Well be out of resources in 200 years.
Still_Vicious' forum posts
@hillelslovak said:
@still_vicious said:
@hillelslovak said:
@still_vicious said:
I like how you completely changed to topic to avoid my facts. Dishonest ;).
People are paid according to their value in the market, supply and demand, minimum wage puts a floor on what people must be paid.
You shouldn't have kids if you're living on minimum wage, it's really that simple. Stop expecting people to pay for the mistakes of others, maybe instead you should be asking people to take some personal responsibility as wrap it. But teh evil corperation is out to getchu and stuffs; hey maybe if you're 29 and have no skills and have kids, then you fucked up royally, it's your fault that your life is shit because you wasted many many years not studying, not building skills or networks, or even purely job experience. If you are workng minimum wage at 29, then you deserve it, plain and simple. bu bu teh corporations and teh ceos are so greedy! Who cares? Them being more generous doesn't make a skill-less 29 year old any more valuable and doesn't magically mean he/she didn't **** up royally to get where they are.
Harsh truth: you are worth what you produce, and if you have no skills you don't produce much.
My original point still stands though. The system is broken, you make way too much money off of gov't assistance (50k+).
How am I being dishonest, I did not change any subject. God damn you are crass as hell.
How does supply and demand and market value per employee dictate wages? That makes no sense. Profits rise and fall, inflation increases and decreases, and wages stagnate. Supply and demand dictates profits.
Do you not realize that people can have kids, and maybe lose a higher paying job, then have to take low wage jobs? Low minimum wages are not th eproblem at root, they are a symptom. Lack of oversight and regulation in business results in the centralization of wealth. This is an obvious and natural course. Your dismissal of this point is to paint an entirely simplistic red herring of evil corporations out to get you.
And once again, damn are you callous. You sound like a real Ayn Rand type, f everyone else, they are weak.
If government gives out too much money in assistance, lets take the course you seem to want and lower it off to nothing. We get a homeless epidemic, and the ideal of our very country is thrown away. You might be tempted to just say screw them, they deserve to live like animals. Or maybe you take the view that they can all pull themselves up by their bootstraps. How do they get jobs? We are talking millions of new minimum wage jobs that need to be opened up. Where are these jobs? We spent 2008-2010 in a huge recession, and since our financial sector is still extremely shaky at best, how does our insanely overburdened economy compensate for all the demand for workers?
I was being a smart ass since you misused the word dishonest. U did change the subject though, I started talking about how social programs are too generous, and in some states you can make more than 50k a year by doing nothing.
If somebody is in demand, say an engineer, they get paid more, since there are fewer engineers out there than average people, they get paid more. High demad, low supply, very simple. Let's look at mcdonalds workers, it's very easy to find them as anybody can do the job, and it. Therefore high supply decreases the demand. Lower wagess.
Teh evil corporations. You keep revisiting that. There's more to the economy than teh evil corperations. If he had a higher paying job, than he should have been able to save up money, he should have gained skills that would get him another well paying job. It's very simple, if he was responsible, saved money and invested in himself time to learn new skills, than there would be an issue.
Reality is harsh, but it's reality, you aren't doing youself favors by pretending that it's not true. The world does not care about you, it only cares what it can get from you, and what it can get from you determines your value. It doesn't have to be money, but it does have to benefit people. Some people are worth more than others, get over it.
I never said lower it off to nothing. You're making assumptions. However, maybe if social programs weren't bogging down businesses and the government, than both could create jobs when needed lmao.
To be honest, you sound like you view things in an overly simplistic, cut and dry fashion that does not take variables into account. I dont see your simplicity as being indicative of sophistication. Ayn Rand like.
Again, I was not relying on evil corporations as a debate tactic. I merely stated that you attempt to discredit an argument made against your position by throwing a red herring into the mix, as if I am being overly immature, making statements about evil corporations out to get the common man. I articulated it in my previous post, and there, again. You dont seem to take into account the fact that their are indeed factor of greed that cause wages to stagnate. If a corporation can get away with paying you less, why would they not? A corporation is not a person, it is an amoral construct. It;s not evil or good, per se. Corporations lobby to keep wages lower, along with keeping regulations lax, using loopholes to escape taxes and receive subsidies, etc etc etc. That is the nature of business. That doesnt mean wages should be as low as they are. Wealth continues to be concentrated more and more, each and every year. Supply and demand is not at all the only factor in determining wages. Specialization will cause someone to be more in demand, of course, but you are painting an extremely simplistic picture.
