[QUOTE="Euroshinobi"]i really dont get how its so hard to understand, if you do not follow a religion, if you do not follow a certain god, you are atheist period, you can say you're agnostic, but you are still atheist until you follow a god agnostics are just "weak athiest"Theokhoth

It's debatable as to whether or not "weak atheism" actually exists (as demonstrated by Tennaged's continued debating), as it's an invention that popped up only in the last twenty-five years. Some people, including atheists, consider "weak atheism" to be nothing more than a cop-out.

There's really nothing to debate, in my opinion. Babies for example, do not have religious beliefs and could therefore be considered "weak atheists"

Another example would be savages or animals.

Yes..funny how you call the eternal suffering and torture of sinners the "bad place".Solid_Snake325

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]What an argument! Once you have something actually compelling to say, do come back and enlighten us. Over-simplifications will lead you nowhere.

But if you are just trying to say that based on Christianity, both atheists and agnostics are going to hell, then I agree.

If you are trying to "prove" the above by saying that atheists and agnostics are the same then I will tell you you are wrong. ;)

Teenaged

No, he is exactly right. Atheism and theism are states of belief, gnosticism and agnosticism are states of knowledge. Many agnostics are in fact atheists. The two words are not mutually exclusive.

[QUOTE="JabbaDaHutt30"][QUOTE="hiphops_savior"]If you don't believe that Jesus is the Messiah, and that he can save you from your sins, you'll die physically AND spiritually. Deny it all you want, because "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Romans 3:23 and "For the wages of sin is death..."Romans 6:23a. Therefore, the fact is, all have fallen short of God, no exceptions, and you'll die because of your sins. Why am I saying this? It's because I don't want to see you guys burn with the devil himself.hiphops_savior

[QUOTE="JabbaDaHutt30"]

[QUOTE="The_Versatile"]What a silly argument going back and forth here. Yes, atheism and agnosticism are basically the same thing. Just because an agnostic won't definitively say the magic words "There is no God", doesn't mean they hold any more belief than an atheist would in their heart that there is a chance for a God to exist. Why else do you think they don't believe in the first place? They'll believe it when they see it, just like an atheist would. The term "atheism" means - a lack of theism, or, being without theism. An agnostic is without theism, aren't they? I'd say so. An agnostic sits on the fence waiting for evidence to come along. An atheist takes a more assertive approach. When an athiest says, "There is no God", they're simply referring to, or openly rejecting, the Gods of worldly religions that they've been exposed to. But they're just like the agnostics, in that they'll believe in any God that reveals itself to them. Who wouldn't. You'd have to be an idiot not to. It's really only a diffference in personality types. Basically, agnosticism is weak atheism.Teenaged

You either believe it's true, or don't. You can say "I don't know for sure if it's true or not" - you still don't believe it's true.

Can you possibly tell me you know FOR SURE that there is a god.

[QUOTE="JabbaDaHutt30"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]Depends on why they're atheists, but in general, most likely.Theokhoth

Yep.

Depends on why they're atheists, but in general, most likely.Theokhoth

There is no "Bad" place sorry to say, christians are deluded, everyone in the world is an atheist, Why you ask ? well becausee there are hundreds of religions in the world a lot even came way before christianity, the christian god is just a carbon copy of several others, thus Christians are indeed atheist because they only believe in THERE GOD and not ANYONE ELSE's GOD, including ones that came before christ, haEuroshinobi

If you don't believe that Jesus is the Messiah, and that he can save you from your sins, you'll die physically AND spiritually. Deny it all you want, because "All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Romans 3:23 and "For the wages of sin is death..."Romans 6:23a. Therefore, the fact is, all have fallen short of God, no exceptions, and you'll die because of your sins. Why am I saying this? It's because I don't want to see you guys burn with the devil himself.hiphops_savior

[QUOTE="freshgman"]never. my family gets fed up and clean it usuallyJandurin