2024 OT Election Day Thread: Donald Trump elected POTUS, GOP wins Senate and House of Representatives

The deal was basically redone and finalized where it resembled something "reasonable", but they couldn't contain their hostility, and we had that shit show.

It's ridiculous really. They tried to scam Ukraine twice with what was tantamount to economic slavery for generations, made out dictator, tried to force elections, locked them out of talks, refuse to say anything about Russia, praise them ect... etc.. etc...

The worst thing as well, Ukraine kind of has to do this, which means they are probably gong to try humiliate him again, probably going to be vile.

Hope they just sign it behind close doors or pose for 20 seconds and then depart and never speak again.

Meanwhile Europe can focus on detaching from them, which they seem in the process of starting as of today.

And the MAGA menial illness can eat itself up, ideally.

Yeah, I noticed. It's good to see. It's not quite ideal in the grand scheme of things, but at least it shows things aren't entirely hopeless...

Ugh.

I’ve made it a point not to watch anything with Trump in it, but I had to suffer through this meeting to see just how bad it really was. No surprises to the vileness of the orange buffoon and his sycophantic cronies who are too craven to say boo to him. Never a shocker.

….but it was explicitly apparent that this had absolutely nothing to do with policy or making a deal. It was obviously a very calculated invitation only intended to ambush and attempt to humiliate, denigrate, and frame Zelensky in a poor light on the world stage to turn sentiment against him. I mean, seriously… The question about him and the suit? What was this, grade school antics? The partner of MTG so no surprise there, but this was grade school tier excruciating. They were trying so hard to rile him up to a point that would not have done him any favors in his comportment, but he didn’t take the bait, and it was immensely satisfying to see. Aside from the cult who slurps up Trump’s predictable vomit as the nectar of the gods, I don’t think this is going to have the effect he desires. Attempting to belittle a man who, for better or worse, is trying to do nothing but defend his country against foreign aggression is going to create a groundswell of sympathy and support while also weakening America.

I suppose this is what Trumpers view as effective statecraft. 🤣 It accomplishes nothing aside making us look terrible in the abandonment of our values and allies while giving even more support to Ukraine. I‘m in admiration of Zelensky far more after watching that. Good on him.

Can anyone explain what's up with Cyber Command?

This is the same group who came up with the "Let's go Brandon" chant, presumably because they thought talking in code won't get them in trouble with their teachers.

So yes, primary school antics is their forte. I suspect it's where most of them peaked.

It would have been amusing to see Zelensky say something along the lines of, and without a hint of sarcasm,

’My deepest apologies, I was under the assumption this would be considered acceptable attire after seeing Musk with the president wearing a T-shirt and ball cap‘.

When it comes to Trump and his ilk, it doesn’t take much wit and class to outdo the witless and classless while retaining his own. He still came out shining.

Been a lot of people theorizing on this.

The biggest indicator

1. Russian State Media was there, somehow. But were thrown out.

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/02/28/tass-oval-office-trump-zelenskyy-00206739

2. As mentioned the person who asked the about the suit was Brian Glenn, Marjorie Taylor Greens boyfriend, but alot of these are pro Trump picks by default, arguably nothing changed here

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14451179/Trumps-wink-Marjorie-Taylor-Greens-boyfriend-Brian-Glenn-White-House-Zelensky.html

Even with this fairly substantial evidence of if being pre-prepared, still wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't.

Many people were expecting a shit show by default, this stance and attitude to Zel/UKR is nothing new, consistent.

Trumps rambling became incoherent, specifically about Hunter Biden Laptop, and in and outside the Whitehouse rambling about Putin being portrayed as a bad guy, and how he endured with him during the "Russian hoax", none of this makes America look good internally or externally.

Potentially, it could be people outside Trump himself who planned it, as JDVance (who was selected by Elon Musk) seemed very much scripted. Marco Rubio just uncomfortable but it did seem to be primarily JDVance pushing events to collide.

It was also a mistake on Zelensky' part not to use his home language via translation or expect this. Given the circumstances, he dealt with it well not raising his voice and showing dignity, but the language barrier automatically put him at a disadvantage.

The stuff afterword's is absolutely staged, cronies, Fox News with the "how dare Johnny Foreigner!" narrative.

Johnson and others pivoting back to the "he must be replaced", shtick. Which is part of Putins demands.

If this was setup, honestly MAGA are too stupid to actually keep it canned, Russia are master provocateurs, these people are closer to Meet The Kardashians.

