Vice-Presidential Debate 2008 Discussion!

[QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"]

you still can't answer that syllogism. Answer in one word, is taxation theft? let's try this again.

Theft is taking from someone without consent

Taxation is taking without consent

Therefor, taxation is theft.

That syllogism cannot be proved false, for the love of god, stop.

killtactics

You consent by living here.

You have a right to leave the country any time you want.

Thus it is not theft.. I have said this time and time again, you don't like it leave the country. And yourplans are unrealistic.. They breed aristocracy, they breed the press down of the working and poor classes. What your saying is that people who live are not given their rights inless they can afford it.. That is not the United States, nor do the majority picture it.. To me your system is no better then the aristocracy of the dark ages. Perhapes you should have been born around that time, because I garentee that none of the presidents were for that, nor the founding fathers.

no, it is theft, because no place in the world allows us to live without taxation. no matter where i go, there is taxation, so since i cannot leave here and live freely, i should try and change the place that i live so that i'm not a slave to the state.

so the concept of taxation is not theft huh?

and no...once again...you don't know history. aristocracy did not believe in the concept of equal human rights...that's a little bit of a problem for me.

First of all, give me proof that they don't tax.

Second, would all of my other rights be free as well? don't think so.

Third, so if anyone has a complaint about the system, they should leave?

Something tells me Biden would make a better President than Obama.

limpbizkit818

Probably, but he's way too undisciplined for anyone to take him seriously.

well its fairly obvious who won.....

gongytron

[QUOTE="biggest_loser"]I definitely think Biden won. He was actually debating and creating arguments against the Republican Government. Palin was just selling her party. As someone else said highly scripted. Trashface

Palin didn't try selling her party at all. Matter of fact, she talked about challenging her party. Biden is the one who kept trying to bring partisanship into it. About the only times she didnt respond to Biden is when Biden spoke off topic and even once interupted the moderator. I was nervous going into the debate, but she more than met people's expectations. Also, bravo to her for having the guts to take a shot at the media and called them out on the biased filter theyd been presenting her through. Her ticket made huge progress tonight. Watch and see.

Also how does asking the media to stop talking negative about her take "guts".....

[QUOTE="Devil-Itachi"]

[QUOTE="helium_flash"]In terms of the debate, Biden won. However, Palin easily was able to handle herself up there, which is a victory among itself.mfacek

Indeed that's why I can't decide.

We should think Palin being able to handle herself is a victory? She is running as the vice-president. She will be sparring with Putin, Osama, etc. Should we really be satisified with her "handling" herself?

lol wut?

[QUOTE="gongytron"]

well its fairly obvious who won.....

cough* biden cough*

DivergeUnify

[QUOTE="killtactics"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"]

you still can't answer that syllogism. Answer in one word, is taxation theft? let's try this again.

Theft is taking from someone without consent

Taxation is taking without consent

Therefor, taxation is theft.

That syllogism cannot be proved false, for the love of god, stop.

lilburtonboy748

You consent by living here.

You have a right to leave the country any time you want.

Thus it is not theft.. I have said this time and time again, you don't like it leave the country. And yourplans are unrealistic.. They breed aristocracy, they breed the press down of the working and poor classes. What your saying is that people who live are not given their rights inless they can afford it.. That is not the United States, nor do the majority picture it.. To me your system is no better then the aristocracy of the dark ages. Perhapes you should have been born around that time, because I garentee that none of the presidents were for that, nor the founding fathers.

no, it is theft, because no place in the world allows us to live without taxation. no matter where i go, there is taxation, so since i cannot leave here and live freely, i should try and change the place that i live so that i'm not a slave to the state.

so the concept of taxation is not theft huh?

and no...once again...you don't know history. aristocracy did not believe in the concept of equal human rights...that's a little bit of a problem for me.

First of all, give me proof that they don't tax.

Second, would all of my other rights be free as well? don't think so.

Third, so if anyone has a complaint about the system, they should leave?

Or you can try to get elected to public office. As I said no one is making you stay here.. If you don't like the system that the United States is under, maybe you should go somewhere else.

And no its not just a complaint of the system.. You want the system dismantled.. Lets be realistic here..

[QUOTE="Devil-Itachi"]

[QUOTE="helium_flash"]In terms of the debate, Biden won. However, Palin easily was able to handle herself up there, which is a victory among itself.mfacek

Indeed that's why I can't decide.

We should think Palin being able to handle herself is a victory? She is running as the vice-president. She will be sparring with Putin, Osama, etc. Should we really be satisified with her "handling" herself?

