What's with Western obssession of shooting games?

I have this feeling that everyone in this thread dismissing Western games as shallow has no real, in-depth experience with PC gaming.

Whats Japans obsession with putting GIANT swords in every game?EzcapeTheFate

It is a trend in our society right now, it says something about us as a culture. Here are my theories.

1) The rise of first person games has exploded, video games have become more and more mainstream as well. These days everyone is a gamer basically. The fact that more and more games are in a first person point of view represents people in our society looking to experience life in their own way, with their own eyes. The world is changing, the future is unclear, many of us are looking towards an uncertainty.

Do we just get office jobs or other 9-5 jobs like our parents? Or do we look for something more, something we as individuals want? First Person is a reflection of this. To be our own individuals, this is why games like Skyrim etc...are so popular now, first person and player freedom. Make who you want, work where you want, be what you want.

2) Guns and excessive violence can be pinned down for many reasons. Violence it's self is nothing new, there was violence in the ancient world, there was violence in our parents and grad parents time, there is violence in out time. It is an unfortuante part of human life, and IMO it won't ever end until God sends the Messiah. Gun obsession could represent a will to be empowered.

In our current age the people feel small, they feel helpless, they see a government system that is broken and corrupt and they don't feel there is much they can do about it. Guns are a symbol of power and defense, it impowers the indivudal (back to point 1), it gives them the ability to fight back. We have also become a less masculine society, we are often taught at an early age that guns are bad, and in some circles, things like hunting and whatnot are wrong. You tend to see this trend in more far left communities and extreame feminisem. Guns games are so popluar because it is a return to male masculinity, an escape from all the PC (political correctness) in society.

These are just my theories anyway. But culutral trends do represent and say things about people.

Because shooters have gentle learning curves.

Western gamers tend to have short attention spans. They're scared of games with "too many" menus. They're too lazy to learn how to play more complex games like RPGs.

Everyone is in a rush, they want to know how to play a game as soon as they pick up the controller. They don't want to have to take the time to learn how to play.

GeoffZak

What's with the Eastern obsession of pre teen girls w/ DD's that are half naked?

Or we could focus on the easts total lack of innovation in game design.

moistsandwich

Besides, it's not like Western games have any shortage of muscle-bound bald space marines or topless chicks...

I´m just confused as to why you quoted me, because I never tried to talk down Japanese gaming culture.DraugenCP

Right, because Final Fantasy X has so much depth and takes so much time to learn how to play.

This is ridiculous - most good first-person shooters do actually require and investment - games like Counter-Strike and Team Fortress 2 require you to learn about the map and about how the weapons work. Heck, if you want to be any good at Counter-Strike at all you have to learn the spray patterns. It's sure as hell a lot harder to get into CS than FFX, I'll tell you that much.PannicAtack

and dont forget early Rainbow six games, Ghost recon, SWAT, ARMA, OFP.. etc etc sure as hell take more skills than any japanese gameSNIPER4321

THE HARDEST VIDEO GAME BOSS EVER!

[QUOTE="Jag85"]

[QUOTE="SNIPER4321"]and dont forget early Rainbow six games, Ghost recon, SWAT, ARMA, OFP.. etc etc sure as hell take more skills than any japanese gameSNIPER4321

THE HARDEST VIDEO GAME BOSS EVER!

[QUOTE="SNIPER4321"][QUOTE="Jag85"]
Prepare to be proven completely and utterly wrong...

THE HARDEST VIDEO GAME BOSS EVER!

soulitane

I thought the debate was originally about complexity; not difficulty.

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]Not to act as though Sniper is in any way right, but aren't bullet hell games more about pattern recognition than "skill"?MrYaotubo

Read the following thread from last month where several posters (particularly Some-Mist and myself) have already explained why arcade bullet-hell shooters require much more "skill" than first-person shooters:

Which genre of video games requires the most skill?

Even beyond bullet-hell shooters, I would argue that arcade games in general require more "skill" than most console or computer games (whether Eastern or Western in origin). And that's simply because of the very nature of arcade gaming.

