Do you belive in God??????????

[QUOTE="Nuck81"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] . If that's the best a scientific illiterate like you can come back with, bravo. HoolaHoopMan

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

ShadowMoses900

Honestly, why can't anyone just read up on a certain theory before opening their big dumb mouths. The big bang theory doesn't say it just appeared out of no where and that it magically came to be. In fact the BBT doesn't address where everything came from AT ALL, get this through your big stupid thick skull. Quit misrepresenting a theory you know nothing about.

There is no 'magic' happening here at all. Everything in the universe is governed by laws, they follow a strict set of rules that will lead to eventual outcomes. The tricky part is understanding theses rules and using them to predict the outcomes.

Resorting to personal attacks just makes you look juvenile. In a debate that is a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are arguing about or against, and they resort to personal attacks to try and escape the argument. In other words you lose. Come back when you grow up some.

And I understand the big bang theory just fine and believe in it. I just believe God caused it to happen.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="Nuck81"]Why waste time with someone that has the maturity and intellect of a third grader who just learned cuss words are funny when mommy is not around

Nuck81

Tsk tsk...

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="Nuck81"]Why waste time with someone that has the maturity and intellect of a third grader who just learned cuss words are funny when mommy is not aroundNuck81

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]Yes that someone appeared out of nowhere and used his magic powers to create everything out of nothing is completely logical.

toast_burner

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnation God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense then your idea.

There is no evidence at all suggesting there is a god, none. if you have some, show it.

Well your an atheist and your theory is that life began by sheer random accident without any divine or higher power involved. So yes that is your idea of how life and the world came into existence.

There is no evidence to suggest there is no God either. None, if you have some, show it. Your just like the atheist baby in that scenario I told, you don't believe in Mom because you never saw her, and you don't believe in life after birth because there is no direct evidence for it. Same exact thing.

All I can say is, it makes more logical sense to believe a higher power of some sort started the process and guided it to create the world and complex life as we know it, as opposed to just believing life started from nothing and just through sheer magical accident and luck, managed to create complex life and the scietnific mechanics and laws the world is based on.

Both those views require faith to one degree or the other, however the second view requires far more faith than the first. And that's why I'm not an atheist, I don't have enough faith to be an atheist.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnation God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense then your idea.

ShadowMoses900

There is no evidence at all suggesting there is a god, none. if you have some, show it.

Well your an atheist and your theory is that life began by sheer random accident without any divine or higher power involved. So yes that is your idea of how life and the world came into existence.

There is no evidence to suggest there is no God either. None, if you have some, show it. Your just like the atheist baby in that scenario I told, you don't believe in Mom because you never saw her, and you don't believe in life after birth because there is no direct evidence for it. Same exact thing.

All I can say is, it makes more logical sense to believe a higher power of some sort started the process and guided it to create the world and complex life as we know it, as opposed to just believing life started from nothing and just through sheer magical accident and luck, managed to create complex life and the scietnific mechanics and laws the world is based on.

Both those views require faith to one degree or the other, however the second view requires far more faith than the first. And that's why I'm not an atheist, I don't have enough faith to be an atheist.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnation God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense then your idea.

ShadowMoses900

There is no evidence at all suggesting there is a god, none. if you have some, show it.

Well your an atheist and your theory is that life began by sheer random accident without any divine or higher power involved. So yes that is your idea of how life and the world came into existence.

There is no evidence to suggest there is no God either. None, if you have some, show it. Your just like the atheist baby in that scenario I told, you don't believe in Mom because you never saw her, and you don't believe in life after birth because there is no direct evidence for it. Same exact thing.

All I can say is, it makes more logical sense to believe a higher power of some sort started the process and guided it to create the world and complex life as we know it, as opposed to just believing life started from nothing and just through sheer magical accident and luck, managed to create complex life and the scietnific mechanics and laws the world is based on.

Both those views require faith to one degree or the other, however the second view requires far more faith than the first. And that's why I'm not an atheist, I don't have enough faith to be an atheist.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="Nuck81"] :lol: How about we start with a thesaurus so you can expand your language.Nuck81

ie atheism and the BB theory dont go hand in hand.