Biden was grumpy, Palin was charming and direct

Palin won imo

Palin stood her ground way better than expected, but it's foolish for anyone to believe that Biden did not win this.

He won this easily, though palin still was able to regain her reputation solidly.

[QUOTE="DivergeUnify"][QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]

DARN RIGHT!!!!:lol:

I love Sarah Palin. With that said, this debate is painful! Biden is too wise. McCain needs to kick the cutie and get Romney or Huckabee in...

Theokhoth

Picking Romney would have been like giving the entire Conservative base the finger on live television.

and picking Palin gave the entire country the finger live.

[QUOTE="Devil-Itachi"]

[QUOTE="helium_flash"]In terms of the debate, Biden won. However, Palin easily was able to handle herself up there, which is a victory among itself.SaintLeonidas

Indeed that's why I can't decide.

yeah, but you cant say it was close just because she exceed expectations, especially ones that were so low.

You do make a good point.

[QUOTE="Trashface"]

[QUOTE="biggest_loser"]I definitely think Biden won. He was actually debating and creating arguments against the Republican Government. Palin was just selling her party. As someone else said highly scripted. killtactics

Palin didn't try selling her party at all. Matter of fact, she talked about challenging her party. Biden is the one who kept trying to bring partisanship into it. About the only times she didnt respond to Biden is when Biden spoke off topic and even once interupted the moderator. I was nervous going into the debate, but she more than met people's expectations. Also, bravo to her for having the guts to take a shot at the media and called them out on the biased filter theyd been presenting her through. Her ticket made huge progress tonight. Watch and see.

Also how does asking the media to stop talking negative about her take "guts".....

After her nomination, the media were going after every single thing they could to try and break her momentum. The questioned her on her daughter, her child. They dropped investigators to try and dig dirt up on her. They tried as hard as they could to get her in gotcha moments. Couric asked her if she knew of certain past McCain policies as if any VP candidate would know every single policy their running mate every supported. They tried as hard as they could to paint her as incompetant. She called them out and basically bypassed their filter. If you couldnt see the media crusade against her, youre blind. Its not surprising, though. Im glad the GS demo isnt indicative of the major population. She also did a great job on calling Biden out on his contradictory statements. Anyway, bed time. Got work in the morning.

[QUOTE="C_BozkurT_C"]

Biden was grumpy, Palin was charming and direct

Bio_Spark

Really? You seriously think that?

Yeah, she was anything but direct.

Biden was grumpy, Palin was charming and direct

Palin won imo

C_BozkurT_C

Charming...maybe, but that has nothing to do with it...direct...are you kidding? SHe was so off topic on almost every issue, swaying away from the question, she was anything but direct. Biden wasnt grumpy, and many will say he was actually more relaxed then he could have or possibly should have been.

[QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="killtactics"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"]

you still can't answer that syllogism. Answer in one word, is taxation theft? let's try this again.

Theft is taking from someone without consent

Taxation is taking without consent

Therefor, taxation is theft.

That syllogism cannot be proved false, for the love of god, stop.

sSubZerOo

You consent by living here.

You have a right to leave the country any time you want.

Thus it is not theft.. I have said this time and time again, you don't like it leave the country. And yourplans are unrealistic.. They breed aristocracy, they breed the press down of the working and poor classes. What your saying is that people who live are not given their rights inless they can afford it.. That is not the United States, nor do the majority picture it.. To me your system is no better then the aristocracy of the dark ages. Perhapes you should have been born around that time, because I garentee that none of the presidents were for that, nor the founding fathers.

no, it is theft, because no place in the world allows us to live without taxation. no matter where i go, there is taxation, so since i cannot leave here and live freely, i should try and change the place that i live so that i'm not a slave to the state.

so the concept of taxation is not theft huh?

and no...once again...you don't know history. aristocracy did not believe in the concept of equal human rights...that's a little bit of a problem for me.

First of all, give me proof that they don't tax.

Second, would all of my other rights be free as well? don't think so.

Third, so if anyone has a complaint about the system, they should leave?

Or you can try to get elected to public office. As I said no one is making you stay here.. If you don't like the system that the United States is under, maybe you should go somewhere else.

And no its not just a complaint of the system.. You want the system dismantled.. Lets be realistic here..

