Why do people believe you need evidence to disprove a god?

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champion837

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#251 champion837
Member since 2012 • 1423 Posts

You used wiki as a source and you also chose to determine exactly when a religion begins, you cannot determine the age of hinduism based upon what documents where written at what time.tenaka2

No, I was answering your question.

Christianity started as a jewish cult and the bible wasn't written when christ was alive but many many years later, this doesnt mean that christianity started when the book was written, same applies for hinduism.tenaka2
Ok? Like I said, you asked me when these things occured. I have told you already that it isnt those merits alone of what makes Christianity unique
Not that it matters, hinduism predates christianity by many hundreds if not thousands of years.

tenaka2

What do you mean by that? Christianity (the OT part of it) pre dates the age of the documents we have found on them as well.

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champion837

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#252 champion837
Member since 2012 • 1423 Posts

[QUOTE="champion837"][QUOTE="SuperKaio-ken"] No actually I'm the Father, the Son and the Holy spirit, and just becaues I said it makes it true. Oh wait, you don't believe me?

SuperKaio-ken

If someone wanted to say that, then they would need prophecies about them, people to prepare your way, and many, many texts that complimented each other throughout thousands of years that led to that person's arrival for it to be the same.

You mean those prophecies that were either made up or have been completely disproved entirely? Or the texts that were written by regular men apparently instructed by god that have been translated and revised so many times that they are basically worthless and irrelevant, and maybe at most only good if you want to learn a little bit of history; that is of course after being forced to look past all the crap like Noah's ark and the flood. Actually come to think of it I have a prophecy bro, one day the world will end and the universe will become uninhabitable. To bad you won't be around to worship me for predicting that when it actually happens. (sucks for me I guess)

In other words, no the bible is not evidence for your god. If anything it can be used as evidence against your god because of all the inaccuracies in it and the constant contradictions. That is why when "blurayhidef" links his biblical quotes thinking he is smart I can't help but laugh at the guy, because not only is it proving absolute nothing, it's utterly worthless to copy and paste. Let me ask you this though, maybe you'll give me a good answer; Why if the we know the world isn't flat, the earth isn't at the centre of the universe, the world is not 6000 years old, there wasn't a massive flood a few thousand years ago and Noah's ark never happened, why does the bible say otherwise? Knowing all of it is untrue, why would you even bother believing anything else in it? (and please don't say it is only inaccurate because it was written by men and men are imperfect, because if anything it's a strawman argument) and how you can so critical of Hinduism for it's inaccuracies yet be so oblivious to your own religions is truly and utterly way beyond me



Once again, I answered your question, people wouldnt believe that you are Jesus because you dont have what Jesus had to back him up. What you are talking about now is a totally different conversation, that I have been trying to have. So instead of attacking me and telling me what you think you know about the Bible, how about you ask me a question on it so that I could help you with something.
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champion837

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#253 champion837
Member since 2012 • 1423 Posts

[QUOTE="champion837"]If someone wanted to say that, then they would need prophecies about them, people to prepare your way, and many, many texts that complimented each other throughout thousands of years that led to that person's arrival for it to be the same.RationalAtheist

This idea of thousands of years keeps cropping up, although you discount other religions with as much if not more quantity and longevity of documentation to support them.

We can also see that there is dispute over interpretations of the bible between Christians (regarding the Trinity, amonst other things). This shows me that the texts don't necessarily compliment each other like you say they do, if they create disagreements between people interpreting the same book in different ways.

Us as sinful human beings have different interpretations. That doesnt mean that The Bible isnt on one accord. When you asked me a question, I answered it. I am talking to you, so if you have a misinterpretation of it I can help you. Dont use other peoples misinterpretation and say "they dont agree with what you said, so it cant be true", I am not talking to them, I am talking to you.

And secondly, and most importantly, I would say the vast majority of the Bible Christians agree on, just because you are on the OT where it would be expected that the stuff Christians disagree on would be discussed, that wouldnt show most of things that Christians do agree one. If that were the case, then perhaps most churches wouldnt even function. And there are a bunch of denominations, sure, but those denominations havent deemed fit to break off into a bunch of other religions. We still agree on most of what it is said in the Bible.