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This def wasn't calculated though, 100%

@uninspiredcup: Oh I'm certain the whole thing was carefully planned by Trump's team. You don't hold important meetings that fly completely off the cuff - especially not ones where there are news crews present, you're discussing international diplomacy, and you're in total control of who gets to be in that room. They workshopped this and executed it according to their plan.

The sad reality is that this is the best the US Government could come up with - a limp-wristed attempt to manufacture outrage against a European hero.

We shouldn't be surprised though. Trump's greatest success has always been his reality TV show where he pretended to be a successful businessman, so he stuck to what he knew. This kind of performance also plays really well to his voters, who don't understand international politics but who like to be told who to be angry at this week.

@Planeforger: If he tried to make Zelensky look bad. It clearly didnt work. Considering the international reaction was the opposite of what Trump wanted then.

But then again, this seems to be a common theme with narcissists. Propose absolutely TERRIBLE deals and act like the others are in the wrong for refusing it.

Prediction

- Officially announce end to all aid to UKR

- Try to shift all blame on Zel

- Blame Nato

- (less likely but still possible) Potential announcement to leave Nato

- Possibly make up lies about UKR corruption, attempt to force extortion "for the American people"

- Russia not the problem, something something immigrants, radical left bla bla

Looks like this question was addressed by Reuters, "the move would have a "symbolic" impact as it didn't have a fixed contract." Whelp. Norway's government says yeah no... Americans are still getting our support. lol As expected, this news blurp was like a fart in the wind, but that's social media for ya.

Europe and Ukraine currently have dependence on America wither they like to say it or not, detaching from entirely from reliance will take years not days. And itself may be extremely short sighted.

Reading that, the point take issue with, and think you're wrong on, symbolic doesn't equate to irrelevant, especially in history. Rosa Parks, Mahatma Gandhi etc...

A prime contemporary example of this even as type away, Zelenskys attire. Which currently, according the US government is worse than a war criminal, and we should all be very angry.

In reality, this is stupid, but get the point.

This isn't an isolated blip, it's symptomatic of wider anti-American sentiment growing globally, including the EU leaders who view America as unreliable at best, potentially abetting Russia at worse.

Donald Trump can turn seeds of resentment, protests, Canada etc.. into a fully grown tree depending further on his future actions, which thus far are a deepening hole.

Um, what. lol

...did you actually read my reply and peruse the link or you just letting chatgpt to drum up your responses?

Yes.

1. US/EU/UKR is reliant on America, this was not in dispute.

e.g.

The worst thing as well, Ukraine kind of has to do this, which means they are probably gong to try humiliate him again, probably going to be vile.

2. "fart in the wind", is indicative of larger growing Anti-US sentiment.

3. Unless a change of course, this will dramatically increase depending on how egregious Trumps future actions are.

The post wasn't that complicated.

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I'd argue accelerating this would be potentially cutting aid, which would directly attribute to killing Ukrainians through coercion, attributing none at all to Russia beyond an extension of sanctions.

The conflict is that America is a power, atm reviled publicly and privately where lesser powers are tepid to create discourse.

This is why it's symbolic, but symbolic and irrelevant are not the same thing.

Go further with the silly Zelenskyy attire crap, and say they want to emasculate him publicly.

However not really sure I'd attribute oil companies to Rosa Parks or Gandhi, the fact even one of them remotely took a stance is surprising in itself.

After spending his whole first term crying about NordStream2, trump is now making a deal with putin to revive the project. I bet the resident MAGA cultists will explain to us how this makes any sense.

What a trouble maker.

https://x.com/atrupar/status/1896591427091476532

Lutnick on Zelenskyy: "You gotta say, 'We love America, We appreciate America' ... Instead he said, 'I want $300b in reparations from Russia. I want them off my land. I want all the land.' Really! All the land ... it's just way too far. That's not a peacemaker. That's a troublemaker."

https://x.com/front_ukrainian/status/1896596739869843637

This man is litterally beaming with a smile as he says this.

Zelensky must apologize on camera for his behavior in the White House. Otherwise, the US will rule out progress on the minerals deal, – Fox News

I'm glad we don't get Fox News over here, and we do it's on some obscure channel never found yet.

Everytime see these like seeing some sort of mass mental illness where nobody is aware, very bizarre.