So you have any idea how many hundreds of billions go into government subsidies? Damn dude, if our country is going to go bankrupt, would you not want to be part of a society that went bankrupt trying to help it's citizens, and world citizenry as an extension, or be the country that gave the majority of it's money to literally a few thousand people while pursuing war after war in order to ensure the stability of these interests?
Some people are worth more than others. That clinches it, Ayn Rand philosophy.
You keep changing the subject. You do seem to have a weird habit of going off on tangents rather than addresseing the original subject, even indirectly. I'll repeat it again, you can make 50k by not working in many states because the system is so broken.
You are being over immature, and you are making statements about "teh evil corporations" as you've said. You say My argument is simple, but you've literally blamed every problem brought up on corporations. Even in this quote you rant about loohoes and greed while adding nothing to the original topic; I get it you don't like the businesses that drive the economy, blaiming everything on an outside evil, rather than saying that maybe it's a matter of the value of the individual or personal responsibility.
I'm aware that bad programs and ideologies that produce laziness and selfishness over practicality will bankrupt this country. Ironically, that's you "help the populace" ideology. In order to help some people you have to stop helping and let them do it for themselves, otherwise you create a system where people can make 50k a year not working. Also, again with the corporations.....
Some people are worth more than others, you'd have to be incredibly dumb to believe all people are equal. But please explain to me how somebody with 20 years of engineering experience is equal in value to somebody just entering the job market. I'll wait for you to call my ayn rand again.
@lamprey263 said:
@still_vicious said:
@lamprey263: Maybe there's a reasonable answer, but, couldn't the person just read all day?
Maybe take a few classes and then basically have 40 hours of pure study time a week?
that would probably be a violation of company policy, they're probably prohibited in occupying their free time as they see fit
and since they're whole goal is to let go of someone without providing unemployment, severance, or health insurance, and other perks, they could probably let someone go for disciplinary reasons if they chose to bring books to read to work when their job is to simply stare at a white wall in a quiet room for 8 hours.
I'm thinking get books to discretely read on one's phone lol
We're about to go into a recession.
dun dun dun dramatic reverb....
@lamprey263: Maybe there's a reasonable answer, but, couldn't the person just read all day?
Maybe take a few classes and then basically have 40 hours of pure study time a week?
I did see one study that said as many as 50% of all rape cases, the "victim" was lying.
In this day and age that's pretty sad. I do expect that as we see more and more of this, it will end up watering down the claim of "rape" or "hate speech".
"officer he raped me"
"yeah right, he probably just touched your shoulder" ;)
Kinda
@datruth said:
@hitomo said:
@datruth said:
Taking away these programs, or reduce them and I believe the crime rate will go up.
you shouldnt abuse These poor People for your fake charity, if the only reason you do it is because you cant overcome your personal anxietys without throughing money at something ... I gave Money, I am save now
not working like dat ^^
I'm not talking about poor people. I specifically talked about people who have checked out of the contract of our society. Please reread my comment. Also, I can't exactly stop giving these people money. It's a tax, so I minus well feel good about it. (sarcasm) Call it fake charity if you want. I want to ask you a question. Take away welfare and what do these people who don't want to work do? And to be clear, I'm not talking about the majority of people who use welfare for a leg up. Specifically talking about people who abuse the system. Do you think they all suddenly decide to work?
Simple, if you are able to contribute but actively choose not to, then no food or money for you.
@Nuck81 said:
@still_vicious said:
@toast_burner said:
@still_vicious said:
I like how you completely changed to topic to avoid my facts. Dishonest ;).
People are paid according to their value in the market, supply and demand, minimum wage puts a floor on what people must be paid.
You shouldn't have kids if you're living on minimum wage, it's really that simple. Stop expecting people to pay for the mistakes of others, maybe instead you should be asking people to take some personal responsibility as wrap it. But teh evil corperation is out to getchu and stuffs; hey maybe if you're 29 and have no skills and have kids, then you fucked up royally, it's your fault that your life is shit because you wasted many many years not studying, not building skills or networks, or even purely job experience. If you are workng minimum wage at 29, then you deserve it, plain and simple. bu bu teh corporations and teh ceos are so greedy! Who cares? Them being more generous doesn't make a skill-less 29 year old any more valuable and doesn't magically mean he/she didn't **** up royally to get where they are.
