Square Enix's biggest mistake ever could be them backing 360

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"] [QUOTE="clintos59"]I dont see why alot of u lemmings are picking on amy I mean she does own a 360 but she isnt blinded like alot of u where she and others like myself can see that jrpg's dont do well on the 360. I mean for example one of the best jrpgs on the 360 is Lost Odyssey and yet if u guys love jrpg's so much as u guys say u do then why does game like, Army of two sell better then Lost Odysset which is exclusive to 360? Amy does have a good point in her arguement. And lets be honest alot of the lemmings in here trying to defend FF13 coming to there system now are some of the same ones who bashed the game when it wasnt announced yet for the 360 and we all know alot of u aint going to be buying the game so why put this bs front like your going to buy it when in reality most lemmings are just happy to see FF13 come over to the 360 just to use it as ownage. Im not saying every lemming in here but I know alot of u dont prolly even care about FF13 just for the fact that I remember tons of Lemmings saying how Lost Odyssey was awesome and a FF13 killer and then when the game comes out, the sales are a joke. And what is even more embarrassing is the 360 is like dead in japan but Lost Odyssey sales in japan prolly triumphed the sales in the US despite the 360 selling more then 10 million units in the US alone. Now that is what u call sad and alot of u lemmings need to buy these jrpg's because u really are missing out on great jrpgs.st1ka

I always see you defending 360 / bashing PS3.

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

NielsNL

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

[QUOTE="NielsNL"]

Come on now man. You started including PS2 games right? Shall we include Final Fantasy as ell then? And Dragon Quest? Enchanted Arms sold more on PS3 than 360. 360 has the games coming, but the JRPG market is connected to the Sony (and Nintendo) systems and you know it.

JLF1

Don't forget SMT: Nocture, SMT: Digital Devil Saga, Tales of the Abyss, Xenosaga, Wild Arms 4, and list goes on.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"]

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

st1ka

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

What's your point? That SE makes nice JRPG's? Did I deny that anywhere?

I agree TC for the most part, most of my freinds here in the UK own 360 Consoles.... guess what they have never played an RPG in there lives let alone a FF im talking of upwards of Twenty people not a huge number but it shows the trend somewhat of 360 owners.

Maybe this will change now with the introduction of a REAL FF to the 360 casual FPS/GTA4 Playing noobs, will be introduced to a different type of game for once in there boring i gotta have the popular sheep game way. Perhaps FF will kick off a wider appeal for RPGs in the rarther boring Madden/FPS/3rd Person Yankee world.

jwsoul

Sony could pull some very nasty strings right now. They are in a position to start investing more in Square-Enix and have more say in the decision making process. I could even see a hostile takeover.AmyMizuno

LOL!!! :lol: That's a joke right?

Erm...those are mostly hardware figures the software figures are of minor franchises that weren't advertised very highly or appearing for the first time on the XBOX brand. Furthermore a franchise like FF isn't one which already has it's fanbase on the 360 but rather has the power to force those stil on the fence to migrate towards the 360.

Everything to gain and nothing to lose.

I always see you defending 360 / bashing PS3.

NielsNL

i bash where i think it should be bashed i defend it when i think it should be defended

i look at the PS2 last gen and at the PS3 this gen and i think "what the hell happened"

i look at the xbox last gen and at the 360 this gen and i see improvements

i look at the gamecube last gen and the Wii this gen and i see improvements

also nince way to dodge my question ;)

[QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

NielsNL

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

What's your point? That SE makes nice JRPG's? Did I deny that anywhere?

the point being that pretty much every non SE JRPG sells better on the 360 than they did on the PS2

[QUOTE="NielsNL"]

I always see you defending 360 / bashing PS3.

st1ka

i bash where i think it should be bashed i defend it when i think it should be defended

i look at the PS2 last gen and at the PS3 this gen and i think "what the hell happened"

i look at the xbox last gen and at the 360 this gen and i see improvements

i look at the gamecube last gen and the Wii this gen and i see improvements

also nince way to dodge my question ;)

So you have a preference meaning you're biased. But this is an easy argument, since true objectiveness doesn't exist of course. Everyone has his own point of view.

And I didn;t dodge a question, but apparently I missed one.

[QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

NielsNL

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

What's your point? That SE makes nice JRPG's? Did I deny that anywhere?

:lol:

This is so EPIC! I don't know how many facepalm's should have been on when the TC tried changing the subject from FFXIII, to the american economy, and to accusing posters of trolling. She has been owned by B^2, Subrosian, and newcomer SBfriends.

To SBfriends, welcome to GS although you chose to post here it is actually rough being the new guy especially being level 1.

[QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

I always see you defending 360 / bashing PS3.

