Why do people believe you need evidence to disprove a god?

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"]

[QUOTE="themajormayor"]The burden of proof is on the one making the claim. You're the one making the claim that he doesn't exist. themajormayor

That's not really Atheism though IMO. Sounds more like Agnosticism to me. Of course it depends on what defintion you use. It's all very fluid.

[QUOTE="themajormayor"][QUOTE="l4dak47"] No, the burden of proof is on the one that claims god is real. l4dak47

Well your sentence is not much to hang in the christmas tree either.

[QUOTE="Asim90"]

If one thing turns into something else, it is impossible to say those both were not designed. Evolution is simply a bridge that explains a change, it does not contradict design. You can see evolution among things created by humans. You say its debated by scientists arguing it is random? How do you know it is random? It is random from an observable viewpoint. This is a theory remember.

RationalAtheist

Do you have any evidence to support your view, or is repetition your preferred tactic? Perhaps you should investigate evolutionary biology some more, before making your claims.Random mutation has been clearly evidenced in meiosis and DNA division. Are you saying randomly mutated off-spring have been designed that way?

I think you confuse what a scientific theory is. Theories are different from hypotheses, since they have corroborating evidence to support them. Do you accept the theory of gravity, or do you float about? Being a self-proclaimed "engineer", you'll be needing scientific theories to establish your engineering principles.

You can attempt to be as condescending as you like, it does little to favour your argument for which I have already adressed. The fact that you pride yourself on being a "rational atheist" leads me to ask the question, do you believe the two to be mutually exclusive or not? I'm just curious.

[QUOTE="themajormayor"]

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"] I knew I'd get a post like this, I was just waiting for it really.....

We are all born without the belief in god, we lack the belief because as newborns we don't hold many opinions on ideas that we have no knowledge about, and god is simply that, an idea. It seems you lack understanding on what Atheism is, so I'll sum it up for you "atheism is merely the absence of belief in a god"

I hope you can understand now why your post sounds ridiculous :)

SuperKaio-ken

That's not really Atheism though IMO. Sounds more like Agnosticism to me. Of course it depends on what defintion you use. It's all very fluid.

"As commonly understood, atheism is the position that affirms the nonexistence of God. So an atheist is someone who disbelieves in God, whereas a theist is someone who believes in God. Another meaning of "atheism" is simply nonbelief in the existence of God"

So as you see there is no clear definition

[QUOTE="l4dak47"][QUOTE="themajormayor"] No one made that claim. TC seemed to have claimed that God isn't real without anyone having claimed that he is. So burden of proof is on himthemajormayor

Well your sentence is not much to hang in the christmas tree either.

You can attempt to be as condescending as you like, it does little to favour your argument for which I have already adressed. The fact that you pride yourself on being a "rational atheist" leads me to ask the question, do you believe the two to be mutually exclusive or not? I'm just curious.

Asim90

I don't think you've addressed any of my comments. I believe you explicity ignored them: for example, after I explained to you the qualities of a scientific theory, you threw the "it's only a theory" out again as part of your continued assertion.

How would you know what I pride myself on? Are you asking if rationality and atheism are mutually exclusive? If so, then I think not. I find religion to be irrational. To deny clear evidence (for example about evolution) seems far less rational than to accept it.

"As commonly understood, atheism is the position that affirms the nonexistence of God. So an atheist is someone who disbelieves in God, whereas a theist is someone who believes in God. Another meaning of "atheism" is simply nonbelief in the existence of God"

So as you see there is no clear definition

themajormayor

There are some very clear definitions, but also some confusion over their interpretation.

You want something that deals with the material universe to prove something that is spirit and therefore suprnatural? Typical.:roll:

[QUOTE="themajormayor"]

[QUOTE="l4dak47"] First off, he never claimed that. Also, this sentence was has got to be of the most pathetic attempts I've seen. l4dak47

Well your sentence is not much to hang in the christmas tree either.

Why do people that disbelieve in God talk about religion so much?SolidSnake35

Why do religious people talk so much about atheists?

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Why do people that disbelieve in God talk about religion so much?RationalAtheist

Why do religious people talk so much about atheists?

The senseless one has said in his heart:
There is no Jehovah.
They have acted ruinously, they have acted detestably in [their] dealing.
There is no one doing good.

2As for Jehovah, he has looked down from heaven itself upon the sons of men,

To see whether there exists anyone having insight, anyone seeking Jehovah.

3They have all turned aside, they are [all] alike corrupt;

There is no one doing good,
Not even one.

4Have none of the practicers of what is hurtful got knowledge,

Eating up my people as they have eaten bread?
They have not called even upon Jehovah.