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In regards to everyone kissing Trumps Godfather ring, Friedrich Merz seems to be almost the sole guy who doesn't give a shit.

https://kyivindependent.com/us-deliberately-escalated-tensions-during-zelenskys-white-house-visit-merz-says/

US deliberately orchestrated Zelensky-Trump Oval Office clash, Friedrich Merz says

The American side deliberately orchestrated the confrontation during President Volodymyr Zelensky's visit to the White House, Friedrich Merz, the head of Germany's Christian Democratic Union (CDU) and the likely chancellor, said on March 3.

"It was not a spontaneous reaction to interventions by Zelensky, but obviously a manufactured escalation in this meeting in the Oval Office," Merz said at a press conference in Hamburg.

The visit was expected to mark the signing of a long-debated agreement between Ukraine and the U.S. on jointly developing Ukraine's mineral resources.

The press conference between Zelensky and U.S. President Donald Trump turned into a heated exchange, with Trump and Vice President JD Vance berating the Ukrainian leader. Zelensky left the White House without an agreement in hand.

Merz said he was "quite surprised, including by the mutual tone of the dialogue," adding that the incident fit a pattern in recent U.S. behavior.

"There is a certain sequence in a number of events in recent weeks and months, including the appearance of the American delegation in Munich at the security conference, and we are now seeing it from Washington," he said.

At the Munich Security Conference on Feb. 14, Vance stunned European leaders with a speech attacking European values and calling for cooperation with far-right parties.

According to Merz, these events serve as a wake-up call for Europe's security policy. "I am in favor of preparing for the fact that in the coming years and decades we will have to do much, much more for our own security," he said.

Merz, whose CDU party won Germany's recent elections, is expected to become chancellor once coalition talks conclude.

He has been a vocal critic of the outgoing government's Ukraine policy and has condemned Trump's shifting stance on the war.

On Feb. 21, Merz called Trump's statements about Ukraine "shocking" and aligning with Russian narratives.

@uninspiredcup: I wouldn't be surprised if it was planned since they started their sad display over literally nothing.

@theformless: Personally still think it wasn't planned. They're capitalizing on it now, but disagree with most that it was a setup.

Trump always seemed to me someone who reacts impulsively.

For example -

The animosity was always there and always has been. His mineral deal scam failed twice, replaced with a severally neutered one, and we had the disinformation bubble, and most likely agreed with Putin to get rid of him (Putin explicity wants this) and going even further back years when wanted Zel to get dirt for him.

Powder keg waiting for the slightest little nudge.

Okay, but you understand the "symbolic" comment was actually made by the CEO of the company who acknowledged they don't have any contracts with the US military ... who also happened to delete his Facebook comment anyways after he got blowback. lol

You also understand that the fart in the wind comment was in reference to the silly nature of the story to begin with; something that stinks and is fleeting with importance. lol It's not indicative of larger anti-US sentiment... What the hell. Lmao!

So, what variant of "teh Skynetz" are you relying on to think for ya?

Not really sure what arguing now, none of these were disputed and if they were wouldn't change the context or intent of the reply.

Bolded seems to be the actual dispute we are having. That this was ultimately nothing burger indictive of fleeting virtue signaling.

To be clear, I hope you are right.

If Ukraine gets a good peace deal, UN/US relations remain stable, And no more, or at the least contained erratic behavior and courting of Russia dissipates, wonderful.

But, I don't think this will be the case at all and these little seeds of dissent, not just here but Canada, protesting, EU leaders etc.. will grow into something significant primarily due to Donald Trump becoming egregious to the point it's no longer attenable for EU or others to put up the façade' of diplomacy.

Ask yourself, is Trump getting better, or is he getting worse? That really isn't a hard one to figure out.

To correct your misinfo:

The deal was finalized and Zelensky agreed to sign, starting the process towards peace. Apparently, he thought he could re-bargain, but Trump didn't have any of that. The whole conspiracy theory of Trump and Vance staging an act of humiliation in front of press is rather dull. For what purpose? Zelensky was obviously displeased with the terms - even though he agreed to sign and traveled all the way to the US - and was unsuccesful in his attempt to sway Trump. The fact, that Zelensky is still interested in the minerals/rare earth deal, makes it evident.

It wouldn't be the first time for Zelensky to back out after an agreement was reached and peace was in reach.

You don't have to rely on the expertise of armchair analysts. Real military officials have a clear picture, and they say Ukraine will lose sooner or later. Even the head of the ukranian military intelligence says so.

