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#101 1PMrFister

Member since 2010 • 3134 Posts

[QUOTE="dvader654"]Ok I read that discs will not be required after installation. This makes it mandatory that MS impose a charge or that disc would simply be used by a bunch of people to install and pass it on. This means the fee will be considerable, it practically has to be the full price of the game, cause if not one friend can buy a game and all friends could own it for a cheaper price. Now in terms of used games it kills them. There would be zero resale value for the disc. Wow this plan is pure evil.

Do you have a source for this?

11 years ago

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#103 GodModeEnabled

Member since 2005 • 15314 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Look. If you were to buy 100 xbox one games and the next xbox was not B/C then sucks to be you. If you bought 100 games on Steam then the difference is they most likely work on your new PC and the one after that and the one after that. I play old PC games all the time and it is great because of the wide availability of mods that improve on the graphics and gameplay of the original games. I am playing System Shock 2 for the first time at the moment and there are mods to upgrade the graphics and everything else. Steam is the face of PC gaming, the face of digital gaming, and insanely profitable. Maybe it goes out of business in the future? I can't see how. Even if some crazy catastrophe happens and this comes to pass you would be able to download all your games and play them offline, they have already said they can do things like that. They are turning console gaming into PC gaming, you just got to open your eyes a bit. Console gaming is dying, and it is happening right now.

I'll explain myself better: DD will not go out of business, Steam will. It will be replaced by something better that will muscle Steam out of business, and when that happens all the games you bought off Steam will be gone. It says so in the EULA. they know it will happen and they made you agree to it when you installed Steam. And you are 100% right: console gaming is going to shit, and that's because it's trying to be like PC gaming, which has been shit for many years.

Wow man you are f*cked. I can't even talk to you about this and take you seriously, i'm out.

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#105 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="fl4tlined"]please quote the EULA exactly where "It will be replaced by something better that will muscle Steam out of business, and when that happens all the games you bought off Steam will be gone." is found please.. also please give any evidence of steam pulling shady business and screwing over their customers.. Rather then of course giving free dlc to games such as team fortress and making it free to play and giving a podium for people to vote good indy games onto steam giving them a great place to take off on..

Of course it doesn't use those same words. Here: A. Term. The term of this Agreement (the "Term") commences on the date you first indicate your acceptance of these terms, and will continue in effect until otherwise terminated in accordance with this Agreement. The above statement is valid for all cases of cessation of service, be it termination by Valve, termination by you or simple cessation of service. Oh and by the way "YOU UNDERSTAND THAT YOU AND VALVE ARE GIVING UP THE RIGHT TO SUE IN COURT AND TO HAVE A TRIAL BEFORE A JUDGE OR JURY." (I didn't add the capitals, that's how Valve put it in the EULA you signed)

11 years ago

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#107 S0lidSnake

Member since 2002 • 29001 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Look. If you were to buy 100 xbox one games and the next xbox was not B/C then sucks to be you. If you bought 100 games on Steam then the difference is they most likely work on your new PC and the one after that and the one after that. I play old PC games all the time and it is great because of the wide availability of mods that improve on the graphics and gameplay of the original games. I am playing System Shock 2 for the first time at the moment and there are mods to upgrade the graphics and everything else. Steam is the face of PC gaming, the face of digital gaming, and insanely profitable. Maybe it goes out of business in the future? I can't see how. Even if some crazy catastrophe happens and this comes to pass you would be able to download all your games and play them offline, they have already said they can do things like that. They are turning console gaming into PC gaming, you just got to open your eyes a bit. Console gaming is dying, and it is happening right now.GodModeEnabled

I'll explain myself better: DD will not go out of business, Steam will. It will be replaced by something better that will muscle Steam out of business, and when that happens all the games you bought off Steam will be gone. It says so in the EULA. they know it will happen and they made you agree to it when you installed Steam. And you are 100% right: console gaming is going to shit, and that's because it's trying to be like PC gaming, which has been shit for many years.

Wow man you are f*cked. I can't even talk to you about this and take you seriously, i'm out.

Yup you are losing it BlackKnight.

You need to buy a PC because you have no idea what you are talkng about.

I agree with you that Steam could potentially go out of business and render all the games unplayable but even GME conceded that improbable possibility. The rest of what you've said is bonkers. Stop right now and educate yourself some more on PC gaming. It doesnt look good on you.