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Zeviander

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#254 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
[QUOTE="gotdangit"]You make way too many assumptions. Why can't God still be a flying invisible unicorn monster, we don't know what God looks like, no one does. The whole White guy with a beard is just like a place holder really, do you really think everyone assumes he's white? And a lot of people convert to Christianity for some reason or another, not just because they were raised that way. I know a lot of Christians that came to Jesus because their life was so bad that they turned to Jesus and God, and Christianity, and to them, it's the only religion that makes sense. I'm not saying christianity is the "right" religion, but it's just the one so far that makes the most sense. And I know a lot of things about christianity don't make sense, but you have to make sense of things, and I have my own view on things. I don't know where you get all these ideas about religion and how people got to where they were, but you can't just assume because of your own personal interactions, how did you even come to that conclusion that only a small amount of people found Christianity without being taught from the age of 5.

You spent a whole lot of time saying a whole lot of nothing. Congratulations. Many, and I mean MANY people stick with the religion they were taught as children out of convenience of not having to think for themselves. And I understand people convert to other religions all the time... but they definitely, on the world stage, number in the tiniest percentile. Hell, being born a Muslim in any Muslim country pretty much guarantees that you either die a Muslim, or die an apostate after being executed. If people didn't just accept the beliefs of their parents, and actually were given free reign over their lives, without the threat of execution or excommunication, I can guarantee that the religious landscape of the world would me much different right now. Chances are atheism would be the majority, and non-denominational and syncretic beliefs would fall second. Religion has numerous ways to convince people to stay, many of which depend on fear of reprisal. Whether you accept these truths or not is up to you. To me, God is an unnecessary element in life, and I wished more people could realize this, and depend more on themselves and actual people around them.
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v13_KiiLtz

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#255 v13_KiiLtz
Member since 2010 • 2791 Posts
To me, religion is like Paul Rudd. I see the appeal and I would never take it away from anyone, but I would also never stand in line for it.
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xscrapzx

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#256 xscrapzx
Member since 2007 • 6636 Posts
Why do people that disbelieve in God talk about religion so much?SolidSnake35
Because they are just as curious as believers.
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wis3boi

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#258 wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

[QUOTE="gotdangit"]You make way too many assumptions. Why can't God still be a flying invisible unicorn monster, we don't know what God looks like, no one does. The whole White guy with a beard is just like a place holder really, do you really think everyone assumes he's white? And a lot of people convert to Christianity for some reason or another, not just because they were raised that way. I know a lot of Christians that came to Jesus because their life was so bad that they turned to Jesus and God, and Christianity, and to them, it's the only religion that makes sense. I'm not saying christianity is the "right" religion, but it's just the one so far that makes the most sense. And I know a lot of things about christianity don't make sense, but you have to make sense of things, and I have my own view on things. I don't know where you get all these ideas about religion and how people got to where they were, but you can't just assume because of your own personal interactions, how did you even come to that conclusion that only a small amount of people found Christianity without being taught from the age of 5.Zeviander
You spent a whole lot of time saying a whole lot of nothing. Congratulations. Many, and I mean MANY people stick with the religion they were taught as children out of convenience of not having to think for themselves. And I understand people convert to other religions all the time... but they definitely, on the world stage, number in the tiniest percentile. Hell, being born a Muslim in any Muslim country pretty much guarantees that you either die a Muslim, or die an apostate after being executed. If people didn't just accept the beliefs of their parents, and actually were given free reign over their lives, without the threat of execution or excommunication, I can guarantee that the religious landscape of the world would me much different right now. Chances are atheism would be the majority, and non-denominational and syncretic beliefs would fall second. Religion has numerous ways to convince people to stay, many of which depend on fear of reprisal. Whether you accept these truths or not is up to you. To me, God is an unnecessary element in life, and I wished more people could realize this, and depend more on themselves and actual people around them.