People like using guns. It's frowned upon to actually shoot real people with guns. Hence, shooting video games.

I'm afraid to say that both of you (as well as Sniper) are wrong...

Read the following thread from last month where several posters (particularly Some-Mist and myself) have already explained why arcade bullet-hell shooters require much more "skill" than first-person shooters:

Jag85

Did you explain how they require more skill in comparison to Call of Duty, or in comparison to Quake 3/Tribes/CS/UT?

[QUOTE="Jag85"]

I'm afraid to say that both of you (as well as Sniper) are wrong...

Read the following thread from last month where several posters (particularly Some-Mist and myself) have already explained why arcade bullet-hell shooters require much more "skill" than first-person shooters:

Ly_the_Fairy

Did you explain how they require more skill in comparison to Call of Duty, or in comparison to Quake 3/Tribes/CS/UT?

[QUOTE="heretrix"]

[QUOTE="GeoffZak"]

Western gamers tend to have short attention spans. They're scared of games with "too many" menus. They're too lazy to learn how to play more complex games like RPGs.

speedfreak48t5p

RTS games and MMOs say f*cking hello. You aren't smarter than anyone because you like overblown, treacly japanese soap operas.

I'm not obsessed with shooters.

I have this feeling that everyone in this thread dismissing Western games as shallow has no real, in-depth experience with PC gaming.

Ly_the_Fairy

This is fvcking hilarious. I'm looking at all the negative replies I'm getting and they're all practically saying the same thing. "Final Fantasy isn't all that complex." Hell, it's more complex than Call of Duty MW3 or Uncharted 3.

It's funny how everyone ignored my second post.

I just have one more thing to say:

This is fvcking hilarious. I'm looking at all the negative replies I'm getting and they're all practically saying the same thing. "Final Fantasy isn't all that complex." Hell, it's more complex than Call of Duty MW3 or Uncharted 3.

It's funny how everyone ignored my second post.

I just have one more thing to say:

GeoffZak

This is fvcking hilarious. I'm looking at all the negative replies I'm getting and they're all practically saying the same thing. "Final Fantasy isn't all that complex." Hell, it's more complex than Call of Duty MW3 or Uncharted 3.

It's funny how everyone ignored my second post.

I just have one more thing to say:

GeoffZak

[QUOTE="GeoffZak"]

This is fvcking hilarious. I'm looking at all the negative replies I'm getting and they're all practically saying the same thing. "Final Fantasy isn't all that complex." Hell, it's more complex than Call of Duty MW3 or Uncharted 3.

It's funny how everyone ignored my second post.

I just have one more thing to say:

heretrix

Shooters are a popular genre. But I'm pretty sure there are plenty of other genres.

What's with the Japanese obssession with weird sh!t?

They even turn games of other genre, which usually doesn't have shooting machanism, into shooting stuff.

nchan

Can you give me an example? Cause I honestly cant think of any...

What's with the Japanese obssession with weird sh!t?

OB-47

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

What's with the Japanese obssession with weird sh!t?

Bigboi500

This is fvcking hilarious. I'm looking at all the negative replies I'm getting and they're all practically saying the same thing. "Final Fantasy isn't all that complex." Hell, it's more complex than Call of Duty MW3 or Uncharted 3.GeoffZak

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

What's with the Japanese obssession with weird sh!t?

Bigboi500

That was just a response to the huge generalizationthat the OP made of Western tastes so I did the same to Japanese.

Doesn't feel good does it?

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

What's with the Japanese obssession with weird sh!t?

mems_1224

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

What's with the Japanese obssession with weird sh!t?

OB-47

That was just a response to the huge generalizationthat the OP made of Western tastes so I did the same to Japanese.

Doesn't feel good does it?

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]What's with the West's obsession of pointy-eared elves, shaved heads and sweaty man-muscles?

Bigboi500

That was just a response to the huge generalizationthat the OP made of Western tastes so I did the same to Japanese.

Doesn't feel good does it?