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#108 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

Wow man you are f*cked. I can't even talk to you about this and take you seriously, i'm out.GodModeEnabled

Why man? I just agreed with what you said. I simply added that PC gaming has had DRM, activation codes, DLC and all the shit we complain about consoles today for a longer time.

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"]please quote the EULA exactly where "It will be replaced by something better that will muscle Steam out of business, and when that happens all the games you bought off Steam will be gone." is found please.. also please give any evidence of steam pulling shady business and screwing over their customers.. Rather then of course giving free dlc to games such as team fortress and making it free to play and giving a podium for people to vote good indy games onto steam giving them a great place to take off on..

Of course it doesn't use those same words. Here: A. Term. The term of this Agreement (the "Term") commences on the date you first indicate your acceptance of these terms, and will continue in effect until otherwise terminated in accordance with this Agreement. The above statement is valid for all cases of cessation of service, be it termination by Valve, termination by you or simple cessation of service. Oh and by the way "YOU UNDERSTAND THAT YOU AND VALVE ARE GIVING UP THE RIGHT TO SUE IN COURT AND TO HAVE A TRIAL BEFORE A JUDGE OR JURY." (I didn't add the capitals, that's how Valve put it in the EULA you signed)

every EULA you sign basically says you can't sue them if you accept it.. and what you showed me was nothing more then the EULA stating that it last until terminated.. nowhere do i see losing all my games mentioned.. give me different evidence please this time something more direct and concrete

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#110 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="fl4tlined"] every EULA you sign basically says you can't sue them if you accept it.. and what you showed me was nothing more then the EULA stating that it last until terminated.. nowhere do i see losing all my games mentioned.. give me different evidence please this time something more direct and concrete

That's as direct and concrete as it need to be if you only use your brain that mama gave you: if your account is terminated what happens? You lose all the licenses to your games, yes or no? Can you seek compensation from Valve if that happens? No. What else do you need? Oh and most services do that you say? Cool, nothing we didn't know already.: Steam is just one of many.

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Wow man you are f*cked. I can't even talk to you about this and take you seriously, i'm out.Black_Knight_00

Why man? I just agreed with what you said. I simply added that PC gaming has had DRM, activation codes, DLC and all the shit we complain about consoles today for a longer time.

pc games also go on discount and sale alot more and for alot less then console games. for instance i bought metro for only 30 dollars off greenman gaming. microsoft forces people to charge for dlc such as when they wanted to make some of the gears of war dlc free but microsoft wouldnt let them.. unlike pc gaming which allows the company to decide and choose how to run things (such as Projekt red making all dlc free and no drm.) it gets so bad patching even cost money. such as when a game breaking glitch was in fez and microsoft wouldnt let them patch it out unless they paid a shit ton of money unlike the pc version.

11 years ago

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#112 GodModeEnabled

Member since 2005 • 15314 Posts

[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Wow man you are f*cked. I can't even talk to you about this and take you seriously, i'm out.Black_Knight_00

Why man? I just agreed with what you said. I simply added that PC gaming has had DRM, activation codes, DLC and all the shit we complain about consoles today for a longer time.

I explained already though that it works differently on am open platform than on a closed one. I am not trying to be a dick but please read my previous post(s) a bit more. I am not trying to say anything bad about you because I think you are generally an awesome poster it's just in the interest of mutual respect I have to back out of this conversation with you due to your underlying prejudices and misconceptions about PC gaming. I am a horrible teacher and just don't have the patience to educate you, if you are interested I explained it in a previous post.

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"] every EULA you sign basically says you can't sue them if you accept it.. and what you showed me was nothing more then the EULA stating that it last until terminated.. nowhere do i see losing all my games mentioned.. give me different evidence please this time something more direct and concrete

That's as direct and concrete as it need to be if you only use your brain that mama gave you: if your account is terminated what happens? You lose all the licenses to your games, yes or no? Can you seek compensation from Valve if that happens? No. What else do you need? Oh and most services do that you say? Cool, nothing we didn't know already.: Steam is just one of many.

where is the licenses for my games anywhere in what you stated?

11 years ago

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#114 1PMrFister

Member since 2010 • 3134 Posts

[QUOTE="1PMrFister"][QUOTE="dvader654"]Ok I read that discs will not be required after installation. This makes it mandatory that MS impose a charge or that disc would simply be used by a bunch of people to install and pass it on. This means the fee will be considerable, it practically has to be the full price of the game, cause if not one friend can buy a game and all friends could own it for a cheaper price. Now in terms of used games it kills them. There would be zero resale value for the disc. Wow this plan is pure evil.dvader654

Do you have a source for this?