Need any more paraphrases?

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

Honestly, why can't anyone just read up on a certain theory before opening their big dumb mouths. The big bang theory doesn't say it just appeared out of no where and that it magically came to be. In fact the BBT doesn't address where everything came from AT ALL, get this through your big stupid thick skull. Quit misrepresenting a theory you know nothing about.

There is no 'magic' happening here at all. Everything in the universe is governed by laws, they follow a strict set of rules that will lead to eventual outcomes. The tricky part is understanding theses rules and using them to predict the outcomes.

toast_burner

Resorting to personal attacks just makes you look juvenile. In a debate that is a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are arguing about or against, and they resort to personal attacks to try and escape the argument. In other words you lose. Come back when you grow up some.

And I understand the big bang theory just fine and believe in it. I just believe God caused it to happen.

No, I've provided thought provoking ideas and good solid arguments. I never resort to personal attacks like an immature kid, I don't throw tantrums. The reason why you and your friends get mad at me is because I'm a challenge to debate with, and it's hard for you to argue effectively against me.

If you were having this same argument with me in real life I would seriously doubt you would be acting the way you do on here. People would just laugh at you and think your being childish. I honestly wouldn't waste my time, I would just take off and go on about my day while you sit there and be upset all day over religious people.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Yes I do believe in God. My spiritual beliefs are very important to me, and to be honest I find athesim to be the most illogical view. I am reminded by this picture I saw once, it had two twins in a womb and they were having a conversation that went something like this:

Baby 1: "Hey brother, do you believe in life after birth?"

Baby 2: "No I don't, there is no evidence for it. I have to see it to believe it"

Baby 1: "Do you believe in Mom?"

Baby 2: "No, of course not, that's just silly. I'm an atheist. There is no such thing as Mom"

Lol it's pretty funny and clever and makes a good point. I think I found it: Unborn Atheists: Do You Believe in Mom?

ShadowMoses900

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed and guided in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, the Big Bang and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnations God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense than your idea.

Lawl, strawman much?

No one is saying that the universe appeared magically, but what we are saying is that it is possible that the universe has no first cause. It's a perfectly reasonable conclusion, and one based in more evidence than the idea of a first cause. The argument goes that everything in nature has a cause, therefore there must be something in nature that has no cause (because a first cause, by definition, is uncaused). That is a departure from the evidence at hand. The atheist argument, however, says that everything in nature has a cause, so there is nothing in nature that has no cause and therefore no first cause, perfectly reasonable given the evidence at hand.

This is a fallacious argument, it is a false analogy. You are comparing somethign that we know has a creator to something that we don't know if it has a creator or not in order to erroneously infer the existence of a creator for the second object.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Resorting to personal attacks just makes you look juvenile. In a debate that is a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are arguing about or against, and they resort to personal attacks to try and escape the argument. In other words you lose. Come back when you grow up some.

And I understand the big bang theory just fine and believe in it. I just believe God caused it to happen.

ShadowMoses900

No, I've provided thought provoking ideas and good solid arguments. I never resort to personal attacks like an immature kid, I don't throw tantrums. The reason why you and your friends get mad at me is because I'm a challenge to debate with, and it's hard for you to argue effectively against me.

If you were having this same argument with me in real life I would seriously doubt you would be acting the way you do on here. People would just laugh at you and think your being childish. I honestly wouldn't waste my time, I would just take off and go on about my day while you sit there and be upset all day over religious people.

Cause he was too f***ing dumb and thought he knew what he was talking about.

See our problem is with people who have some beliefs and think that their beliefs are on par with scientific evidence because it just "makes sense" to them. They are effectively admitting their beliefs are subjective and at the same time they arrogantly challenge scientific knowledge with it. It doesnt take much stupidity of that kind to piss someone off. And frankly I dont know if you can do much about it, shadowmoses. It's beyond you I think.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]Yes that someone appeared out of nowhere and used his magic powers to create everything out of nothing is completely logical.

theone86

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed and guided in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, the Big Bang and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnations God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense than your idea.