NielsNL

i bash where i think it should be bashed i defend it when i think it should be defended

i look at the PS2 last gen and at the PS3 this gen and i think "what the hell happened"

i look at the xbox last gen and at the 360 this gen and i see improvements

i look at the gamecube last gen and the Wii this gen and i see improvements

also nince way to dodge my question ;)

So you have a preference meaning you're biased. But this is an easy argument, since true objectiveness doesn't exist of course. Everyone has his own point of view.

And I didn;t dodge a question, but apparently I missed one.

[QUOTE="jknight5422"]

For a woman that brags about owning two (count'em two) Xbox 360s...this is hilarious!!!

For openers, Lost Odyssey AND Devil May Cry 4 were released in February...Gee, don't you think..I don't know CHRISTMAS two months earlier had something to do with it?!? Of course it did! A lot of kids own a 360 aren't going to have parents running out to buy a new game after spending buku cash over the holidays.pielover666

Probably. I was at a Gamespot once & saw these kids trying to dig a game out of their Mom & she was complaining they had not finished the games she already bought them.

I'd say that creating awareness of JRPG games by putting them on the 360 console is a good way to build a following of fans that have not experienced the genre. I've rarely played JRPG games before coming from a PC game. I like being given the chance to try them.

[QUOTE="st1ka"]4

actually it is, your reply actually helped my case i proved that so far the 360´s unknown RPGS sold better then many of the more famous ips

NielsNL

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

st1ka

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

What's your point? That SE makes nice JRPG's? Did I deny that anywhere?

the point being that pretty much every non SE JRPG sells better on the 360 than they did on the PS2

But that has more to do with the way they've been presented on the 360 than with popularity of the JRPG genre in general. LEt me ask it like that then: my main point is that i truly think that te JRPG genre is more popular in general on the PS3 than on the 360. Do you agree or do you think it's more popular on the 360? If you agree we can pretty much end this discussion, since it's the point i've been trying to make, If you don't.. well then you're wrong!! :P

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

JLF1

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

What's your point? That SE makes nice JRPG's? Did I deny that anywhere?

exactly my point thank you

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

I always see you defending 360 / bashing PS3.

st1ka

i bash where i think it should be bashed i defend it when i think it should be defended

i look at the PS2 last gen and at the PS3 this gen and i think "what the hell happened"

i look at the xbox last gen and at the 360 this gen and i see improvements

i look at the gamecube last gen and the Wii this gen and i see improvements

also nince way to dodge my question ;)

So you have a preference meaning you're biased. But this is an easy argument, since true objectiveness doesn't exist of course. Everyone has his own point of view.

And I didn;t dodge a question, but apparently I missed one.

No i can't recall seeing you make these kind of threads. And if vgchartz numbers are considered facts nowadays you're using some facts here and there. See, i can be reasonable.. ;)

Sony owns $150 Million of Square Enix Stock, and that amounts to 8.5% of Square Enix. Source

Another 900 million will push them above 50%, making them the functional leaders of the company.

AmyMizuno

Sorny also uses Vista on their Sony VAIO & other laptops. What you are saying is nothing more than wishful thinking. The game developers at SE could walk out after a take-over. They get paid their stock options in a take-over after all & SE might have a poison pill in place to make sure they get even more cash in the event of a hostile takeover. Back to The Matrix..er, I mean reality.

[QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"] In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives. NielsNL

so far i dont agree with you

although i will tell you this: FF 13 will sell better on the PS3 i have no doubts about that

but on the other hand: no SE games will sell better on the 360

this is my prediction, call it a crystal ball prediction if you want

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]SE knows that Sony is not going to make them much money this gen.Delsage

Yeah cause CLEARLY the 360 is doing well in Japan where JRPG's sell the most. Plus with the sale figures the TC posted CLEARLY JRPG's are doing SO well on the Xbox 360.

Seriously dude, are you just kidding yourself? Not even one has broken a million.

It doesn't matter how it does in Japan. The cash cow is America. Otherwise, they wouldn't bother making JRPGs available to the 360. The Japanese game companies are in it to make money, right? They know where the money's at.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"]

In a situation where the choice was very limited that doesn't surprise me. The PS2 offered so many other RPG's at the time the ip's you mention were released that dilution of sales are inevitable. The 360 only has a couple of JRPG's. If that's your thing, it's the one you have to buy for lack of alternatives.

JLF1

and yet most if not all of the JRPGs that sold more then one million on the PS2 were either developed or published by square enix intersting heh?

What's your point? That SE makes nice JRPG's? Did I deny that anywhere?

Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here.