The verge article on this, they got it from wired.

Just read that article. Christ, the Xbox One is sounding more and more like a gaming system straight out of 1984, and I'm not referring to the calendar year.

11 years ago

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Member since 2013 • 352 Posts

After reading about the Xbox One reveal, I am heavily leaning towards getting a PS4.

11 years ago

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#116 ThaneKrios28

Member since 2013 • 1551 Posts

[QUOTE="dvader654"][QUOTE="1PMrFister"] Do you have a source for this?1PMrFister

The verge article on this, they got it from wired.

Just read that article. Christ, the Xbox One is sounding more and more like a gaming system straight out of 1984, and I'm not referring to the calendar year.

sounds more like a ea system with the lame excuses and crappy promotion. this is going to become ea's wetdream for a microtransaction system

11 years ago

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#117 Floppy_Jim

Member since 2007 • 25933 Posts

The used game fee stuff has been debunked

945245_10200813484246901_1790377615_n.jp

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#118 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"]
[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"]Wow man you are f*cked. I can't even talk to you about this and take you seriously, i'm out.GodModeEnabled

Why man? I just agreed with what you said. I simply added that PC gaming has had DRM, activation codes, DLC and all the shit we complain about consoles today for a longer time.

I explained already though that it works differently on am open platform than on a closed one. I am not trying to be a dick but please read my previous post(s) a bit more. I am not trying to say anything bad about you because I think you are generally an awesome poster it's just in the interest of mutual respect I have to back out of this conversation with you due to your underlying prejudices and misconceptions about PC gaming. I am a horrible teacher and just don't have the patience to educate you, if you are interested I explained it in a previous post.

I get that, games can be modded and tweaked and that's awesome, I've gamed on PC for 15 years for pete's sake. But: unless there was a second coming of jesus in PC gaming in the last 3 years I've been out of the loop, the fact remains that most older games have problems to run unless they have been retooled. For instance: a 1999 game is optimized for old Direct3D cards that no longer exist and getting it to run is a pain in the neck. Hell, if I want to run Monkey Island 3 on a Win XP PC I need to hold directx at gunpoin through dxdiagt, I don't even want to imagine what it must be on Win 8 (unless: second coming of christ) I want to play Tenchu, I just hook up my PS1 and I'm good to go. It's a simple matter of convenience man.

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

The used game fee stuff has been debunked
Floppy_Jim

and the plot thickens...

11 years ago

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#120 Shinobishyguy

Member since 2006 • 22928 Posts

Well I gotta hand it to Microsoft, they actually managed to make the Wii U look better by comparison.

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="GodModeEnabled"][QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"] Why man? I just agreed with what you said. I simply added that PC gaming has had DRM, activation codes, DLC and all the shit we complain about consoles today for a longer time.Black_Knight_00

I explained already though that it works differently on am open platform than on a closed one. I am not trying to be a dick but please read my previous post(s) a bit more. I am not trying to say anything bad about you because I think you are generally an awesome poster it's just in the interest of mutual respect I have to back out of this conversation with you due to your underlying prejudices and misconceptions about PC gaming. I am a horrible teacher and just don't have the patience to educate you, if you are interested I explained it in a previous post.

I get that, games can be modded and tweaked and that's awesome, I've gamed on PC for 15 years for pete's sake. But: unless there was a second coming of jesus in PC gaming in the last 3 years I've been out of the loop, the fact remains that most older games have problems to run unless they have been retooled. For instance: a 1999 game is optimized for old Direct3D cards that no longer exist and getting it to run is a pain in the neck. Hell, if I want to run Monkey Island 3 on a Win XP PC I need to hold directx at gunpoin through dxdiagt, I don't even want to imagine what it must be on Win 8 (unless: second coming of christ) I want to play Tenchu, I just hook up my PS1 and I'm good to go. It's a simple matter of convenience man.

seriously unless you have some incredibly obscure game it's incredibly likely to be either available on GMG or have a mod associated with it... even then what happens if say your console does not work anymore to play that game? or the disc gets scratched like with many games that sit for a long time

11 years ago

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#122 ThaneKrios28

Member since 2013 • 1551 Posts

The used game fee stuff has been debunked
Floppy_Jim

im sorry but any company will lie to simply try to calm a angry fanbase down i have a really bad bad bad feeling everything we fear will be revealed at e3 and instead of games we get some lame demonstration of another bs sports package

11 years ago

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#123 c_rakestraw Moderator

Member since 2007 • 14627 Posts

The used game fee stuff has been debunkedFloppy_Jim

Huh. That was a quick turn-around.