I almost have my degree in political science and economics, then off to yale for my phd, so i plan on running for an office.

and the united states has the best system, but it's becoming worse and worse every day, so i want to change that.

and it isn't the dismanteling of the government. i would keep lots of things, i'm just saying the way it should be. but people are too lazy, complacent, irresponsible, and stupid to have the system i want. so i would settle for everything privatized except for state military, state courts, city firefighters. that's about it. and that, is very possible. that's what ron paul would have done, and he actually got a lot of support.

awesome palin won itx_Martyr_x

.. what? -facepalm-

She dodged almost all the questions, she kept going back to energy. I'm mad the moderator didn't cut her off for dodging/swaying away from so many of the questions ...

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="killtactics"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"]

you still can't answer that syllogism. Answer in one word, is taxation theft? let's try this again.

Theft is taking from someone without consent

Taxation is taking without consent

Therefor, taxation is theft.

That syllogism cannot be proved false, for the love of god, stop.

lilburtonboy748

You consent by living here.

You have a right to leave the country any time you want.

Thus it is not theft.. I have said this time and time again, you don't like it leave the country. And yourplans are unrealistic.. They breed aristocracy, they breed the press down of the working and poor classes. What your saying is that people who live are not given their rights inless they can afford it.. That is not the United States, nor do the majority picture it.. To me your system is no better then the aristocracy of the dark ages. Perhapes you should have been born around that time, because I garentee that none of the presidents were for that, nor the founding fathers.

no, it is theft, because no place in the world allows us to live without taxation. no matter where i go, there is taxation, so since i cannot leave here and live freely, i should try and change the place that i live so that i'm not a slave to the state.

so the concept of taxation is not theft huh?

and no...once again...you don't know history. aristocracy did not believe in the concept of equal human rights...that's a little bit of a problem for me.

First of all, give me proof that they don't tax.

Second, would all of my other rights be free as well? don't think so.

Third, so if anyone has a complaint about the system, they should leave?

Or you can try to get elected to public office. As I said no one is making you stay here.. If you don't like the system that the United States is under, maybe you should go somewhere else.

And no its not just a complaint of the system.. You want the system dismantled.. Lets be realistic here..

I almost have my degree in political science and economics, then off to yale for my phd, so i plan on running for an office.

and the united states has the best system, but it's becoming worse and worse every day, so i want to change that.

and it isn't the dismanteling of the government. i would keep lots of things, i'm just saying the way it should be. but people are too lazy, complacent, irresponsible, and stupid to have the system i want. so i would settle for everything privatized except for state military, state courts, city firefighters. that's about it. and that, is very possible. that's what ron paul would have done, and he actually got a lot of support.

[QUOTE="x_Martyr_x"]awesome palin won itHaziqonfire

.. what? -facepalm-.

[QUOTE="Haziqonfire"]

[QUOTE="x_Martyr_x"]awesome palin won itStevo_the_gamer

.. what? -facepalm-.

Exactly. We're not insulting you for thinking that Biden won. We just think differently. I found Palin to be victorious because she actually held in there really well and her policies run more along the lines of my own. If you think Biden won, that's cool; we just have different ideas.

Now that's the Zen approach to debate.

Bah! I missed it. :( Will they be replaying it?d51man

I'll paraphrase

Biden: McCain wants to eat your babies

Palin: Yes, but lets talk about energy.

jk, that's a terrible summary.

[QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"][QUOTE="Haziqonfire"]

[QUOTE="x_Martyr_x"]awesome palin won itZentrenius

.. what? -facepalm-.

Exactly. We're not insulting you for thinking that Biden won. We just think differently. I found Palin to be victorious because she actually held in there really well and her policies run more along the lines of my own. If you think Biden won, that's cool; we just have different ideas.

Now that's the Zen approach to debate.

[QUOTE="C_BozkurT_C"]

Biden was grumpy, Palin was charming and direct

Palin won imo

SaintLeonidas

Charming...maybe, but that has nothing to do with it...direct...are you kidding? SHe was so off topic on almost every issue, swaying away from the question, she was anything but direct. Biden wasnt grumpy, and many will say he was actually more relaxed then he could have or possibly should have been.

Anyone who thinks Palin did good must have stars in their eyes. She completely avoided any direct question (especially whenever she was challenged to say how McCain was different than Bush), had literally no factual evidence, and dropped colloquialisms and even bushisms(patriotism, stay the course, blahblah) in the place of content. Biden was full of facts, ideas, dates, statisitcs.

Bah! I missed it. :( Will they be replaying it?d51man

I think soon cnn will replay it, also look tomorrow on CNN and MSNBC or Fox News, after the last Pres. debate those sites had the full debates on there to watch.

[QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="killtactics"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="lilburtonboy748"]

you still can't answer that syllogism. Answer in one word, is taxation theft? let's try this again.

