[QUOTE="Cow4ever"][QUOTE="SaudiFury"] umm not just Abbas. i'm not naive. but i do not think Israel are being fair at all. Frankly. between you, Darkman, and Grape of Wrath. you are by far the most blind supporter and i cannot imagine ANY sort of fair deal for the Palestinians, the least of which a sustainable Palestinian state to form with the way you think or view things. mayceV

highly doubtful. What is your take on the refugee problem? and how will you make it fair for both sides? How would you tackle, Jeruslem? both sides have rights to it under international law. How will you make that fair to both sides? Also what are the borders to be based on? What will you do about the settlements? People say that its easy however If you want it the Easy way then Isreal is extremly sad in the end angered and probably shattered economically ( that''s going fully by the Internaional court). Its not something that can be fixed easily so don't jump to conclusions. There are millions of people on each side, human beings that both deserve rights. Anyone denying either side any rights is racist.

Oh ok I don't have a solution to the refugee solution. Well actually there is only one solution, a very limited number can come to Israel. Israel can compensate the rest but the arab states should compensate the Jewish refugees as well. Point is Israel would NEVER accept a big number of refugees. It doesn't matter if you think it's fair or not. They'll never do it because that can destroy Israel just as much as war.

Ok Jerusalem:

1) split temple mount 50/50: Dome of the rock (holiest place in Judaism) to Israel, Al-aksa mosque (3rd holiest place in Islam) to Palestine

2) split rest of the old city 50/50: Jewish quarter to Israel and muslim to Palestine. Split the rest to make it 50/50

3) split rest of holy basin 50/50

4) split rest of E.Jerusalem 50/50: Jewish neighborhoods to Israel and Arab neighborhoods to Palestine.

It's fair and a compromise from both really.

About the settlements Israel should be able to keep the big ones that doesn't severely hamper Palestinian freedom of movement or in any other way infringe on the state's sustainability. I don't know the exact details of every settlement but it shouldn't be too hard to implement. For example a settlement close to the green line should be able to be in Israel but not one in the middle of the WB. To put it with a very simple criteria.

The problem is the Jordan Valley really. And although unrelated to this Israel shouldn't give up on inch of the Golan.

[QUOTE="Cow4ever"]

[QUOTE="mayceV"]I know, however the religious ideology of Zionism is very flawed. People can convert into judaism and lots of people did when it spread all across asia to russia to China to East Europe over 2 meliniums ago so its hard to pinpoint who's a Jew in origin and who converted 2000 years ago. especially when the ethnecities range so widely- Kurdish Jews, Yemenite Jews, European Jews. mayceV

Actually I had a teacher from Lebanon and he had blue eyes.

right....

[QUOTE="Cow4ever"][QUOTE="mayceV"] Actually, if they did stop the settlements the peace process would move forward no prolem. Granted there are the rockets however with the peace negotiations on track action can be taken against the terrorism. Look at afghanistan and Iraq exremists eventualy give up when support for thier cause dwindles. Same thing will happen to hamas. If the peace process is put for and a state with rights to the people is the outcome then Hamas would loose all support especially if the state continues to grow economically. However continuing the settlements is halting long term peace and unstalbizing the region. Jordan is afraid that Isreal will dump its problems on them as proposed by a few in the Isreali government. Not good. the settlemnts have to stop if Isreal wants peace its as simple as that. mayceV

I know, however the religious ideology of Zionism is very flawed. People can convert into judaism and lots of people did when it spread all across asia to russia to China to East Europe over 2 meliniums ago so its hard to pinpoint who's a Jew in origin and who converted 2000 years ago. especially when the ethnecities range so widely- Kurdish Jews, Yemenite Jews, European Jews. mayceV

Actually I had a teacher from Lebanon and he had blue eyes.

[QUOTE="Darkman2007"][QUOTE="Redinko"]Its not shooting yourself in the foot, its normalizing relations by taking steps that will ultimitly lead to peace.. You attribute the reasons for violence as an inherint need to kill you because you are Jewish, Israeli ect... which, i guess, is eassier then looking at the actual actions taken by the Israeli government as the roots of this violence. Also, dont you think morally it is wrong for YOUR country to take such actions? Dont you see this as a stain against your country? Against the jewish state? mayceV