5There they were filled with a great dread,

For Jehovah is among the generation of the righteous one.

6The counsel of the afflicted oneYOUpeople would put to shame,

Because Jehovah is his refuge.

7O that out of Zion there were the salvation of Israel!

When Jehovah gathers back the captive ones of his people,
Let Jacob be joyful, let Israel rejoice.

Psalms 14

[QUOTE="RationalAtheist"]

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Why do people that disbelieve in God talk about religion so much?SolidSnake35

Why do religious people talk so much about atheists?

So does religion....

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="RationalAtheist"]

Why do religious people talk so much about atheists?

RationalAtheist

So does religion....

Not God though, apparently.SolidSnake35

You too?

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Not God though, apparently.RationalAtheist

You too?

[Quote="Psalms 14"]

The senseless one has said in his heart:
There is no Jehovah.
They have acted ruinously, they have acted detestably in [their] dealing.
There is no one doing good.

2As for Jehovah, he has looked down from heaven itself upon the sons of men,

To see whether there exists anyone having insight, anyone seeking Jehovah.

3They have all turned aside, they are [all] alike corrupt;

There is no one doing good,
Not even one.

4Have none of the practicers of what is hurtful got knowledge,

Eating up my people as they have eaten bread?
They have not called even upon Jehovah.

5There they were filled with a great dread,

For Jehovah is among the generation of the righteous one.

6The counsel of the afflicted oneYOUpeople would put to shame,

Because Jehovah is his refuge.

7O that out of Zion there were the salvation of Israel!

When Jehovah gathers back the captive ones of his people,
Let Jacob be joyful, let Israel rejoice.

BluRayHiDef

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[Quote="Psalms 14"]

The senseless one has said in his heart:
There is no Jehovah.
They have acted ruinously, they have acted detestably in [their] dealing.
There is no one doing good.

2As for Jehovah, he has looked down from heaven itself upon the sons of men,

To see whether there exists anyone having insight, anyone seeking Jehovah.

3They have all turned aside, they are [all] alike corrupt;

There is no one doing good,
Not even one.

4Have none of the practicers of what is hurtful got knowledge,

Eating up my people as they have eaten bread?
They have not called even upon Jehovah.

5There they were filled with a great dread,

For Jehovah is among the generation of the righteous one.

6The counsel of the afflicted oneYOUpeople would put to shame,

Because Jehovah is his refuge.

7O that out of Zion there were the salvation of Israel!

When Jehovah gathers back the captive ones of his people,
Let Jacob be joyful, let Israel rejoice.

SuperKaio-ken

I used to be like you, constantly trying to disprove God's existence and never understanding that belief in God is not a matter of science but is a matter of faith. Either you believe or you don't. It's up to you to believe. I've decided to believe. For me, Yahweh/ Jehovah is real.

I figure because it is like 2nd grade. Whomever has more on their side the teacher believes and the other side gets the crap. Whomever looks more prepared, legit, and backed by evidence pulls in more people who just wanna be on the bashing side. CreasianDevaili

[...] why do I see so many religious people asking for Atheists to disprove their beliefs?SuperKaio-ken

Because God means a lot to them one way or another, and it isnt easy for them to admit the possibility he is just like flying unicorns, giant teapots etc, the only difference being his/her/it's greater plausibility, which is only true based on standards of human psychology, not science.

That's my take.

Teenaged

You sayin' giant teapots don't exist?

I dont think people approach god/religion in a scientific matter. It's not something like physics or electomagnetism that can be directly studied and observed. Religion is more a cultural and spritual phenomena.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

Because God means a lot to them one way or another, and it isnt easy for them to admit the possibility he is just like flying unicorns, giant teapots etc, the only difference being his/her/it's greater plausibility, which is only true based on standards of human psychology, not science.

That's my take.

Necrifer

You sayin' giant teapots don't exist?

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[Quote="Psalms 14"]

The senseless one has said in his heart:
There is no Jehovah.
They have acted ruinously, they have acted detestably in [their] dealing.
There is no one doing good.

2As for Jehovah, he has looked down from heaven itself upon the sons of men,

To see whether there exists anyone having insight, anyone seeking Jehovah.

3They have all turned aside, they are [all] alike corrupt;

There is no one doing good,
Not even one.

4Have none of the practicers of what is hurtful got knowledge,

Eating up my people as they have eaten bread?
They have not called even upon Jehovah.

5There they were filled with a great dread,

For Jehovah is among the generation of the righteous one.

6The counsel of the afflicted oneYOUpeople would put to shame,

Because Jehovah is his refuge.