Theft is taking from someone without consent

Taxation is taking without consent

Therefor, taxation is theft.

That syllogism cannot be proved false, for the love of god, stop.

fat_rob

You consent by living here.

You have a right to leave the country any time you want.

Thus it is not theft.. I have said this time and time again, you don't like it leave the country. And yourplans are unrealistic.. They breed aristocracy, they breed the press down of the working and poor classes. What your saying is that people who live are not given their rights inless they can afford it.. That is not the United States, nor do the majority picture it.. To me your system is no better then the aristocracy of the dark ages. Perhapes you should have been born around that time, because I garentee that none of the presidents were for that, nor the founding fathers.

no, it is theft, because no place in the world allows us to live without taxation. no matter where i go, there is taxation, so since i cannot leave here and live freely, i should try and change the place that i live so that i'm not a slave to the state.

so the concept of taxation is not theft huh?

and no...once again...you don't know history. aristocracy did not believe in the concept of equal human rights...that's a little bit of a problem for me.

First of all, give me proof that they don't tax.

Second, would all of my other rights be free as well? don't think so.

Third, so if anyone has a complaint about the system, they should leave?

Or you can try to get elected to public office. As I said no one is making you stay here.. If you don't like the system that the United States is under, maybe you should go somewhere else.

And no its not just a complaint of the system.. You want the system dismantled.. Lets be realistic here..

I almost have my degree in political science and economics, then off to yale for my phd, so i plan on running for an office.

and the united states has the best system, but it's becoming worse and worse every day, so i want to change that.

and it isn't the dismanteling of the government. i would keep lots of things, i'm just saying the way it should be. but people are too lazy, complacent, irresponsible, and stupid to have the system i want. so i would settle for everything privatized except for state military, state courts, city firefighters. that's about it. and that, is very possible. that's what ron paul would have done, and he actually got a lot of support.

probably not...but smart people can still dream of it.

[QUOTE="Zentrenius"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"][QUOTE="Haziqonfire"]

[QUOTE="x_Martyr_x"]awesome palin won ithelium_flash

.. what? -facepalm-.

Exactly. We're not insulting you for thinking that Biden won. We just think differently. I found Palin to be victorious because she actually held in there really well and her policies run more along the lines of my own. If you think Biden won, that's cool; we just have different ideas.

Now that's the Zen approach to debate.

I think they may have converted an equal number of undecided voters. They both presented themselves fairly well in their respective ways.

[QUOTE="SaintLeonidas"][QUOTE="C_BozkurT_C"]

Biden was grumpy, Palin was charming and direct

Palin won imo

hmac777

Charming...maybe, but that has nothing to do with it...direct...are you kidding? SHe was so off topic on almost every issue, swaying away from the question, she was anything but direct. Biden wasnt grumpy, and many will say he was actually more relaxed then he could have or possibly should have been.

Anyone who thinks Palin did good must have stars in their eyes. She completely avoided any direct question (especially whenever she was challenged to say how McCain was different than Bush), had literally no factual evidence, and dropped colloquialisms and even bushisms(patriotism, stay the course, blahblah) in the place of content. Biden was full of facts, ideas, dates, statisitcs.

That's what good debaters do, talk about what they want to talk about.

Do I think it's right to sway from a question? No. But she showed good debating skills by changing the subject to matters she wanted to touch upon. Again, and again, and again.

Palin didn't fall flat on her face due to weeks of coaching and mock debates; however, she spent most of the debate meandering and playing the Tina Fay "adorable" card.

Biden performed as he should have: restrained.

palin was sexy tonight.H8sMikeMoore

Biden's thoughts during the debate:

Thank God this podium is here. The American people may have otherwise noticed the tent being constructed.

I think it's interesting that people are talking about how great Biden did, but, when you boil it down to the raw meaning of what was said, all he did was a better job of avoiding the questions. He spent more time pointing fingers at McCain, Bush, and Cheney than answering the questions. Palin may not have been factual but she was more straightforward about her views.Thyeora

Did we watch the same debate?

Even without going on the attack like I wished he would have but known he couldn't have, id say Biden still one. I want to say it was close, thats how it seemed, but Palin really don't anwser alot of the questions. tman93

he sure is/does.

[QUOTE="H8sMikeMoore"]palin was sexy tonight.Zentrenius

Biden's thoughts during the debate:

Thank God this podium is here. The American people may have otherwise noticed the tent being constructed.

I think he would've needed Viagra to get that thing to stand at attention. Dude is old.