Lawl, strawman much?

No one is saying that the universe appeared magically, but what we are saying is that it is possible that the universe has no first cause. It's a perfectly reasonable conclusion, and one based in more evidence than the idea of a first cause. The argument goes that everything in nature has a cause, therefore there must be something in nature that has no cause (because a first cause, by definition, is uncaused). That is a departure from the evidence at hand. The atheist argument, however, says that everything in nature has a cause, so there is nothing in nature that has no cause and therefore no first cause, perfectly reasonable given the evidence at hand.

This is a fallacious argument, it is a false analogy. You are comparing somethign that we know has a creator to something that we don't know if it has a creator or not in order to erroneously infer the existence of a creator for the second object.

[QUOTE="Nuck81"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] Great, dodgy too. If you'd like to have an actual discussion on what the BBT posits I'm game. If you're afraid you won't able to straw man physicists any longer because you might learn something then don't. HoolaHoopMan

The BBT doesn't explain where the matter came from but it does attempt to explain how the universe expanded and formed.

It also has a lot of similarities to the Kalam cosmological argument, when considering was there, or wasn't there a creator or instigator of the Big Bang itself.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]

Honestly, why can't anyone just read up on a certain theory before opening their big dumb mouths. The big bang theory doesn't say it just appeared out of no where and that it magically came to be. In fact the BBT doesn't address where everything came from AT ALL, get this through your big stupid thick skull. Quit misrepresenting a theory you know nothing about.

There is no 'magic' happening here at all. Everything in the universe is governed by laws, they follow a strict set of rules that will lead to eventual outcomes. The tricky part is understanding theses rules and using them to predict the outcomes.

HoolaHoopMan

Resorting to personal attacks just makes you look juvenile. In a debate that is a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are arguing about or against, and they resort to personal attacks to try and escape the argument. In other words you lose. Come back when you grow up some.

And I understand the big bang theory just fine and believe in it. I just believe God caused it to happen.

I think it's the other way around pal, I'm not so sure you understand science as much as you pretend you do. You may cling to it with a religious foundation (which is ironic considering your anti religion and all) but yet it seems like you don't fully understand the science behind the theories themselves.

In fact you would be laughed at by the scientific community, the majoirty of scientists, including those who study evolution and the big bang theory, have religious beliefs. The atheists are a very small minority in the scientific community and the world at large.

I doubt you actually understand things like the big bang theory, or how atoms are formed, or natural selection, or even how planets come about. Because if you did you would find it very hard to believe all that happened on it's own by complete randmomness.

And no, being childish means you lost the debate. That's debate 101, acting immature and throwing insults around just means your really saying "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm going to get angry". Present a solid argument or no one is going to take you seriously.

[QUOTE="Nuck81"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] Great, dodgy too. If you'd like to have an actual discussion on what the BBT posits I'm game. If you're afraid you won't able to straw man physicists any longer because you might learn something then don't. Teenaged

ie atheism and the BB theory dont go hand in hand.

Need any more paraphrases?

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Resorting to personal attacks just makes you look juvenile. In a debate that is a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are arguing about or against, and they resort to personal attacks to try and escape the argument. In other words you lose. Come back when you grow up some.

And I understand the big bang theory just fine and believe in it. I just believe God caused it to happen.

ShadowMoses900

No, I've provided thought provoking ideas and good solid arguments. I never resort to personal attacks like an immature kid, I don't throw tantrums. The reason why you and your friends get mad at me is because I'm a challenge to debate with, and it's hard for you to argue effectively against me.

If you were having this same argument with me in real life I would seriously doubt you would be acting the way you do on here. People would just laugh at you and think your being childish. I honestly wouldn't waste my time, I would just take off and go on about my day while you sit there and be upset all day over religious people.

And no, being childish means you lost the debate. That's debate 101, acting immature and throwing insults around just means your really saying "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm going to get angry". Present a solid argument or no one is going to take you seriously.