Ukrainska Pravda published anarticleon Jan. 27 claiming thatKyrylo Budanov, head of Ukraine’smilitary intelligence(HUR), warned of serious consequences for Ukraine’s existence if negotiations do not begin by the summer.

https://kyivindependent.com/sbu-probes-alleged-leak-of-budanovs-statement-on-threat-to-ukraines-existence/

Agreeing with Starmer? You want british troops fighting in Ukraine? Am not sure, but it's almost like you want WW3 to happen. I guess the motto is: It will happen anyway, why not getting it over with while the opporunity presents itself.

To refresh why this war is happening: NATO, that thing Putin wants to prevent from expanding towards russian borders. Trump blinking isn't Putins motivation to continue the war. It is rather Europes reluctance to abstain from expanding NATO, and Ukraine is a high value target. After investing so much, so many (ukrainian) lifes lost, they don't want to back down. Now escalating further, with "boots on the ground and planes in the air"? And now they want to persuade Merz to send Taurus missiles? Yesyes, Trumps eye twitch is the reason why this conflict is 3+8 years old.

@palasta: To correct your misinfo:

Zelenskyy wanted security to stop Russia from invading again. Trump wouldn't do that.

For context, Zelenskyy was actually tracked, and he thanks America at least 94 times.

MAGA have overwhelmingly been directly opposed to Ukraine and Pro-Putin.

The US number is made up.

The EU number is made up.

The EU used loans and grants, that's made up.

Joe Biden.

https://x.com/atrupar/status/1896650940133834837

Absolutely, but Trump also has a very shrewd calculative side to him in the broader manipulations he seeks to employ......he would not be nearly so successful in swaying public opinion to his gain if he weren't.

Look at his announcing his 2024 presidential long before usual, just to be able to grab control of the narrative before it was out of his control and claim the only reason he was being legally pursued was because it was a political hitjob to prevent him from running for president. Had he waited until after the indictments dropped, he knows that the optics would've appeared he was running to escape justice.

The man knows exactly what he's doing, and I don't believe this meeting was any exception. Not saying you're wrong, he's 100% impulsive, but I believe it's a careful combination of both. He plans things in the broader, then uses off-the-cuff impulsivity he sees as beneficial to furthering his cause depending on his reading of the audience at any given moment.

I'd write a big long post responding to this all, but we really need to start here.

The NATO issue is only part of the reason why the war is happening, and it's a self-fulfilling loop. Russia invades its neighbours under the pretense of resisting NATO (which may be partly true), and its neighbours ask to join NATO to stop Russia invading them. NATO promises defence and at least nominal independence, so it's easy to see why that's preferable to submitting to Russia (who promises to rape and murder your civilians until you give up your independence) or independent deals with countries like the US (who will extort you for protection money).

Either way though, Russia is the belligerent here, and the US and Europe had agreed to a plan to pressure Russia into a ceasefire - a plan which Trump is now deliberately scuttling.

@palasta: "Agreeing with Starmer? You want british troops fighting in Ukraine? Am not sure, but it's almost like you want WW3 to happen. I guess the motto is: It will happen anyway, why not getting it over with while the opporunity presents itself."

I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth, but here is how I personally see it. The scenario least likely to lead to WW3, is one where Russia is pushed back and gets none of Ukraine. It leaves Putin facing the fact he does not have a strong enough army to expand. Letting Russia keep the land they have taken, has a lot of parallels to Europe conceding part of Chzeckoslovakia to Germany in 1938. Much as I'd like to see the war end, I don't want another "Peace for our time" situation where it all falls apart soon after.

I'm not sure what you're arguing either, as your long-winded material was missing the mark entirely from my replies. It was very bizarre. lol But finally, I think, we're on the same sheet of music now.

Not surprised this is happening. Especially in a post-Luigi Mangione world.

@Stevo_the_gamer: And now Donnie has suspended all support for Ukraine and is reinstating the 25% tariffs against Canada and Mexico, so it looks like Stevie has to tap dance extra hard to try and spin this as a 4D chess move from Cheetolini. 🤭

"Trump pauses US military aid to Ukraine, White House confirms"

It is my understanding that the aid is set and decided on by congress not the president, separation of powers blah blab blah but 🤷🏽‍♂️🤭

Ya but when the president does it, it's not illegal 🤔

Unless they look like... you know😏

@agent_stroud: Hey don't be too harsh, it's not easy to gaslight an entire board.