7O that out of Zion there were the salvation of Israel!

When Jehovah gathers back the captive ones of his people,
Let Jacob be joyful, let Israel rejoice.

BluRayHiDef

I used to be like you, constantly trying to disprove God's existence and never understanding that belief in God is not a matter of science but is a matter of faith. Either you believe or you don't. It's up to you to believe. I've decided to believe. For me, Yahweh/ Jehovah is real.

[QUOTE="themajormayor"]The burden of proof is on the one making the claim. You're the one making the claim that he doesn't exist. SuperKaio-ken

The logic SuperKaio-ken

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"] So the bible talks about non believers in a negative way and predicts that there will be those who do not believe? This is amazing how exactly? What religion doesn't do this?

Man you might as well convert to Islam or any other religion if you think what you just posted means something

SuperKaio-ken

I used to be like you, constantly trying to disprove God's existence and never understanding that belief in God is not a matter of science but is a matter of faith. Either you believe or you don't. It's up to you to believe. I've decided to believe. For me, Yahweh/ Jehovah is real.

If you're not trying to disprove God's existence, then why did you make this thread? If you think belief in God is so stupid, then why are you concerned with it? Why not just let us foolish people of faith be? As for evidence, the evidence for God is not empirical but spiritual; it's something that people of faith feel in their being. It's not something that can be proven or disproven by physical observations. As I said, it's a matter of faith.

26 ForYOUbehold his calling ofYOU, brothers, that not many wise in a fleshly way were called, not many powerful, not many of noble birth;

27but God chose the foolish things of the world, that he might put the wise men to shame; and God chose the weak things of the world, that he might put the strong things to shame;

28 and God chose the ignoble things of the world and the things looked down upon, the things that are not, that he might bring to nothing the things that are,

29in order that no flesh might boast in the sight of God.

30But it is due to him thatYOUare in union with Christ Jesus, who has become to us wisdom from God, also righteousness and sanctification and release by ransom;

31that it may be just as it is written: He that boasts, let him boast in Jehovah.1 Corinthians 1

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"]The logic Nude_Dude

BluRayHiDef

Having fun?

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"]The logic Nude_Dude

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

I used to be like you, constantly trying to disprove God's existence and never understanding that belief in God is not a matter of science but is a matter of faith. Either you believe or you don't. It's up to you to believe. I've decided to believe. For me, Yahweh/ Jehovah is real.

BluRayHiDef

If you're not trying to disprove God's existence, then why did you make this thread? If you think belief in God is so stupid, then why are you concerned with it? Why not just let us foolish people of faith be? As for evidence, the evidence for God is not empirical but spiritual; it's something that people of faith feel in their being. It's not something that can be proven or disproven by physical observations. As I said, it's a matter of faith.

26 ForYOUbehold his calling ofYOU, brothers, that not many wise in a fleshly way were called, not many powerful, not many of noble birth;

27but God chose the foolish things of the world, that he might put the wise men to shame; and God chose the weak things of the world, that he might put the strong things to shame;

28 and God chose the ignoble things of the world and the things looked down upon, the things that are not, that he might bring to nothing the things that are,

29in order that no flesh might boast in the sight of God.

30But it is due to him thatYOUare in union with Christ Jesus, who has become to us wisdom from God, also righteousness and sanctification and release by ransom;

31that it may be just as it is written: He that boasts, let him boast in Jehovah.1 Corinthians 1

BRHD is just trolling. The guy makes anti-religion threads every other day. th3warr1or

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"] Firstly, I'm not trying to "Disprove gods" existence, I just see no compelling reason to believe in one when there is absolutely not one spec of evidence to support the claim of one. I tend to hold the belief that believing in something based off of nothing isn't the smartest thing to do. Now of course you'll have the opposing argument, such as"God is not a matter of science it is a matter of faith" but do you even understand what faith is? It is believing in something without proof, without evidence, and without good reason.

Now you might be willing to do that, but I am not nor will I ever be, because not only do I think it is irrational to do so, I hold that belief it is absolutely absurd to do so. Just because you WISH and WANT something to be true, doesn't mean it is true, nor does it give you a good reason to believe in it. Because you have no reason to believe in something, there is no reason why you should believe, it really is that simple. The point of this topic wasn't to DISPROVE god, the point was that because of there being no reason to believe in god (because it is a claim that is not supported with any sort of revidence) it can be dismissed equally without it.

This is why it is not up to science or anybody to disprove god in the first place, it is up to the person making the claim.

