pink clothing these days and it does something with them psychologically. System Wars will be rehabilitated!smokeydabear076

Nice! So now we will make a difference in sw after all! You knew the answer but kept this thread going for a good 40ish pages, shame on you for that.

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"]Exactly! They put prisoners in pink clothing these days and it does something with them psychologically. System Wars will be rehabilitated!astiop

Nice! So now we will make a difference in sw after all! You knew the answer but kept this thread going for a good 40ish pages, shame on you for that.

Hey subrosian why are you avoiding kcpp2b he counters all your points decisively yet for 3 pages he goes unanswered????Jacboy71

[QUOTE="subrosian"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

kcpp2b

And the realistic possibility of that happening? I haven't seen anything on GameSpot to suggest that the average SW member (or OT for that matter) has any deep respect for the TOU, or eliminating trolls by eliminating the response. Really we're both talking about removing the reward mechanism.

The question is - which is more effective - removing the attention reward by expecting every poster on SW to ignore the trolls, or restructuring the forum so that trolling is reduced in the first place?

Are you avoiding my question Sub cause I asked it like maybe a half dozen times now

Dude just forget it hes backing out. Remember your a troll if you dont agree with him and he doesnt respond to trolls lol

[QUOTE="Jacboy71"]Hey subrosian why are you avoiding kcpp2b he counters all your points decisively yet for 3 pages he goes unanswered????smokeydabear076

Then let god have mercy on all our souls:(

I would post more if this came to be.Heydanbud92

[QUOTE="kcpp2b"][QUOTE="subrosian"][QUOTE="CaseyWegner"]

i don't think i'm that jaded.

i honestly don't think we need to make too many changes. for people complaining about the hype threads, do you remember what it was like before?

what people need to do is read the forum rules and the guide i posted. if people would stop responding to trolls and just report them, a lot of problems would go away.

Jacboy71

And the realistic possibility of that happening? I haven't seen anything on GameSpot to suggest that the average SW member (or OT for that matter) has any deep respect for the TOU, or eliminating trolls by eliminating the response. Really we're both talking about removing the reward mechanism.

The question is - which is more effective - removing the attention reward by expecting every poster on SW to ignore the trolls, or restructuring the forum so that trolling is reduced in the first place?

Are you avoiding my question Sub cause I asked it like maybe a half dozen times now

Dude just forget it hes backing out. Remember your a troll if you dont agree with him and he doesnt respond to trolls lol

I forgot ur right lol

[QUOTE="Heydanbud92"]I would post more if this came to be.smokeydabear076

Damn you smokey you and your dictator ways..... oh no im trolling im not posting in pink.

[QUOTE="astiop"]

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"]Exactly! They put prisoners in pink clothing these days and it does something with them psychologically. System Wars will be rehabilitated!smokeydabear076

Nice! So now we will make a difference in sw after all! You knew the answer but kept this thread going for a good 40ish pages, shame on you for that.

Is there a way to make pink your permanant text colour on the forums, or do you have to change it every time you post?BTW, I think this font is "teh kiddy", it might have a bigger effect on those type of trolls.

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="Heydanbud92"]I would post more if this came to be.Jacboy71

Damn you smokey you and your dictator ways..... oh no im trolling im not posting in pink.

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"][QUOTE="astiop"]

[QUOTE="smokeydabear076"]Exactly! They put prisoners in pink clothing these days and it does something with them psychologically. System Wars will be rehabilitated!astiop

Nice! So now we will make a difference in sw after all! You knew the answer but kept this thread going for a good 40ish pages, shame on you for that.

Is there a way to make pink your permanant text colour on the forums, or do you have to change it every time you post?BTW, I think this font is "teh kiddy", it might have a bigger effect on those type of trolls.

Damn you smokey you and your dictator ways..... oh no im trolling im not posting in pink.

Jacboy71

I propose a minimum level of 10, and a minimum post count of 100 to post in System Wars. This level is not hard to achieve, but it will force new accounts to prove they can contribute meaningfully to GameSpot before participating in System Wars.

subrosian

tsk tsk.

Hey subrosian why are you avoiding kcpp2b he counters all your points decisively yet for 3 pages he goes unanswered????Jacboy71

When I feel he has countered a point, I'll post a reply.

-

Some of the posts in this thread have simply been flamebait, thread-hijacking, or a repeat of sentiments I was aware would be posted already. They serve to demonstrate the behavior I'm concerned about, but I feel no need to reply to them. However, I will do my best to reply to intelligent debates on the subject - though by not replying I'm not necessarily implying anything bad, I simpy cannot reply to every contribution to this thread. I am giving precedence to new content, those who are contributing to the idea of System Wars reform, and helpful suggestions on improving System Wars in 2008.

An interesting tidbit relating to System Wars Bets:

I made this thread to make SW more enjoyable for me and others. I found the forum to get a little bit weird for me at the time and it was losing the fun factor for me. I saw the Cheeseburger thread...and even though Subrosian said he made it in a way to mock these kinds of bets to help stop them well I started this thread because of that.kcpp2b

Kcpp2b and I have talked on the subject before, he knows the answers to his questions already.

Dude...I'm digging the pink.

But why is this thread still alive?

[QUOTE="Jacboy71"]Hey subrosian why are you avoiding kcpp2b he counters all your points decisively yet for 3 pages he goes unanswered????subrosian

When I feel he has countered a point, I'll post a reply.

-

Some of the posts in this thread have simply been flamebait, thread-hijacking, or a repeat of sentiments I was aware would be posted already. They serve to demonstrate the behavior I'm concerned about, but I feel no need to reply to them. However, I will do my best to reply to intelligent debates on the subject - though by not replying I'm not necessarily implying anything bad, I simpy cannot reply to every contribution to this thread. I am giving precedence to new content, those who are contributing to the idea of System Wars reform, and helpful suggestions on improving System Wars in 2008.

An interesting tidbit relating to System Wars Bets:

I made this thread to make SW more enjoyable for me and others. I found the forum to get a little bit weird for me at the time and it was losing the fun factor for me. I saw the Cheeseburger thread...and even though Subrosian said he made it in a way to mock these kinds of bets to help stop them well I started this thread because of that.kcpp2b

Kcpp2b and I have talked on the subject before, he knows the answers to his questions already.

You're still STILL STILL avoiding my question which it seems you CANNOT answer which must only mean one thing.

You only want things your way and no other way. I mean you already called me and others Trolls JUST for disagreeing. I think you are getting way over your head and a little full yourself here. (And I'm sure you'll report me, AGAIN, for saying that and even though it's not against the TOS i'm sure they'll mod me for saying it)

It's very simple... there are other boards here. There is even a System Wars II which I'm sure MANY of you are aware of with their own mods and leader etc...

So why not create an avant gamer board or something else where you can do everything you want to do. And those that agree can follow you there or YOU KNOW WHAT? They can post here AND there?

It's called freedom. You're trying to be somewhat of a dictator and enforce rules we don't need and ban things and end things we never asked to end.... you don't speak for everyone and neither do I. So why not have it both ways then?

Well?

[QUOTE="Jacboy71"]

Damn you smokey you and your dictator ways..... oh no im trolling im not posting in pink.

astiop

I propose a minimum level of 10, and a minimum post count of 100 to post in System Wars. This level is not hard to achieve, but it will force new accounts to prove they can contribute meaningfully to GameSpot before participating in System Wars.

subrosian

tsk tsk.

Hey man I post when I want, where I want and how many time as I ant and if you dont agree then your just a big meanie.

P.s

lol im workin towards that 100 post minimum.