Harsh truth: you are worth what you produce, and if you have no skills you don't produce much.
My original point still stands though. The system is broken, you make way too much money off of gov't assistance (50k+).
So if you have a well paid job and then have some kids, but you then lose your job, you should what? Kill your children?
lol, if you have developed skills to get a new job, and saved money as you should, there should be no problem.
See what happens when people take responsibility for their actions?
A child who has yet to enter the workforce lecturing people about responsibility is hilarious
I'm in the workforce. Been in it for a while. I responsibly save up the majority of my paycheck too.
@hillelslovak said:
@still_vicious said:
@hillelslovak said:
@still_vicious said:
@hillelslovak said:
Are you for raising wages then?
I'm for paying somebody what supply and demand justify.
What does supply and demand have to do with laws regarding minimum wages, and how they havent risen even close to inflation of the currency? The average age of Mcdonalds, per your example, is 29. Many people at age 29 have families to support. They cannot support their families, while the ceos of corporations make on average 204 times that of their average worker.
If wages keep stagnating, while inflation keeps rising, how are people supposed to live on the minimum wage?
I like how you completely changed to topic to avoid my facts. Dishonest ;).
People are paid according to their value in the market, supply and demand, minimum wage puts a floor on what people must be paid.
You shouldn't have kids if you're living on minimum wage, it's really that simple. Stop expecting people to pay for the mistakes of others, maybe instead you should be asking people to take some personal responsibility as wrap it. But teh evil corperation is out to getchu and stuffs; hey maybe if you're 29 and have no skills and have kids, then you fucked up royally, it's your fault that your life is shit because you wasted many many years not studying, not building skills or networks, or even purely job experience. If you are workng minimum wage at 29, then you deserve it, plain and simple. bu bu teh corporations and teh ceos are so greedy! Who cares? Them being more generous doesn't make a skill-less 29 year old any more valuable and doesn't magically mean he/she didn't **** up royally to get where they are.
Harsh truth: you are worth what you produce, and if you have no skills you don't produce much.
My original point still stands though. The system is broken, you make way too much money off of gov't assistance (50k+).
How am I being dishonest, I did not change any subject. God damn you are crass as hell.
How does supply and demand and market value per employee dictate wages? That makes no sense. Profits rise and fall, inflation increases and decreases, and wages stagnate. Supply and demand dictates profits.
Do you not realize that people can have kids, and maybe lose a higher paying job, then have to take low wage jobs? Low minimum wages are not th eproblem at root, they are a symptom. Lack of oversight and regulation in business results in the centralization of wealth. This is an obvious and natural course. Your dismissal of this point is to paint an entirely simplistic red herring of evil corporations out to get you.
And once again, damn are you callous. You sound like a real Ayn Rand type, f everyone else, they are weak.
If government gives out too much money in assistance, lets take the course you seem to want and lower it off to nothing. We get a homeless epidemic, and the ideal of our very country is thrown away. You might be tempted to just say screw them, they deserve to live like animals. Or maybe you take the view that they can all pull themselves up by their bootstraps. How do they get jobs? We are talking millions of new minimum wage jobs that need to be opened up. Where are these jobs? We spent 2008-2010 in a huge recession, and since our financial sector is still extremely shaky at best, how does our insanely overburdened economy compensate for all the demand for workers?
I was being a smart ass since you misused the word dishonest. U did change the subject though, I started talking about how social programs are too generous, and in some states you can make more than 50k a year by doing nothing.
If somebody is in demand, say an engineer, they get paid more, since there are fewer engineers out there than average people, they get paid more. High demad, low supply, very simple. Let's look at mcdonalds workers, it's very easy to find them as anybody can do the job, and it. Therefore high supply decreases the demand. Lower wagess.
Teh evil corporations. You keep revisiting that. There's more to the economy than teh evil corperations. If he had a higher paying job, than he should have been able to save up money, he should have gained skills that would get him another well paying job. It's very simple, if he was responsible, saved money and invested in himself time to learn new skills, than there would be an issue.
Reality is harsh, but it's reality, you aren't doing youself favors by pretending that it's not true. The world does not care about you, it only cares what it can get from you, and what it can get from you determines your value. It doesn't have to be money, but it does have to benefit people. Some people are worth more than others, get over it.
I never said lower it off to nothing. You're making assumptions. However, maybe if social programs weren't bogging down businesses and the government, than both could create jobs when needed lmao.
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