Very

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

That was just a response to the huge generalizationthat the OP made of Western tastes so I did the same to Japanese.

Doesn't feel good does it?

OB-47

Very

[QUOTE="OB-47"]

[QUOTE="Bigboi500"]It's all stupid isn't it?

Bigboi500

Very

True. People seriously need to stop being so stubborn.

Atleast it's changing though. Dark Souls has had huge success in the West, and an article I read ages ago in Edge said that Call of Duty MW2 did pretty decent in Japan.

JRPGs suck ass.JohnnyCageMK

[QUOTE="JohnnyCageMK"]JRPGs suck ass.Ghost120x

The problem are not shooters because shooters were always popular (starting with Space Invaders) and are a diverse genre (you got FPS, TPS, shmups, rail shooters, light gun shooters, ect.), the problem is that every other game today is a shooter that tries to mimic CoD in one way or another.

Now copycats are nothing new as every successful game tends to be copied a lot (there used to be an expression in the 90s - "Doom clones") and sometimes the copycat can turn out to be the better game or take the genre to yet unexplored areas.

So the real problem are generic, uninspired shooters who just rip on popular ones just for the sake of it (read: in expectiation of better sales).

Yeah, I once read there´s a saying in Japan that goes `Western game, sh!t game´.

DraugenCP

True. Japanese gamers started the trash-talking first by using the insult "kusoge" ("sh!t games") against Western games up until last gen, and now it's backfired with Western gamers insulting Japanese games in much the same way this gen. Their low opinion of Western games was somewhat justifiable at the time though, since Western developers were behind in technical terms, not to mention Japan dominated at least half the worldwide gaming market a decade ago. Nowadays though, Western games are slowly gaining popularity in Japan.

all of that stuff is still better than what japan is into. weird little cartoon girls with big boobs. guys that dress like girls and have stupid hair and all the other weird crap.

why cant japan make a game with good shooting mechanics or a good UI? mems_1224

True. People seriously need to stop being so stubborn.

Atleast it's changing though. Dark Souls has had huge success in the West, and an article I read ages ago in Edge said that Call of Duty MW2 did pretty decent in Japan.

OB-47

What's with the Eastern obsession of Slashing games?

[QUOTE="JohnnyCageMK"]JRPGs suck ass.Ghost120x

[QUOTE="Ghost120x"][QUOTE="JohnnyCageMK"]JRPGs suck ass.TheEroica

[QUOTE="DraugenCP"]

Yeah, I once read there´s a saying in Japan that goes `Western game, sh!t game´.

Jag85

True. Japanese gamers started the trash-talking first by using the insult "kusoge" ("sh!t games") against Western games up until last gen

Japanese call certain Japanese games kusoge too, it's not exclusive to western games.

Skyrim? Rock Band? Forza Motorsport? Madden? Need for Speed? Wipeout? Angry Birds? Little Big Planet? Motorstorm?lowe0

The problem are not shooters because shooters were always popular (starting with Space Invaders) and are a diverse genre (you got FPS, TPS, shmups, rail shooters, light gun shooters, ect.), the problem is that every other game today is a shooter that tries to mimic CoD in one way or another.

Now copycats are nothing new as every successful game tends to be copied a lot (there used to be an expression in the 90s - "Doom clones") and sometimes the copycat can turn out to be the better game or take the genre to yet unexplored areas.

So the real problem are generic, uninspired shooters who just rip on popular ones just for the sake of it (read: in expectiation of better sales).

nameless12345

Another point I'd add is that trends change over time. Up until the mid-90s, Japan was more obsessed with shooters than the West, since most shooters up until then were Japanese-developed (mostly in the form of 2D shooters and 3D light-gun shooters). Over time, Japan started losing interest in shooters just as the genre (mostly in the form of FPS games) was becoming even more popular in the West. It's not like shooters were always an exclusively Western "obsession".

Its the same shiit its been for 20 years. TheEroica

Wrong answer. WRPGs haven't evolved anymore than JRPGs have over the past 20 years.