To be fair, this isn't the first time Trump has blocked aid to Ukraine. Remember Trump's first impeachment? I'd almost forgotten it tbh, considering the very long train of crimes and political failings he's been embroiled in over the years.

Hopefully Trump will reverse this one too. Or contract some kind of agonising and debilitating illness. Preferably both.

@Planeforger: People forget Trump gave Syria to Russia too. It's just impossible to keep up with every crime or act of treason.

40 - 42 days is it?

https://x.com/wallaceme/status/1896850711012651195

Bad news for Starmer and Macron. Vance confirms the only US security guarantee in Ukraine will be the mineral deal. He also plays down British & French peacekeeping troops as “20k troops from some random country that hasn’t fought a war in 30 or 40 years”.

@uninspiredcup: Is the security deal like Trump's deal in Syria? Just dont interfere with US economic interests, otherwise do as you please? Or the security guarantee covers all of Ukraine?

In all honesty the way out of this mess is for constituents to en masse their GOP Congress members and tell them they're not being re-elected if they don't stand up for democracy and reign Trump in.

Omg dude. Write a book, Fiction section.

When it comes to technically of business specifics probably better talking to Matt or Marodox then it comes to that stuff.

From what I understand -

The third iteration offers 0 security guarantees with the idea that America simply being there as one.

Ukriane is intrinsically and keenly aware Russia and more specifically, Putin, works and have had "deals" in the part no honored. Trump is absolutely clueless thinking he understands bigly. They know Putin won't give up aspirations.

In that regard they are absolutely correct to want this.

America itself cannot be trusted. Thus far they have tried to scam them twice, which sure seen me ramble about. Economic slavery for generations, 500b, 350b etc.. Attempted to blame Ukraine, change their leader, disrespect them (setup depending on your opinion), and now directly trying to coercion them through giving Russia advantage and directly killing them as leverage.

You can also argue this is yet another attempt to replace Zelensky, which is something Russia wants, and something attempted repeatedly as this point, with American media doubling down with the idea.

Thus far, the Trump administration have never at any point blame at Russia, supporting them, trying to have them dictate "peice", denigrating Ukraine at every point.

Also Europeans who are suppose to be peace keepers, except Ukraine is massive, America isn't going to help, we would effectively be guarding Americas investment after all the bullshit they have pulled..

Theoretically as well, this could escalate war, and by default does. Not just if Russia attacks, their might be groups within Ukraine itself who could purposefully attempt to create conflict.

Russia has other methods of taking Ukraine, namely replacing the government with internal influence, we discussed about 3-4 pages back how they try to influence Europe by promoting right-wing parties, and managed to get Trump himself muttering the Kremlin mouth for the world to see.

Letting Russia lick it wounds, America wanting to remove sanctions is a god awful idea.

Me personally? I wouldn't take it. Even if America tried to strongarm Ukraine. Rely on the Europeans to step up (which they should be doing), it will be harder, need to fill American gaps, many which cannot be filled, but I still think that would be a better option than trusting Trump.

Problem is Europe itself is very cucky, they know Trump is trash, but they fear losing America' umbrella, trying to appease them still trying to get Zel to cave in, which is still highly likely from what I can tell.

Long term Europe will need to defend and invest in itself regardless.

Video found as well which was interesting, if find it post it, lost on Youtube list. Went into detail about how the deal outside the minerals works.

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This was an interesting vid with Supreme Ultra Mega Uber Allied 40K commander in Europe General Sir Richard Shirreff where he has a slightly more optimistic outlook if Ukraine continued to fight.

Essentially, bad but not an end-game.

The party of free speech.🤭

Oh, gee. What a shocker.

I flicked through a couple of headlines today - Canada tariffs, Trump ordering the destruction of US forests, Trump threatening to defund schools that disagree with him - and I'm reminded that we could have had a totally normal, mundane, sane year if Americans had simply voted for Harris.

I did. But I only had the one vote.

@theformless: Found it.

Maybe this is good news 🤷‍♂️

Ukraine war latest: Trump 'hopes to announce minerals deal tonight' - after Zelenskyy's olive branch and truce talk | World News | Sky News

Donald Trump is hoping to announce an agreement with Ukraine in front of Congress tonight, according to Reuters. Earlier, Volodymyr Zelenskyy said it's "time to make things right" after his White House argument with Trump.

I guess it is better than the alternative 🤷‍♂️. It would be nice in things would calm down a little bit. As soon as the deal is signed it would feel like a relief to me. Even though I'm highly sceptical if it's a good deal.