ShadowMoses900

This was not a debate to begin with. and you're certainly not someone able to participate in one.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="Nuck81"]The Big Bang itself is a scientific theory, But as a theory which addresses the origins of reality it carries theological implications regarding the concept of creationNuck81

ie atheism and the BB theory dont go hand in hand.

Need any more paraphrases?

So the possibilities are: you cant read and/or you were off topic in regards to the discussion you butted into.

Not the actual instance of the Big Bang, but the consequences of it do. The BBT doesn't explain where the matter came from but it does attempt to explain how the universe expanded and formed. It also has a lot of similarities to the Kal?m cosmological argument, when considering was there, or wasn't there a creator or instigator of the Big Bang itself.Nuck81

What do you mean consequences? The observations we have fit in line with plenty of predictions made by the BBT. What certain predictions/observations do you have a problem with?

And again, please leave this creator/creation/instigator stuff at the door. Its not something it addresses.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]You've shown that you have the intelligence of a juvenile so obvious he will treat you like one. It's not his fault that you don't understand KS3 science.

toast_burner

No, I've provided thought provoking ideas and good solid arguments. I never resort to personal attacks like an immature kid, I don't throw tantrums. The reason why you and your friends get mad at me is because I'm a challenge to debate with, and it's hard for you to argue effectively against me.

If you were having this same argument with me in real life I would seriously doubt you would be acting the way you do on here. People would just laugh at you and think your being childish. I honestly wouldn't waste my time, I would just take off and go on about my day while you sit there and be upset all day over religious people.

Most people who are friends in real life have religious discussions all the time. I have quite a few friends in real life who are very vocal atheits, however they respect my personal views and I respect theirs. On here however, do to the anonymity of the internet or just extreame people who have no life and cannot fucntion in soceity, they don't respect each other's personal beliefs.

And implying that having a basic education means your too smart for religion just says to me you don't know very much, especially about history.

[QUOTE="Nuck81"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]Yes but that doesnt mean every atheist thinks the BB theory is the most accurate theory.

ie atheism and the BB theory dont go hand in hand.

Need any more paraphrases?

Teenaged

Most people who are friends in real life have religious discussions all the time. I have quite a few friends in real life who are very vocal atheits, however they respect my personal views and I respect theirs. On here however, do to the anonymity of the internet or just extreame people who have no life and cannot fucntion in soceity, they don't respect each other's personal beliefs.

And implying that having a basic education means your too smart for religion just says to me you don't know very much, especially about history.

ShadowMoses900

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"][QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Resorting to personal attacks just makes you look juvenile. In a debate that is a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are arguing about or against, and they resort to personal attacks to try and escape the argument. In other words you lose. Come back when you grow up some.

And I understand the big bang theory just fine and believe in it. I just believe God caused it to happen.

ShadowMoses900

I think it's the other way around pal, I'm not so sure you understand science as much as you pretend you do.

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

I think it's the other way around pal, I'm not so sure you understand science as much as you pretend you do. You may cling to it with a religious foundation (which is ironic considering your anti religion and all) but yet it seems like you don't fully understand the science behind the theories themselves.

In fact you would be laughed at by the scientific community, the majoirty of scientists, including those who study evolution and the big bang theory, have religious beliefs. The atheists are a very small minority in the scientific community and the world at large.

I doubt you actually understand things like the big bang theory, or how atoms are formed, or natural selection, or even how planets come about. Because if you did you would find it very hard to believe all that happened on it's own by complete randmomness.

And no, being childish means you lost the debate. That's debate 101, acting immature and throwing insults around just means your really saying "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm going to get angry". Present a solid argument or no one is going to take you seriously.

ShadowMoses900

I'm pretty sure I do understand science a bit better than you considering I deal with science every day, I'm betting my colleagues would agree as well. I'm not the one straw manning theories in here.

I'm glad you've already declared yourself the winner though Mr. I Took Debate 101. You don't win debates by throwing out fallacies everywhere, you win them by substantiating your arguments.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"] I don't mind making juvenile attacks on juveniles like you. You obviously don't understand the theory since you're not representing it correctly, you've made this painfully obvious, which also makes you a liar now. theone86

I think it's the other way around pal, I'm not so sure you understand science as much as you pretend you do.

