that's my only recourse if they take it back. I bought it end of june. Who knows if they will believe me though. From what MS was saying when they scan it at the store it shows up as banned or not once it's been banned.

But that's the point. I didn't mod this console. I bought it from a store and have the receipt. I haven't modded it at all. I just understand what they are doing...... What i'm saying is this is the problem with them doing what they are. For one they have no right to tamper with hardware that i purchased. Secondly they messed up and are actually wrong in this instance. I did not mod my console. I was just using that as an example because that's the whole problem with wha tthey are doing and why they are doing it. So they can control what you use and charge whatever they want. MS is not the law and they actually tampered with a persons console here who was not doing anything wrong. I'm out $300 because they think they are the law and messed up.

Let me put it this way. I have a console that ms has basically rendered completely useless because htey think i was doing something i wasn't. I have a crappy dvd drive. The disabled my harddrive with this update and banned me from live. It's now a banned console so i cant repair the dvd drive through them. Say I think I see you doing something that i dont agree with. It's my word against yours. Hypothetically speaking of course, I go over to your house and break your legs and disable you. You would think i was a psycho and was breaking the law right? Because that's how i feel. That's basicalyl what they did. The thing is MS knows it's not worth it to me. I could go get a lawyer and go after them but it's not worth the time and effort so they win and they know this. MS wins... It's just scary because what kind of precendence does this set? They are cutting out all 3rd parties and who's to say what they will do next? They control the pc market with their OS, and make the rules there as well. The government really needs to step in or something but MS has connections in high places. But MS basically has their police force on the net and makes their own rules. this is a console i purchased and own and they basically tampered with it . Thing is you call them they don't do anything about it. The internet doesn't follow the same rules as actual law and companies like microsoft can get away with it because noone else is up to speed.

i dont have a 3rd party harddrive though. I was just using that as an example. Because what ms is doing isnt abotu piracy. It's about stopping 3rd party use so they have complete control. i swapped this 360 out at a store and have a receipt. I bought it new and havent touched it. Maybe there was something wrong with it when i bought it. I have no idea. This is just scary to me. Who made Microsoft the law? They have way too much control to be able to do what they did here.

First off I am not a software pirate. I bought my system legally and own all my games. Somehow i got flagged for banning. I owned a 360 for 2 years without a problem. I traded mine in 4 monoths back because i wanted a ps3. I decided i didnt like the ps3 so returned it and got another 360.

Anyways I work in internet security and know about internet law. What amazes me is MS is actually going out and tampering with hardware disabling features such as being able to install games to the harddrive. Nevermind being banned from xbox live and not being able to install updates to my games that i purchased. I can't install games to the harddrive. They actually disabled this feature on my hardware that i purchased and own. I have a dvd player that skips sometimes and doesnt read discs too well because of ms's junky hardware as it is, so its crucial for me to be able to install games to the harddrive. This is absurd. What if my system was past warrenty and a part breaks? I'm not a computer idiot and its perfectly legal to install a 3rd party harddrive in a piece of hardware i own vs having to buy it from microsoft and spend whatever ridiculous price they charge. This is anticompetitive on their part and completely absurd. What's even worse is they broke into my network and tampered with hardware i own.

I called them today and explained my situation and spoke to a manager. I'm a completely honest hardworking person here. He told me they are weeding through a lot of cases right now and there are a lot of people they banned that shouldnt have been. But its going to take time before they unban me. His excuse and i quote himi was that this is for the greater good and so that microsoft can make their service better. What gave microsoft the right to decide what the greater good is to do with my money? I'm out $300 here because they broke into my home and disabled certain features of hardware i own. If this was a car, what they did is the equivalent of breaking into my car and disabling the breaking system because they think i was doing something i wasn't. This is the problem with microsoft. They are too powerful and think they are doing some greater good when they are actually messing with innocent people and i'm out $300 because they are criminals. I never agreed to allowing them to tamper with my hardware. Please explain to me how what they are doing isn't completely messed up? So I have hope they unban me when I did nothign wrong.

microsoft sucks.

[QUOTE="Walker34"]

[QUOTE="glesniak"]

Hey man, you agreed to the TOS and it clearly states that you allowed them to do this. Like I said, you just didnt read the fine print.

shawn7324

I also have every right to not agree and create a separate network that MS doesn't have access to and allows for open sourcing and doesn't spy on people. This is pretty much what linux is to windows. The problem is microsoft is getting so powerful people arent going to have a choice if they want to use the internet at all pretty soon. Stuff like thsi is setting a really bad precedent as companies like MS expand and control more of the internet.

You naive people realize this isn't about piracy or Microsoft doing some good deed here. This is a dirty game that microsoft plays and they are trying to cut out all 3rd parties and force people to use their hardware and their service. I realize this is just a video game system but it's the precedent that is bad. So your system breaks you have no other option other than to either replace your entire system or go through microsoft. This is about microsoft controlling the market and eliminating that choice and being able to charge whatever they want. So when you are wondering why things cost so much and you have no choice don't cry to me.

No i'm not. I'm against them scanning hardware. Like i said before they were monitoring what games were being played on live and if they caught you playinga pirated game they were banning people. They have every right to do that. Now they are crossing a line. I'm against the precedence this sets. All of it pretty much.