[QUOTE="AmyMizuno"]

Sony owns $150 Million of Square Enix Stock, and that amounts to 8.5% of Square Enix. Source

Another 900 million will push them above 50%, making them the functional leaders of the company.

jknight5422

Sorny also uses Vista on their Sony VAIO & other laptops. What you are saying is nothing more than wishful thinking. The game developers at SE could walk out after a take-over. They get paid their stock options in a take-over after all & SE might have a poison pill in place to make sure they get even more cash in the event of a hostile takeover. Back to The Matrix..er, I mean reality.

This is aimed at Amy...

SONY doesn't have the MONEY to buy SE...Sony is cancelling its in-house projects (8 days, getaway) and letting 3rd parties develop multiplat (not getting exclusive contracts) to cut costs and try to turn a profit. They are in no position to be buying studios.

[QUOTE="bphan"]This entire thread is ridiculous. Seriously, get over it already. FF 13 is coming to 360. The OP sounds like such a whiner and cry baby. Oh noes. Square is teh doomed cuz ff13 is teh goin to Xbox. hahaha.AmyMizuno

If Sorny sells out its share, Mr. Softy would pick it up. Nobody is going to try to screw with the FF franchise as it hurts their own sales of products & the fan base.

so far there are only 2 JRPGs on the PS3, Folklore and Disgaea 3 (correct me if im wrong) eternal sonata sold better then both of them

so far i dont agree with you

although i will tell you this: FF 13 will sell better on the PS3 i have no doubts about that

but on the other hand: no SE games will sell better on the 360

this is my prediction, call it a crystal ball prediction if you wantst1ka

There's also Enchanted Arms which sold better on the PS3 than on the 360. But that game sucks, so let's not consider it.

But you actually do agree with me. Why else would you think that SE games will sell better on PS3 than on 360? Or do you think that SE JRPG's are more popular on Sony systems than on 360 whereas other JRPG's aren't? That would be strange..

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"] I always see you defending 360 / bashing PS3. st1ka

Nothing wrong with bias. I prefer the PS3. Just don't claim you're objective if you know you're not.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"] Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here. st1ka

I think the media hype helped Halo a lot. Don't underestimate the power of good advertising.

Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here.

NielsNL

[QUOTE="AmyMizuno"][QUOTE="Danm_999"]

[QUOTE="AmyMizuno"][QUOTE="Jynxzor"]Wow this thread is entertaining, it's just a two way ownage fest served by Subro and Blackbond.Danm_999

If your so confident in your history as a debater, why not rebutt Blackbond's repeated reference to the claims you made about Star Ocean 4?

The proof is?

i agree there is no proof. But if you think about it, SE does not abandon japan. I'm sure that japan will get SO4 sooner or later. Companies love money no? This thread is indeed very business like lol.

[QUOTE="Nolan16"]i don't really understand how that could be a mistake having a multi plat as big as FF i mean 70% of north american owns a 360 over PS3.AmyMizuno

Square-Enix is:

1) Snubbing their nose in their third largest investor, Sony. If Sony wanted to harm Square Enix, they are in a position to do so by undervaluing their stock. This would be a bigger hit to Square-Enix than would be a bank failure.

2) Spending money on exclusive titles on the 360, which will not well well and will end up costing more money to make and port than they will return.

Maybe they just want to make a favour for gamers and they also get more profit, but I guess fanboys think I'm speaking in an alien language.

I agree TC for the most part, most of my freinds here in the UK own 360 Consoles.... guess what they have never played an RPG in there lives let alone a FF im talking of upwards of Twenty people not a huge number but it shows the trend somewhat of 360 owners.

Maybe this will change now with the introduction of a REAL FF to the 360 casual FPS/GTA4 Playing noobs, will be introduced to a different type of game for once in there boring i gotta have the popular sheep game way. Perhaps FF will kick off a wider appeal for RPGs in the rarther boring Madden/FPS/3rd Person Yankee world.

jwsoul

Say it again seeing as most plp here ARE YET again off target and 2 people seem to be ruling the thread WITH FFS SPAM.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"] so far there are only 2 JRPGs on the PS3, Folklore and Disgaea 3 (correct me if im wrong) eternal sonata sold better then both of them so far i dont agree with you although i will tell you this: FF 13 will sell better on the PS3 i have no doubts about that but on the other hand: no SE games will sell better on the 360 this is my prediction, call it a crystal ball prediction if you wantst1ka

I think the most JRPG fans are obviously from Japan. Considering that I find it highly doubtful that the 360 has most of them. But we can discuss this endlessly, alas there's no way of proving anything for both of us.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"] Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here. st1ka

[QUOTE="NielsNL"]

Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here.