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

And no, being childish means you lost the debate. That's debate 101, acting immature and throwing insults around just means your really saying "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm going to get angry". Present a solid argument or no one is going to take you seriously.

Teenaged

This was not a debate to begin with. and you're certainly not someone able to participate in one.

I take debate classes at my university, I know the rules and formation of a strong argument. Something you and most other people on here do not. While you cannot prove God exists or not, one could still argue effectively for their personal beliefs which is what I did.

You however cannot and instead have to resort to childish attacks like a 5 year old, it's a way to escape from an argument but it's just silly. If this was a court romm and somone accused you of murder, you can't sit there and say "oh don't believe him, he is stupid idiot, I'm innocent, he is just dumb." that isn't a defense and no one would buy it.

It wouldn't be an argument, it would be an admission of defeat through a cop out. Which is exactly what your doing.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed and guided in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, the Big Bang and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnations God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense than your idea.

HoolaHoopMan

Lawl, strawman much?

No one is saying that the universe appeared magically, but what we are saying is that it is possible that the universe has no first cause. It's a perfectly reasonable conclusion, and one based in more evidence than the idea of a first cause. The argument goes that everything in nature has a cause, therefore there must be something in nature that has no cause (because a first cause, by definition, is uncaused). That is a departure from the evidence at hand. The atheist argument, however, says that everything in nature has a cause, so there is nothing in nature that has no cause and therefore no first cause, perfectly reasonable given the evidence at hand.

This is a fallacious argument, it is a false analogy. You are comparing somethign that we know has a creator to something that we don't know if it has a creator or not in order to erroneously infer the existence of a creator for the second object.

Claims to be well-versed in logic, portrays watchmaker argument as deductively valid. Not sure if serious...

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

And no, being childish means you lost the debate. That's debate 101, acting immature and throwing insults around just means your really saying "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm going to get angry". Present a solid argument or no one is going to take you seriously.

ShadowMoses900

This was not a debate to begin with. and you're certainly not someone able to participate in one.

I take debate classes at my university, I know the rules and formation of a strong argument. Something you and most other people on here do not. While you cannot prove God exists or not, one could still argue effectively for their personal beliefs which is what I did.

You however cannot and instead have to resort to childish attacks like a 5 year old, it's a way to escape from an argument but it's just silly. If this was a court romm and somone accused you of murder, you can't sit there and say "oh don't believe him, he is stupid idiot, I'm innocent, he is just dumb." that isn't a defense and no one would buy it.

It wouldn't be an argument, it would be an admission of defeat through a cop out. Which is exactly what your doing.

Doing debate classes doesn't mean s*** if you know nothing about the subject.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I think it's the other way around pal, I'm not so sure you understand science as much as you pretend you do.

Teenaged

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

And again, please leave this creator/creation/instigator stuff at the door. Its not something it addresses.HoolaHoopMan

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

I think it's the other way around pal, I'm not so sure you understand science as much as you pretend you do.

Teenaged

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

As long as you keep it above the waist.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

theone86

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

As long as you keep it above the waist.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

And no, being childish means you lost the debate. That's debate 101, acting immature and throwing insults around just means your really saying "I don't know what I'm talking about, so I'm going to get angry". Present a solid argument or no one is going to take you seriously.

ShadowMoses900

This was not a debate to begin with. and you're certainly not someone able to participate in one.

I take debate classes at my university, I know the rules and formation of a strong argument. Something you and most other people on here do not. While you cannot prove God exists or not, one could still argue effectively for their personal beliefs which is what I did.

You however cannot and instead have to resort to childish attacks like a 5 year old, it's a way to escape from an argument but it's just silly. If this was a court romm and somone accused you of murder, you can't sit there and say "oh don't believe him, he is stupid idiot, I'm innocent, he is just dumb." that isn't a defense and no one would buy it.

It wouldn't be an argument, it would be an admission of defeat through a cop out. Which is exactly what your doing.