[QUOTE="Walker34"]

[QUOTE="Hotwire246"]Your hardware is hardly personal information... Infact its personal to them more than anyone.glesniak

It is personal information though. I own the hardware. I bought it. What they were doing before was fine. If you were playing illegal games on live and they see you doing it, they have every right to ban you. But now they are actually coming into my network and scanning my system. Say joe blow's harddrive breaks. His system is past warrenty. He's good with computers so he decides to swap it out and put in a bigger harddrive. He owns his xbox and it's his and has every right to do that and there is nothing illegal about it. He logs into xbox live. He does nothing illegal. HE doesnt even insert a game. live scans his system and bans him. Say joe blow is on a private network with crucial data to his business, and ms is actually invading that network and scanning hardware. Because that is what they are doing. I could understand if there was another option or choice or another online service. But there isn't. MS controls it and has a monopoly. So what is joe blow going to do? Just not play on xbox live? your damn right he isnt. I dont want ms scanning hardware in my network. If i had a choice id go somewhere else. What MS is doing is crossing a line. IT's scary really.

So what you are saying is you are blindly putting all your faith and trust in MS that their software is full proof and there are no bugs. This is microsoft we are talking about. So when someday you get banned because they glitched up and there is no recourse and you come crying to me because you can't play on live and there is no other option except spending another $300 and buying a new system.

YEah it's just a game system but this is setting a really bad precedent.

Hey man, you agreed to the TOS and it clearly states that you allowed them to do this. Like I said, you just didnt read the fine print.

I also have every right to not agree and create a separate network that MS doesn't have access to and allows for open sourcing and doesn't spy on people. This is pretty much what linux is to windows. The problem is microsoft is getting so powerful people arent going to have a choice if they want to use the internet at all pretty soon. Stuff like thsi is setting a really bad precedent as companies like MS expand and control more of the internet.

You naive people realize this isn't about piracy or Microsoft doing some good deed here. This is a dirty game that microsoft plays and they are trying to cut out all 3rd parties and force people to use their hardware and their service. I realize this is just a video game system but it's the precedent that is bad. So your system breaks you have no other option other than to either replace your entire system or go through microsoft. This is about microsoft controlling the market and eliminating that choice and being able to charge whatever they want. So when you are wondering why things cost so much and you have no choice don't cry to me.

Your hardware is hardly personal information... Infact its personal to them more than anyone.Hotwire246

It is personal information though. I own the hardware. I bought it. What they were doing before was fine. If you were playing illegal games on live and they see you doing it, they have every right to ban you. But now they are actually coming into my network and scanning my system. Say joe blow's harddrive breaks. His system is past warrenty. He's good with computers so he decides to swap it out and put in a bigger harddrive. He owns his xbox and it's his and has every right to do that and there is nothing illegal about it. He logs into xbox live. He does nothing illegal. HE doesnt even insert a game. live scans his system and bans him. Say joe blow is on a private network with crucial data to his business, and ms is actually invading that network and scanning hardware. Because that is what they are doing. I could understand if there was another option or choice or another online service. But there isn't. MS controls it and has a monopoly. So what is joe blow going to do? Just not play on xbox live? your damn right he isnt. I dont want ms scanning hardware in my network. If i had a choice id go somewhere else. What MS is doing is crossing a line. IT's scary really.

So what you are saying is you are blindly putting all your faith and trust in MS that their software is full proof and there are no bugs. This is microsoft we are talking about. So when someday you get banned because they glitched up and there is no recourse and you come crying to me because you can't play on live and there is no other option except spending another $300 and buying a new system.

YEah it's just a game system but this is setting a really bad precedent.

[QUOTE="Walker34"]

So pretty much microsoft is breaking and entering and spying on units that were purchased. Isn't that against the law what they are doing? I didn't mod my console but that's pretty unnerving. What if i had chosen to swap out the harddrive and put a larger one in there. I have every right to do that. It's my console. I bought it. If i want to void the warrenty that's my choice? There is nothing illegal about modding a console you own like microsoft will have you believe. What they are doing is actually illegal. If i don't want them spying on my console they have no right to do that. It's in my possesion and i own it. They are using xbox live to break the law. The problem is ms has so much money and control noone will challenge them on this. I work in internet security and what they are doing is really shady. IT's their network they can do what they want i guess. But stating it's illegal to mod consoles is a load of crap. I can throw my xbox against a brick wall if i want and there is nothing illegal about it. It's also not their network. They are actually sending information into my domain that i don't want.This is MS using the system to make more money for themselves. So if their tracking/spying software is buggy and someone gets a ban who didn't do anything wrong that's pretty piss poor that innocent people will suffer because MS is really incompetant. For those of you who say more power to microsoft, you are really naive and obviously dont give two **** about human rights. If there was another service that i could play online with a game console in peace that would be another story but there isn't. MS forces you to use xbox live if you want to play online.

Hotwire246

They are though. they are retrieving hardware information . They have no right to do that. This new software they just installed on my system does checks on hardware and retrieves personal information. It isn't watching for illegal activity. Thats what were doing before. This new update just scans your hardware the minute you log into xbox live and if it sees anything out of whack your console is banned.