SuperKaio-ken

If you're not trying to disprove God's existence, then why did you make this thread? If you think belief in God is so stupid, then why are you concerned with it? Why not just let us foolish people of faith be? As for evidence, the evidence for God is not empirical but spiritual; it's something that people of faith feel in their being. It's not something that can be proven or disproven by physical observations. As I said, it's a matter of faith.

26 ForYOUbehold his calling ofYOU, brothers, that not many wise in a fleshly way were called, not many powerful, not many of noble birth;

27but God chose the foolish things of the world, that he might put the wise men to shame; and God chose the weak things of the world, that he might put the strong things to shame;

28 and God chose the ignoble things of the world and the things looked down upon, the things that are not, that he might bring to nothing the things that are,

29in order that no flesh might boast in the sight of God.

30But it is due to him thatYOUare in union with Christ Jesus, who has become to us wisdom from God, also righteousness and sanctification and release by ransom;

31that it may be just as it is written: He that boasts, let him boast in Jehovah.1 Corinthians 1

You don't understand. God's existence isn't something to be argued, especially in a religious context. You have to take a leap of faith. Either you do or you don't. One cannot prove or disprove the existence of a being that is invisible, intangible, and beyond the scope of Human comprehension. You, me, and everyone else are infinitely less to God than what a microorganism is to us. He is way above our level.

i believe there is a pink unicorn and purple dragon doing battle in front me. you can't disprove me cus i have teh faithz tr0l0l0lLiftedHeadshot

Logically, you can assume there is not much space in front of you, as you are probably on a desktop against the wall. If a fight were in front of you, your computer would be heavily damaged and you wouldn't have been able to make that post.

Faith is not enough here.

BRHD is just trolling. The guy makes anti-religion threads every other day. th3warr1or

[QUOTE="th3warr1or"]BRHD is just trolling. The guy makes anti-religion threads every other day. BluRayHiDef

[QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"]

[QUOTE="BluRayHiDef"]

If you're not trying to disprove God's existence, then why did you make this thread? If you think belief in God is so stupid, then why are you concerned with it? Why not just let us foolish people of faith be? As for evidence, the evidence for God is not empirical but spiritual; it's something that people of faith feel in their being. It's not something that can be proven or disproven by physical observations. As I said, it's a matter of faith.

[quote="1 Corinthians 1"]

26 ForYOUbehold his calling ofYOU, brothers, that not many wise in a fleshly way were called, not many powerful, not many of noble birth;

27but God chose the foolish things of the world, that he might put the wise men to shame; and God chose the weak things of the world, that he might put the strong things to shame;

28 and God chose the ignoble things of the world and the things looked down upon, the things that are not, that he might bring to nothing the things that are,

29in order that no flesh might boast in the sight of God.

30But it is due to him thatYOUare in union with Christ Jesus, who has become to us wisdom from God, also righteousness and sanctification and release by ransom;

31that it may be just as it is written: He that boasts, let him boast in Jehovah.BluRayHiDef

You don't understand. God's existence isn't something to be argued, especially in a religious context. You have to take a leap of faith. Either you do or you don't. One cannot prove or disprove the existence of a being that is invisible, intangible, and beyond the scope of Human comprehension. You, me, and everyone else are infinitely less to God than what a microorganism is to us. He is way above our level.

[QUOTE="LiftedHeadshot"]i believe there is a pink unicorn and purple dragon doing battle in front me. you can't disprove me cus i have teh faithz tr0l0l0lNecrifer

Logically, you can assume there is not much space in front of you, as you are probably on a desktop against the wall. If a fight were in front of you, your computer would be heavily damaged and you wouldn't have been able to make that post.

Faith is not enough here.

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"]I figure because it is like 2nd grade. Whomever has more on their side the teacher believes and the other side gets the crap. Whomever looks more prepared, legit, and backed by evidence pulls in more people who just wanna be on the bashing side. Teenaged

You do need an argument/evidence to disprove the notion of God. You do not need an argument/evidence to dismiss it.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"]I figure because it is like 2nd grade. Whomever has more on their side the teacher believes and the other side gets the crap. Whomever looks more prepared, legit, and backed by evidence pulls in more people who just wanna be on the bashing side. CreasianDevaili

If someone tries to "deceive" the other side of being credible, there are ways to sort things out.

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]Well that's deplorable, isnt it...

If someone tries to "deceive" the other side of being credible, there are ways to sort things out.

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="CreasianDevaili"] I said looked, not is, you unstable teenager.CreasianDevaili

If someone tries to "deceive" the other side of being credible, there are ways to sort things out.

Good to know. Keep calling meinsane if that makes you feel better though.

Not being able to disprove something, does not mean that its existnece is proven.