Saying "it makes sense" doesnt constitute an argument. Neither is the twins in the womb analogy a sound argument. I really shouldnt have to explain this to someone who supposedly took debate cIasses in university.

But I'm not professing to be debating right now. You are. So you cant really call me out on anything. I choose to insult you and I aknowledge that I do. That has nothing to do with whether I can debate when I feel like it; and that is definitely not when dealing with people like you. Patience has its limits.

Once again, SM, I'm not even debating right now. Are you so eager to claim victory even when there is no debate going on?

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]Dude, please, it makes sense... isnt that logical enough for you?

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

wis3boi

As long as you keep it above the waist.

I have felt the hand of god, and now I am taking him to court.

I'm pretty sure I do understand science a bit better than you considering I deal with science every dayHoolaHoopMan

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

theone86

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

As long as you keep it above the waist.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

Oh, you mean kinda like how you pretend to understand logic but completely misrepresent logical principles?

theone86

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

As long as you keep it above the waist.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]And "it makes sense to me" is winning a debate?

This was not a debate to begin with. and you're certainly not someone able to participate in one.

Teenaged

I take debate classes at my university, I know the rules and formation of a strong argument. Something you and most other people on here do not. While you cannot prove God exists or not, one could still argue effectively for their personal beliefs which is what I did.

You however cannot and instead have to resort to childish attacks like a 5 year old, it's a way to escape from an argument but it's just silly. If this was a court romm and somone accused you of murder, you can't sit there and say "oh don't believe him, he is stupid idiot, I'm innocent, he is just dumb." that isn't a defense and no one would buy it.

It wouldn't be an argument, it would be an admission of defeat through a cop out. Which is exactly what your doing.

Saying "it makes sense" doesnt constitute an argument. Neither is the twins in the womb analogy a sond argument. I really shouldnt have to explain this to someone who supposedly took debate cIasses in university.

But I'm not professing to be debating right now. You are. So you cant really call me out on anything. I choose to insult you and aknowledge that I do. That has nothing to do with whether I can debate when I feel like it; and that is definitely not when dealing with people like you. Patience has its limits.

Once again, SM, I'm not even debating right now. Are you so eager to claim victory even when there is no debate going on?

Right, then I guess his debate class didn't teach him that for an argument to be deductively valid the conclusion has to be true given the premises, didn't teach him that all logic is contigent on evidence, or about fallacies of relevance. Shadowmoses, I think you deserve your money back.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Yes I do believe in God. My spiritual beliefs are very important to me, and to be honest I find athesim to be the most illogical view. I am reminded by this picture I saw once, it had two twins in a womb and they were having a conversation that went something like this:

Baby 1: "Hey brother, do you believe in life after birth?"

Baby 2: "No I don't, there is no evidence for it. I have to see it to believe it"

Baby 1: "Do you believe in Mom?"

Baby 2: "No, of course not, that's just silly. I'm an atheist. There is no such thing as Mom"

Lol it's pretty funny and clever and makes a good point. I think I found it: Unborn Atheists: Do You Believe in Mom?

ShadowMoses900

Yes that life and the universe just appeared out of nowhere magically and eventually lead to complex life all on it's own is completely logical. Ya that makes so much more sense.

Think of it like game design, a video game has a designer, a creator. It clearly did not just pop into existence on it's own, someone took the time to program and design it. They built the engine, they built the mechanics, they built the world and everything else in that game.

Life is the same way, God desinged the universe and it's mechanics, and used them to create life and make human beings. Things like evolution are just one of the many design tools God designed and guided in this world to create life.

Gravity, atoms, DNA, the Big Bang and all the other things are just the many mechanics and foudnations God used to design the world with. It certainly makes more logical sense than your idea.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

Most people who are friends in real life have religious discussions all the time. I have quite a few friends in real life who are very vocal atheits, however they respect my personal views and I respect theirs. On here however, do to the anonymity of the internet or just extreame people who have no life and cannot fucntion in soceity, they don't respect each other's personal beliefs.