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#124 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

where is the licenses for my games anywhere in what you stated?fl4tlined

When you buy a game off Steam, what are you buying?

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="fl4tlined"]where is the licenses for my games anywhere in what you stated?Black_Knight_00

When you buy a game off Steam, what are you buying?

A license to play the game... and your point is..

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#127 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"]where is the licenses for my games anywhere in what you stated?fl4tlined

When you buy a game off Steam, what are you buying?

A license to play the game... and your point is..

When your account is terminated, what happens to your license?

11 years ago

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#128 c_rakestraw Moderator

Member since 2007 • 14627 Posts

I knew it!! I am right again. Do I know this industry or what. So what do you guys believe now?dvader654

Sorry for doubting you, vader. Won't happen again.

11 years ago

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#129 S0lidSnake

Member since 2002 • 29001 Posts

[QUOTE="dvader654"]I knew it!! I am right again. Do I know this industry or what. So what do you guys believe now?c_rake

Sorry for doubting you, vader. Won't happen again.

Yeah. dvader was right.

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#130 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="c_rake"]
[QUOTE="dvader654"]I knew it!! I am right again. Do I know this industry or what. So what do you guys believe now?S0lidSnake

Sorry for doubting you, vader. Won't happen again.

Yeah. dvader was right.

If microsoft were anywhere near competent we wouldn't have to sit here guessing. if the were competent they would have said at the conference "We've read the rumors too: they are false" BAM, done. But nope.

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"][QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"] When you buy a game off Steam, what are you buying?

A license to play the game... and your point is..

When your account is terminated, what happens to your license?

I don't know the company has'nt reached that point yet...

11 years ago

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#132 c_rakestraw Moderator

Member since 2007 • 14627 Posts

If microsoft were anywhere near competent we wouldn't have to sit here guessing. if the were competent they would have said at the conference "We've read the rumors too: they are false" BAM, done. But nope.Black_Knight_00

You expect too much from them.

Makes me wonder, though: how long ago did Wired receive their debriefing on the Xbox One? They seemed confident in their report. Can't imagine they would purposefully get their facts wrong.

11 years ago

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#133 gamingqueen

Member since 2004 • 31076 Posts

[QUOTE="S0lidSnake"]
[QUOTE="c_rake"]
Sorry for doubting you, vader. Won't happen again.
Black_Knight_00

Yeah. dvader was right.

If microsoft were anywhere near competent we wouldn't have to sit here guessing. if the were competent they would have said at the conference "We've read the rumors too: they are false" BAM, done. But nope.

Waiting for game companies to offer a higher price for including pass/activation code...

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#134 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="fl4tlined"][QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"] A license to play the game... and your point is..

When your account is terminated, what happens to your license?

I don't know the company has'nt reached that point yet...

Your licenses are lost along with your account.

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#135 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"]If microsoft were anywhere near competent we wouldn't have to sit here guessing. if the were competent they would have said at the conference "We've read the rumors too: they are false" BAM, done. But nope.c_rake

You expect too much from them.

Makes me wonder, though: how long ago did Wired receive their debriefing on the Xbox One? They seemed confident in their report. Can't imagine they would purposefully get their facts wrong.

Yeah, they are greeedy incompetents with zero regard for the customer, after all.

11 years ago

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#136 LoG-Sacrament

Member since 2006 • 20397 Posts

if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.

11 years ago

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Member since 2003 • 2783 Posts

if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.
LoG-Sacrament

it originally came from this Wired article. http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2013/05/xbox-one-analysis/

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"][QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"] When your account is terminated, what happens to your license?

I don't know the company has'nt reached that point yet...

Your licenses are lost along with your account.

So let me get this straight..... gabe newel said that he will turn off the drm and make the games not be connected to steam if ever should a event occur.. but mind you i understand you say "he does not have a obligation to do that it's not in the contract!" That is so but what sorta **** idiot would do something like that just revoke all the games from the millions of people who use steam suddenly? His name would forever be blacklisted any sort of future hopes or projects he could create would be forever tainted by this event his name would go down in history as the person who killed pc gaming... A man who has mad one of their most successful games f2p. Given free dlc. Has humongous steam sales out the wazo which he never had to instate or atleast at that low of a price. Created a platform for indy games to be able to be successful that they would'nt otherwise. and you think that this person would be dumb enough to taint his image for the rest of his life when he had nothing to gain from it?