Most people seem to fear admitting this fact. Or they just never realize it. Another thing similar to this that really makes me facepalm is when people label kids as Christian, Muslim, Jewish, Hindu, etc.....the kid is no more a a true member of any of those sects as they are members of the postal worker's union

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champion837

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#259 champion837
Member since 2012 • 1423 Posts
[ and actually were given free reign over their lives, without the threat of execution or excommunication, I can guarantee that the religious landscape of the world would me much different right now.Zeviander
Life for people now isnt even remotely close to that of the crusades era and such. You think that the things that have happened are a reflection of God, when wars and mass killings have occurred whether or not people used God as an excuse for it. During the last books of the Bible, the people who knew Jesus (the aposltes), didnt lift a finger even though they were even being killed. That is how you should make your determination of the people of God, and what God is about. Atrocities are a human thing and will continue to be a human thing until we actually learn how to cure that.
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xscrapzx

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#260 xscrapzx
Member since 2007 • 6636 Posts
[QUOTE="gotdangit"]You make way too many assumptions. Why can't God still be a flying invisible unicorn monster, we don't know what God looks like, no one does. The whole White guy with a beard is just like a place holder really, do you really think everyone assumes he's white? And a lot of people convert to Christianity for some reason or another, not just because they were raised that way. I know a lot of Christians that came to Jesus because their life was so bad that they turned to Jesus and God, and Christianity, and to them, it's the only religion that makes sense. I'm not saying christianity is the "right" religion, but it's just the one so far that makes the most sense. And I know a lot of things about christianity don't make sense, but you have to make sense of things, and I have my own view on things. I don't know where you get all these ideas about religion and how people got to where they were, but you can't just assume because of your own personal interactions, how did you even come to that conclusion that only a small amount of people found Christianity without being taught from the age of 5.Zeviander
You spent a whole lot of time saying a whole lot of nothing. Congratulations. Many, and I mean MANY people stick with the religion they were taught as children out of convenience of not having to think for themselves. And I understand people convert to other religions all the time... but they definitely, on the world stage, number in the tiniest percentile. Hell, being born a Muslim in any Muslim country pretty much guarantees that you either die a Muslim, or die an apostate after being executed. If people didn't just accept the beliefs of their parents, and actually were given free reign over their lives, without the threat of execution or excommunication, I can guarantee that the religious landscape of the world would me much different right now. Chances are atheism would be the majority, and non-denominational and syncretic beliefs would fall second. Religion has numerous ways to convince people to stay, many of which depend on fear of reprisal. Whether you accept these truths or not is up to you. To me, God is an unnecessary element in life, and I wished more people could realize this, and depend more on themselves and actual people around them.

So what you are saying is as we grow older we never think for ourselves? I have to disagree with that. Yes when you are younger you are a lot more guliable and easier to believe in something because someone told you the reasons why it was the right thing to do. You feel god is unnecessary in life and that is fine, while others don't. You have no right to tell others how they should or should not feel. Thats where you are wrong, no matter how foolish you think their thinking might be. At the end of the day you are doing the same thing that religous parents were doing when raising their children. Bringing them up the way they feel they should be and now you are trying to claim because someone has God in their life that some how that is wrong and they should be doing things differently. The bottom is people do think for themselves, yes in very small cases there are people who are brainwashed so badly that they don't how else to live, but I might not follow Catholicism to the T, but i'm a spiritual person for my own reasons, and no others.
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#261 champion837
Member since 2012 • 1423 Posts
the kid is no more a a true member of any of those sects as they are members of the postal worker's unionwis3boi
By definition that is incorrect. Whether or not someone changes their mind in the future, doesnt mean that they arent the classification of what they are part of.
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wis3boi

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#262 wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]the kid is no more a a true member of any of those sects as they are members of the postal worker's unionchampion837
By definition that is incorrect. Whether or not someone changes their mind in the future, doesnt mean that they arent the classification of what they are part of.

So a 4 year old kid knows what religion is and all the other religions are and what they mean? No, he/she does not. They are labeled so because of their parent's beliefs. It would be silly to call a kid a "Marxist child" or a "democratic child" because that's what his parent's may be. All your arguments in this thread raise alarm bells in the heads of any sane and logical person.

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Nibroc420

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#263 Nibroc420
Member since 2007 • 13571 Posts

All your arguments in this thread raise alarm bells in the heads of any sane and logical person.

wis3boi

Welcome to religion.