And implying that having a basic education means your too smart for religion just says to me you don't know very much, especially about history.

toast_burner

I understand the big bang just fine, what you don't understand were did the matter for the big bang come from? It had to come from somewhere in the first place, so where from? I believe God did it, you have no answer.

I'm not so sure you have a basic understanding of evolution let alone science. You seem to be under the assumption that just becasue your an atheist that makes you an expert on the subject, which is obviously not true in your case.

Ironically for you, most of the scientific community, including those who study big bang and evolution, are religious. You are in a very small minority, both in science and other areas. I would like to see you show your understanding of the big bang, I'm curious to see if you can do it.

I don't think you actually understand it or study it. You seem to just belive in it by faith alone and your idenitity as an atheist. You clearly don't even research the subject. You probably don't even know the timeline where it probably happened, which is the Planck Epoch.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]And again, please leave this creator/creation/instigator stuff at the door. Its not something it addresses.Nuck81

I am using my brain, I'd suggest you take your own advice though. I asked you specifically what about the BBT you have a problem with and guess what? You couldn't specificy a damn thing. Better to just admit you don't know a damn thing about it and move on.

Simply because religions feel the need to reconcile some of their beliefs as new evidence comes about such as the BBT or evolution, doesn't mean that science needs to address these issues. Religious implications are completely irrelevant to science and the laws governing the universe. You're trying to inject them where they shouldn't be.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I'm pretty sure I do understand science a bit better than you considering I deal with science every dayNuck81

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]Dude, please, it makes sense... isnt that logical enough for you?

___________________

And yes, we're patting each others backs right now. *pats theone's back*

Teenaged

As long as you keep it above the waist.

Alright, just tell people we play baseball together or something.

[QUOTE="Nuck81"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]And again, please leave this creator/creation/instigator stuff at the door. Its not something it addresses.HoolaHoopMan

I am using my brain, I'd suggest you take your own advice though. I asked you specifically what about the BBT you have a problem with and guess what? You couldn't specificy a damn thing. Better to just admit you don't know a damn thing about it and move on.

Simply because religions feel the need to reconcile some of their beliefs as new evidence comes about such as the BBT or evolution, doesn't mean that science needs to address these issues. Religious implications are completely irrelevant to science and the laws governing the universe. You're trying to inject them where they shouldn't be.

[QUOTE="ShadowMoses900"]

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]And "it makes sense to me" is winning a debate?

This was not a debate to begin with. and you're certainly not someone able to participate in one.

Teenaged

I take debate classes at my university, I know the rules and formation of a strong argument. Something you and most other people on here do not. While you cannot prove God exists or not, one could still argue effectively for their personal beliefs which is what I did.

You however cannot and instead have to resort to childish attacks like a 5 year old, it's a way to escape from an argument but it's just silly. If this was a court romm and somone accused you of murder, you can't sit there and say "oh don't believe him, he is stupid idiot, I'm innocent, he is just dumb." that isn't a defense and no one would buy it.

It wouldn't be an argument, it would be an admission of defeat through a cop out. Which is exactly what your doing.

Saying "it makes sense" doesnt constitute an argument. Neither is the twins in the womb analogy a sound argument. I really shouldnt have to explain this to someone who supposedly took debate cIasses in university.

But I'm not professing to be debating right now. You are. So you cant really call me out on anything. I choose to insult you and I aknowledge that I do. That has nothing to do with whether I can debate when I feel like it; and that is definitely not when dealing with people like you. Patience has its limits.

Once again, SM, I'm not even debating right now. Are you so eager to claim victory even when there is no debate going on?

I used standard debate format for all my arguments, you don't understand it because you never learned basic debate before. Once you do you will understand the format, which you clearly don't as you resorted to personal and child like tantrum attacks. The person who loses their cool means they lose in a debate because they resort to emotions instead of logic and reason.

I can't believe you don't understand this, after all you are claiming to be the debate expert and everything. You should at least know the basics.

[QUOTE="Nuck81"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I'm pretty sure I do understand science a bit better than you considering I deal with science every dayHoolaHoopMan