11 years ago

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Member since 2011 • 490 Posts

[QUOTE="Floppy_Jim"]The used game fee stuff has been debunkedc_rake

Huh. That was a quick turn-around.

Quick, what else can we get them to change? :P

11 years ago

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#140 c_rakestraw Moderator

Member since 2007 • 14627 Posts

if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.
LoG-Sacrament

Wired. One of their articles mentioned the fee. I imagine they got it straight from Microsoft when one of their editors was preparing this feature.

EDIT: Beaten to it.

11 years ago

speedfreak48t5p

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#141 speedfreak48t5p

Member since 2009 • 14490 Posts

if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.
LoG-Sacrament

This.

11 years ago

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#142 c_rakestraw Moderator

Member since 2007 • 14627 Posts

Quick, what else can we get them to change? :Plozengez

Xbox Live fees! If we can dispose of one, we can dispose of another! GO GO GO!

11 years ago

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#143 Minishdriveby

Member since 2006 • 10519 Posts

if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.
LoG-Sacrament

It seems to be because every other gaming site went off of what Wired said. "Microsoft today confirmed with Wired..." - Gamespot "According to Wired..." - IGN

11 years ago

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Member since 2003 • 2783 Posts

[QUOTE="LoG-Sacrament"]
if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.
c_rake

Wired. One of their articles mentioned the fee. I imagine they got it straight from Microsoft when one of their editors was preparing this feature.

EDIT: Beaten to it.

*Bruce Lee accent* "You got to be faster, brotha! You soooooo slow sometime."

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#145 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

gabe newel said that he will turn off the drm and make the games not be connected to steam if ever should a event occur..fl4tlined

You make a good point, but before I respond, do you have a link to that statement?

11 years ago

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="LoG-Sacrament"]
if it doesn't have a secondhand fee, how the f*ck did every gaming site get the idea that it did? i'm not saying one side is right or wrong (yet), but the whole thing is a mess.
speedfreak48t5p

This.

Either a company got misinformed and it spread like wildfire, some idiot create a sensational news article and it spread like wildfire, or Microsoft is just trying to do a huge coverup. I would like to believe in one of the former options though the third is definitely possible because i would like to think that a game company wouldn't be so stupid to enact such an idea.

11 years ago

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Member since 2009 • 11111 Posts

So this isn't true now? I don't know if I should feel relieved or remain skeptical.

11 years ago

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#148 gamingqueen

Member since 2004 • 31076 Posts

I'd never trust a company if I were you. Birds of a feather flock together, they'd never side with poor folks who buy consoles to play games after a hard day of work. And then MS makes and publishes games to so not including a pass goes against their interests too.

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Member since 2007 • 4134 Posts

[QUOTE="fl4tlined"]gabe newel said that he will turn off the drm and make the games not be connected to steam if ever should a event occur..Black_Knight_00

You make a good point, but before I respond, do you have a link to that statement?

I cannot find it He posted a while back on the steam forums.. but I do have something to say if something ever were to happen to valve steam would just revert to offline mode.. or if your apocalypse situation were to happen you could force offline mode to never connect to the servers for them to take their games back... also please explain why he would take his games back other then become the most notorious figure in gaming ever what would he gain from doing such a thing?

11 years ago

Black_Knight_00

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#150 Black_Knight_00

Member since 2007 • 78 Posts

[QUOTE="Black_Knight_00"][QUOTE="fl4tlined"]gabe newel said that he will turn off the drm and make the games not be connected to steam if ever should a event occur..fl4tlined

You make a good point, but before I respond, do you have a link to that statement?

I cannot find it He posted a while back on the steam forums.. but I do have something to say if something ever were to happen to valve steam would just revert to offline mode.. or if your apocalypse situation were to happen you could force offline mode to never connect to the servers for them to take their games back...

Say you own 200 games on Steam (make it 7 years-worth of purchases), do you keep them all installed on your computer at all times? I know I wouldn't: I would uninstall the games I don't play and redownload them in case I want to play them. What happens if the servers go offline though and you can't access them to download your games anymore? You'd still have the ones you kept on your HDD, sure, but what about the others?

11 years ago

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