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wis3boi

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#264 wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

[QUOTE="wis3boi"] All your arguments in this thread raise alarm bells in the heads of any sane and logical person.

Nibroc420

Welcome to religion.

No need to welcome me, I lived in it :P

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champion837

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#265 champion837
Member since 2012 • 1423 Posts
of any sane and logical person.wis3boi
Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?
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#266 Nibroc420
Member since 2007 • 13571 Posts
[QUOTE="wis3boi"] of any sane and logical person.champion837
Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?

I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?
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#267 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts
[QUOTE="wis3boi"] of any sane and logical person.champion837
Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?

So Christian that we still have yet to ban pork products.
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xscrapzx

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#268 xscrapzx
Member since 2007 • 6636 Posts
[QUOTE="champion837"][QUOTE="wis3boi"] of any sane and logical person.Nibroc420
Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?

I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?

So because someone has certain spiritual beliefs they are not sane?
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#269 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
[QUOTE="Nibroc420"][QUOTE="champion837"] Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?xscrapzx
I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?

So because someone has certain spiritual beliefs they are not sane?

If they follow organized religion, they're not sane or logical.
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wis3boi

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#270 wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

[QUOTE="champion837"][QUOTE="wis3boi"] of any sane and logical person.Nibroc420
Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?

I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?

and the vast majority of people I meet around my age (21) don't follow any religion.

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xscrapzx

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#271 xscrapzx
Member since 2007 • 6636 Posts
[QUOTE="xscrapzx"][QUOTE="Nibroc420"] I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?l4dak47
So because someone has certain spiritual beliefs they are not sane?

If they follow organized religion, they're not sane or logical.

So because someone disagrees with someone's view that person is now defined as insane?
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Nibroc420

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#272 Nibroc420
Member since 2007 • 13571 Posts
[QUOTE="Nibroc420"][QUOTE="champion837"] Most of the country is Christian, you mean to tell me that we dont think that our children are christians?xscrapzx
I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?

So because someone has certain spiritual beliefs they are not sane?

I suppose it depends on the degree in which they believe it. Personally i think that WBC's members are insane due to their spiritual beliefs and the effects those beliefs have on their lives. However since we're talking about children, i doubt they fully understand their religion. I also dont think many of them have developed strong enough critical thinking yet to be fully able to form meaningful questions that they need to think upon, in regards to their religion and their parents religion.
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l4dak47

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#273 l4dak47
Member since 2009 • 6838 Posts
[QUOTE="l4dak47"][QUOTE="xscrapzx"] So because someone has certain spiritual beliefs they are not sane?xscrapzx
If they follow organized religion, they're not sane or logical.

So because someone disagrees with someone's view that person is now defined as insane?

No, it's not just a "viewpoint" It's a crazy following that makes no sense and only serves to repress rights based on stupid, arbitrary, and outdated ideas.
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Zeviander

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#274 Zeviander
Member since 2011 • 9503 Posts
So what you are saying is as we grow older we never think for ourselves? I have to disagree with that. Yes when you are younger you are a lot more guliable and easier to believe in something because someone told you the reasons why it was the right thing to do. xscrapzx
Not everyone grows out of that mindset. Many stay because it is comfortable. Questioning one's very purpose and existence can be very unsettling for some. I find it funny that you think a majority of people make a conscious decision about what to believe. "Brainwashing" doesn't have to be forced. It can be passive. It can be engrained in cultural mores. People could brainwash the next generation and neither know they are doing it, nor intend on doing it. And as for my children, I will teach them to always question things. To be sceptical of anything they are told until they are able to determine the actual truth for themselves. If they end up converting to Islam, Christianity or another tradition that bases it's beliefs on untruths, I'll allow it, and I'll still love them... but I will not hesitate to engage them in debate and try to bring them to their senses.
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PressXtoJump

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#275 PressXtoJump
Member since 2012 • 1484 Posts
[QUOTE="xscrapzx"][QUOTE="Nibroc420"] I'd like to think our children are sane and logical. Wouldn't you like the same?l4dak47
So because someone has certain spiritual beliefs they are not sane?

If they follow organized religion, they're not sane or logical.

your sentence makes no mathematical sense.