JLF1

I don't like your tone. Stop calling people dumb.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"] so far there are only 2 JRPGs on the PS3, Folklore and Disgaea 3 (correct me if im wrong) eternal sonata sold better then both of them so far i dont agree with you although i will tell you this: FF 13 will sell better on the PS3 i have no doubts about that but on the other hand: no SE games will sell better on the 360 this is my prediction, call it a crystal ball prediction if you wantst1ka

For RPG's? Sales have shown us that RPG sales at lackluster at best for the install base on the 360 and I doubt FFXIII will radically change that. I still expect good sales, but nothing compared to the PS3 even in America.

Let it be known my crystal ball can see all!

Jynxzor

JRPGs on the 360 is breaking the stereotype that a JRPG must be enjoyed on a Japanese console. It's a start. Perhaps this is the shape of things to come.

[QUOTE="Delsage"]

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]SE knows that Sony is not going to make them much money this gen.jknight5422

Yeah cause CLEARLY the 360 is doing well in Japan where JRPG's sell the most. Plus with the sale figures the TC posted CLEARLY JRPG's are doing SO well on the Xbox 360.

Seriously dude, are you just kidding yourself? Not even one has broken a million.

It doesn't matter how it does in Japan. The cash cow is America. Otherwise, they wouldn't bother making JRPGs available to the 360. The Japanese game companies are in it to make money, right? They know where the money's at.

are we forgetting that M$ puts money down for these rpgs.

[QUOTE="Jynxzor"]

For RPG's? Sales have shown us that RPG sales at lackluster at best for the install base on the 360 and I doubt FFXIII will radically change that. I still expect good sales, but nothing compared to the PS3 even in America.

Let it be known my crystal ball can see all!

jknight5422

JRPGs on the 360 is breaking the stereotype that a JRPG must be enjoyed on a Japanese console. It's a start. Perhaps this is the shape of things to come.

The downfall of SE has been prophesied by many, their latest moves(supporting 360 exclusively with so many games that don't recoup costs) could be their demise.

Contrary to popular belief, MS doesn't have an infinite ammout of cash to keep paying for games that don't turn out profits and for SE to rely on MS as their sugar-daddy is a really bad decision(as It was when they released Spirits Whitin flop and went on Sony payroll, but the setting that time didn't troubled them).

Team Ninja has disolved and Mistwalk is jumping in the Nintendo bandwagon.

While 360 certainly has the best library and the best online service(altough I wouldn't pay for it no matter what) but MS way of doind business has a way of pissing a LOT of people.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"] [QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"] Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here. st1ka

I agree on that. But even if you leave out the mainstream JRPG's so to speak, I still think my previous argument considering mostly Japanese being the true JRPG fans indicative for my view that the PS3 must have more JRPG fans, relatively speaking. Don't forget the bigger install base of the 360 when using sales as an argument. And though we skipped over it previously, the fact that Enchanted Arms sold better on PS3, while it was out a year earlier on 360 which had an even larger user base relitve to PS3 at that time, is saying something.

[QUOTE="NielsNL"] [QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"][QUOTE="st1ka"] so far there are only 2 JRPGs on the PS3, Folklore and Disgaea 3 (correct me if im wrong) eternal sonata sold better then both of them so far i dont agree with you although i will tell you this: FF 13 will sell better on the PS3 i have no doubts about that but on the other hand: no SE games will sell better on the 360 this is my prediction, call it a crystal ball prediction if you wantst1ka

I doubt that.

[QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"] [QUOTE="st1ka"][QUOTE="NielsNL"] Comparing 2 jrpg's is dumb? The fact that you consider it like that is just saying how good ff is. But that's totally not the discussion here. NielsNL

by the way is anyone else having problem writing on the boards? i seem to be getting black messages when i write

Maybe you shouldn't start assuming again that you know what my educational background consists of. Last time you did that, it started a huge flame war and the moderators had to come in and delete the topic.

Anyway, takeovers aren't the same in Japan as they are in the United States because of the Keiretsu. Sony however, is not a part of the Keiretsu. Did you read what I said above, or are you just trying to troll?

AmyMizuno

It's not going to happen. Do you have any idea how weak it makes Sorny look to do something like that? They have to buy a game company to ward off Mr. Softy? I suppose Mr. Softy could just double the price of Vista for Sorny's laptops or remove the contract altogether. Sorny has a working relationship with Mr. Softy too. So they are in no position to sink Mr. Softy's battleship. They're all in bed together in different configurations.

SE says that they will treat all consoles fairly if my memory serves me right. We'll just see how this goes.

yes ti does say something, and you have a point, although i think i have proven that the stigma "JRPGS dont sell on the 360" is nonsese,this was my point

by the way is anyone else having problem writing on the boards? i seem to be getting black messages when i write

st1ka

You also have a point. Good we've got that sorted. :)

And I'm having no problems.

[QUOTE="st1ka"] like i said SE games will sell better on the PS3 non SE games will sell better on the 360 this is my predictionNielsNL

I doubt that.